AAAgent's meditation journal

[AAAgent]

Documented Session: #1
Time: 23 minutes
Counted Breathes: 156 (roughly 20 mins)
Objective: OBE (failed)

Notes: body started to feel change around 80 deep breathes. My body automatically shifted into shorter more relaxed breathes at 156 and I stopped counting. This was likely 3 minutes or so before I woke up due to a phone call. I felt alot of sensations in my body and tried to leave my body but was unsuccessful. Sensations could be related to blood circulation as when I finished meditation my foot was asleep. Feel good after meditation but not great.

 

[Fruitbat]

If you think you’re getting an OBE off 23 mins med you’re mistaken.

you may have some other form of meditation but you are supposed to be bringing your attention to the present and what’s real, not what isn’t.

Meditating is about reality. Not sure why you’re counting breaths either. You’re supposed to let go of thought.

 

[AAAgent]

If you think you’re getting an OBE off 23 mins med you’re mistaken.

you may have some other form of meditation but you are supposed to be bringing your attention to the present and what’s real, not what isn’t.

Meditating is about reality. Not sure why you’re counting breaths either. You’re supposed to let go of thought.

I'm guessing you haven't done much meditation or looked into its roots? It is rooted and breathing and many start by focusing on breathing first, than removing the counting. If you're getting started. Focusing on the counting allows you to remove other thoughts and just focusing on the breathing. Basically helps to limit the brain from shooting to other thoughts and just singling it down to one. Over longer periods of time, the breathing slowly happens subconsciously without counting and you even knowing it, removing the final thought entirely.

I've spent a decent amount of time meditating throughout the years. Right now what i'm doing is slowly warming up my body aka training it. Getting my body accustomed to focusing on breathing and slowly working up the periods to becoming longer and longer. Skilled people can achieve OBE faster but as it's been a while and i'm somewhat busy with many things on my mind, i'm just getting my body accustomed to breathing, clearing my mind, and increasing duration over time.

Meditation is actually rooted in spirituality and removing yourself from reality. The affects on a person in reality are an after effect but not the actual purpose that its meant for.

 

[Epicenter]

I'm guessing you haven't done much meditation or looked into its roots? It is rooted and breathing and many start by focusing on breathing first, than removing the counting. If you're getting started. Focusing on the counting allows you to remove other thoughts and just focusing on the breathing. Basically helps to limit the brain from shooting to other thoughts and just singling it down to one. Over longer periods of time, the breathing slowly happens subconsciously without counting and you even knowing it, removing the final thought entirely.

I've spent a decent amount of time meditating throughout the years. Right now what i'm doing is slowly warming up my body aka training it. Getting my body accustomed to focusing on breathing and slowly working up the periods to becoming longer and longer. Skilled people can achieve OBE faster but as it's been a while and i'm somewhat busy with many things on my mind, i'm just getting my body accustomed to breathing, clearing my mind, and increasing duration over time.

Meditation is actually rooted in spirituality and removing yourself from reality. The affects on a person in reality are an after effect but not the actual purpose that its meant for.

If you think you’re getting an OBE off 23 mins med you’re mistaken.

you may have some other form of meditation but you are supposed to be bringing your attention to the present and what’s real, not what isn’t.

Meditating is about reality. Not sure why you’re counting breaths either. You’re supposed to let go of thought.

No in general you can't get rid of thoughts. You just create an obstacle to the thoughts so it does not effect you much so you don't get reactive.

I used to focus on one point with my eyes. I did it for many years but it was a bit exhausting. So I did the counting. That was still not good. I did breath counting that was much better. Then I did only breath counting till 2. That was much better.

I guess one could do a meditation that is more near to reality. You have only one topic in mind and you stay just focused on it. This is quite difficult and it feels actually like work. So it does not feel refreshing like the breathing meditation.

 

[Fruitbat]

I'm guessing you haven't done much meditation or looked into its roots? It is rooted and breathing and many start by focusing on breathing first, than removing the counting. If you're getting started. Focusing on the counting allows you to remove other thoughts and just focusing on the breathing. Basically helps to limit the brain from shooting to other thoughts and just singling it down to one. Over longer periods of time, the breathing slowly happens subconsciously without counting and you even knowing it, removing the final thought entirely.

I've spent a decent amount of time meditating throughout the years. Right now what i'm doing is slowly warming up my body aka training it. Getting my body accustomed to focusing on breathing and slowly working up the periods to becoming longer and longer. Skilled people can achieve OBE faster but as it's been a while and i'm somewhat busy with many things on my mind, i'm just getting my body accustomed to breathing, clearing my mind, and increasing duration over time.

Meditation is actually rooted in spirituality and removing yourself from reality. The affects on a person in reality are an after effect but not the actual purpose that its meant for.

