Women & Money

[Bigpapa]

Well, I'm 34 now and I bang lots of different women, quite regularly, in the Sydney market. I primarily target early-mid 20's. Realistically, I still do bang to occasional late-20's, early 30's woman. But once a woman gets past 25 she really loses a lot of value for me.

My point being, I do all of this while going out of my way not to pay for women unless I want to. Especially upfront. Upfront I'll get her a coffee or a drink. Depending on the date. I'll only take her out for food after we are banging. I'll pay for her food and I genuinely enjoy going out for meals with women I'm in a sexual relationship with. If a woman is hooked, I've discovered that I can basically almost spend no money on her if I want to. This includes skipping birthday gifts, which I have regularly done in past LTRs because it's highly manipulative knocking her off her pedestal Game. Even after she has made effort to buy me a birthday gift. This might seem very mean, but it is such a blow to her ego that I'd say it's worth trying it out. Skip a birthday gift, hold frame, and see how she reacts. Tell me she doesn't think you're an absolute badboy assh0le, if you hold frame the right way. Cue the crazy sex "why doesn't Daddy love me?"

I did this .I rarely even remember their birthdays

what I saw that happens is that they build up and out of the sudden they go loco and never really hear from them ever again , but they still check me on my instagram and so on

the problem is that yes , from a frame point of view they will not forget you , and most likely they will remember forever , but that”s it . Nothing that helps for long term commitment

 

[biggoal]

Well, I'm 34 now and I bang lots of different women, quite regularly, in the Sydney market. I primarily target early-mid 20's. Realistically, I still do bang to occasional late-20's, early 30's woman. But once a woman gets past 25 she really loses a lot of value for me.

My point being, I do all of this while going out of my way not to pay for women unless I want to. Especially upfront. Upfront I'll get her a coffee or a drink. Depending on the date. I'll only take her out for food after we are banging. I'll pay for her food and I genuinely enjoy going out for meals with women I'm in a sexual relationship with. If a woman is hooked, I've discovered that I can basically almost spend no money on her if I want to. This includes skipping birthday gifts, which I have regularly done in past LTRs because it's highly manipulative knocking her off her pedestal Game. Even after she has made effort to buy me a birthday gift. This might seem very mean, but it is such a blow to her ego that I'd say it's worth trying it out. Skip a birthday gift, hold frame, and see how she reacts. Tell me she doesn't think you're an absolute badboy assh0le, if you hold frame the right way. Cue the crazy sex "why doesn't Daddy love me?"

How can that be when that other poster lives in Sydney right now and says it's terrible. Everyone on here says AU is the worst country for dating due to male to female ratios.

 

[Konada]

How can that be when that other poster lives in Sydney right now and says it's terrible. Everyone on here says AU is the worst country for dating due to male to female ratios.

Precisely pareto principle at work. @Pan87 has hot women bouncing up and down his d!ck everyday while the other is thinking to quit his government job to smell young pu$$y.

 

[Bigpapa]

Unless she’s chasing long term commitment with you, and you are reluctant about it, then you’ll never find an LTR with a girl that will last.

Women want men that they have to mate guard intensely because the guy would rather be out there living and experiencing his abundance.

yeah , this is what I was saying .

women do not chase men for relationship anymore , or not to the same extent that they had let”s say 5 years ago

now they expect men to also chase for the relationship . And those who do , will always remember this and will hit you when she will see the opportunity to do it

the dynamic between men and women changed accelerated in the last 5 years . More than it changed in the prior 10 years when feminism and stuff like that start rooting in into society

it is easier to have hookups , but way more difficult to have a relationship

 

[B80]

yeah , this is what I was saying .

women do not chase men for relationship anymore , or not to the same extent that they had let”s say 5 years ago

now they expect men to also chase for the relationship . And those who do , will always remember this and will hit you when she will see the opportunity to do it

the dynamic between men and women changed accelerated in the last 5 years . More than it changed in the prior 10 years when feminism and stuff like that start rooting in into society

it is easier to have hookups , but way more difficult to have a relationship

Good post, you usually put good stuff out. Summarized how I feel better than I could.

