Am I okay looking?

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In Russia I've seen a lot a hot Russian girls with skinny below average guys, they looked like everything but masculine... And they had hot girlfriends. I see the same thing here in the Czech Republic.
There is no differnece in being ugly and skinny but being/looking rough. You can have the body of a beast but have babyface because your balls haven't dropped yet. On the other hand if you speak of young couples you have seen in the metropolitan areas in Russia I am not surprised, moreso when you mentioned Czech Republic which has the same issue of inverted sex roles like Germany. You can be a skinny tough mother****er and pull girls with no problem. But if you are a soft sissyboy you won't pull quality women, only masculinized ones. I don't consider Czech/Poland to be Eastern Europe bc they are far too westernized.
 

mikedee

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There is no differnece in being ugly and skinny but being/looking rough. You can have the body of a beast but have babyface because your balls haven't dropped yet. On the other hand if you speak of young couples you have seen in the metropolitan areas in Russia I am not surprised, moreso when you mentioned Czech Republic which has the same issue of inverted sex roles like Germany. You can be a skinny tough mother****er and pull girls with no problem. But if you are a soft sissyboy you won't pull quality women, only masculinized ones. I don't consider Czech/Poland to be Eastern Europe bc they are far too westernized.
I agree with you, but the guys I saw didn't look like tough guys, they looked like shlt, but yes I was in Moscow. My point is, I'm above average and tall but I don't look like a tough guy and I managed to pull a lot of really hot girls. I don't look tough but I don't look like I'm boring or soft. I guess that makes a difference.
 

Bigpapa

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Normally I would agree. However, he asked for his appearance to be dissected. I agree, his physical appearance is not a limitation. But if he is asking what he can do to maximize that he is getting fair advice.
How you look is a limitation in terms of the max quality that you can get

But … it is true , no matter how you look yoh still should be able to sleep with women from time to time
 

sangheilios

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In Russia I've seen a lot a hot Russian girls with skinny below average guys, they looked like everything but masculine... And they had hot girlfriends. I see the same thing here in the Czech Republic.
That's a very different dating market than what we'd have in the west. There is a surplus of women there relative to normal/relationship material men. Men also die substantially earlier than the women there on average due to rampant issues with drugs and alcohol, suicide, etc.
 

sangheilios

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Normally I would agree. However, he asked for his appearance to be dissected. I agree, his physical appearance is not a limitation. But if he is asking what he can do to maximize that he is getting fair advice.
Good point, I'm just saying that for him to even be coming on here for this reason shows that he has some insecurity about his appearance, and I guarantee it's due to poor experiences from his interactions with women, either online or in real life.
 
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I don't look tough but I don't look like I'm boring or soft.
That is what I am talking about. I don't mean you have to look like a hardline criminal but like you have testosterone flowing through your veins. I have a pretty boy face, which I don't mean in the soft sense, but in the very handsome and masculine face. Sharp jawlines, high cheekbones and well-defined chin and all.
 
M

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Few things need clarification.
-what type of women do you chase?
-how do you arrange dates?
- where are you located?
-do you have interactions with women and where do the end?

Insanity is ...and yeah, not getting women drives a man insane. Ofcourse "you " should always be you. I dont expect you to suddenly look like prime Eminem or Vanilla ice. But you definitely should consider a make over.

Now, I know this will be judged upon mostly by people close to you, but F them. But mind you, this physical make over is only done to get a mental edge. It's all mental.

And yeah you should also reconsider your dating strategies. Why dont you just get a gf (main plate), get a overdose of " female behaviour " (aka speed course) and use that as leverage to get experience and more women?
When I was in high school and my early twenties I was a lot more open to having relationships. I had kind of a Disneyland fantasy about it for a while. Then I had several repeated nasty encounters where I got played badly and started getting into MGTOW. I’ve gotten over that phase pretty much and now just want ONS. When I deal with bull**** and don’t attain ONS my mental state suffers and I start posting threads like these. This has been the case for a while. A big issue behind it is not having a social circle due to being transient.

I tend to interact with girls randomly because I don’t cold approach often and hate OLD, and also have no consistent social circle as mentioned. The last several I’ve tried to lay have **** tested me and pissed me off. Either flaked on going out, used me for something else, etc etc. I could make another thread about it.

I think I need to work on not giving off the beta provider vibe so much as other have mentioned.
 

