Ive noticed something - testing

[TheGambino]

Hi fellas.

I want to spit some new facts I learned from my last dating experience (3 months with her) which were on no contact now for almost 2 weeks. We argued, she went on an emotional rage and told me to leave her house in the end. She wasn't what I was looking for in looks, and personality anyway. That's part of the reason didn't work out anyway. It's good I move on and we'll see what happens when I run into her since we both like to go out, we will meet. I will be short, sweet and distant. Maybe I can turn it in fwb. Maybe we never speak again.

After the experience I got a lot of confirmations I already knew from studying women and field experience in dating. But I learned something new also.

Women will test you when you act needy, jealous and weak. That is for certain. When they can walk all over you they gonna back off and test to see what you are really made off. If you pass the tests in a good way, she will become affectionate again if her interest level is high enough to begin with. If you chase, smother her and panic and reflect that on her, she will lose complete interest. Everyone knows this.

When you come off too stiff, hard to catch, and play with her emotions too much she will think that you are uncontrollable. This means she will have her guard up against you, because you are playing with her emotions. Making her feel good about you and then very bad. She will become distant, and b1tchy and test you because she doesn't trust you with her feelings anymore.

You have to somewhat have some beta traits if you want her to see you as a potential bf material. If you want to string her along, this is important. She will move on eventually when she thinks your only out to use her for cex. She will think he is wasting my time, I need to move on, this is going nowhere.

When you also try to enforce boundaries on a harsh dominant way without being exclusive she will block on that too. If she is a good girl or completley broken, women are women. I think they will react the same. Ofcourse a normal easy going woman will go silent, distant, embrace her feelings and look for a new guy. A insane, broken woman, will yell, cry, show bad behavior and look for new d1cks to jump on.

What I learned from this girl is something new:

When women are still attracted to you, have high interest in you, still want to rip your clothes off and fvck you they will test you if you don't do what they want or go in the direction they want.

Don't come up with, would she move on from Bradd Pitt, Leonardo Dicaprio or Chris Brown. Yes, the heck they will. Women that deal with these guys have high SMVs also (and can fvck other celibrities, millionaires and high value men) and will also be turned off by a high SMV guy like them. If they act jealous, needy or on the other side never do what the woman wants.

If she feels caged, doesn't have control over your actions at all, she will feel so empowered that it's feels hopeless for her to keep chasing you to change you in something that she wants. So she will become distant, because why would she chase someone she doesnt have control over at all or who doesnt want to commit/comply to her needs.

This will also result in testing, bad behavior and mirroring you to either get what she wants or to push you away.

Conclusion: Women test when her interest drops in attraction but also when she feels the relationship is going nowhere and she has no control over you. She will only accept enforced healthy boundaries when she also gets what she wants and that's exclusivity for example. Some guys told me this in earlier threads but I had to really rethink the situation and understand it to come to this conclusion.

It doesn't mean that she doesn't want to fvck you, it means she thinks it's not going in the direction she wants it to go. So she will break and look for a guy that will go in the direction she wants to go. Testing is not all about losing attraction, they also test when they feel unheared, bad communication or no purpose/direction in the ''relationship''.

 

[James Cruse]

When you come off too stiff, hard to catch, and play with her emotions too much she will think that you are uncontrollable. This means she will have her guard up against you, because you are playing with her emotions. Making her feel good about you and then very bad. She will become distant, and b1tchy and test you because she doesn't trust you with her feelings anymore.

I agree with this but hadn’t seen it written down before in this way.

I would add the following to this:
If you’re behaving in a way that she perceives as being out of her reach for possible commitment or unattainable for potential commitment, then she will begin to test you hard.

Women do this because they want to:
1. Avoid a potential relationship going nowhere for them (no commitment - casual sex only)
2. To provoke you into either more attainable behaviour/behaviour of someone interested in a relationship or just plain beta behaviour
3. She’s preparing to break up with you because she knows you don’t take her seriously and she wants you to bait you into making a huge mistake/becoming extremely needy or saying/doing something outrageous so that she has a good reason to pre-emptively break up with you that she can tell her friends/family before you break up with her, so she doesn’t feel rejected.

