The invisible wall

[sxevanguy]

This is my first post on this forum, and really any forum about relationships with women, but it's time to unload. I hope that being in this forum can help me to be the man I want to be.

I have been aware of these types of topics for about 20 years. I understood these things and I felt like it helped me somewhat at that time, but not to the extent that I would have liked. I still suffered a lack of self confidence and I had very little going for me at the time, but had some success with fairly unattractive women.

Eventually I ended up meeting my soon-to-be ex-wife. She really seemed to like me...but she turned out to be a sociopath, and I played the martyr role for a long time. I lost a lot in that time, and it was only at a certain breaking point that I had the backbone to end it, and even that decision was one I was so afraid of making at the time.

Since that time, I have been working on getting my life together. She was a hoarder and I eventually got all her **** out of my home, and bought some new furniture, got it clean, money is coming in fairly well, and I have a sense of happiness and self worth that I haven't felt in a long time, if ever.

The first 5+ months of separation, I just was still living with her hoarding crap in my home, and I just didn't feel ready to date, but I was reading and preparing for it. I felt like I was re-gaining a good grasp on myself and felt like I was much more desirable and had a lot more going for me when it came to relationships with women. In recent weeks, I started bouldering to improve my fitness (plus the girls in those places are ****ing amazing). I have also started to learn how to dance, and just started to learn the guitar. Even with me trying to get fitter, I am not overweight and I am a fairly good looking man, but I would like to become some degree of "ripped" both for myself and for my SMV. I generally try and take good care of my health as well and I think I look good and healthy for my age (early 40s).

I was a loner growing up and during the course of my marriage I had continued to shut myself off from the world, partly due to my ex trying to isolate me from people for purposes of her control over me, and partly shame over how my life was. I also developed a really bad social skills when I was a kid. I had been bullied and my solution was to wall myself off and even when girls seemed interested in me, I was unfriendly with them out of fear that they were just setting me up for a prank. I also didn't dress very well and when kids would tease me about it, unlike most kids who would take a hint and make changes, I just steeled my resolve to not cave to the pressure. I also didn't drink or smoke or use drugs and I was uncomfortable with and judgemental of the kids that did.

Anyways...to present day. About 5 months ago I tried to start dating again. Except for 2 women, virtually every date that I went on keeps on saying "I don't feel a connection". I am aware of what that means, and I have read enough to understand the "general" way women are. My sense of what it means is that they aren't getting ***** tingles when they meet with me. The exceptions were one girl who I was not interested in but she kept coming back to me. I ****ed her but she was OCD about cleaning and my home was not that clean at the time. She didn't want to see me again after that and I wasn't disappointed.

The other was really into me at the start but I ended up repeating some of the mistakes of my marriage with her, and after 2 weeks of dating and lots of sex, she told me that she was taking an antidepressant and was stopping it. Within days, she became mean, angry, and hateful. I really enjoyed the frequent sex, but other than that I thank God that it ended.

There is another woman who I met in the early days of dating and became platonic friends with, and there have been times that I would have agreed to a relationship with her if she wanted me. However, she spent the whole time hung up on another guy who neglects her. He spent the last 4 months in Mexico surfing and she would go weeks without hearing from him. She said from the moment she met him that she felt amazing "chemistry" She has admitted that he has said things that make her feel like she is "one of many." I told her that it was a great idea for him that he go to Mexico, that I should do the same, and that the girls will be all over him down there. I have no doubt he was having a good time there, but when I suggested to meet her one time she shot me down, and said she was waiting for him to get back. The girl is very sweet and I don't have many friends and I have valued her friendship, and I am OK with it as it is because I also feel like I can do better, and I feel if she can't see the man that I am that she does not deserve me.

These women that I have met have been from dating apps. I understand that it is not the ideal way to meet women, but partly due to the pandemic, partly just finding a starting point, and partly that I feel it is a legitimate way to meet women, it is where I am right now. I don't drink and I am only just now starting to learn anything about dancing, so clubs and bars have been awkward for me. I also seem to have a difficult time hearing anything a woman (or anyone) says in these places.

I feel like I am stuck for good activities to meet girls where it is fun and sort of intimate. I find meeting a girl for coffee or even dinner to be ****. Small talk is boring. I found some success with movie theatres. I am in a cold weather area and this time of year is not great for outdoor activities, and I don't feel recreational activities are necessarily great ways to increase intimacy.

