A few dates, rejection, and now no contact?

[Vink]

There's a lot out there about the friend zone and the no contact rule, but there's not much out there for dating, getting rejected, and then using the no contact rule. Here's my story. I apologize for the length, but I hope whoever reads it is able to consider what I'm saying and offer a thoughtful reply. I know you might instinctively dismiss everything. If that's the case, then I would ask that you either try to put more thought into a reply.

I appreciate your help.

I met a girl online back in July. We’re the same age in our late 20s. We went out and it went really well. We have a lot in common: we both have professional careers, Masters Degrees that we finished late, a strong interest in diverse, foreign, and classic films and music, similar close families, and we took an interest in each other’s hobbies. She runs marathons, does art, and sings, while I play squash, recently got into photography, and am politically engaged. I showed a lot of interest in her and rarely broke eye contact. She told me it was the first time she went out with someone online and she didn't believe me when I said it was the same for me. She wanted to set up the next date before we went our separate ways. I told her I would get in touch and she was surprised that I gave her a hug. I tried to set up a follow-up and she said she was busy with family events and then she was going away for a wedding, so we could get together two weeks from then. I asked her to text me once she got back. I didn’t get a response that week so I texted her in the middle of the week and we made plans for Friday. I’m not sure what happened on that particular day, but I think asking family members for advice really affected me. I didn’t initiate any physical contact and I was generally nervous and passive. Flirting was at a minimum and, for some reason I behaved as if I was at a job interview. We parted ways with another hug. I was hesitant for the common reasons: she was sweet and I didn't want to scare her. I also thought she was past the age where she would go for a bad boy or someone who plays games. On her social media (I followed her after the first date because I mistakenly liked one of her photos), she's been posting things about being single for years and I don't see any traces of a long-term relationship. All of the men she’s connected to are friends or family. She told me she was free for the weekend but I never followed up because I wrongly thought meeting up again so soon would kill her interest.

I contacted her in the middle of the week and asked her availability to arrange for a third date. She didn’t respond after 24 hours so I sent her another text. She apologized for missing the text and I asked if I could call her later that night. We spoke and she mentioned that she was looking into the dating service we met on once again. I almost avoided that comment because I didn’t know how to respond to it. We spoke a little bit and I asked if she was available on Thursday. She said she wasn’t and said she had another family event. I asked about Friday and she said she’s busy as well. I asked her what she was busy with, to which she didn’t give a clear answer. Then I asked about Sunday, telling her that I only had plans for Saturday. She told me she would get back to me. I took some more bad advice at this point. I was told that I should keep communicating with her so she doesn’t forget about me and I should offer to do things for her. I texted her the following day, saying I could make food for us when we go out on Sunday. Of course, she rejected me by text the following day. She said that the decision was a struggle since, on paper, I’m what she is looking for. She said that I’m sweet but that we’re different and she doesn't see it going anywhere. I texted her the following morning and said we should give it another shot because we’re both looking for people like each other. She said she would like to hang out again if I understand how she feels. I tried to meet her for coffee but she told me she was busy that day.

In early September, I texted her about a film festival that I thought she’d be interested in. We talked about it for a while and she asked if I’m going. I told her that I was, but I never invited her. She told me that she tried to buy tickets but she made a mistake and wasn’t able to. This festival has over 300 films over 10 days, with about three screenings per film. She said that she’s interested in going to one of the films that I told her I was attending. The tickets were sold out at this point. I told her that, if she ends up going to the premiere, I would see her in line. I didn't expect anything. I just want to point out that, to go to this film, she had to pay twice the price of regular tickets and buy them at 7:00am the same day. An hour or so after the film, she texts me and asks me what I thought. She was still in the area at this time but I was driving home. We talked about it for a bit but I never asked her to meet up. I told her to let me know if she was going to any other films. Later on, she told me she didn't know it was the first screening and she didn't know what normal pricing was, despite there being a week between the time we spoke about the film and the day of the screening. This information is clearly printed all over the festival website. She also didn't go to any other films. It's possible she had some doubts about ending things and she wanted her sister to meet me for a second opinion. She could have been attracted to this display of confidence.

