Teaching my son to PU

[TheGrindEqualsHappiness]

Hello,

Short version:
How would you go about introducing your own son to pua/redpill?

Or if you are younger member and find it difficult to relate:

How you wished that your happily married old man would have told you about PU/redpill?

Long version:
Background/context
- Found PUA circa 22 years ago. The old days of ASF and later mASF. For good looking guy that had no social skills and no idea how to be around women it was pure gold. From zero to learning how to flying through clubs with 3s rule with my own routines. Totally awesome. XD
- Some plate-spinning, until I found my wife, married and we are still happily together after almost 20 years.
She is the second best thing to happen in my life. My pre-teen son is the best. Call me old fashioned, but my family means everything to me.

Without finding ASF I would be in a totally different, much worse, place in my life. Now the dilemma is how do I introduce my son to PUA/redpill taking in the good but avoiding the crap.

Pros of introducing to pua-community:
- Emphasis on self improvement and being alpha. Being a MAN mentally and physically instead of manlet-soyboy of today's popular culture is really something to go for whether you do it for women or not. Having mission, confidence, and goals in life is something man needs. IMHO the old days focused too much on pure game.
-Being a loser simp, clueless in relationships and taken advantage of is pure ****. I have seen my share of those and ****ed their chicks in my old days.
-Having successful and healthy relationships is really integral to success and happiness in life so this is something I’ll have to do.

Cons
-Total pua lifestyle with multiple spinning plates can be quite depressing and lonely. My hidden agenda is that I want grandkids someday. xD
-Integrating redpill to your persona without cynicism is not always easy. Understanding that women are just humans, with their own personal issues and flaws, like you and me, is not easy for everyone. One must understand that there are all kinds of people. Some are good for you and some are not. Identify and handle accordingly.
-There are really, really unsavory corners in the manosphere today that are full of total losers, from which I really would like to keep him away from. Blackpill crazies, incell communities etc.
-There is and has always been misogyny in the PUA community. Understandable concerning how people come here and some guys need this swift kick to the ass to stop pedestalizing women.
On the other hand, when taken too far, it is debilitating for everyday life. Most women that you interact with, you are not going to FC anyway. According to my life experience having the proverbial balls, being mentally strong and useful doesn’t require physical balls. I’d much rather take hardline boss-biatch to my team or network instead of some woke-soyboy-weakling with easily hurt feelings. Trust me. I know from experience.

The Plan: introduce him to lifestyle that will lead to high SMV when he’s adult.
-Took him already to lift weights with me. Men lift weights.
-Teaching him a growth mindset and value of hard work.
-Teaching him the basics of how to take care of himself: Diet, skincare, style etc.
-Emphasizing the importance of education. Masters degree at least. This is a high value trait and will be even more in the future since so many young men are dropping out. Also opportune time to go sarging in student parties..
-Teaching basics of social interactions and power dynamics. Try to make him also understand how basic male-female interactions work without making him think that women are somehow evil. Carefully introduce him to some selected pu-material when he is mature enough. Lover/provider frames, basic kino escalation etc.

What do you think?

 

[zekko]

The main thing that would worry me about his is the kid putting too much value on sex at a young age. Which could lead to unwanted consequences like pregnancy or STDs. Plus no matter how much red pill material he might absorb, there's always a question of maturity. Hormones still might drive him to get attached to the wrong girl, no matter what he thinks he knows. A lot of the well known PUAs ended up getting attached to a woman.

 

[holidayad_]

Hello,

Short version:
How would you go about introducing your own son to pua/redpill?

Or if you are younger member and find it difficult to relate:

How you wished that your happily married old man would have told you about PU/redpill?

Long version:
Background/context
- Found PUA circa 22 years ago. The old days of ASF and later mASF. For good looking guy that had no social skills and no idea how to be around women it was pure gold. From zero to learning how to flying through clubs with 3s rule with my own routines. Totally awesome. XD
- Some plate-spinning, until I found my wife, married and we are still happily together after almost 20 years.
She is the second best thing to happen in my life. My pre-teen son is the best. Call me old fashioned, but my family means everything to me.