The solution to this is becoming slightly more attainable and giving her hope of a potential exclusive or long term commitment from you, without being dishonest.
This can be a challenge and delicate to do, but it is a huge part of the game for maintaining several regular casual sex partners at the same time.

The balancing act of keeping yourself attainable and giving her hope, while still being your strong, confident, masculine self does take some trial and error with each girl.

 

[European-DJ]

@TheGambino , this is why you treat every girl you date as you girlfriend when you’re together. Key here is “when you are together”. Take an interest in her and her life while after / before sex and really listen to what she says. It does wonders for keeping someone around. My longest plate was with me for 2.5years and I honestly think she rotated out in the end because I stoped caring even when I saw her. All of this naturally requires you to be genuinely interested in the person that you are seeing!

This has never failed me and my former roommate used to tell me how every one of my plates would look at me in this loving way, as if we were still in the honeymoon face 3-6 months in.

Try it out with your next plate and let me know if you see a difference in outcome.

 

[RangerMIke]

When you work too hard to keep her, she doesn't need to put in effort. If she isn't working to keep you interested then she doesn't value you, no value = no respect, no respect = no love.

For a woman to fall for you, she has to work for you. Too many men make things too easy for women and she never has to work for them.

As far as what is called 'testing', I really don't think it's a test... it's just a human being seeing how much they can get away with. This happens with every employee I hire. People will drift into work 5 minutes late, and if you don't say something, 5 minutes becomes 15, then 30, then the next thing you know they are coming and going as they please and you are the one accommodating their schedule. The first time you see this you have to say something... if they can't get to work on time you fire them, if they want a flexible schedule and you don't want to give it to them, they'll quit and work someplace else. Everyone wants to give as little as possible and maximize what they take.

Passing a 'test' a chick gives you is really nothing more than her having to accommodate what you want IF SHE LIKES YOU, meaning she has to work for you. If she doesn't like you, you can not 'pass' this 'test'. You draw a line, and she doesn't like you... she will just go away. The more she has to work for you, the more she is committed. We all value things more, if you have to work for it.

 

[TheGambino]

When you work too hard to keep her, she doesn't need to put in effort. If she isn't working to keep you interested then she doesn't value you, no value = no respect, no respect = no love.

For a woman to fall for you, she has to work for you. Too many men make things too easy for women and she never has to work for them.

As far as what is called 'testing', I really don't think it's a test... it's just a human being seeing how much they can get away with. This happens with every employee I hire. People will drift into work 5 minutes late, and if you don't say something, 5 minutes becomes 15, then 30, then the next thing you know they are coming and going as they please and you are the one accommodating their schedule. The first time you see this you have to say something... if they can't get to work on time you fire them, if they want a flexible schedule and you don't want to give it to them, they'll quit and work someplace else. Everyone wants to give as little as possible and maximize what they take.

Passing a 'test' a chick gives you is really nothing more than her having to accommodate what you want IF SHE LIKES YOU, meaning she has to work for you. If she doesn't like you, you can not 'pass' this 'test'. You draw a line, and she doesn't like you... she will just go away. The more she has to work for you, the more she is committed. We all value things more, if you have to work for it.

@RangerMIke So you are saying the chick didn’t like me anymore or was losing interest that’s why she started to see what she could get away with to look for boundaries so she could get away?

I have to add that she caught me talking to a girl when I ignored her text so I think it was more of an payback and then sh*t got out of hand. She was only plate material for me, period.

I think you’ll have to add. It won’t be acceptable and worth it for her to give up the boundary to keep u happy. Meaning she doesn’t like you enough to fully change in what u want her to be.

And she feels like you cannot make the changes that will work for her so you aren’t compatible. Which will result in her testing.

 

[RangerMIke]

@RangerMIke So you are saying the chick didn’t like me anymore or was losing interest that’s why she started to see what she could get away with to look for boundaries so she could get away?

What I'm saying is that you can not worry about what people call 'testing'. It's just a woman figuring out what she can get away with, all people do this... just let her do this and when it gets to a point where it bothers you just put distance between you. If she likes you, she will correct, if she doesn't like you she will walk away.

You see the whole 'test' theory comes from PUAs who make their living trying to convince men that they have control over attraction. It's a 'test' you can pass, makes men think they have some level of control. We don't... not at all. She is either attracted, or she isn't. If she's attracted then a man can fvck it up... if she isn't attracted, no amount of 'game' will matter.