I’ve spend several years practicing it and reading about it

isn’t never heard of counting as a method. I use Ujjayi breathing to begin. Meditation isn’t in any way about removing yourself from reality, it is the direct opposite.

Your thoughts are not reality, they are abstractions. What is real is your breath, the creaks in the floor, the gurgling in your stomach and the sound of the wind.

Trying to experience these without putting words or names to them and experiencing them for exactly what they are.

Relaxation may remove you from reality and drugs perhaps but meditation is 100% about the real, physical world and the experience of that directly and recognising that thoughts are as much an automatic process like the chattering of birds. The deeper experience of this is what meditation is.

From the diamond sutra:

“All composed things are like a dream,

a phantom, a drop of dew, a flash of lightning.

That is how to meditate on them,

that is how to observe them”

There are many forms of meditation.

I would recommend The Secret Oral Teachings or Tibetan Buddhist Sects by Alexandra David Neal.

 

[Fruitbat]

No in general you can't get rid of thoughts. You just create an obstacle to the thoughts so it does not effect you much so you don't get reactive.

I used to focus on one point with my eyes. I did it for many years but it was a bit exhausting. So I did the counting. That was still not good. I did breath counting that was much better. Then I did only breath counting till 2. That was much better.

I guess one could do a meditation that is more near to reality. You have only one topic in mind and you stay just focused on it. This is quite difficult and it feels actually like work. So it does not feel refreshing like the breathing meditation.

it shouldn’t be exhausting!

just let the thoughts float away.

Hard to explain but they do indeed keep coming and as you say it’s impossible to stop that. I don’t want to fight against them, I let them go. To me they are like a nerve twitching in the leg.

 

[AAAgent]

I’ve spend several years practicing it and reading about it

isn’t never heard of counting as a method. I use Ujjayi breathing to begin. Meditation isn’t in any way about removing yourself from reality, it is the direct opposite.

Your thoughts are not reality, they are abstractions. What is real is your breath, the creaks in the floor, the gurgling in your stomach and the sound of the wind.

Trying to experience these without putting words or names to them and experiencing them for exactly what they are.

Relaxation may remove you from reality and drugs perhaps but meditation is 100% about the real, physical world and the experience of that directly and recognising that thoughts are as much an automatic process like the chattering of birds. The deeper experience of this is what meditation is.

From the diamond sutra:

“All composed things are like a dream,

a phantom, a drop of dew, a flash of lightning.

That is how to meditate on them,

that is how to observe them”

There are many forms of meditation.

I would recommend The Secret Oral Teachings or Tibetan Buddhist Sects by Alexandra David Neal.

Have you studied Buddhism? If you have, you'll understand that the entire point of the scriptures is to help guide you to spiritual enlightenment by detaching yourself from all things physical and emotional.

Samsara aka what we call in modern day, the Matrix construct we live in can only be broken through by following the eightfold path to achieving enlightenment and reaching Nirvana. Understanding that the body and life on this planet is just a blink of an eye but your spiritual soul is eternal.

Perhaps you have a different interpretation or haven't dug deep into it, but essentially meditation and building yourself spiritually will help you in the physical world but the act of meditation itself is not meant to be rooted in focusing on the physical. Otherwise there wouldn't be any type of traversing the astral realm.

 

[Epicenter]

it shouldn’t be exhausting!

just let the thoughts float away.

Hard to explain but they do indeed keep coming and as you say it’s impossible to stop that. I don’t want to fight against them, I let them go. To me they are like a nerve twitching in the leg.

It might work for you but it is a terrible advice for meditation. I heard that stuff decades ago and it really is bad advice. I wasted years with it. The counting method is much better. I teached that many people. They learn it in 30 seconds. Even kids learn it super fast. I wish somebody told me that before and it is super easy to explain why and how it works.

 

[Epicenter]

Have you studied Buddhism? If you have, you'll understand that the entire point of the scriptures is to help guide you to spiritual enlightenment by detaching yourself from all things physical and emotional.

Samsara aka what we call in modern day, the Matrix construct we live in can only be broken through by following the eightfold path to achieving enlightenment and reaching Nirvana. Understanding that the body and life on this planet is just a blink of an eye but your spiritual soul is eternal.

Perhaps you have a different interpretation or haven't dug deep into it, but essentially meditation and building yourself spiritually will help you in the physical world but the act of meditation itself is not meant to be rooted in focusing on the physical. Otherwise there wouldn't be any type of traversing the astral realm.

I think you don't need all this for meditation. You just use the method and you feel better and function better in the world.

The main principle of meditation most people use without knowing that they use it. It is basically distracting your mind but not too much so you can listen to your thoughts but your thoughts have only 20 per cent or so of the power. Many activities have meditational effects like drawing, walking, calculating. Actually most 'boring' activities have meditational effects.