Bigpapa

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That's a very different dating market than what we'd have in the west. There is a surplus of women there relative to normal/relationship material men. Men also die substantially earlier than the women there on average due to rampant issues with drugs and alcohol, suicide, etc.
Men in the west are just as sh1t as those in the east when it comes to relationship material

How many of you afford to rent or buy a good house to begin with ?

If you think that a broke guy in the west that barely affords rent is better than a pig farmer in the east … you have a big problem on your hand
 

sangheilios

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Men in the west are just as sh1t as those in the east when it comes to relationship material

How many of you afford to rent or buy a good house to begin with ?

If you think that a broke guy in the west that barely affords rent is better than a pig farmer in the east … you have a big problem on your hand
You kind of missed the point with that post of mine. Issues with alcohol and drugs are a huge problem in Russia, thus the reason why the life expectancy of a Russian male is much lower than that of a Russian female and almost 2 decades lower than a western male. The prevalence of alcoholism and drug use is at a level that we just don't see in the west. Both Ukraine and Russia also have an issue with HIV/AIDs because of injectable drugs. In the U.S HIV/AIDs is basically limited to gay men and drug users, plus more common in the black community, but in the general population occurs at quite low frequencies. When men are dying substantially younger than the women in these countries that in itself creates a shortage of men and a surplus of women, and that doesn't even factor in the alcoholic or drug addict men that are still alive lol. Yes, women can be alcoholics or drug addicts but these issues are more common in men than in women, no real debate on that.

Russia, as well as Ukraine and other eastern European countries, are expected to have a population collapse in the not-too-distant future as well. I highly encourage you to look up some demographic trends of the former Soviet bloc countries, it's pretty crazy to say the least.
 

SW15

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Threads like this are a testament to why men do so bad in the dating market today. Totally normal and relatively attractive guy that is having his appearance dissected like this is mind boggling. It's not like he is some basement dwelling morbidly obese man that hasn't showered in a month lol. Is he some top tier chad pro athlete, no, but he's definitely not below average or in need of working heavily on his appearance lol. And these posts on here are coming from other men, I can't even imagine how much women would criticize a man's appearance lol.
There is nothing wrong with the way you look but posting things like this is not a masculine trait, not making fun of you just saying.You'd definitely be a certain type that some women go for, nothing wrong with that. I've noticed that women have a large range of "types" of men they go for, some women are really into the boy next door look, others like nerdy guys, etc. With that said, I wouldn't worry about it.

I'm 6'4" and one of the fittest guys at my gym but have kind of a naturally unapproachable/mean look.
@sangheilios is correct in his assessment of this situation. @Donesimping is a classic white collar guy normie look. That's not bad. 35-50 years old, women would have been glad to settle down with a guy like him. The problem is that normies like @Donesimping are totally overlooked.

The way us men are assessing him is exactly what females are doing it to him.

The dating market today doesn't have a lot of room for normie looking guys. If you're a normie looking guy, you need money or a lot of charisma to compensate. More so money than charisma.

If you are normie on looks and don't have a lot of money, you'd better hope you have a decent social circle.
 

BackInTheGame78

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There is nothing out there stopping you other than your confidence that you are amazing and any women would be lucky to be with you. Until you actually believe that and emanate that in a way women can feel, you will likely continue having issues.

Even as I have gained weight and gotten older, I still have that and it's worth a lot...I still have a full pipeline.
 

Foe

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View attachment 9254

Trying to figure out why I’ve been dry for two years now
I saw a short clip (might have been tik tok) of a male model who summarized the entire profession in "knowing" how to look. In short when the camera turns on he puts on his model (i.e blue steel) face and bam, photogenic. He also said everyone can do this, its just celebs and models are well practiced and do it "naturally".

I think there is allot to this as Ive been using photo feeler to guage my face over many photos. Your photo here is too candid, no mystery and hence no attraction. There's nothing wrong with the way you look rather you just dont know how to look "seductive". Smile less, squint more and use less lighting with something edgy going on in the background and see the difference it makes. Infact do all those things and re-post. Try and get that James Dean thing going.

Online dating is all in the photo and so why not use it to your advantage. Last two photofeelers I got 9.8 out of ten on attraction just because of the above. This photo will rate high on trustworthy but honestly if your trying to get laid thats useless........
 
