The obsession with foreign women is a fantasy tale cope

[Luni]

Fellas whats in the water lately?

Everyone is being so damn sensitive these days. 2 pages in and already four people are "done replying " because of pity disagreements. Yet i haven't seen many constructive comments about why it's "good or bad".

Let me say it like this: personally it's something that's always in the back of my mind, like with most western men who had struggled with women . What IF a foreign woman was the solution all along? Due to perhaps ego laziness and the lack of ability to travel overseas with an abundance it's something I've never even considered.

90 days is ofcourse a rather extreme social experiment. The culture differences magnifies the already challenging dynamics between a man and a woman. From that pov it might not be the best example , even tho it's tempting to use it.

So what's left is WHOLE lotta questions and unknowns. Personally I can't even have a strong opinion rather than a gut feeling. Looking forward to actually hear why its a good or actually a bad idea.

from my observations, feminism in foreign countries is a good 15-20 years behind the west. western women are subconsciously realizing it's bs. meanwhile, the latinas et al are eating it up. the intersexual dynamics are disastrous. no thanks.

 

[Canadian_Man]

The fact is that you are criticizing my OP on a literal cherry picked fallacy from a poster that supports said ideology and giving me a lecture on how to construct an argument while the RP posters have done nothing but commit fallacies and support their claims off hyperboles, straw man’s, and attacking me as a whole. Don’t even try to hide behind the curtain bro, I can hear the duck quacking

You're making assumptions, again.

I didn't read any of the other replies to this thread before replying myself.


You didn't happen to see my edit, before you replied.

The edit from the last post:

(I happen to like reading your opinions, by the way. Different perspectives are usually helpful).

If I were pressed to give an opinion on the topic, it would start with the caveat that I don't have enough information to really assess the issue accurately.

I've dated both local (Canadian) women and foreign women (whom had moved to Canada/The US), but not enough of the latter to make an experience-based judgement of non-Western women.

From a theoretical point of view, I can see why it's believed that Westernization is part of the problem with modern Western dating with non-foreigners.

However, this idealization of a non-Western woman probably doesn't take into account other possibly undesireable realities about said women, nor individual variance if it's taken to the extreme.

I would assume each type of woman comes with their own challenges.

Which is better overall? I really don't know


As for the cope angle, I agree it could be a cope, though that will vary from individual to individual

i.e., is said person just complaining about the state of modern Western dating without doing anything about it?
Do they fantasize about those foreign women but not make an effort to date them in some capacity?

If so, then it could be in 'cope' territory.


So no, I'm not simply "attacking part of your post while secretly really wanting to attack all of it".

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

THE THREAD STARTED AT 0632 SYSTEM TIME.

286 minutes / 42 posts = ~ 1 post every 7 minutes...

 

[CornbreadFed]

You're making assumptions, again.

I didn't read any of the other replies to this thread before replying myself.


You didn't happen to see my edit, before you replied.

The edit from the last post:



If I were pressed to give an opinion on the topic, it would start with the caveat that I don't have enough information to really assess the issue accurately.

I've dated both local (Canadian) women and foreign women (whom had moved to Canada/The US), but not enough of the latter to make an experience-based judgement of non-Western women.

From a theoretical point of view, I can see why it's believed that Westernization is part of the problem with modern Western dating with non-foreigners.

However, this idealization of a non-Western woman probably doesn't take into account other possibly undesireable realities about said women, nor individual variance if it's taken to the extreme.

I would assume each type of woman comes with their own challenges.

Which is better overall? I really don't know


As for the cope angle, I agree it could be a cope, though that will vary from individual to individual

i.e., is said person just complaining about the state of modern Western dating without doing anything about it?
Do they fantasize about those foreign women but not make an effort to date them in some capacity?

If so, then it could be in 'cope' territory.


So no, I'm not simply "attacking part of your post while secretly really wanting to attack all of it".

understood, my bad

 

[MatureDJ]

I’ve been watching 90-day fiancé Uk and I just do not get how men in the manosphere can hype up foreign women so much. The one from Kazakhstan in particular is a fvcking bvtch and I would never want that thing in my house lol. Furthermore, the majority of my relationships have been with women not born in America so no I’m not speaking from inexperience: India (Kashmir), Poland, Australia, Argentina, Chile, Mexico, and Japan. Here are the honest truths about dating a foreign woman.