At the end of the day, at this point in time, I don't want a serious relationship with a woman. I just want to ****, and I want to **** a lot. I was OK with one woman when I was getting it 3 times a day. If I can become an expert in ***** tingles, then I am confident that I would not be looking to settle down unless she either let me continue to do that or joined me. The first couple weeks of that relationship I thought I was in love, and I have also felt at times like I loved the friend with the neglectful BF, but I am conscious of one-itis and I can very well imagine that if I had 6 gorgeous women readily available to **** that I would never choose to give that up for the affections of one, no matter how sweet she may be.

Tonight was just another breaking point for me. A fairly average, kind of chubby girl with a skin pigment issue met with me for coffee. She seemed friendly and engaging, and was decent enough that I would have been willing to **** her. However, after we left she texted me and said it was nice to meet me but "she didn't feel the connection." I have been through this rodeo enough times but I found it laughable that she felt she could do better. I normally respond politely with confidence to such messages, but what good has being nice ever done for me? As an aside I have read most of "No More Mr. Nice Guy" and read A Rational Male and a couple other books already.

I thought I would take a different approach. I wouldn't see her again anyway. I replied with the most honest thing that I could think of. I wrote "lol, no problem, after meeting you, I was only interested in ****ing you." I didn't enjoy it frankly, but it was true and that was one important lesson I was trying to implement from the book. She didn't take it well, but that didn't bother me. She spoke her truth, and so did I.

I see advice to just keep going out and get back in the saddle, but its clear that whatever I am doing is not working and that I am just a sucker for punishment because I am horny and am spending too much time pursuing women and not having any success. I feel like I just need to step back for a bit and figure out the equation to make a ***** tingle and then go out to the lab and test it again. But I am stuck. I will keep reading and I saw some of the additional suggested materials on the forum, but I have read a lot, learned a lot and come a long way but it's clearly not getting results.

Further, high in the funnel of ***** attraction, I don't have an idea of what to write on my profile that would get the most interest, and I haven't had a lot of photos so I don't have a lot of good ones. I tested a few on photofeeler and get good feedback that they are not great photos. I could go hire a photographer but then it would look too canned, so I need to figure out my "branding".

NMMNG has recommended connecting with men as a way to improve my manliness, and I think its a good idea but I play a racquet sport and do associate with men somewhat there and have for years, although I don't have any guy friends where we just kind of hang out or whatever. It is something I am going to figure out.

I am determined to figure this out so that I can enjoy this aspect of my life that I feel is missing. Miss sweetiepie sometimes says things to me that give me the feeling that she is floating in her mind the idea of me as a husband/provider type, but I don't want to settle for it. I want to feel like a man, I would rather feel a woman's lust than feel a woman's love.

Any suggestions? Free

 

[Billtx49]

Good to see you’re a new member here. Welcome to the Forum.…

 

[corrector]

But I am stuck. I will keep reading and I saw some of the additional suggested materials on the forum, but I have read a lot, learned a lot and come a long way but it's clearly not getting results.

How have you come a long way?

 

[sxevanguy]

How have you come a long way?

It's a fair question, but when you are at the very bottom, not being at the very bottom is an improvement even if it's a long way from the top. I have come a long way as far as valuing myself and self worth, my career, becoming a more well rounded person, setting higher standards for women. Not letting one gaslight me with guilt and shame. Not letting what women think of me determine my self worth. I wouldn't say any of these things are perfect, but they are much better than they were, even if they could still be even better.

I also have a better understanding of the nature of women and how they generally don't really know or are unwilling to articulate what they want, and not to take them at their word as to the reasons something isn't working. I don't even ask them. I understand the reasons they aren't working, I just cannot translate that into a conversation and behaviours that inspire arousal.

 

[metalwater]

There is another woman who I met in the early days of dating and became platonic friends with, and there have been times that I would have agreed to a relationship with her if she wanted me. However, she spent the whole time hung up on another guy who neglects her. He spent the last 4 months in Mexico surfing and she would go weeks without hearing from him. She said from the moment she met him that she felt amazing "chemistry" She has admitted that he has said things that make her feel like she is "one of many." I told her that it was a great idea for him that he go to Mexico, that I should do the same, and that the girls will be all over him down there. I have no doubt he was having a good time there, but when I suggested to meet her one time she shot me down, and said she was waiting for him to get back. The girl is very sweet and I don't have many friends and I have valued her friendship, and I am OK with it as it is because I also feel like I can do better, and I feel if she can't see the man that I am that she does not deserve me.