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Foe

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Most of the time I don’t have a neck beard, I’d just let things go a bit since I was on vacation when that was taken. Below is a pic without the nice guy look
Better but try a smirk. As if you know something they dont. Turn your head slightly off camera and glance back to the lens as if you just realised somone took a photo. Has to look natural but if you pull it off its a better angle.

See previous post for more suggestions.
 
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You are really either good at taking pics and hiding something or your personality/game is dog shvt. No reason for you to be two years in a dry spell.
 

mikedee

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I saw a short clip (might have been tik tok) of a male model who summarized the entire profession in "knowing" how to look. In short when the camera turns on he puts on his model (i.e blue steel) face and bam, photogenic. He also said everyone can do this, its just celebs and models are well practiced and do it "naturally".
This is bullshlt. I worked as a fashion photographer for several years, male models are photogenic, they look good even when constipated on the toilet. Whatever they do, they look good. Most of us don't have a model face to "put on".
 

sangheilios

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This is bullshlt. I worked as a fashion photographer for several years, male models are photogenic, they look good even when constipated on the toilet. Whatever they do, they look good. Most of us don't have a model face to "put on".
There's some truth to it, like knowing how to pose and being comfortable in front of a camera, though a good photographer should be able to address these issues. Male models have facial features that are a combination of both masculine and feminine facial features, which is all genetics. Things like high cheekbones and a good jawline but then also full lips, very youthful looking eyes and skin, etc.

Having low body fat, which accentuates those facial features, such as your jawline and cheekbones, makes a huge difference. If you took an attractive male model and made him gain 25 pounds of fat he'd be far less handsome looking. Just about any man will appear better/more handsome when he has a healthy body fat percentage, though especially more so if is body fat gets into the 10-15% area. Being overweight or into obese territory drastically lowers the attractiveness of both men and women.
 

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You look a lot older than 27, seriously consider using moisteriser. Learn to style your hair and beard properly.
 

SW15

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You are really either good at taking pics and hiding something or your personality/game is dog shvt. No reason for you to be two years in a dry spell.
It's possible to be a normie and have a 2 year dry spell. Normies are having more and more dry spells. Twenty-six percent of Americans ages 18 and up didn’t have sex once over the past 12 months, according to the 2021 General Social Survey.

There are some normies who are a part of that 26%. Additionally, besides that 26% (which is more male than female), there are men who aren't in relationships who are barely getting laid, men in LTRs/mariages with very little sex, and men who can't get laid conventionally and directly pay for sex.

@Donesimping probably has nothing in the way of a social circle capable of arranging introductions/dates for him. When you don't get social circle introductions, you're forced to fight it out on either swipe apps, the social media DMs, or approach strangers in a variety of real life venues. All of those paths are much more difficult than getting an introduction and settling into some sort of extended relationship that might last 2+ years.

The biggest flaw with a lot of men who get social circle introductions is that they tend to stay in relationships that are social circle generated too long. They tend to stay in these relationships beyond their useful life because they realize how difficult sparking up new relationships would be from swipe apps or strangers approaches. Additionally, these men often have blue pill conditioning too about how life should progress. According to their blue pill conditioning, the path is supposed to be: meet woman, start relationship, put a ring on it, get house in suburbs, have babies. I also think a lot of these blue pill men live in fear of the reactions of other people in their social circle if they deviate from blue pill/normie life development path.

Social circles have a way of getting pissed off at men who continually exchange girlfriends without marriage or babies, even if the relationships are semi-long (1-4 years). After 2 or so instances of medium term relationships, the social circle will run dry. Social circle is not likely ideal for serial monogamist who does have extended relationships but doesn't commit or the player type who tends to have relationships of less than 1 year. The serial monogamist will likely exhaust his social circle options in roughly 3-7 years, whereas a player type would piss off a social circle in less than 2 years.

It takes a lot to build a social circle and I don't think that's the best course of action for @Donesimping right now. He needs to change. There are certain things he can do with his looks and he might need mental health therapy based on another thread he started about his current mental state. The first thing he needs to have is a more relationship orientation because he's not going to be getting casual sex based on his looks alone. He would need a lot of charisma and/or money for that, neither of which he likely has right now or can get rather quickly. He's probably been too dependent on swipe apps or sending DMs on Instagram, which are both very competitive forms of game.