I came to similar realization a few years back. Good thing is, if you have other stuff going on that gives you purpose, fulfillment, you're much less likely to see women as the main thing in life. Just become something else to enjoy from time to time.

Current climate, it just seems too stressful, 'juice not worth the squeeze' so to speak and can effect rest of your life. Society, rules, right behind them if/when they have a change of heart. Women are great, long term relationships... nah, not for me anymore. Seems to much risk for possibility of finding a 'unicorn'. Getting laid once or twice a week and rest of time to do whatever I want is much more appealing.

 

[Bigpapa]

Good post, you usually put good stuff out. Summarized how I feel better than I could.

I came to similar realization a few years back. Good thing is, if you have other stuff going on that gives you purpose, fulfillment, you're much less likely to see women as the main thing in life. Just become something else to enjoy from time to time.

Current climate, it just seems too stressful, 'juice not worth the squeeze' so to speak and can effect rest of your life. Society, rules, right behind them if/when they have a change of heart. Women are great, long term relationships... nah, not for me anymore. Seems to much risk for possibility of finding a 'unicorn'. Getting laid once or twice a week and rest of time to do whatever I want is much more appealing.

yeah , even if I agree with you , I do not really like the outcome

the problem is that you as a guy also get old , sure if you are smart & lucky you can keep your SMV for a long period of time , but eventually you will get old and lonely

this sounds to me like quite a grim end game , and something that I would like to avoid

in the same time , I am not ok with the idea of having a woman around that only makes your life harder

can be something between this 2 scenarios ?

 

[B80]

yeah , even if I agree with you , I do not really like the outcome

the problem is that you as a guy also get old , sure if you are smart & lucky you can keep your SMV for a long period of time , but eventually you will get old and lonely

this sounds to me like quite a grim end game , and something that I would like to avoid

in the same time , I am not ok with the idea of having a woman around that only makes your life harder

can be something between this 2 scenarios ?

I think there'll be plenty of options around as you get into 50/60's. Or whatever age you start valuing companionship, beyond friends, fwbs etc.

Particularly if you've had a good life and not turned into a bitter hermit.

 

[tkazansky]

I do not have this issue , and hopefully will not have it ever …

was just curious how other guys view the whole situation and maybe learn new tricks

better to be like this , rather than acting like a know it all

Bigpapa,

I am sympathetic to your view point. I have often thought that for a woman to stay in a relationship, even if her man is alpha AF, she has to have a certain standard of living (set by her mind / expectations/ family upbringing, etc.) met otherwise she will leave...or be a miserable disrespectful *****. In my view, this is part of the burden of performance for men...if they want a LTR.

I worry that we have entered a time where women at a very primitive level understand that once married to man, she has a lot of power over him. It is hard to see the up side for men now in any kind of marriage. Even with an exclusive long-term LTR, she still gets a fair amount of power over the man if they have children...which, to me, is sort of the only reason to keep women around...to mother children. All of this is to say, I have hard time recommending any sort of modern LTR to another man. Sad to say.

I was awakened while married. What keeps me in my miserable situation is my son. I never cared to much about having kids or taking care of them, and when I saw my son everything changed. Men today have a tough lot. Modern women are miserable. However, they are required to pass along your genes. Once you have kids, there is the profound happiness in seeing them grow and love you, but then you are stuck with a legal anchor.

If you are considering any long term thing with a woman, her body count MUST be very low. If not, forget about it.

Just my 0.02

T

 

[B80]

Bigpapa,

I am sympathetic to your view point. I have often thought that for a woman to stay in a relationship, even if her man is alpha AF, she has to have a certain standard of living (set by her mind / expectations/ family upbringing, etc.) met otherwise she will leave...or be a miserable disrespectful *****. In my view, this is part of the burden of performance for men...if they want a LTR.

I worry that we have entered a time where women at a very primitive level understand that once married to man, she has a lot of power over him. It is hard to see the up side for men now in any kind of marriage. Even with an exclusive long-term LTR, she still gets a fair amount of power over the man if they have children...which, to me, is sort of the only reason to keep women around...to mother children. All of this is to say, I have hard time recommending any sort of modern LTR to another man. Sad to say.