Any suggestions? Free

Welcome. What you have told is not that uncommon. Man men are in the same situation, most of them are in a dead LTR of some sort with all of the other issues you talk about. The good news for you is that you have already cut that cord and are very free to improve.

I quoted the part of what you wrote that is interesting to focus on for you. In some regards, women are mostly the same from place to place. You described a man that women like, and that man acts differently than you do. it is likely that you do not approve of him and how he chooses to live. Women like him...

Probably will take some time to get it all sorted out for you, while you're doing that I suggest you continue to work hard on physical fitness. Heavy lifting and some running. It will help you in every way to do that, and it is something that you don't have to figure out, it is something you can just decide and do.

Look forward to updates about how it goes for you. When you have specific questions, the men on SS can give you ideas, some ideas will be crazy and others really good.

 

[bat soup]

This is my first post on this forum, and really any forum about relationships with women, but it's time to unload. I hope that being in this forum can help me to be the man I want to be.

I have been aware of these types of topics for about 20 years. I understood these things and I felt like it helped me somewhat at that time, but not to the extent that I would have liked. I still suffered a lack of self confidence and I had very little going for me at the time, but had some success with fairly unattractive women.

Eventually I ended up meeting my soon-to-be ex-wife. She really seemed to like me...but she turned out to be a sociopath, and I played the martyr role for a long time. I lost a lot in that time, and it was only at a certain breaking point that I had the backbone to end it, and even that decision was one I was so afraid of making at the time.

Since that time, I have been working on getting my life together. She was a hoarder and I eventually got all her **** out of my home, and bought some new furniture, got it clean, money is coming in fairly well, and I have a sense of happiness and self worth that I haven't felt in a long time, if ever.

The first 5+ months of separation, I just was still living with her hoarding crap in my home, and I just didn't feel ready to date, but I was reading and preparing for it. I felt like I was re-gaining a good grasp on myself and felt like I was much more desirable and had a lot more going for me when it came to relationships with women. In recent weeks, I started bouldering to improve my fitness (plus the girls in those places are ****ing amazing). I have also started to learn how to dance, and just started to learn the guitar. Even with me trying to get fitter, I am not overweight and I am a fairly good looking man, but I would like to become some degree of "ripped" both for myself and for my SMV. I generally try and take good care of my health as well and I think I look good and healthy for my age (early 40s).

I was a loner growing up and during the course of my marriage I had continued to shut myself off from the world, partly due to my ex trying to isolate me from people for purposes of her control over me, and partly shame over how my life was. I also developed a really bad social skills when I was a kid. I had been bullied and my solution was to wall myself off and even when girls seemed interested in me, I was unfriendly with them out of fear that they were just setting me up for a prank. I also didn't dress very well and when kids would tease me about it, unlike most kids who would take a hint and make changes, I just steeled my resolve to not cave to the pressure. I also didn't drink or smoke or use drugs and I was uncomfortable with and judgemental of the kids that did.

Anyways...to present day. About 5 months ago I tried to start dating again. Except for 2 women, virtually every date that I went on keeps on saying "I don't feel a connection". I am aware of what that means, and I have read enough to understand the "general" way women are. My sense of what it means is that they aren't getting ***** tingles when they meet with me. The exceptions were one girl who I was not interested in but she kept coming back to me. I ****ed her but she was OCD about cleaning and my home was not that clean at the time. She didn't want to see me again after that and I wasn't disappointed.

The other was really into me at the start but I ended up repeating some of the mistakes of my marriage with her, and after 2 weeks of dating and lots of sex, she told me that she was taking an antidepressant and was stopping it. Within days, she became mean, angry, and hateful. I really enjoyed the frequent sex, but other than that I thank God that it ended.

There is another woman who I met in the early days of dating and became platonic friends with, and there have been times that I would have agreed to a relationship with her if she wanted me. However, she spent the whole time hung up on another guy who neglects her. He spent the last 4 months in Mexico surfing and she would go weeks without hearing from him. She said from the moment she met him that she felt amazing "chemistry" She has admitted that he has said things that make her feel like she is "one of many." I told her that it was a great idea for him that he go to Mexico, that I should do the same, and that the girls will be all over him down there. I have no doubt he was having a good time there, but when I suggested to meet her one time she shot me down, and said she was waiting for him to get back. The girl is very sweet and I don't have many friends and I have valued her friendship, and I am OK with it as it is because I also feel like I can do better, and I feel if she can't see the man that I am that she does not deserve me.

