the system doc love vs the rational male opininion?

[taiyuu_otoko]

"The Rational Male" is philosophical.
"The System" is a process for men the screen out women.

I tend to agree. Rational Male tries to explain why things happen, which tends to give guys a feeling of "superiority" while they continue to hang out on the sidelines and rationalize their outside-the-game sour-grapes MGTOW approach.

Doc Love is for guys who want to get in the game, stay in the game, and do better than they have been. More of a How To guide.

 

[Divorced w 3]

I tend to agree. Rational Male tries to explain why things happen, which tends to give guys a feeling of "superiority" while they continue to hang out on the sidelines and rationalize their outside-the-game sour-grapes MGTOW approach.

Doc Love is for guys who want to get in the game, stay in the game, and do better than they have been. More of a How To guide.

Have you read Rational Male?

 

[Dr.Suave]

@jiggolo71

Comfort + Sexual tension = Good

Comfort + No sexual tension = Friendzone

 

[Gamisch]

Somehow this discussion always feels like boomers saying; " Jimmy Hendrix was the best guitar player EVER.

Are there better players now? Ofcourse. Jimmy was groundbreaking in his time, and arguably without him MOST modern players would have different influences and thus the overall sound of music might've been different now.

Newsflash gentlemen; there aint no such thing as a 100% airtight book with advice about women. Just like you wont find a perfect solution for boxing, or chess. Each " master" has his own view, and you as the player gotta be able to separate fiction from facts.

Your role as a man is to make a date that could potentially end in sex. A virgin that will make you wait for 10 dates before sex doesn't guarantee a long lasting relationship, same as a girl fvcking you the first night.

That's what dating is having fun and making a connection. All girls wanna fvck, either with you or with someone else.

Most guys are afc puzzy beggers, then we put ourselves above them, improving game, physique and money, then when a girl responds sexually enthusiastic, we say she's a hoe, complete nonsense.

The MAN always plays the most important role in all this. Each man , situation and interaction with a woman is unique. Just because she had a ONS once in her life doesn't mean she now is obligated to put out with every man first night for the rest of her life. There could be a million factors at play that determine the outcome (vibe , alcohol ,timing ect)

 

[Gamisch]

@jiggolo71

Comfort + Sexual tension = Good

Comfort + No sexual tension = Friendzone

Comfort + s tension =good /her best option
Comfort +no s tension = provider /cuck bF
No comfort + s tension = feckboy
No comfort + no tension = friendzone

 

[pipeman84]

Most guys are afc puzzy beggers, then we put ourselves above them, improving game, physique and money, then when a girl responds sexually enthusiastic, we say she's a hoe, complete nonsense.

I say she's a hoe because she responds sexually enthusiastic to 5 guys in 2 years while in casual relationships and then to one guy she meets on vacation. Rollo implies all girls are like that particularly in what he calls their party years (early 20s), you know the example with the Cancun foam party girl who has ONS and then makes the beta guy wait 6 dates. So the egregious thing he does is he takes the example of one hoe and assumes all girls in their 20s are like that or if they're over 30, that they were like that.
I want to make the clear distinction between girls that wait because they want to get to know the guy better and establish an emotional connection and the hoe that uses the waiting game as a manipulation tool.

 

[Divorced w 3]

Bottom line is, assume she's fvcking multiple guys and act accordingly, spinning multiple plates until she brings a value that nobody else can.

Even if she’s not banging multiple guys, she’s entertaining the thought of it. She’s wired, hormonally and mentally from birth, to find a high quality provider- and Rollo, Richard et all are NOT WRONG when they point out that they are the ultimate plate spinner. “Hard to get” “make him work for it” etc, these cliches stand the test of time for a reason.

there is nothing wrong with understanding that women operate for survival and so do men. You can’t fight reality no matter how much you want to try. Otherwise Buddhism wouldn’t exist lol.

I was out this summer with an attorney. She even lived at home. She probably makes 150+ with no overhead. 32 years old. Attractive. Socially a little introverted but whatever. First thing she says to me at dinner. I want a saber tooth tiger. I’m like no problem got you covered I am mean in the streets. Shes like no professionally, etc.

take it or leave it.

 

[RangerMIke]

One of the biggest issues now with "The System" is the changes in technology since it was written in the 1990s. He was writing when home phones were most dominant. Most people didn't even have basic cell phones then, let alone smartphones were text messaging was the primary communication medium. @EyeBRollin has written about how someone can adapt the Doc Love principles with newer tech forms.