I was awakened while married. What keeps me in my miserable situation is my son. I never cared to much about having kids or taking care of them, and when I saw my son everything changed. Men today have a tough lot. Modern women are miserable. However, they are required to pass along your genes. Once you have kids, there is the profound happiness in seeing them grow and love you, but then you are stuck with a legal anchor.

If you are considering any long term thing with a woman, her body count MUST be very low. If not, forget about it.

Just my 0.02

Agree. I'm divorced after 12 years or so relationship, 5 married. Wife called it a day and started seeing gym instructor right away (was obviously in pipeline for a while). Shame she decided to do it when we had a child barely 18 months old.

I was pretty strict with money, outlook was I was 2 years into gettting online business off the ground and wanted to accumalate x amount as cushion and to invest further, minimizing risk from the business going wrong. I am/was working full time job and put several hours in each night to business. I always fed my daugther, bathed her and read/put her to bed - usually 5 out of 7 nights a week.

Wife appeared to be fully onboard, understod. We got on well, communicated, no bad feeling right up until the day she said she'd had enough. Which coincided with a 2nd hen door with a group of younger single friends a few days before....

I defo played part in downfall. but still upset she pulled it at that point, not for me or her, but our young child.

She said I was selfish, but to me what she did was ultimate selfish act. I've dealt with it and have daughter 50% of time. But still get horrible moments of anguish/pain, thinking my daughter will never grow up in a proper family (like I did and the ex didn;t). Luckily I'm pretty resilient, have other stuff going on, but wouldn't wish it on anyone else. I would honestly sacrifice everything for next 15 years, even if meant I was miserable/bored inside (but wouldn't show it)(, to give daughter chance of growing up in proper family unit. Shes the most important thing in my life and I can't change what I feel would be best for her, no matter what I do. Pangs not as frequent, but will no doubt be a shadow that clouds me periodically for a long time. Anyway, I'm not feeling sorry for myself, more acknowledging thoughts/feelings. Life must go on!

 

[SW15]

true , but the question is the profit worth it ?

It isn’t. There are a ton of high earning STEM workers who struggle to get attention from women and struggle to get their penises wet.

Men speak in probability, not possibility. You are taking this too literally. Money is simply the dominance hierarchy for adults. Women want the top 10-20% of men in their environment. In school, that means screwing the athletes. If that don’t work, she goes to the frat house. After graduation, $30K hobo simply doesn’t cut it.

Nah. To a woman, a “sexy 30K man” is an oxymoron.

You're right about the sexual dynamics at the high school and undergraduate college levels. The frat house is second because it takes some money to join a frat. Joining a frat can be perceived as a signal of having money. However, that might be a bit overstated because sororities also change money to join them.

If you look ordinary or white collar, a lower paying ($50,000 or under) isn't going to impress women. If you're lower earning, you need to present an aura of a dirtbag with a criminal record (multiple tattoos will help with this) to get women's vaginas to tingle in your favor.

Virtually no attractive woman over around 21 will go for 30k guy over 150k guy unless tge 30k is top tier in other stuff... which by definition of only earning 30k is extremely unlikely.

Incredibmy Good looking and or charismatic men are unlikely to be earning such a low wage.

Assuming the 150k guy isn't some autistic nerd. But then the attractive woman is likely to have plenty of options.

Money matters more to post college women than women in college or of the general college age range if they don't attend college. However, money is not meaningless to college aged women.

Remember men, when women are young and most fertile, they don’t care about money, they want to basic instinct sex, When they hit 30 and lose their looks and their sexual power declines, then they start to care about money, they want the transactional sex.

I believe that all sex is transactional, either directly or indirectly. There are plenty of young and fertile women on Seeking looking for older sugar daddies. The presence of women 18-24 on sugar daddy websites/apps would be an indicator that young women care about money. Outside of that ecosystem, there's more truth to what you are saying but it's not entirely there. Having money will always help in getting a 22-27 year old woman.

But then who wants a relationship? The man gets a used up woman, who bitches more, and looks worse by the second.

But the who wants a relationship? The man has to make more money to keep an aging older women?

Plenty of men are lining up to have relationships with 30s/40s women.