Without finding ASF I would be in a totally different, much worse, place in my life. Now the dilemma is how do I introduce my son to PUA/redpill taking in the good but avoiding the crap.

Pros of introducing to pua-community:
- Emphasis on self improvement and being alpha. Being a MAN mentally and physically instead of manlet-soyboy of today's popular culture is really something to go for whether you do it for women or not. Having mission, confidence, and goals in life is something man needs. IMHO the old days focused too much on pure game.
-Being a loser simp, clueless in relationships and taken advantage of is pure ****. I have seen my share of those and ****ed their chicks in my old days.
-Having successful and healthy relationships is really integral to success and happiness in life so this is something I’ll have to do.

Cons
-Total pua lifestyle with multiple spinning plates can be quite depressing and lonely. My hidden agenda is that I want grandkids someday. xD
-Integrating redpill to your persona without cynicism is not always easy. Understanding that women are just humans, with their own personal issues and flaws, like you and me, is not easy for everyone. One must understand that there are all kinds of people. Some are good for you and some are not. Identify and handle accordingly.
-There are really, really unsavory corners in the manosphere today that are full of total losers, from which I really would like to keep him away from. Blackpill crazies, incell communities etc.
-There is and has always been misogyny in the PUA community. Understandable concerning how people come here and some guys need this swift kick to the ass to stop pedestalizing women.
On the other hand, when taken too far, it is debilitating for everyday life. Most women that you interact with, you are not going to FC anyway. According to my life experience having the proverbial balls, being mentally strong and useful doesn’t require physical balls. I’d much rather take hardline boss-biatch to my team or network instead of some woke-soyboy-weakling with easily hurt feelings. Trust me. I know from experience.

The Plan: introduce him to lifestyle that will lead to high SMV when he’s adult.
-Took him already to lift weights with me. Men lift weights.
-Teaching him a growth mindset and value of hard work.
-Teaching him the basics of how to take care of himself: Diet, skincare, style etc.
-Emphasizing the importance of education. Masters degree at least. This is a high value trait and will be even more in the future since so many young men are dropping out. Also opportune time to go sarging in student parties..
-Teaching basics of social interactions and power dynamics. Try to make him also understand how basic male-female interactions work without making him think that women are somehow evil. Carefully introduce him to some selected pu-material when he is mature enough. Lover/provider frames, basic kino escalation etc.

What do you think?

I think that's very nice of you. I wish I'd had that kind of "direction" from my old man.

On the other hand, I'm glad I went through some sh*t on my own and still recovered and built my critical sense of how to act or not.

I think the ideal world would be a balance of the two.

 

[Macadellic]

I waited for my oldest nephew to turn 22 when I began to teach him the red pill.

He had a ltr all of high school and it ended when he was 21 so it was the perfect time to begin talking to him about women.

Now he is 24 and has a side gig as a photographer for girls on OnlyFns.

He still calls me and tells me what girls say and do and I am still mentoring him to this day.

 

[zekko]

Now he is 24 and has a side gig as a photographer for girls on OnlyFns.

See what you've done, lol?
Seriously, 22 seems like a good age for a lot of this stuff. If you're savvy at 22, wow you could clean up.
But I'd hit the self improvement stuff younger than that.

 

[Macadellic]

See what you've done, lol?

The only thing I did was tell him, when he asked “What should I put on my IG uncle Macadellic?”

Your IG is a highlight reel of your life. Post your accomplishments that you are proud of. Post an interest that you are passionate about it. Post your adventures that display your happiness.

He then has built quite the IG page for his passion in photography amongst other things. He then started getting DMs from OFs girls and women. These gals tell their other girl friends who did their photoshoot.

But I'd hit the self improvement stuff younger than that.

He’s always been on top of his game. It helps he grew up seeing me play soccer at a Cal State University and I told him, “Your studies come first, read a chapter, go to class, write a paper, take an exam and then you party.”

He figured out what he wanted to do after high school and he has his career at 24. He was also an athlete and still maintains his fitness.

 

[Cowboy-Cheems]

My only advice to youth is the following:

Manage your social circle well. This will ultimately be your most reliable path to meeting women, if done right.