This is the hardest thing for old dudes like me (50 plus) to get used to. I am not comfortable with texting, on-line dating, or social media... so I just don't do it. I can get away with it since I'm older, so women excuse my reluctance, but you young guys have to master smart phone dating. To me it all looks like weak behavior... I know it isn't, it's just the way things are now. I am not knocking it... I just can't do it without coming off as ridiculous.

The only other thing I don't like about "The System", which is mostly pretty good is how Doc Love describes 'interest level'. In "the System' it is all about interest level. IMO that is over simplification, but there really isn't anything wrong with that but in reality... there is 'attraction' and 'interest'. "The Rational Male" IMO better describes what is going on. "The System" says a woman has to have 50% interest: "The Rational Male" says she has to be attracted to you.

I know why Doc Love does this because he's all about screening out women and he doesn't care why she gets screened out, only that it happens. But really attraction is a function of her perceived LMS you have. Interest is confidence, control, and challenge (CCC). LMS is internal: CCC is external. Doc Love assumes you are already the best version of yourself you can be (LMS), for many this isn't true. The System still works without self improvement, but the quality of woman you attract is not going to be as good as it could be if you don't work on LMS. The better looking, more money, and improved social status you have the more women will like you.

 

[pipeman84]

I know why Doc Love does this because he's all about screening out women and he doesn't care why she gets screened out, only that it happens. But really attraction is a function of her perceived LMS you have. Interest is confidence, control, and challenge (CCC). LMS is internal: CCC is external. Doc Love assumes you are already the best version of yourself you can be (LMS), for many this isn't true. The System still works without self improvement, but the quality of woman you attract is not going to be as good as it could be if you don't work on LMS. The better looking, more money, and improved social status you have the more women will like you.

Here is where Doc shines in my opinion...he's all about genuine interest (attraction is not a choice), not the interested type of attraction, ie gold diggers. He even tells the story of a dentist (I don't know if it was true or tongue in cheek to send a message) who for the first 2 months of dating a woman tells her he is in construction business, all to play down his actual monetary worth. To be in a relationship with a woman who is with you for your money or social status while you think she is actually in love with you is as pathetic as it can get.

 

[SW15]

Desperate housewives the show existed for a reason.

This is a ridiculous point. Desperate Housewives aired from 2004-2012. Right now in 2022, that's a dated reference. Additionally, back in 2004-2012, women under 35 weren't watching the show. Desperate Housewives' audience in those days was typically 35-54 year old married women or upscale divorcees with kids in that same range. The Desperate Housewives characters themselves fit that demographic I described in the last sentence.

One of the biggest issues now with "The System" is the changes in technology since it was written in the 1990s. He was writing when home phones were most dominant. Most people didn't even have basic cell phones then, let alone smartphones were text messaging was the primary communication medium. @EyeBRollin has written about how someone can adapt the Doc Love principles with newer tech forms.

This is the hardest thing for old dudes like me (50 plus) to get used to. I am not comfortable with texting, on-line dating, or social media... so I just don't do it. I can get away with it since I'm older, so women excuse my reluctance, but you young guys have to master smart phone dating. To me it all looks like weak behavior... I know it isn't, it's just the way things are now. I am not knocking it... I just can't do it without coming off as ridiculous.

It's not even just young people who need to manage the smartphone in dating. I'm 39 and in middle age. If a guy wants to even date a 30 something today, the smartphone is a big part of the process.

I cut out swipe apps and I don't send DMs on Instagram.

I try to limit contact with women on smartphones to logistics only but even that can be a challenge. Perhaps I need to improve my frame on that issue.

If you're not doing much texting, it's essentially impossible to date anyone born in 1981 or later. It has been that way since ~2010.

 

[Divorced w 3]

This is a ridiculous point. Desperate Housewives aired from 2004-2012. Right now in 2022, that's a dated reference. Additionally, back in 2004-2012, women under 35 weren't watching the show. Desperate Housewives' audience in those days was typically 35-54 year old married women or upscale divorcees with kids in that same range. The Desperate Housewives characters themselves fit that demographic I described in the last sentence.





It's not even just young people who need to manage the smartphone in dating. I'm 39 and in middle age. If a guy wants to even date a 30 something today, the smartphone is a big part of the process.

I cut out swipe apps and I don't send DMs on Instagram.

I try to limit contact with women on smartphones to logistics only but even that can be a challenge. Perhaps I need to improve my frame on that issue.

If you're not doing much texting, it's essentially impossible to date anyone born in 1981 or later. It has been that way since ~2010.

I’m a ridiculous person