These women that I have met have been from dating apps. I understand that it is not the ideal way to meet women, but partly due to the pandemic, partly just finding a starting point, and partly that I feel it is a legitimate way to meet women, it is where I am right now. I don't drink and I am only just now starting to learn anything about dancing, so clubs and bars have been awkward for me. I also seem to have a difficult time hearing anything a woman (or anyone) says in these places.

I feel like I am stuck for good activities to meet girls where it is fun and sort of intimate. I find meeting a girl for coffee or even dinner to be ****. Small talk is boring. I found some success with movie theatres. I am in a cold weather area and this time of year is not great for outdoor activities, and I don't feel recreational activities are necessarily great ways to increase intimacy.

At the end of the day, at this point in time, I don't want a serious relationship with a woman. I just want to ****, and I want to **** a lot. I was OK with one woman when I was getting it 3 times a day. If I can become an expert in ***** tingles, then I am confident that I would not be looking to settle down unless she either let me continue to do that or joined me. The first couple weeks of that relationship I thought I was in love, and I have also felt at times like I loved the friend with the neglectful BF, but I am conscious of one-itis and I can very well imagine that if I had 6 gorgeous women readily available to **** that I would never choose to give that up for the affections of one, no matter how sweet she may be.

Tonight was just another breaking point for me. A fairly average, kind of chubby girl with a skin pigment issue met with me for coffee. She seemed friendly and engaging, and was decent enough that I would have been willing to **** her. However, after we left she texted me and said it was nice to meet me but "she didn't feel the connection." I have been through this rodeo enough times but I found it laughable that she felt she could do better. I normally respond politely with confidence to such messages, but what good has being nice ever done for me? As an aside I have read most of "No More Mr. Nice Guy" and read A Rational Male and a couple other books already.

I thought I would take a different approach. I wouldn't see her again anyway. I replied with the most honest thing that I could think of. I wrote "lol, no problem, after meeting you, I was only interested in ****ing you." I didn't enjoy it frankly, but it was true and that was one important lesson I was trying to implement from the book. She didn't take it well, but that didn't bother me. She spoke her truth, and so did I.

I see advice to just keep going out and get back in the saddle, but its clear that whatever I am doing is not working and that I am just a sucker for punishment because I am horny and am spending too much time pursuing women and not having any success. I feel like I just need to step back for a bit and figure out the equation to make a ***** tingle and then go out to the lab and test it again. But I am stuck. I will keep reading and I saw some of the additional suggested materials on the forum, but I have read a lot, learned a lot and come a long way but it's clearly not getting results.

Further, high in the funnel of ***** attraction, I don't have an idea of what to write on my profile that would get the most interest, and I haven't had a lot of photos so I don't have a lot of good ones. I tested a few on photofeeler and get good feedback that they are not great photos. I could go hire a photographer but then it would look too canned, so I need to figure out my "branding".

NMMNG has recommended connecting with men as a way to improve my manliness, and I think its a good idea but I play a racquet sport and do associate with men somewhat there and have for years, although I don't have any guy friends where we just kind of hang out or whatever. It is something I am going to figure out.

I am determined to figure this out so that I can enjoy this aspect of my life that I feel is missing. Miss sweetiepie sometimes says things to me that give me the feeling that she is floating in her mind the idea of me as a husband/provider type, but I don't want to settle for it. I want to feel like a man, I would rather feel a woman's lust than feel a woman's love.

Any suggestions? Free

If a woman says any of these words: "connection", "chemistry" or "friend" just immediately block her number, then delete it and move on. Don't accept friendship with women that you want to date and don't let them talk about their exes or other guys unless you're sliding your hand up between their legs whilst they do it.

 

[sxevanguy]

Welcome. What you have told is not that uncommon. Man men are in the same situation, most of them are in a dead LTR of some sort with all of the other issues you talk about. The good news for you is that you have already cut that cord and are very free to improve.

I quoted the part of what you wrote that is interesting to focus on for you. In some regards, women are mostly the same from place to place. You described a man that women like, and that man acts differently than you do. it is likely that you do not approve of him and how he chooses to live. Women like him...