A few weeks later, I was traveling to another continent and I noticed that she liked the page of another dating service on social media. I texted her before my plane took off. I said I was away for a few weeks but that I would like to see her when I got back. I got her reply when I landed and she said she would love to hear about my travels. While I was away, I met a European model. Things went well between us and it definitely boosted my self-esteem, but I didn't really care for this girl.

 

[Vink]

I contacted her a week after I got back. I texted her a specific time and place three days in advance for the following week. She hadn’t replied by the night before so I called her and left voicemail. She texted back immediately, apologized profusely, and said she’s going away once again and so she’s busy but that we could meet up the following week. I texted her in the middle of the week and she said she’s now busy for the rest of it and that it would have to be the following week. She asked for a specific day that I was available. She accepted the date in early November and I sent her a place and time.

She texted me that day and said she would be a little late. I didn’t respond because I was at work. She texted again to ask if we’re still on in two hours. I said that we were. She said the place was further than she realized and asked if we could meet elsewhere. Instead, I offered to meet her along the way. She said it was fine and that we could just meet there. She got to the location first. We had dinner and it went really well. She complimented my appearance. I was able to demonstrate value, telling her about my travels, my recent investment, my work, and many funny stories along the way. I asked her some deep personal questions and she was clearly taken aback in a good way. She said no one asks her questions like that. She said she was free on Sunday so we made tentative plans. I think the conversational split was about 40-60. She said she noticed how much more myself I was this time and it seemed we both enjoyed each other's companies thoroughly. I paid the bill and told her she could get the next one, to which she seemed happy. Afterwards, I told her we should go for a walk since this particular place is in a nice part of town. I joked around with her and touched her. She said that she was cold. We both had jackets on. She didn't want to walk too far. I wanted to hold her hand but her hands were occupied. I tried putting my arm around her but she tensed up and seemed to cut the walk short. At this point, I realized that she saw this particular outing as a chance to catch up between friends.

I walked her back to her car. I asked if we were on for Sunday. She said she wasn’t sure. I told her that there was a way she could be sure and went in for a kiss on her cheek. She stopped me. I told her that I think we should spend more time together. I said that I wasn’t interested in being friends and that we both know that it would be a lie. She took my hand and told me that she's been dating other people and is seeing a new guy that weekend. She never mentioned him when we were talking about her weekend over dinner. I told her that I've been dating other people, too, but I still find myself thinking about her. I said we could see each other and other people. She didn’t seem to like that idea. I asked her what happened between us. She said that she was excited at first, she told her family and friends about me, and that there was a reason I was her first online date. She said she was reluctant to reject me but that she had to be honest with herself. She said she just didn’t feel instant attraction. That didn't seem to be the case on our first date and I suspect it's something she justified to herself after her attraction level dropped. I told her that I got some bad advice from my sister, I wasn't being myself, and attraction can grow over time and what we had, compatibility, was much more valuable. She said that she's always had instant attraction in her past relationships and that she had to go with her gut. She said she wants to date around for a while, so I told her I wasn't going to wait for her. I told her that I hope she finds a guy who makes her feel instant attraction. Then she said that her own idea sounded dumb. At this point, she gently tried pulling her hand back and said that she had to go. I asked her one last time if she wanted to get together and she said she was probably too busy for the next two months because she's going to another continent for a month. I told her she didn’t sound rational and to have a good night. I walked away. She asked me to keep in touch.

 

[Vink]

Maybe the things I said weren’t always best, but I was confident and genuine in my delivery. I feel I was most honest with her when I revealed everything. It started as a way for her to realize the potential for attraction (rejecting being friends), but then it expanded into my insecurities (what happened?), my secrets (following bad advice), and my feelings (calling her special and unique). I didn't intend to say as much as I did and I realize that much of what I did say is typically considered attraction-killing conversation. At that point, I don't think I could've stopped myself. Going forward, I want to be honest and direct with her. At the same time, though, I can't put myself on the line as I did. I have to stop taking people's advice, believe in myself, and value my time. We had a great dinner that night and that's what I'd like her to remember most. I doubt other guys she dates would get as invested into her deepest thoughts as I did.Of course, it was only two hours, but if I see her again, I would delve more. She even offered to show me videos of her singing when she's typically embarrassed to show them to her friends. She's dating other people but I somehow doubt she's going to find someone she likes. That doesn't mean I think she likes me the best or that she'll even want to start dating me again, but I think there's a chance she'll contact me at some point in the future. If I'd never had that conversation with her, I'd have probably seen her sing in full by now, but I couldn't risk falling into the so-called "friend-zone" permanently. Now that I’ve said what I have to say, I don’t want to have these conversations with her anymore. I want to see her again and just have a good time. I hope that she realizes that this is out of the way now.