1). Cultural Differences - These usually aren't a problem during the honeymoon phase, but after a few months, they start to become apparent. Even women from other western countries are going to be different. In reality, it is going to be you who has to suck it up and deal with the differences, especially if you want your woman to be as preserved as possible. Lastly, you may encounter conflicts with traditionalism. For instance, even if you are a right-wing American, you are liberal compared to a conservative from Iran, for example. It is not uncommon for an American to grow up in a healthy family environment and just not be into catering resources and time to family events & holidays. However, people from other cultures, like Iranians, tend to be more devoted to their traditional families.

2). They are women at the end of the day- Any guy that hypes of foreign women as this end all be all is either A). Selling you Snake Oil, B). A guy that cannot get laid and is just regurgitating shvt he listened/read, or C). Has never gone beyond a honeymoon phase with a foreign woman due to only interacting with them through transactional relationships or casual sex encounters. In reality, they are going to operate just like any other woman. If they like you than they will respect and care for you, if they do not like you then they will combative. Furthermore, they can be way worse than American women according to my experience, stories I read on the internet, and watching murder episodes on Investigation Discovery.

3). The End Goal of Marriage or a Long-Distance Relationship will always be staring you at gunpoint - Every non-citizen foreign girl I have dated has had Visa scares and paranoia about it being revoked. Even in the "90-day fiancé" show, they are always worried about Visa issues. Women with strong visas tend to be in college, career higher ups, established business owners, and academics. AKA The Women y'all complain about lol. Becoming an American citizen is not an easy task and can take even decades of living here to obtain. The easiest solution to this is through marriage, but that entails a strong commitment. Remember that strong family connection I mentioned in point 1? Yeah, now that's your family and responsibility now lol!

4). So why do I prefer to date non-American women? I am not going to lie to you and sell you this fairy tale myth of them being super submissive, non-combative, and etc. There are a lot of issues with these women, but I simply cannot emotionally connect with American women due to my roguish/vagabond personality and the negative racial history of this country. For example, American women tend to have interests outside Football, Kim Kardashian, making politics her main identity and consider Panda Express and Taco Bell as exotic. While I can meet a Chilean woman and have a better chance of having a conversation outside those topics. Yes, there's a huge chance that she does like Football and Kim Kardashian, but it is usually secondary or not her main focus. All I am trying to say is to remove the rose-colored lenses and snake oil cologne and smell the wonderful smell of reality.

I can speak as someone with authority on this subject.

Yes, the 90-day thing is quite a "Indiana Jones walking across the gorge" thing. (My MO has pretty much been to live with my woman for a while before getting "legally entangled" with marriage and visa sponsorship.) And there were (are still?) a fair number of women who have a boyfriend that has already immigrated somehow to wealthy country, and they look upon some idiot foreign man as a ticket to immigrate themself - and in the USA, sue him for I-864 foreign-wife sponsorship alimony to boot.

The cultural differences aren't really that much, but the fact that her parents are still quote poor while you two are living decently does make the gal expect that you support the in-laws (this is especially true for the Philippines). I suppose that if the man is not a cosmopolitan, he will look down upon such differences.

As for the whole idea of foreign women, let's call a spade a spade - it's because the man can get a more desirable women abroad than be can at home, for whatever reason, like being short - and the woman can score a man or more means. If this dynamic were not at play, this would not be a meme.

 

[MatureDJ]

90-day fiancé seems like a fun study exercise. having dealt with many foreign ladies, i must concur. yet unlike you, western women are my bread and butter. especially when sprinkled with european sophistication a la francaise ou a la swisse. too much class to ignore. the foreign women these passport bros are chasing simply lack nuance. they may be feminine but they lack a certain finish.

How tall are you?

 

[Luni]

How tall are you?

lol 6ft 185lbs negro right here

 

[MatureDJ]

No dude, she is nice to you because she needs that Green Card. She is nice because she needs that visa. She is nice because she actually has some use for you. Western women have no obligation or motive to be nice to you, they are set.

So what is your advice for a man whose only options are a fat American woman, or an American single mommy? Ascend by getting better at Game? Lift, bro? (What if he already is lifting?) FaceMaxxing? Leg-Lengthening? The fact is that you have NO answers for this guy - and if foreign women were not an option, it would be SO OVER for him.

 

[MatureDJ]

lol 6ft 185lbs negro right here

You have the height to ascend. Of course, that is not always enough for a black man to ascend, as evidenced by @corrector, FaceAndLMS, Oreo Man, etc.

 

[Canadian_Man]

understood, my bad

No worries.

May have DM'd instead if I had thought my original comment was going to lead to thread derailment.