Try this exercise. Ask an unmarried, childless woman what her purpose in life is. Not only will she not have an answer to that, most can’t even describe a single hobby.

I'd like to try this. You could do the same exercise with unmarried, childless men. The main difference is that men will probably have more hobbies.

Precisely pareto principle at work. @Pan87 has hot women bouncing up and down his d!ck everyday while the other is thinking to quit his government job to smell young pu$$y.

The poster who had thoughts of quitting his cushy government job to meet more women wasn't playing that situation correctly at all.

 

[B80]

It isn’t. There are a ton of high earning STEM workers who struggle to get attention from women and struggle to get their penises wet.





You're right about the sexual dynamics at the high school and undergraduate college levels. The frat house is second because it takes some money to join a frat. Joining a frat can be perceived as a signal of having money. However, that might be a bit overstated because sororities also change money to join them.

If you look ordinary or white collar, a lower paying ($50,000 or under) isn't going to impress women. If you're lower earning, you need to present an aura of a dirtbag with a criminal record (multiple tattoos will help with this) to get women's vaginas to tingle in your favor.



Money matters more to post college women than women in college or of the general college age range if they don't attend college. However, money is not meaningless to college aged women.




I believe that all sex is transactional, either directly or indirectly. There are plenty of young and fertile women on Seeking looking for older sugar daddies. The presence of women 18-24 on sugar daddy websites/apps would be an indicator that young women care about money. Outside of that ecosystem, there's more truth to what you are saying but it's not entirely there. Having money will always help in getting a 22-27 year old woman.



Plenty of men are lining up to have relationships with 30s/40s women.




I'd like to try this. You could do the same exercise with unmarried, childless men. The main difference is that men will probably have more hobbies.



The poster who had thoughts of quitting his cushy government job to meet more women wasn't playing that situation correctly at all.

SW15 talking sense as usual!

Out of interest, what are your thoughts around women liking money. Security plays a part, but from what I gauge over the years, a big part is showing off/competing with 'friends' to. Not just good to have cushion of money, assets growing, big 'need' for outward displays of wealth too.

Mentioned ages on here, but I was seeing a woman last year for 6 months. She started mentioning friends, 1 particular friend that was seeing a blue collar worker, who had his own business (can;t recall what it was exactly now). Apparently her bought her friend a new/nnearly new merc, with personal plate which had 'Boss' via some mix of numbers and letters hahaa. Also he was buying her shoes for over 1k and load of other sh1t. Crazy really.

And to add, people who think women have sell by date are kidding themselves. One of my aunties is into 60's and has dated various seriously wealthy men of a similar age.

Maybe for small % of men, they'll keep banging 20 year olds into their 60's, but from what I see, men/women seem to have no problems with dating all the way through life with people from same age range.

 

[Bigpapa]

SW15 talking sense as usual!

Out of interest, what are your thoughts around women liking money. Security plays a part, but from what I gauge over the years, a big part is showing off/competing with 'friends' to. Not just good to have cushion of money, assets growing, big 'need' for outward displays of wealth too.

Mentioned ages on here, but I was seeing a woman last year for 6 months. She started mentioning friends, 1 particular friend that was seeing a blue collar worker, who had his own business (can;t recall what it was exactly now). Apparently her bought her friend a new/nnearly new merc, with personal plate which had 'Boss' via some mix of numbers and letters hahaa. Also he was buying her shoes for over 1k and load of other sh1t. Crazy really.

yeah , was saying this in a previous post . Women brag about this to other women , which in return will want the same thing .

it is like a competition between guys when it comes to cars “ bro look at my brand new Mercedes’ “

the only difference is that guys do it on their own pocket , while women do it on someone else pocket

my ex made a scandal when I have asked her to pay a hotel for something that she insisted a lot , even though I told her that for the next couple of months I am a bit tight with money

my guess comes from listening to stuff from her friends

 

[Bigpapa]

I just don't agree with this line of thinking anymore. Its modern western man thinking. This is how we got "honey do lists" and "man caves"
The relationship maintenence is on her. This is why we watch behavior and not words. What is she doing for us.