I know it sounds silly to some people since we only went out three times but there is something special about her. She just has this sweetness about her that's intoxicating. I love her love of the arts, the fact that she spends her life with kids, she's really close to her family, and I want to get to know everything about her. She is beautiful but that's like the least of it. There's this vulnerable emotional core that she lets out in her art and her singing (she posts seconds on social media). I want to experience that intensity. I just can't stop thinking about her and I find it hard to believe I'll meet someone else that I like more.

The thing is, though, I strongly suspect that, like me, she doesn't have much relationship experience. I'm not saying she's afraid of commitment, because if she were, these events would have played out differently. She was obviously nervous the first two times that we went out. Even during the phone call where she told me she was still using that dating service, I flirted with her just seconds before and she started giggling. It was adorable. With our mutual lack of experience for our ages, though, maybe its best we see other people for now. I still believe she rejected me because she wasn't attracted to me, but if she were more experienced, she would be more open to that attraction developing over time. Her rejection would have just been a warning. If I had played it right from the beginning and worked on being the more confident version of myself, I know it would have worked. I chose to take some bad advice and I might regret it for the rest of my life, unless if there's a solution out there.

It was a mistake to try to be someone else at first. I should have looked inside and been the best version of myself. She's noticed some changes for the better and that pattern will just continue. I want her to feel an uncontrollable attraction, as if I'm a new man. Something like that will take work, and I intend to do it. If I'm going to do it effectively, I'll have to focus on other girls and put my all into improving my dating and attraction skills. If I forget about her because I meet someone better, great. If I don't, I probably won't forget about her, but we'll see where we both are down the line. If this somehow works out, then our relationship will never be the same. She won't resign to someone she didn't feel attracted to, she'll be chosen by a different man who she finds irresistible.

Clearly, I made some mistakes along the way. I’ve recognized them and I tried to fix them with the third “date.” If I was less persistent from the beginning and allowed her to chase me, I think it would have been great. I think she lacks attraction because I displayed passive approval-seeking behaviour, failed to flirt or touch, and was too serious. These are all things I'm committed to changing. Now I've learned my lesson and I just need to implement it. I need to rewind and try again. Now I’m going to enjoy other women but I hope she'll contact me again. We're still connected via social media. We have quite a few things in common. We know she wants a guy just like me, as long as I can light a spark. I want her attraction to me to rise so that, next time, I could be confident, funny, and genuine. I'll pass her tests and I'll engage her. I will not display neediness; I'll take it one-step at a time and have her enjoy it. I wish I could have been more lighthearted with what I said, but I didn't know how that would be possible, but at least she'll remember me for a confident and honest act. There were signs along the way that she was quite interested at times. Overall, though, I just seemed like a passive approval seeker. I don't think she'd feel the same way now due to this drastic change in personality.

She is seeing other guys but I think I'll stand out when she thinks of me. Whether or not she contacts me again, that's the difficult part. If she comes back, she'll know that she can't be friends with me because I made my intentions clear and that I'd have dated a few other people. She'll know that I won't behave as I did before. So why would she come back? I'd like to believe it's because we have a lot in common. She comes across as extremely genuine and I think she really does enjoy my company. She noticed changes the last time we went out. We still have each other on social media and she'll see hints of these changes. She'll know that I'm committed to bettering myself, and what's more attractive than that? If I left things where they were in August (when she sent the rejection text), I'd understand if someone said I have no chance. I've worked hard to salvage this since then, though. I still think there was more to the film festival incident, especially after hearing her explanation. Then, when we went out again, I was able to show her the great guy that I naturally am. Then we spoke and I'm sure it was a little uncomfortable, but she saw me standing up for myself and being honest with her, which at the same time, said that I was fine risking complete rejection. Now I'm satisfied with the amount of information she has to make a decision. She might worry I'll find someone else before she does now. She won't be my top priority, which is what she wants, even if she'll never say it. I want her to be curious about how I really am, since I said I was not myself at the time. She might just want what she can't have. The only time I acted as if I had no interest in seeing her, she showed up to the place I was. I don't think it's that unreasonable to think she might do it again. In extension, when I see her, I'll be able to make her feel special, too. There is still some hope left, right?