Funny thing with my counting method. It is really not mentioned much by mainstream meditation practitioners. Actually i tried that before but it clicked with me once I met one guy who had mental problems. His thoughts drove him sometimes crazy. So when he walks he always counts to calm and distract from his thoughts. I thought that is interesting. If it works for a guy with mental health problems then it should work for most people. So I used it and it worked but later I used the breath counting and counting till 2 that made it much better. This method is almost fool proof. Almost anybody can do it. I showed it many people and it worked without training.

 

[Fruitbat]

Good luck finding the OBE.

“Just sit down and count bro”

Siddhartha Gautama

 

[AAAgent]

Good luck finding the OBE.

“Just sit down and count bro”

Siddhartha Gautama

I should probably mention that I've already achieved it before and also have a meditation mentor/guide. This is just my journal.

 

[Fruitbat]

I should probably mention that I've already achieved it before and also have a meditation mentor/guide. This is just my journal.

I’m sorry but we have to disagree. If you’re citing walking or drawing as meditation then we are talking about two different things, also 20% of the power of thoughts….these are concepts which are in opposition to all the practice I’ve done and studied and you’re talking about CBT and relaxation essentially. This is the kind of thing you get off an app, not from a couple years study of Zen and Taoism, sorry.

Get a new mentor as he/she hasn’t got the faintest idea what they’re doing

 

[AAAgent]

I’m sorry but we have to disagree. If you’re citing walking or drawing as meditation then we are talking about two different things, also 20% of the power of thoughts….these are concepts which are in opposition to all the practice I’ve done and studied and you’re talking about CBT and relaxation essentially. This is the kind of thing you get off an app, not from a couple years study of Zen and Taoism, sorry.

Get a new mentor as he/she hasn’t got the faintest idea what they’re doing

You must be getting confused. I never mentioned anything about walking or drawing. I don't actually utilize those methods to help meditation but I don't doubt that as a way to channel energy.

Also, if you believe it's your way or the highway and haven't achieved an OBE yet, seems very tunnel vision-esque for someone with a lack of experience. Happy for you to share what works for you, but you shouldn't be coming into someone else's journal talking about how your way works and their way doesn't when you haven't actually made your way work yet.

Secondly, your knowledge of Buddhism and the meditation seem to be very confused. The entire root and foundation of meditation and buddhism is seeded in spirituality. This may be why you haven't been able to achieve OBE as the fundamental aspects of meditation itself you seem to clash with. This may be in part due to ignorance, or just some personal belief you have against spirituality, but you'll likely need to sort that out yourself. We are both spiritual and physical beings. Without proper connection to both, you will never be whole or reach a state of full understanding of the world itself.

Good luck with your journey. Happy to share what i've learnt if you have other questions.

 

[Fruitbat]

You must be getting confused. I never mentioned anything about walking or drawing. I don't actually utilize those methods to help meditation but I don't doubt that as a way to channel energy.

Also, if you believe it's your way or the highway and haven't achieved an OBE yet, seems very tunnel vision-esque for someone with a lack of experience. Happy for you to share what works for you, but you shouldn't be coming into someone else's journal talking about how your way works and their way doesn't when you haven't actually made your way work yet.

Secondly, your knowledge of Buddhism and the meditation seem to be very confused. The entire root and foundation of meditation and buddhism is seeded in spirituality. This may be why you haven't been able to achieve OBE as the fundamental aspects of meditation itself you seem to clash with. This may be in part due to ignorance, or just some personal belief you have against spirituality, but you'll likely need to sort that out yourself. We are both spiritual and physical beings. Without proper connection to both, you will never be whole or reach a state of full understanding of the world itself.

Good luck with your journey. Happy to share what i've learnt if you have other questions.

View attachment 12655

There is no reincarnation in Zen Buddhism.

it’s questionable whether there is even such a thing as rebirth.

Who, exactly, has a spirit? You?

Who is reincarnated? You?

You’re talking about a westernised abbreviation of Buddhism, which is a huge, multi-national school, but the essential teaching is there is no-self, hence there is no spirit, no rebirth and no death.

Very, very few Buddhists believe you can be reborn as an animal. That is Jainism.

Buddha said virtually nothing about the spirit. He spoke of the mind and body.

It’s not very charitable or Buddhist to say you don’t know what you’re talking about, but you would do well to try to understand it better.

Perhaps start with the Heart and Diamond sutras and not web pages.
I would give up trying to have an OBE too, it is disrespectful to the art of meditation to try to turn it into Disneyland.

cheers

 

[AAAgent]

There is no reincarnation in Zen Buddhism.

it’s questionable whether there is even such a thing as rebirth.

Who, exactly, has a spirit? You?

Who is reincarnated? You?

You’re talking about a westernised abbreviation of Buddhism, which is a huge, multi-national school, but the essential teaching is there is no-self, hence there is no spirit, no rebirth and no death.