Your social media success is only meaningfully measured by the women that DM you and meet you IRL, not follow you or exist in "online-only relationships". (I know this one sounds stupid, but I have encountered a lot of guys my age or a few years younger that are disgruntled after a failed online-only relationship; and never even felt the touch of a real female in their entire life.)

Choose a path that gets you the most money at a young age without too much stress. There are various trades such as HVAC and E&I that can get you well-paid at a young age without destroying your body on the jobsite or burdening yourself with Bachelor's degree student debt. It is hard to participate in any game when you are broke or have the body of 60 year old man at age 27. If you are dead-set on the University route, choose a major that has plentiful jobs and quick return on investment.

Do not ever become a victim of "one-itus." You and everyone else have no soulmate. It is logistically impossible and violates the premise of freewill.

Never let a woman in your life think she is irreplaceable. She will either use this to manipulate you for her gain, or she will just leave you on the assumption that you are a desperate fool that cannot get any other woman.

Always assume a woman is lying about her usage of contraceptives. Bring and use your own rubber that you know fits and has not been tampered with. "Pulling out" is not a viable form of contraceptive (There are other fluids that come out of your pecker prior to ejaculation that can indeed fertilize an egg.)

 

[TheGrindEqualsHappiness]

Also couple of things that I've been thinking:

- Most probably during the teenage years he'll consider the old man as the cringiest thing ever. So going to more esoteric parts of PU is out of question. "You should go clubbing wearing a funny hat like the Mystery guy from daddys youth. Thats how you get girls!", wont fly.

- Social skills are pretty hard to teach, they need to be learn in practise. I was thinking that one pretty awesome thing would be to get him into hobby where he would need to interact with girls of his age. Perhaps even get some into his social circle as a friends.
On the other hand I forced him against his will into into "girly" hobby like dancing, without him knowing the reason, whe would likely never talk to me again..
What would be good hobbies to try to get him into for getting used to being around girls?

 

[Stanley]

Don't actively teach your kid 'RedPill', instead show him by being a strong masculine role model in his life and guide him as he ages. Exposing youth to pickup and all that nonsense isn't going to go well in the long term

 

[NorwegianDJ]

The main thing is to remain open yourself.
When I read your post, I see someone that has a lot to learn about the world.
If you go to teach your son how things are, you might unwittingly give him a lot of murky karma to work through as he grows old enough to understand the world beyond you.
And you might be surprised, he will probably come to teach you more than you could ever teach him.

I don't subscribe to many of the opinions that float around in these parts.
I've tried them on and thrown them out.
Something that has me stop in my tracks a bit when I read your post, is your aversion to the "soyboy-manlet" whatever it is.
Can you describe this persona to me, beyond the stereotype?

You don't want to mould your kid to be the man of old, you want him to be the man of the new world.
You don't want him to spin plates and hook chicks and mack this and slap that. Sure, yes, all of that,
but what you want is a balanced human being that can function autonomously in the world and also has a strong sense of connection and belonging. You want a son with a happy family.
You need to accept that learning what it means to exist with your internal milieu; to flow in accordance to the energies flowing through you, is the top of the mountain of what it means to attain manhood.
This means that both you and your kid have to learn and embody, what it means to feel and to love.
That is the real work, and everybody, including yourself, will tell you otherwise.
Should you ignore that advice, perhaps you're just as well off taking the advice of misogynists and women-haters.

 

[mikedee]

Redpill is toxic and can cause a lot of damage.
It was created by mgtows and incels. When I discovered redpill I was like wow and started to apply the principles, result: 2 year dryspell.

When I realized that it's actually garbage, things started to improve and I started to get laid again.

The only thing from redpill that is useful is: "Dont be a simp", the rest is bs. RP is mgtows and incels distortion of dating and reality, not accurate at all.

 

[Cowboy-Cheems]

I think another key element that is overlooked by all ages is that women should only be a potential addition in your life, not a necessity. Make sure your son knows what a good and fulfilling lifestyle looks like with or without women in it. The most successful "pickups" I and many others I have known were initiated by accident and pushed further by applying game principles. If you go to night clubs, parties, bars etc. and expect to pickup women on a reliable and consistent basis, you will be sorely disappointed.