Actually I don’t have an issue with the guy, not that I know him. I was serious about it when I told the girl that it was a great idea. I am sure he is pulling in town also but I don’t feel bad for her, she knows what he is and she keeps hanging on even if she doesn’t like it. It is where I would like to be. Look after my own needs and be ambiguously honest about it.

 

[metalwater]

Actually I don’t have an issue with the guy, not that I know him. I was serious about it when I told the girl that it was a great idea. I am sure he is pulling in town also but I don’t feel bad for her, she knows what he is and she keeps hanging on even if she doesn’t like it. It is where I would like to be. Look after my own needs and be ambiguously honest about it.

great, you got the point exactly. some version of that is what it is. read all the stuff and visit the forum often.

 

[corrector]

I understand the reasons they aren't working, I just cannot translate that into a conversation and behaviours that inspire arousal.

They have to cooperate with you too. Maybe you dont look hot enough for the women who get tonnes of social media validations, guys simping over them, and have plenty of options and orbiters. You may not really have a chance in todays marketplace.

 

[Robert28]

If a woman says any of these words: "connection", "chemistry" or "friend" just immediately block her number, then delete it and move on. Don't accept friendship with women that you want to date and don't let them talk about their exes or other guys unless you're sliding your hand up between their legs whilst they do it.

If a woman in her mid to late 30’s and 40’s uses those words, RUN. They aren’t emotionally mature and are fvcked up in the head. They’re basically a teenager in an old lady’s body. Women your age should know that successful relationships are more than just gina tingles and won’t waste your time trying to be friends either. The whole “connection” and “chemistry” bs is for when you’re teenager or in your 20’s. But when these women get old they need to be looking for WAY more than that from a man.

 

[DSterlen]

I don't want a serious relationship with a woman. I just want to ****, and I want to **** a lot

This "connection" or "vibe" bullsh*t is basically a combination of all this...

Body language - relaxed / comfortable / open / lean back / move smoothly & intentionally / don't be jumpy or over-reactive

Control your voice - don't speak too quickly / use pauses for effect / use your (slightly) sexy voice

C*cky & funny - playful teasing i.e. David DeAngelo

Don't let things she says affect your mood, confidence or "frame"

Mystery - don't spill every detail about yourself. Leave a little something to the imagination.

Facial expressions - speak with your facial expressions and eyes / the subtle lower-lip bite and the sly smile for example. The little head **** when she says something goofy. Go look at all the face emoji's you have on your phone. Each one literally says something, and it's just a cartoon face. Be fairly subtle, it doesn't take much. Chicks pick up on it more easily than you probably do.

Gradual escalation of physical touch - from accidental light shoulder to shoulder brushes to touching her forearm to get her attention. From there maybe upper or lower back when entering a building or room. Don't be weird and let these touches linger as if you're getting off on it. It's casual, natural and not a big deal if you're doing it appropriately for the comfort level that you are at with her at that moment. Physical contact releases chemicals, period. It does not have to be in a sexual spot to do so. If you think you're going to hang out and talk with a woman for hours with zero physical contact and she's going to want to f*ck you at the end, you're wrong, unless your name is Giga-Chad.

Also, generally speaking, women will not touch you at all, even accidentally, if they're not interested somewhat. They actively avoid it so you don't get the wrong idea. If she does, it's a good sign. There was this hot young chick I unfortunately had the One-Itis for. I wasn't sure if she was down but one day she walked past me and brushed her shoulder against me (unnecessarily) twice in a short period of time. I thought "yup, she's down". She was.

 

[Black Widow Void]

Welcome aboard.

Despite your self-belief, you are actually further along than probably half the members here.
What I mean is... half the members here are not willing to admit to themselves that they have failed (we all do by the way). Instead, they look for postings such as yours to attack in effort to feel better about themselves. Rest assured that are are further along than them.

From 1st to 5th grade, I went to various schools and was constantly put on 'trial' as the new kid. It wasn't fun. I am actual proof that with enough introspection and social observation, things can be worked through and you can succeed.

I still think about my past parental upbringing, the neighborhood bullies, school ridicule etc... That doesn't go away, and although the memories remain, the current experiences do not (I did a lot of the hard work to make things change ).