 

[Luni]

You have the minimum height to ascend.

speaking of copium.. spent 3 years in the gutter learning intersexual dynamics and game. might have good genetics but the rest was extensive lab and fieldwork. can no longer recognize myself since i was shattered to pieces after a 7 year relationship. Again, thank you Rollo

 

[CornbreadFed]

So what is your advice for a man whose only options are a fat American woman, or an American single mommy? Ascend by getting better at Game? Lift, bro? (What if he already is lifting?) FaceMaxxing? Leg-Lengthening? The fact is that you have NO answers for this guy - and if foreign women were not an option, it would be SO OVER for him.

I'm 6ft 2 and black and these were literally my options at some point in time until I revised my game and logistics.

 

[Smooth_texter]

I’ve been watching 90-day fiancé Uk and I just do not get how men in the manosphere can hype up foreign women so much. The one from Kazakhstan in particular is a fvcking bvtch and I would never want that thing in my house lol. Furthermore, the majority of my relationships have been with women not born in America so no I’m not speaking from inexperience: India (Kashmir), Poland, Australia, Argentina, Chile, Mexico, and Japan. Here are the honest truths about dating a foreign woman.

1). Cultural Differences - These usually aren't a problem during the honeymoon phase, but after a few months, they start to become apparent. Even women from other western countries are going to be different. In reality, it is going to be you who has to suck it up and deal with the differences, especially if you want your woman to be as preserved as possible. Lastly, you may encounter conflicts with traditionalism. For instance, even if you are a right-wing American, you are liberal compared to a conservative from Iran, for example. It is not uncommon for an American to grow up in a healthy family environment and just not be into catering resources and time to family events & holidays. However, people from other cultures, like Iranians, tend to be more devoted to their traditional families.

2). They are women at the end of the day- Any guy that hypes of foreign women as this end all be all is either A). Selling you Snake Oil, B). A guy that cannot get laid and is just regurgitating shvt he listened/read, or C). Has never gone beyond a honeymoon phase with a foreign woman due to only interacting with them through transactional relationships or casual sex encounters. In reality, they are going to operate just like any other woman. If they like you than they will respect and care for you, if they do not like you then they will combative. Furthermore, they can be way worse than American women according to my experience, stories I read on the internet, and watching murder episodes on Investigation Discovery.

3). The End Goal of Marriage or a Long-Distance Relationship will always be staring you at gunpoint - Every non-citizen foreign girl I have dated has had Visa scares and paranoia about it being revoked. Even in the "90-day fiancé" show, they are always worried about Visa issues. Women with strong visas tend to be in college, career higher ups, established business owners, and academics. AKA The Women y'all complain about lol. Becoming an American citizen is not an easy task and can take even decades of living here to obtain. The easiest solution to this is through marriage, but that entails a strong commitment. Remember that strong family connection I mentioned in point 1? Yeah, now that's your family and responsibility now lol!

4). So why do I prefer to date non-American women? I am not going to lie to you and sell you this fairy tale myth of them being super submissive, non-combative, and etc. There are a lot of issues with these women, but I simply cannot emotionally connect with American women due to my roguish/vagabond personality and the negative racial history of this country. For example, American women tend to have interests outside Football, Kim Kardashian, making politics her main identity and consider Panda Express and Taco Bell as exotic. While I can meet a Chilean woman and have a better chance of having a conversation outside those topics. Yes, there's a huge chance that she does like Football and Kim Kardashian, but it is usually secondary or not her main focus. All I am trying to say is to remove the rose-colored lenses and snake oil cologne and smell the wonderful smell of reality.

Hi OP.

I have not watched the show, nor do I have all the stats.

However, as a slav that was born and still living in Eastern Europe (on the Balkans), I have observed a few situations here and there.
From what at least I have seen, my fellow countrywomen prefer men from their homeland. Even if they migrate abroad, they usually do so with a men with whom they were already in an LTR or find a fellow countrymen in our communities in a given country.

The whole notion of being American, British or whatever gets Eastern European women to spread their legs is not correct. Our women are quite passionate and usually deal only with men that give them the "feelz" (like anywhere else in the world, but usually its to their countrymen). I cannot comment on Ukrainian or Russian women, as I do not have experience with them.

Unfortunately, it pains me to say that I watched most of the conservatism and values get destroyed in the last 20-25 years, and the dramatic changes in society, and in women. Now everybody is a social media junkie, boss babes (again, like in every other country) and even OLD is not frowned upon.

 

[MatureDJ]

Hi OP.