The real reliable pickup game is a successful marketing campaign of yourself. The guys I know that took orientation jobs on Campus often had women chasing after them constantly. They are one of the first guys that many incoming freshman girls encounter and being a familiar face on campus often draws attention from upper class girls as well. Participation in campus orgs also broadens your selections, whether it be Greek life or even the bowling team. The best "pickup line" will always be the one where you physically say nothing, but image of you burned into her mind after a brief encounter sings love songs to her.

 

[TheGrindEqualsHappiness]

Although this feels little bit like second joint comment, I really have to comment here:

When I read your post, I see someone that has a lot to learn about the world.
If you go to teach your son how things are, you might unwittingly give him a lot of murky karma to work through as he grows old enough to understand the world beyond you.

Could you elaborate bit here wit concrete example? What kind of things should I learn about world?
I don't see how getting someone to understand how the world actually works has anything to do with imaginary concept of karma?

Something that has me stop in my tracks a bit when I read your post, is your aversion to the "soyboy-manlet" whatever it is.
Can you describe this persona to me, beyond the stereotype?

Ok, I'll elaborate here and you elaborate on previous section, deal!

Typical beta/omega-male loser bred by todays popular culture. Typically leftist views if hasn't found incel community yet. Victim mentality. Takes no ownership of his life. Easily hurt ferlings, no toughness whatsoever. No goals or ambition. Loser and typically depressed because of that. Weak man and pushover. In my experience, typically also skinny-fat vegetarian.

And my point is that womens hypergamous nature is actually good thing. Striving for the same traits that make her pants wet, will make for much happier life overall for man:

Goals and ambition - check
Emotional stability - check
Good social skills - check
In good physical shape - check
Intelligent - check.(Inherited trait on big part, but education enhances.)
Takes care of himself - check
..the list is endless..

You don't want to mould your kid to be the man of old, you want him to be the man of the new world.
You don't want him to spin plates and hook chicks and mack this and slap that. Sure, yes, all of that,
but what you want is a balanced human being that can function autonomously in the world and also has a strong sense of connection and belonging. You want a son with a happy family.

Exactly this.

Thats were I differ quite a lot from status quo in manosphere. I'm currently married and my family means everything for me and really gives meaning to my life.(..call me beta if you wish..)
My hope is that my son would be able to have the same thing in his life too. And me also to have grandchildren some day..

In my opinion if man doesn't have a clue about how relationship dynamics work he's F:ed. And not in the literal sense. Might have been different thing 100 years ago, but not today.

This means that both you and your kid have to learn and embody, what it means to feel and to love.

Love is precious thing. And precious things should not be wasted on people who don't deserve them. Because then they are not precious anymore.

 

[TheGrindEqualsHappiness]

Redpill is toxic and can cause a lot of damage.
It was created by mgtows and incels. When I discovered redpill I was like wow and started to apply the principles, result: 2 year dryspell.

When I realized that it's actually garbage, things started to improve and I started to get laid again.

The only thing from redpill that is useful is: "Dont be a simp", the rest is bs. RP is mgtows and incels distortion of dating and reality, not accurate at all.

Yep there are corners in todays manosphere that are downright crazy. "In the good old days" PUA forums pretty much lacked the whiners.(incel and mgtow -types) The idea was to get your sh1t together and those who didn't were ridiculed

 

[NorwegianDJ]

Although this feels little bit like second joint comment, I really have to comment here:



Could you elaborate bit here wit concrete example? What kind of things should I learn about world?
I don't see how getting someone to understand how the world actually works has anything to do with imaginary concept of karma?