Leading and controlling a relationship comes by displaying qualities that she in return maintains through her being able to "let go" because you are that rock.
She will then more so do things for as if you are ok. Like feeding or physical or serving in a way that is submissive. Sprinkle this in with an occasional bit of beta and you have a great balance.

I was saying that they do not really do this anymore , so as a guy if you really want a relationship you have to take full accountability for the relationship too , otherwise it will not work

so you either take a dead weight with you , either you do not . But things will not change based on framing anymore

 

[B80]

yeah , was saying this in a previous post . Women brag about this to other women , which in return will want the same thing .

it is like a competition between guys when it comes to cars “ bro look at my brand new Mercedes’ “

the only difference is that guys do it on their own pocket , while women do it on someone else pocket

my ex made a scandal when I have asked her to pay a hotel for something that she insisted a lot , even though I told her that for the next couple of months I am a bit tight with money

my guess comes from listening to stuff from her friends

Yeah, you're no doubt right re friends. As mentioned on here, women are inclined to follow the herd, be influenced more than men. Not always of course but as generalization. Ties in with consumerism and women earning more, more influenced by advertising and in term spending more money imo.

Recently overheard my boss sounding wound up talking to someone about his wife. Basically she was moaning about not going on enough trips abroad. He was saying how he bought her new electric car last year, she doesn;t work and hasn;t since 3 kids arrived (now all over 18). And he was saying she had chance to give up work and raise kids (which she wanted), he works a lot of hours now and probably always has to earn very good wage. Was saying he's fed up and if she wants all of this, then she'll have to get a job. Hope it doesn;t happen, but listening in, was thinking 'umm, this doesn;t sound good. ' hope I don't hear about separation in coming months, but sadly wouldn;t surprise me.

 

[HaleyBaron]

I like it. You're a fox who's taken a career as a chicken so that you can gain access to the hen house and slay the chickens while they sleep.

I hear that Male Nurses are currently playing this game. Male Occupational Therapists are in automatic pvssy paradise. I believe that Trans Men are pulling the same trick so that they can gain access to the women's bathroom and watch women pee.

I'd never want to go out with nurses. Stuck up and usually unattractive unless she's fresh 18-22 year old out of college.

 

[Bigpapa]

Bigpapa,

I am sympathetic to your view point. I have often thought that for a woman to stay in a relationship, even if her man is alpha AF, she has to have a certain standard of living (set by her mind / expectations/ family upbringing, etc.) met otherwise she will leave...or be a miserable disrespectful *****. In my view, this is part of the burden of performance for men...if they want a LTR.

I worry that we have entered a time where women at a very primitive level understand that once married to man, she has a lot of power over him. It is hard to see the up side for men now in any kind of marriage. Even with an exclusive long-term LTR, she still gets a fair amount of power over the man if they have children...which, to me, is sort of the only reason to keep women around...to mother children. All of this is to say, I have hard time recommending any sort of modern LTR to another man. Sad to say.

I was awakened while married. What keeps me in my miserable situation is my son. I never cared to much about having kids or taking care of them, and when I saw my son everything changed. Men today have a tough lot. Modern women are miserable. However, they are required to pass along your genes. Once you have kids, there is the profound happiness in seeing them grow and love you, but then you are stuck with a legal anchor.

If you are considering any long term thing with a woman, her body count MUST be very low. If not, forget about it.

Just my 0.02

T

hey man . Good post , and a lot of guys who have families and so on go through the same thing . Women will always use everything against you to get what she wants

framing alone does not work anymore , or at least is not as effective as it used to be .

the only sad part of the whole thing is that if indeed you have children with someone , you also have to be at peace with yourself that things will go south .

if you know this , you might not be as affected as guys who did not knew the Female Mondus operandi , but the children will be the ones taking the hit

 

[Velasco]

unless she's fresh 18-22 year old out of college.