If you have been dating a woman any length of time, she knows what you like, what you don't like, what buttons they push to get results they want. If she starts doing sh1t that aggravates you, she knows what she is doing... and in that emotional moment she is pushing you away.... if you don't create distance so she can figure out her sh1t, and just 'try harder' she will get MORE and MORE difficult... she is trying to drive you off... the longer you hang around and 'try' the more respect she will lose for you.

Humans are social creatures... you put a bunch of people in a room and what immediately happens is everyone tries to figure out where they fit in the social structure. It's all subconscious, most people really do not know what they are doing.

 

[TheGambino]

What I'm saying is that you can not worry about what people call 'testing'. It's just a woman figuring out what she can get away with, all people do this... just let her do this and when it gets to a point where it bothers you just put distance between you. If she likes you, she will correct, if she doesn't like you she will walk away.

You see the whole 'test' theory comes from PUAs who make their living trying to convince men that they have control over attraction. It's a 'test' you can pass, makes men think they have some level of control. We don't... not at all. She is either attracted, or she isn't. If she's attracted then a man can fvck it up... if she isn't attracted, no amount of 'game' will matter.

If you have been dating a woman any length of time, she knows what you like, what you don't like, what buttons they push to get results they want. If she starts doing sh1t that aggravates you, she knows what she is doing... and in that emotional moment she is pushing you away.... if you don't create distance so she can figure out her sh1t, and just 'try harder' she will get MORE and MORE difficult... she is trying to drive you off... the longer you hang around and 'try' the more respect she will lose for you.

Humans are social creatures... you put a bunch of people in a room and what immediately happens is everyone tries to figure out where they fit in the social structure. It's all subconscious, most people really do not know what they are doing.

You are a very smart man @RangerMIke

 

[RangerMIke]

You are a very smart man @RangerMIke

Not smart... just 30 plus years of dating women. Wisdom developed through seeing what works and what doesn't.

 

[MtmVaott]

If she's attracted then a man can fvck it up

I've come to the conclusion for me that there is not even a thing like fvcking it up.
Fvcking it up implies you have control whether or not you let your insecurities shine through or not. That implies you have to live in a state of constant fear and vigilance.
So the better question for me is if the woman is OK with my degree of confidence as of right now. If she discovers later on it's not enough for her, she wasn't the right fit for me anyway.
Same for lacking social skills IMO.

 

[TheGambino]

I've come to the conclusion for me that there is not even a thing like fvcking it up.
Fvcking it up implies you have control whether or not you let your insecurities shine through or not. That implies you have to live in a state of constant fear and vigilance.
So the better question for me is if the woman is OK with my degree of confidence as of right now. If she discovers later on it's not enough for her, she wasn't the right fit for me anyway.
Same for lacking social skills IMO.

I understand that but know I got a very important question @RangerMIke @MtmVaott

For whatever reason she is aggravating/testing you without exclusivity by flirting with other men in front of u for example. Or she corrects u or whatever sh*t u dont put up with. Not heavily but u feel it. She may be mad, jealous herself whatever. She is not getting what she wants, whatever.

You call it insecurity that u don’t put up with it and call it out. I call it enforcing boundaries. I don’t think it’s insecurity. It’s telling her u can’t do this to me or I’m out. It’s correcting bad behavior.

Some Guys Will say well she can flirt all night in the end she is going home with me. But would u accept a plate ur dating to flirt with other men in front of u because she’s mad or just slvtty in her nature? I think it’s about respect not insecurity in these cases!

 

[MtmVaott]

I understand that but know I got a very important question @RangerMIke @MtmVaott

For whatever reason she is aggravating/testing you without exclusivity by flirting with other men in front of u for example. Or she corrects u or whatever sh*t u dont put up with. Not heavily but u feel it. She may be mad, jealous herself whatever. She is not getting what she wants, whatever.

You call it insecurity that u don’t put up with it and call it out. I call it enforcing boundaries. I don’t think it’s insecurity. It’s telling her u can’t do this to me or I’m out. It’s correcting bad behavior.

Some Guys Will say well she can flirt all night in the end she is going home with me. But would u accept a plate ur dating to flirt with other men in front of u because she’s mad or just slvtty in her nature? I think it’s about respect not insecurity in these cases!