I have not watched the show, nor do I have all the stats.

However, as a slav that was born and still living in Eastern Europe (on the Balkans), I have observed a few situations here and there.
From what at least I have seen, my fellow countrywomen prefer men from their homeland. Even if they migrate abroad, they usually do so with a men with whom they were already in an LTR or find a fellow countrymen in our communities in a given country.

The whole notion of being American, British or whatever gets Eastern European women to spread their legs is not correct. Our women are quite passionate and usually deal only with men that give them the "feelz" (like anywhere else in the world, but usually its to their countrymen). I cannot comment on Ukrainian or Russian women, as I do not have experience with them.

Unfortunately, it pains me to say that I watched most of the conservatism and values get destroyed in the last 20-25 years, and the dramatic changes in society, and in women. Now everybody is a social media junkie, boss babes (again, like in every other country) and even OLD is not frowned upon.

Which country? Bulgaria?

 

[Millard Fillmore]

I don't know what "obsession" there is about foreign women unless you're talking about incels digging in third world countries for brides, which is not a "DJ" practice.

My experience is I've dated/banged lots of women from around the world, but I lived in NYC and also travel a lot. On balance I've found Yankee women to be bytchier, it's just how they're raised and part of their game. Not hard to get around for a lay but not something I want long term. Even most Euro chicks are more chill (and don't have that annoying shrill Karen voice). So it's a general preference for me but there are always exceptions.

However again I slay women wherever I am because I get out and do, do, do. Not going to wait for a vacation and hope for some princess. They are all women and each to be judged on her merits. Most are a lot of fun if your frame is on point. The cope is when guys go sex-touring bc they can't close at home.

 

[SW15]

So what is your advice for a man whose only options are a fat American woman, or an American single mommy? Ascend by getting better at Game? Lift, bro? (What if he already is lifting?) FaceMaxxing? Leg-Lengthening? The fact is that you have NO answers for this guy - and if foreign women were not an option, it would be SO OVER for him.

Getting big muscles is a key component of game. It's best to be 6'0"+ with big muscles. That's the best way to seduce women. Game is some combination of looks, money, status, and personality. I believe that looks are the most important variable in this.

One of the best seducers I know in my in-person life is a 5'5" guy. He has a triple digit notch count in a Western nation (USA). He's more of an outlier than anything but he does his seducing based on swiping and personality. He tends to get with batshiit crazy chicks, including some American single moms.

Neil Strauss transformed from an incel/borderline incel to an effective seducer in his 30s by hanging out with Mystery and other PUAs as a 5'6" balding man. That's impressive, but I also consider Neil Strauss an outlier too.

Most men in Western nations do not have the option to relocate to a more traditional nation in Eastern Europe, Latin America, or Asia. In the late 2000s, I explored international relocation options and could not get close to making it a reality. After this failed exploration, I decided to stay in the United States.

I don't know what "obsession" there is about foreign women unless you're talking about incels digging in third world countries for brides, which is not a "DJ" practice.

There are Western men who relocate to Eastern Europe, Latin America, and Asia for the purposes of seduction and mating.

Roosh was one of these men before his conversion to Christianity.

@MatureDJ left the United States in order to go to Eastern Europe to try to get his penis wet more efficiently and/or effectively. In the United States, @MatureDJ was a crap prospect due to height. Even in his 20s in the late 1980s/1990s (when women were less demanding on height preferences than the last 15-20 years), his height was deemed insufficient by most United States women and he was sent to the rejection pile. In the last 15-20 years, women are sending an even larger percentage of men to the rejection pile.

MGTOWs are typically men sent to the rejection pile by women. No man who is an effective seducer identifies with the MGTOW movement.

My experience is I've dated/banged lots of women from around the world, but I lived in NYC and also travel a lot. On balance I've found Yankee women to be bytchier, it's just how they're raised and part of their game. Not hard to get around for a lay but not something I want long term. Even most Euro chicks are more chill (and don't have that annoying shrill Karen voice). So it's a general preference for me but there are always exceptions.

However again I slay women wherever I am because I get out and do, do, do. Not going to wait for a vacation and hope for some princess. They are all women and each to be judged on her merits. Most are a lot of fun if your frame is on point. The cope is when guys go sex-touring bc they can't close at home.

True. Very good!

 

[DreamAgain]

It is a double edged sword. Fundamentally though if you cannot assimilate into her culture by becoming fluent in the language of wherever you go, observant and perhaps a fan of the music, cuisine, tv/movies, whatever else, you will be ostracized.