Yes

 

[Bigpapa]

Manipulating true desire in my experience never works. Without that burn she has to be with you it is a smokescreen until she feels for another man. And she will.
Her maintenance is the relationship and to serve.
Yes doing things but don't forget genuine desire.

the problem is not with the genuine desire , is the expectation that a woman has when it comes to relationships . Mainly because they live in a fairy tale , and not in the reality

and even if she eventually succumbs to desire , then the feminist manifesto comes in from media and their friends

a woman cares more about how she is perceived , than actually if it is the right or bad thing for her

 

[Bigpapa]

Yes

same with female doctors , unless she is a dermatologist or something where she does beauty skin treatments and works in a small clinic , or anything like that

the more a woman has to work , the more she will look like sh1t even on short term . On medium and long term , it is horrible

 

[SW15]

SW15 talking sense as usual!

Out of interest, what are your thoughts around women liking money. Security plays a part, but from what I gauge over the years, a big part is showing off/competing with 'friends' to. Not just good to have cushion of money, assets growing, big 'need' for outward displays of wealth too.

Mentioned ages on here, but I was seeing a woman last year for 6 months. She started mentioning friends, 1 particular friend that was seeing a blue collar worker, who had his own business (can;t recall what it was exactly now). Apparently her bought her friend a new/nnearly new merc, with personal plate which had 'Boss' via some mix of numbers and letters hahaa. Also he was buying her shoes for over 1k and load of other sh1t. Crazy really.

And to add, people who think women have sell by date are kidding themselves. One of my aunties is into 60's and has dated various seriously wealthy men of a similar age.

Maybe for small % of men, they'll keep banging 20 year olds into their 60's, but from what I see, men/women seem to have no problems with dating all the way through life with people from same age range.

Women like money. They like outward displays of wealth.

All sex is transactional, whether directly or indirectly. Men will always use money to get access to sex. Some men have money as the entirety of their game. Bill Gates is the classic example of this, but there are plenty of business executives who use their salary as the basis of getting laid and getting relationship. You don't want to primarily compete for women just based on money. You'll need a lot of money to compete mostly on money.

The Wall Is Softer Than We Think – Roosh Valizadeh

One popular maxim of the manosphere is the wall. It goes something like this: Once a girl is done riding the **** carousel, she will find herself at an age and lower attractiveness where she can no longer get the alpha male she wants. She will then have no choice but to load up on cats or find a lo

www.rooshv.com

The wall is softer than we think. Plenty of women in their 30s/40s are heavily pursued. @B80 -- Your aunt is her 60s was pursued. There are post menopausal women in their 50s/60s now getting heavily pursued on Match and OurTime. @BeExcellent is over 50 with children under 18 living at home and has a boyfriend who is 8 years younger. In the mid-2010s, my mom was in her early 60s and on dating websites. She was more pursued as a woman in her early 60s than she was as a high school cheerleader.

I like it. You're a fox who's taken a career as a chicken so that you can gain access to the hen house and slay the chickens while they sleep.

I hear that Male Nurses are currently playing this game. Male Occupational Therapists are in automatic pvssy paradise. I believe that Trans Men are pulling the same trick so that they can gain access to the women's bathroom and watch women pee.

Fewer people are getting laid as a result of their presence at their workplaces. That's a trend that's been happening since the 1990s. The trend has likely accelerated with a lot of white collar work now substantially work at home.

I don't know if male nurses or male occupational therapists are getting laid a lot.

I'd never want to go out with nurses. Stuck up and usually unattractive unless she's fresh 18-22 year old out of college.

same with female doctors , unless she is a dermatologist or something where she does beauty skin treatments and works in a small clinic , or anything like that

the more a woman has to work , the more she will look like sh1t even on short term . On medium and long term , it is horrible

Nurses are more dateable than doctors, at least the nurses with a bachelor's degree or less. In general, women with advanced level degrees (more than a bachelor's) are not very dateable. Women with advanced level degrees are usually working a ton. Ever try to date a female lawyer? Good luck with that. Even if they are physically attractive, their schedules are insane and getting on it regularly is very difficult. Getting a female lawyer for one night of sex is possible or maybe even a casual bang scenario for a few months, but they are terrible girlfriends. It's a similar story for female doctors. Nurses are more likely to have enough free time to be dateable. Some nurses have the attitude problem that @HaleyBaron describes but writing off the entirety of that profession isn't an idea that makes sense. It's much more sensible to write off females in a profession requiring an advanced degree.