I just picked up on "fvcking it up" in general, I didn't mean to confuse you.
What you take as examples is all something she is doing not because it's important to her, but because she's insecure or wants you to understand something implicitely. Whatever it is. It would make me lose interest in her. If it would be important to her, she would need to just say it. If she can't, or if she wants to drive you off, she's not exactly someone for the long run.
No need to enforce boundaries for obvious examples like the flirting.

 

[TheGambino]

Rangermike cleared it all up regarding the subject.

 

[James Cruse]

hat I'm saying is that you can not worry about what people call 'testing'. It's just a woman figuring out what she can get away with, all people do this... just let her do this and when it gets to a point where it bothers you just put distance between you. If she likes you, she will correct, if she doesn't like you she will walk away.

You see the whole 'test' theory comes from PUAs who make their living trying to convince men that they have control over attraction. It's a 'test' you can pass, makes men think they have some level of control. We don't... not at all. She is either attracted, or she isn't. If she's attracted then a man can fvck it up... if she isn't attracted, no amount of 'game' will matter.

I’ve seen a few guys say this or a variation of “if she’s attracted, she’s attracted. If not, then she’s not. Nothing you can do”.
This is black and white thinking and really doesn’t take into account what behaviour women are attracted to in men.

Women are attracted to confident, masculine, strong, calm, relaxed behaviour.
Women are attracted to men physically who look strong and healthy and masculine.
When you as a man display weakness, lack of strength, women find that unattractive or repulsive.

The reason women “test” men is to quickly and efficiently (or so they think) test men’s strength and masculinity when you meet them. Men can lie all they want but they can find out quickly how tough we are by challenging us and putting us under pressure.

They often keep doing this throughout the relationship. Why? Because women are insecure and cautious by nature.

When PUA’s say women test men - they’re not saying it to enrich themselves or sell you anything. It really happens to all men, no matter how attractive the woman finds them.

Tests don’t just come in the form of being rude or bitchy or challenging in general, but in being boring or being shy/timid.
I know this because I’ve met women who are shy or just outright boring and right before or right after sleeping with them, they become alot more interesting and drop the act.

Anyone who says women don’t test has either lost alot of girls that were interested in them because those girls challenged him or doesn’t actually deal with alot of gorgeous women.

Women believe that strong men will just brush off their tests or challenging bahaviour.

The same as women not showing any real signals that they like you before sleeping with you - why would they need to show you they like you other than being with you?

You’re a confident strong man, surely you don’t need reassurance that a woman is interested in you other than her staying in your presence, is her thinking.

 

[James Cruse]

For whatever reason she is aggravating/testing you without exclusivity by flirting with other men in front of u for example. Or she corrects u or whatever sh*t u dont put up with. Not heavily but u feel it. She may be mad, jealous herself whatever. She is not getting what she wants, whatever.

Flirting with men in front of you isn’t really “testing” behaviour.

Generally women do this because:

1. You haven’t laid down any boundaries for them regarding what you consider acceptable behaviour
2. They want you to see that they are in demand and have other dating options (or so they think, it’s 90%+ purely sexual options)
3. They are using talking to other men as a way to demonstrate scarcity and to scare you into thinking you could lose her - all so she can corral you into requesting an exclusive relationship with her or commitment to her - but on her terms. She knows if you stay cool and ignore this, the relationship is on your terms.
4. Women think men like it when we see they have other male options because they become more attracted to men when they see us with female options. This is a standard “women thinking men like the same things as them” in dating, because women often have no idea what men are attracted to in women’s behaviour these days.
5. Yes, after the above things, it could be a test in a secondary way. They want to see if you crack under pressure, become jealous or behave in a weak, needy, jealous way. They want to see how you handle the situation and they hope you’ll handle it confidently and with strength and experience.

 

[RangerMIke]

I've come to the conclusion for me that there is not even a thing like fvcking it up.
Fvcking it up implies you have control whether or not you let your insecurities shine through or not. That implies you have to live in a state of constant fear and vigilance.
So the better question for me is if the woman is OK with my degree of confidence as of right now. If she discovers later on it's not enough for her, she wasn't the right fit for me anyway.
Same for lacking social skills IMO.