 

[usernamedox11]

OK...

you dont have much experience, you dont know that the girl is special. until you've hung out with over 20+ girls, you don't know how to judge which girl you actually like or don't like. the way you are any girl that gives you the time of day you will fall in love. she doesnt want to date you just let it go. she's just a girl man...she's not even thinking about you and you're writing 20 page essays about her.

text her...tell her to come over and suck your d1ck and see what he she says. after she blocks your #, move on.

if the girl liked you, telling her she was special or different wouldn't have mattered. she'd have eaten that sh1t up.

 

[parkthebus]

I admit I stopped reading half way that post was way to long. You contacted her too much. If they ignore then you don't keep trying to contact. She wasn't attracted to you because you weren't sexually aggressive enough.

 

[dustmuffin]

Move on painful read.

 

[Vink]

I've been in the same kind of situation that you're in now - except the woman that I dealt with decided that she would still keep me around for other reasons. Be very wary of any woman who tries to LJBF you. Always ask 'what's in it for me?'. I bailed fairly quick, but it still hurts to know you've screwed up and wasted your time.

There is no hope for you in getting this girl. I'm sorry to tell you that. Go no contact, and use this experience as motivation to get this area of your life under control. Oh, don't hope that she will come back in a year or two either; make yourself a rule that you will never go back to any woman from your past.

There is hope for your future with women, however. You need to stop being the nice-guy and start looking at increasing your options. No one woman is that special - the more you sleep with, the truer this will be. You also need to start getting what you want from relationships and accept that you're a man with sexual desire. You should start sexualising a relationship with a woman you're interested in immediately. Kino throughout a date, and go for a kiss at the end of it; if she pulls away, it's her loss. Move on to the next one. Women want sex quickly; that much you have learned. Acquire an abundance mentality (pretty women are everywhere, and each is a possible romance). You don't need to act like a b*stard, but you do need to start putting yourself first and be more honest with yourself.

Please read some books on pick-up; I would recommend 'The Game', 'Rules of The Game', and 'Magic Bullets'. A good book on the nice-guy syndrome is 'no more mr. Nice Guy'. At the very least, read 'The Book Of Bonecracker'; it's free on the internet and will give you the harsh realities of male/female relationships: you need this!

Sorry to speak in so many imperatives, but you need to be pointed in the right direction, because you've got it all wrong and will continue to suffer if you don't start changing now.

Thanks for your thoughtful post. I've been reading Becoming a 3% Man and listening to the Girlfriend Activation System. I've seen two other girls since I met her. I have plans with another and I'm trying to set something up with four other girls. The issue was never as simple as not having any game, it's that I thought an older, sweet girl would have wanted a straightforward nice guy. It was incredibly dumb of me to take my sister's advice when she's a very different kind of woman. I will see as many other girls as I can and fix my mistakes, but this is the only girl I've ever met that I could see a life with. It's just too bad I couldn't get more experience before meeting her.

Considering her bad luck, our compatibility, the fact that I told her I wasn't myself, and had a really great last date with her, I left her with a much stronger impression. I have this instinct that, with the no contact rule and her remaining single, something could happen, especially considering the film festival incident. I understand that it's in my best interest not to think about it at all, so I'll focus on finding someone better instead of predicting the future. I guess it'd just be great for at least one person to acknowledge that I have a case here, however remote it might be.