This is the fundamental problem I have with going abroad and trying to game foreign women. You have to become assimilated enough to detach the foreign label, so they become local women to you. But, the issue with this is that, by and large, the places you go are much worse economically, intellectually, culturally than where you came from.

My family is from EE and I have visited the country of where they are from many times. Education is terrible for the most part, failing infrastructure, corruption is rampant and will affect your daily life, the politics of the country are a disaster. Most people live in poverty except for some skilled IT workers and people who get political favors or criminals.

Your trade off for conservative values from the women are low education level, a general lack of ability to think critically and be interesting, but yes she will follow the script and take care of the house for you if you really care about this, and put more of an effort into her appearance.

 

[Manure Spherian]

I’ve been watching 90-day fiancé Uk and I just do not get how men in the manosphere can hype up foreign women so much. The one from Kazakhstan in particular is a fvcking bvtch and I would never want that thing in my house lol. Furthermore, the majority of my relationships have been with women not born in America so no I’m not speaking from inexperience: India (Kashmir), Poland, Australia, Argentina, Chile, Mexico, and Japan. Here are the honest truths about dating a foreign woman.

1). Cultural Differences - These usually aren't a problem during the honeymoon phase, but after a few months, they start to become apparent. Even women from other western countries are going to be different. In reality, it is going to be you who has to suck it up and deal with the differences, especially if you want your woman to be as preserved as possible. Lastly, you may encounter conflicts with traditionalism. For instance, even if you are a right-wing American, you are liberal compared to a conservative from Iran, for example. It is not uncommon for an American to grow up in a healthy family environment and just not be into catering resources and time to family events & holidays. However, people from other cultures, like Iranians, tend to be more devoted to their traditional families.

2). They are women at the end of the day- Any guy that hypes of foreign women as this end all be all is either A). Selling you Snake Oil, B). A guy that cannot get laid and is just regurgitating shvt he listened/read, or C). Has never gone beyond a honeymoon phase with a foreign woman due to only interacting with them through transactional relationships or casual sex encounters. In reality, they are going to operate just like any other woman. If they like you than they will respect and care for you, if they do not like you then they will combative. Furthermore, they can be way worse than American women according to my experience, stories I read on the internet, and watching murder episodes on Investigation Discovery.

3). The End Goal of Marriage or a Long-Distance Relationship will always be staring you at gunpoint - Every non-citizen foreign girl I have dated has had Visa scares and paranoia about it being revoked. Even in the "90-day fiancé" show, they are always worried about Visa issues. Women with strong visas tend to be in college, career higher ups, established business owners, and academics. AKA The Women y'all complain about lol. Becoming an American citizen is not an easy task and can take even decades of living here to obtain. The easiest solution to this is through marriage, but that entails a strong commitment. Remember that strong family connection I mentioned in point 1? Yeah, now that's your family and responsibility now lol!

4). So why do I prefer to date non-American women? I am not going to lie to you and sell you this fairy tale myth of them being super submissive, non-combative, and etc. There are a lot of issues with these women, but I simply cannot emotionally connect with American women due to my roguish/vagabond personality and the negative racial history of this country. For example, American women tend to have interests outside Football, Kim Kardashian, making politics her main identity and consider Panda Express and Taco Bell as exotic. While I can meet a Chilean woman and have a better chance of having a conversation outside those topics. Yes, there's a huge chance that she does like Football and Kim Kardashian, but it is usually secondary or not her main focus. All I am trying to say is to remove the rose-colored lenses and snake oil cologne and smell the wonderful smell of reality.

Do you intend to eventually marry?

If you don’t plan to settle down with any women, does any of this matter? I’m asking seriously.

 

[CornbreadFed]

Do you intend to eventually marry?

If you don’t plan to settle down with any women, does any of this matter? I’m asking seriously.

If you found a really nice girl that you connected with and she saw you as her first priority, are you really going to tell her to kick rocks because Spin plates bro?

 

[Manure Spherian]

If you found a really nice girl that you connected with and she saw you as her first priority, are you really going to tell her to kick rocks because Spin plates bro?

I’d propose, which I did. I wouldn’t indefinitely date a woman as a man over 22 years old. I can’t say I wholeheartedly endorse marriage in this day and age though I chose to take the risks. Nor do I tell others to get married. I simply don’t see a point in being in relationships and being a “boyfriend”.

You said you dated various women. Were any marriage worthy?

I believe spinning plates is pushed by Rollo Tomassi so that men don’t move onto something else in their lives.