Okay... I see what you are saying and I do agree. In a sense you really need to be yourself... if yourself is a goof ball that isn't behaving like a man then chances are you will fail... but you REALLY do not know what she likes. What I am saying is that there is a difference between 'attraction' and 'interest'.

Most everything is developed over time, you really can't pretend anything with women, they can smell out BS pretty darn good. When you meet a woman you are attracted to you are what you are and you have what you have. If you want to be successful with most women, then you can develop your life to meet what most women want. But even a super handsome, tall, wealthy guy with some social status, will not impress a woman that doesn't care about any of these things. If you have ever seen a hot chick with a dude and you wonder WTF! Well, she's not a typical woman, she is attracted to and interested in things that are not apparent.

I have a friend who is a yoga instructor, has her own business that is successful, she if hot as fvck, VERY nice present delightful, great sense of humor wonderful woman, solid 10 in anyone's book. About a year ago, out of nowhere, she up and marries a pudgy, goofy looking dude that is a inch shorter than he is. He dresses average, drives a 2012 Nissan Sentra, has an average job, average dress... you look at these two and on the surface nothing makes sense, but he has something she needs. It really doesn't matter, we might not know sh1t, but she does.

 

[James Cruse]

Okay... I see what you are saying and I do agree. In a sense you really need to be yourself... if yourself is a goof ball that isn't behaving like a man then chances are you will fail... but you REALLY do not know what she likes. What I am saying is that there is a difference between 'attraction' and 'interest'.

Most everything is developed over time, you really can't pretend anything with women, they can smell out BS pretty darn good. When you meet a woman you are attracted to you are what you are and you have what you have. If you want to be successful with most women, then you can develop your life to meet what most women want. But even a super handsome, tall, wealthy guy with some social status, will not impress a woman that doesn't care about any of these things. If you have ever seen a hot chick with a dude and you wonder WTF! Well, she's not a typical woman, she is attracted to and interested in things that are not apparent.

I have a friend who is a yoga instructor, has her own business that is successful, she if hot as fvck, VERY nice present delightful, great sense of humor wonderful woman, solid 10 in anyone's book. About a year ago, out of nowhere, she up and marries a pudgy, goofy looking dude that is a inch shorter than he is. He dresses average, drives a 2012 Nissan Sentra, has an average job, average dress... you look at these two and on the surface nothing makes sense, but he has something she needs. It really doesn't matter, we might not know sh1t, but she does.

I don’t think from all of your experience you understand what women are attracted to.

Most men I see that are with gorgeous women that aren’t really good looking themselves are because the guy is extremely confident.

 

[MtmVaott]

The way to become more confident is to practice dismissing those insecurities. That is a good thing. The question is whether the insecurities are justified or not, objectively. Difficult to maintain the two. You can end up self-gaslightling by chalking up misbehavior as acceptable or caused by poor frame every time.

Insecurities are always justified by past experiences. Not ignoring them is the first step to change them. Maybe we mean the same but I don't really understand what you mean, especially your last sentence. But feel free to send me a PM, I think it gets off-topic.

 

[Bigpapa]

needed someone she could control. Simple as.

no , the correct answer is that you need to have flaws and are a bit of a jerk but show that you have a good heart ( for her at least )

you have to walk the thin line between being too much attainable ( boring ) and not being attainable ( a player )

 

[Bigpapa]

based on what re: flaws? Why is controllability wrong?

because if a woman knows that she is controlling you , then she will start being a jerk and test you on this to see if you still are the same guy or not

ofc , you might also get women who like this … but most of the times they do not

 

[MtmVaott]

because if a woman knows that she is controlling you , then she will start being a jerk and test you on this to see if you still are the same guy or not

ofc , you might also get women who like this … but most of the times they do not

She is controlling if she values you not much, and the "tests" is just her picking up on your blatant ignorance of your inner voice which is telling you exactly that. I don't know if the love can be restored after realizing this.
I was also in this position where I valued her not that much and she didn't realize it, until I disrespected her and she rejected me.
The golden position is mutual respect and valueing. That's LTR incoming.
After realizing this, it's kind of sad how many women put up with being a plate since they could know right away if a LTR is possible or not.
Same for me running after non-interested women