Oh, also I skimmed over lots of things from when we were actually dating. It went on for a month and a half. She was quite flirtatious at the beginning and she even texted me from work. Her interest started to drop after the second date when my behaviour changed. There were other upsetting things going on in my life at that time that contributed to my mood. I explained this to her during the last date as well. It's not as if she was never interested, I just happened to lower it. I should be able to get it back to where it was (see film festival incident).

 

[SmooveMooves]

TLDR;

However, I didn't need to read your post. If you've been on date with a woman and after a while she doesn't contact you, she's not interested. Don't continue contacting her... move on.

Pro Tip: Learn to take a hint...

 

[usernamedox11]

Thanks for your thoughtful post. I've been reading Becoming a 3% Man and listening to the Girlfriend Activation System. I've seen two other girls since I met her. I have plans with another and I'm trying to set something up with four other girls. The issue was never as simple as not having any game, it's that I thought an older, sweet girl would have wanted a straightforward nice guy. It was incredibly dumb of me to take my sister's advice when she's a very different kind of woman. I will see as many other girls as I can and fix my mistakes, but this is the only girl I've ever met that I could see a life with. It's just too bad I couldn't get more experience before meeting her.

Considering her bad luck, our compatibility, the fact that I told her I wasn't myself, and had a really great last date with her, I left her with a much stronger impression. I have this instinct that, with the no contact rule and her remaining single, something could happen, especially considering the film festival incident. I understand that it's in my best interest not to think about it at all, so I'll focus on finding someone better instead of predicting the future. I guess it'd just be great for at least one person to acknowledge that I have a case here, however remote it might be.

Oh, also I skimmed over lots of things from when we were actually dating. It went on for a month and a half. She was quite flirtatious at the beginning and she even texted me from work. Her interest started to drop after the second date when my behaviour changed. There were other upsetting things going on in my life at that time that contributed to my mood. I explained this to her during the last date as well. It's not as if she was never interested, I just happened to lower it. I should be able to get it back to where it was (see film festival incident).

dude fvck that 3% man bulls1t life coach corey the f4g balding wayne bullsh1ts about. do whatever the fvck you want...if the girl doesn't like you fvck her. just be yourself...being yourself means taking what you want, polarizing people and not settling for less than what you want...it doesn't mean "being a nice guy," aka being nice to a girl just in hopes she will suck your d1ck

 

[Vink]

To the people who said she ignored me: she actually never did. She forgot to reply once and sent a long apology text. The first time she didn't respond was when I started to get clingy and texted again the next day. I'm pretty sure this was a test because of a weak second date. She's been quite responsive. Also, I initiated texting every time outside of the film festival incident. I tried to leave it up to her but I still don't know how that would have worked out. At the time, I thought she just prefers not to take the initiative. Even if I was initiating, though, I could have texted less, been more direct, and more mysterious with my intentions. The main thing was desperation, though, and that must have come off during the second date, the phone call, and my texts.

 

[pyros]

1. Just because you go on a couple of dates with a woman it's not like you're dating her.
2. YOU HAVE AN ABSOLUTE BETA MINDSET, which is very bad.
3. Because of 2. you did everything wrong.
4. You don't have a lot of 'compatibility' just because you like to read the same type of books etc.
She doesn't like you, so what compatibility you're talking about man??
5. Just accept when a woman is not into you. Get rid of your ego which blinds you.
6. You must erase everything you know about woman and start from scratch.


P.S.

For next women just stop acting so damn desperate. If they ignore you in any kind of form more than once, THEY ARE NOT INTERESTED IN YOU, so stop contacting them for God's sake.

 

[marmel75]

The only one confused about being in the friend zone is you. You continue to believe you have a chance with this woman when you have none.

Stop believing "things went well" when you didn't fvck her. Hell you didn't even kiss her. Are you going the Pyros method? Show no sexual interest while on dates? He'll be the first to tell you that doesn't work well.

Past the age of "wanting bad boys"? Dude you are clueless. Women are NEVER past the age of wanting bad boys. Instead of doing nothing on the dates and then writing 3 pages of nonsense like you, the bad boy is being sexual with her, making out with her, grabbing her ass, grabbing her hand and putting it on his c0ck, and banging her. You know---acting like you actually have some testosterone.