What I saw in your post was someone that still has a lot of the redpill stuff disproportionately weighed in their model of how to be in the world. This is obviously my own opinion, based on the little you reveal.
A big chunk of what you present to teach your son is still what I view as surface level objects and just another box to place yourself in, in order to get on the ladder and be "successful".
I've experienced that I've moved away from some of those directions and towards others that are entirely under the radar for these communities. I've found and I'm finding that it is akin to a 2nd birth, that there is something to learning to be a human and unlearning to be a thinking machine and automaton.
That's where I draw my statement from: that I clearly see the world differently from you, and I've experienced that shift as essential to the wonders that I experience in my life. And I can draw a clear line, because I also came of age in this PUA culture. Therefore I assume that you could have a lot to learn yet.
Moreover, I guarantee you that you do, irrespective of me and my opinions. That's just the name of the game. For you to remain open to all the places you come up short and ignorant, that is the greatest gift you can provide yourself and your family.

Typical beta/omega-male loser bred by todays popular culture. Typically leftist views if hasn't found incel community yet. Victim mentality. Takes no ownership of his life. Easily hurt ferlings, no toughness whatsoever. No goals or ambition. Loser and typically depressed because of that. Weak man and pushover. In my experience, typically also skinny-fat vegetarian.

And my point is that womens hypergamous nature is actually good thing. Striving for the same traits that make her pants wet, will make for much happier life overall for man:

Goals and ambition - check
Emotional stability - check
Good social skills - check
In good physical shape - check
Intelligent - check.(Inherited trait on big part, but education enhances.)
Takes care of himself - check
..the list is endless..

Your opinions on leftist views and easily hurt feelings cause alarm in me.
Obviously we agree. People like to scream and be loud and ignorant.
At the same time, boxing out leftists and sensitivity is a major red flag.

Thats were I differ quite a lot from status quo in manosphere. I'm currently married and my family means everything for me and really gives meaning to my life.(..call me beta if you wish..)
My hope is that my son would be able to have the same thing in his life too. And me also to have grandchildren some day..

In my opinion if man doesn't have a clue about how relationship dynamics work he's F:ed. And not in the literal sense. Might have been different thing 100 years ago, but not today.



Love is precious thing. And precious things should not be wasted on people who don't deserve them. Because then they are not precious anymore.

I feel that, much more important than any sort of knowledge you impart, the felt nature; the intimacy of your relationship reaches far beyond anything you could teach him. It shifts the focus and the question.
The questions are now in a different category and instead of having to control your son, they are under your control.

1. How can you become more intimate with yourself?
Because you can only see so far into another person as you've seen yourself.
The real work, is your inner connection. Everything else is but a distraction. Karma.

2. How can you tangibly work on your relationship?
How can you deepen connection and belonging? How can you find more love within your family? How can you be the conduit of this love? What does it take for this felt space of peace and joy and living-breathing presence to unfold each and every day? How are these moments formed?

On that path, you may come to find that love is indeed precious, but it is also abundant.

 

[TheGrindEqualsHappiness]

What I saw in your post was someone that still has a lot of the redpill stuff disproportionately weighed in their model of how to be in the world. This is obviously my own opinion, based on the little you reveal.
A big chunk of what you present to teach your son is still what I view as surface level objects and just another box to place yourself in, in order to get on the ladder and be "successful".

When you check the statistics, the "successful"(= high socio-economic status) people live healthier and happier lives. They are also more likely to be in long term relationships and less likely to be divorced. These are pretty much the things I'd wish for my son also.

And also when it comes to understanding basics of evolutionary psychology in human mate choice and in relationships, social dynamics and good social skills they are really indespensable to have a happy relationship as a man.

As I kind of mentioned in the OP, if I didn't find ASF long time a go and learned enough game, I would have never had a chance with my wife. ( At least once I opened my mouth, the looks are not enough.. )
And also most likely would have never even opened her.

I really wish that once my son finds a keeper, he will have necessary skills to get and keep her.

That's where I draw my statement from: that I clearly see the world differently from you, and I've experienced that shift as essential to the wonders that I experience in my life. And I can draw a clear line, because I also came of age in this PUA culture. Therefore I assume that you could have a lot to learn yet.

You're most welcome to have different opinnion than me and I understand your viewpoint here also.
Many guys have really hard time integrating the red pill reality into their personas if they previously have been living in total fantasy land.
The paradigm shift for some men can be too strong and they become disillusioned and start to think that all women are somehow evil. That's a shame too.