@sangheilios is correct that it is a difficult game market out there. @sangheilios has the basic looks of a top tier guy, as a 6'4", 220-230 lb guy with big muscles. With those stats, he's one of the top guys at any gym. That's the profile of the "Chad Thundercocck" women desire. If a guy with the "Chad" look can encounter issues in a reasonably sized metro area, that's a sign of a lack of health of the mating market at large. Guys under 6'0" and without big muscles are less equipped for success than @sangheilios .
 
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Divorced w 3

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When I was in high school and my early twenties I was a lot more open to having relationships. I had kind of a Disneyland fantasy about it for a while. Then I had several repeated nasty encounters where I got played badly and started getting into MGTOW. I’ve gotten over that phase pretty much and now just want ONS. When I deal with bull**** and don’t attain ONS my mental state suffers and I start posting threads like these. This has been the case for a while. A big issue behind it is not having a social circle due to being transient.

I tend to interact with girls randomly because I don’t cold approach often and hate OLD, and also have no consistent social circle as mentioned. The last several I’ve tried to lay have **** tested me and pissed me witoff. Either flaked on going out, used me for something else, etc etc. I could make another thread about it.

I think I need to work on not giving off the beta provider vibe so much as other have mentioned.
have you considered playing social sports, maybe find a volleyball league in your area, make some friends, and then be a ccky bastard and make the losers clean up? good chance to use that big smile and white teeth in a ccky way
 

SW15

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have you considered playing social sports, maybe find a volleyball league in your area, make some friends, and then be a ccky bastard and make the losers clean up? good chance to use that big smile and white teeth in a ccky way
It is mainstream normie advice to participate in co-ed sports leagues to avoid the bars and swipe apps.

I participated in 2 different sports in co-ed sports leagues, mainly in order to get my penis wet. One of the sports I actually liked (volleyball, see volleyball comments below), one I didn't like so much. I was disappointed in the mating outcomes from league participation.

Co-ed sports leagues can be considered a form of weak social circle game. They are not day game at all. It’s pretty difficult to swoop into a co-ed kickball, softball, volleyball, or soccer league & directly arrange dates. First, there are more men than women in all these leagues. Nearly every other guy in these leagues is an unattached guy who is trying to get his penis wet in league because he read some advice article online or in a printed copy of a magazine about doing this. The only exceptions are the men who join teams with their girlfriends or wives. You can make friends in these leagues but chances are that the other men need sex as much as you do. If you’re able to develop a social circle from a co-ed sports league, realize it will take multiple seasons of participation in the league. So you’d better actually like that sport because playing that sport is often the only benefit of it.

Volleyball: This is one of the better hobbies I have had over the years in terms of meeting women. I've not been that active in it for at least 5 years. Sand is better than indoor. I played in both volleyball leagues and random pickup games on weekend afternoons. I found that the random pickup games were better for arranging dates than the organized co-ed leagues around it. I had far more meaningful conversations when participating in random pickup games.

The biggest issue I encountered is volleyball were factors specific to me. I was a decent volleyball player due to my transferrable skills from tennis, mainly serving. However, I'm only 5'10". The best volleyball playing women are 5'8"-6'3". Women 5'7" and under are not all that inclined to randomly play volleyball as adults. While I might have a chance with the 5'8"-5'10" women at volleyball, the 5'11"+ women are very unlikely to consider me worthy of their time. While I enjoy volleyball, there are other activities I enjoy more. Volleyball isn't my best use of time for attracting-seducing.

If you're a 6'0"+ guy with a solid physique and decent volleyball skills, I'd recommend volleyball for pickup. I'd recommend sand over indoor. However, for the 6'0"+ guy with a good physique, I don't think that sand volleyball is any more efficient than swipe apps or randoming approaching at bars. That type of guy is going to have success in all formats. It's a matter of how much screen time he wants to put in on his smartphone vs. how much real life approaching he wants to do. I think it would be more fun for a 6'0"+ guy with sand volleyball skill to pick up women through volleyball than to sit on Tinder/Bumble/Hinge and swipe. It'd be a better use of time for that guy to play volleyball in terms of getting longer term relationships with higher quality women. That'd be the use case where I'd recommend volleyball over the swipe apps. It's a realistic scenario for a 6'2" guy to a get a 5'10"-6'0" volleyball playing girlfriend and that scenario has a better chance of lasting longer than flings with Tinderellas, most of whom are 5'6" and under.
 
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