Read the DJ Bible and the re-read it and then re-read it again. Your mindset is weak and you have no idea how things work.

You always have a better chance of getting the benefit of the doubt from a woman by being too sexual and acting like a man who wants to Fvck her, than by not being sexual enough and acting like a scared little boy who doesn't know what to do.

 

[Yewki]

This girl is not interested probably for the sole reason you're desperate as f*ck.

You wrote a damn thesis on her. Come on man.

 

[marmel75]

Mate, there wasn't any 'incident'; you're looking for signs that aren't there, because you're obsessed. You have to let this go for your own mental health. Put all of this energy into something more positive.

Lmao...pretty much THIS...I mean the OP HASN'T EVEN KISSED THE GIRL YET!!!

 

[Reykhel]

I stopped reading after "I showed a lot of interest in her and rarely broke eye contact"

whoo there tiger.......you probably scared the ****e out of poor Nelly.

Listen, you want to really have her interest level higher than yours...

How can you tell where her interest level is. Focus on her actions, never her words.

How can you keep your own interest level from skyrocketing? Options kid, options. See more
than one at a time.

Concentrate on your next hook-up, create an opportunity for sex to take place and have fun. You can't think of the future with women, for you see women are fickle

Put this one to bed, it's easier to start a fresh with the next one and learn whatever lessons. Every woman is simple practice for the next one.

 

[Vink]

Follow up for those who haven't been banned.

I recently came across this post so I thought it would be a good idea to provide an update.

You were all right. She didn't contact me. Three months after I posted this, she found herself someone new. Then, about six months after that, I found someone new, as well. Early on, I had a fight with my girlfriend and reached out to this girl a year after I last saw her. She read my messages but didn't respond. That was 4 years ago. My girlfriend and I worked it out. If it weren't for Covid, we'd be married now.

I did what you all advised and honestly it really helped. I got some new photos by a professional photographer at my sister's wedding, which led to 13 first dates in a month at the peak. It definitely helped my confidence. Once my now fiancée and I had all the difficult conversations in the first 6 months or so, everything's been really amazing between us. This whole experience has given me more confidence than anything and I've gotten ahead with my career at the same time. I was never too social but luckily my fiancée is very social so we balance each other out.

I do still have my what if moments but it doesn't take me long to realize how content I am in my current situation. While this girl and I were perfect on paper, there's just no way to tell how an actual relationship would have gone. Basically all my struggles with the opposite sex were condensed. While most people struggle in the dating phase for 5 to 10 years, I was stuck in the much earlier nothing ever happens phase and sped through the dating phase in a year.

Everyone has a different pace through life. This girl and I were on a different pace but that's how life works. I don't believe in fate, the universe is chaos and it's rare that you meet someone who is not just on the same pace but also complements you and helps you excel through all avenues of your life. I do think that no one person has it all and, in the best case scenario, you find a partner that is strong where you're weak and who you can support in the same way.

Just because you go on a couple of dates with a woman it's not like you're dating her.

The last thing I wanted to say is, I disagree with @pyros. You're not the first person to say it to me but I vehemently disagree with it every time I hear it. I don't care if it's the way people talk. It contradicts the rules of the English language. If you go on more than one date with someone, you are literally dating them. It's not a code word for sex. How about we call sex with romance a relationship and we call sex without romance casual sex. I'm done.

 

[backseatjuan]

Instead of focusing on ‘a lot in common’ provoke emotions in a btch.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

You came across as desperate, non-sexual and afraid to make a move. She wanted you to kiss her at the end of the date and even TOLD you in a covert way. Not that it would have mattered because you would have really messed it up later on based on your beliefs and mindset which are completely false.

Go read the Rational Male and DJ Bible until you internalize it

 

[Vink]

You came across as desperate, non-sexual and afraid to make a move. She wanted you to kiss her at the end of the date and even TOLD you in a covert way. Not that it would have mattered because you would have really messed it up later on based on your beliefs and mindset which are completely false.

Go read the Rational Male and DJ Bible until you internalize it

Yeah I wish I could communicate with me from five years ago, too. Unfortunately humankind has not invented time travel yet.