Very, very few Buddhists believe you can be reborn as an animal. That is Jainism.

Buddha said virtually nothing about the spirit. He spoke of the mind and body.

It’s not very charitable or Buddhist to say you don’t know what you’re talking about, but you would do well to try to understand it better.

Perhaps start with the Heart and Diamond sutras and not web pages.
I would give up trying to have an OBE too, it is disrespectful to the art of meditation to try to turn it into Disneyland.

cheers

I think your mis-interpreting whatever it is your getting your information from.

All Buddhism is rooted in spirituality. Also, I never mentioned the spirit in particular so maybe this was something incorrectly assumed by you. This type of assumption, mis-reading in your processes seem to be mis-guiding your comprehension and interpretation. There's also an assumption here of turning this into a Disneyland. Your mind is in the wrong place and is driving your ignorance, mis-interpretation, a lack of understanding, and ultimately pushing you towards negative thoughts.

I'm providing you with documented references in order to properly guide you, but you come back with your own monologue citing things in this discussion that never occurred, not providing referencing and stating incorrect things as fact, and also ridicule things you have clearly have no experience in.

FYI - Zen Buddhism acknowledges reincarnation. This is also deeply rooted in Chinese culture in literature and in entertainment. Journey to the West is an example. Hopefully, this can help guide you down the correct path.

 

[Fruitbat]

I think your mis-interpreting whatever it is your getting your information from.

All Buddhism is rooted in spirituality. Also, I never mentioned the spirit in particular so maybe this was something incorrectly assumed by you. This type of assumption, mis-reading in your processes seem to be mis-guiding your comprehension and interpretation. There's also an assumption here of turning this into a Disneyland. Your mind is in the wrong place and is driving your ignorance, mis-interpretation, a lack of understanding, and ultimately pushing you towards negative thoughts.

I'm providing you with documented references in order to properly guide you, but you come back with your own monologue citing things in this discussion that never occurred, not providing referencing and stating incorrect things as fact, and also ridicule things you have clearly have no experience in.

FYI - Zen Buddhism acknowledges reincarnation. This is also deeply rooted in Chinese culture in literature and in entertainment. Journey to the West is an example. Hopefully, this can help guide you down the correct path.

View attachment 12657

View attachment 12658
View attachment 12659

How can something which doesn’t exist be reincarnated?

The fundamental notion of Zen is there is no self.

bluetoothing soul is not a thing.

Common western misappropriation.

 

[AAAgent]

How can something which doesn’t exist be reincarnated?

The fundamental notion of Zen is there is no self.

bluetoothing soul is not a thing.

Common western misappropriation.

The non-self is meant to help us understand that there is no self. your life in this body is just one of countless lives, none of which are connected by physical ties. it is a bit meaningless to focus on something so short when in a blink of an eye, it's over, and you'll need to start anew again. focusing on the physical aspects of this life and not the spiritual aspect of it that is eternal will significantly hinder your spiritual growth. Our live's are eternal, how you view that is subjective but the physical things in this current existence at this current time will constantly change each time you reincarnate. The teachings of buddha are meant to teach you how to develop the skills you need to not focus on the physical, but on the spiritual so that you can break free from reincarnation, aka Samsara. Constantly recycling your soul, this continuity between lives is Samsara. the lives are not the same, even though there is continuity, so trying to focus on building an empire in this life, when in your next life, you could be on the opposite end of it, would be a waste of your current time.

I think it's best if you read more about buddhism. different books, different authors, and get multiple perspectives. I've provided enough information and clarity enough but it doesn't seem to resonate well with you.

You can try other religions or texts as well, as they resonate better.

 

[AAAgent]

Documented Session: #2
Time: 32 minutes
Counted Breathes: 160

Notes: was very tired after my workout. shifted positoins a few times due to leg falling asleep or lower back pain. stopped counting for a bit around 80 breaths, 110 breaths, and 140/150 breaths. Almost dozed off a few times as well. I need to find a better sitting position so my legs don't fall asleep. Still having difficulty clearing my mind, likely because I still haven't spent enough time recently meditating. Will continue at this for a few more sessions/weeks to see if things improve.

 

[Canadian_Man]

Still having difficulty clearing my mind, likely because I still haven't spent enough time recently meditating. Will continue at this for a few more sessions/weeks to see if things improve.

Sounds about right, give it time.

I know when I'm out of practice it's more difficult to achieve the same states I once could

Same goes for exercise.

 

[AAAgent]

Sounds about right, give it time.

I know when I'm out of practice it's more difficult to achieve the same states I once could

Same goes for exercise.

Appreciate the feedback. Another friend said the same thing. I will be heading into a 30 day meditation type of retreat in about 16 days so will definitely get in the reps then. My goal now is to warm myself up for that. figure out ideal sitting and hand positions. Stretching and drinking water, etc.