Stick around. Although you'll encounter some bone-heads among this forum, you'll also get some good insights as well.

 

[RangerMIke]

Except for 2 women, virtually every date that I went on keeps on saying "I don't feel a connection". I am aware of what that means, and I have read enough to understand the "general" way women are.

Totally normal. Just be glad that they tell you this up front so you aren't wasting time with them. Everything starts with the chick... if she isn't feeling it nothing is going to happen. Any man that tells you that he can make anything happen with any woman is a fvcking liar or he is wealthy, good looking, and famous.

However, she spent the whole time hung up on another guy who neglects her. He spent the last 4 months in Mexico surfing and she would go weeks without hearing from him. She said from the moment she met him that she felt amazing "chemistry" She has admitted that he has said things that make her feel like she is "one of many."

She is the RULE not the exception. Pretty much all women are like this. If you are with a chick that is running on about some dude, then just cut that off then and there and walk away. Don't be a d1ck about it, just move on because she is communicating to you that she is not interested in you. It is normal for a woman to talk about her ex on a 1st date, what she is telling you is want she doesn't like. But if she keeps doing this, then you don't have a shot. NEVER NEVER make any comments about dudes she dated... you can't keep her from running her mouth... but do not contribute. The only thing you should say about another dude is "Well, he couldn't be that bad since you are clearly hung up on him." Then change the subject.

These women that I have met have been from dating apps. I understand that it is not the ideal way to meet women, but partly due to the pandemic, partly just finding a starting point, and partly that I feel it is a legitimate way to meet women, it is where I am right now.

I would rather sit home alone and save money than do on-line dating. The pandemic is tough and for over a year I didn't go out on any dates with new women because of this... I pretty much just re-heated leftovers (women I dated in the past). I'm too old to learn that new trick... so I can't give you any advice on how to make OLD work for you... accept to say just move through these woman as fast as you can, if she won't meet you on a date, just move on. You just have to do this a lot.... The problem with OLD is that MOST women are just on there to get an ego boost.

I feel like I am stuck for good activities to meet girls where it is fun and sort of intimate. I find meeting a girl for coffee or even dinner to be ****. Small talk is boring. I found some success with movie theatres. I am in a cold weather area and this time of year is not great for outdoor activities, and I don't feel recreational activities are necessarily great ways to increase intimacy.

You are getting ahead of yourself. Don't worry about this sh1t, figure out what you like to do and get involved with that. You are trying to figure out what chicks might like... fvck that... You are also trying to figure out what kind of activities gives you the best shot at intimacy... again fvck that.... It really doesn't matter what you do, if a chick is into you she will figure out a way to make something happen. Ask yourself "What do I like to do?", then invite chicks along... works out much better.

Tonight was just another breaking point for me. A fairly average, kind of chubby girl with a skin pigment issue met with me for coffee. She seemed friendly and engaging, and was decent enough that I would have been willing to **** her. However, after we left she texted me and said it was nice to meet me but "she didn't feel the connection." I have been through this rodeo enough times but I found it laughable that she felt she could do better. I normally respond politely with confidence to such messages, but what good has being nice ever done for me? As an aside I have read most of "No More Mr. Nice Guy" and read A Rational Male and a couple other books already.

When this happens to me, AND YES, this does happen to me. I always just thank them for honesty, wish them luck, then I delete the number and forget about her. You don't need to be a d1ck about it, just move on. It NEVER NEVER hurts you to be polite... I know a lot of men that will become some butt hurt little b1tch. There is nothing wrong with being a 'nice guy', it only becomes a problem when your 'niceness' cause you to sacrifice your time and resources with a chick then it becomes a form of manipulation.

Any suggestions? Free

Keep working on yourself. Stop worrying so much about getting women. Be the best version of yourself you can be. Use this emotional energy to build a better life for yourself. Learn an new language, use the extra time to get a side gig and make money. Be selfish, plan doing things you want to do, involve yourself with organizations that you care about. Try to make dates and see what happens... but otherwise don't worry about it.

 

[sxevanguy]

Totally normal. Just be glad that they tell you this up front so you aren't wasting time with them. Everything starts with the chick... if she isn't feeling it nothing is going to happen. Any man that tells you that he can make anything happen with any woman is a fvcking liar or he is wealthy, good looking, and famous.



She is the RULE not the exception. Pretty much all women are like this. If you are with a chick that is running on about some dude, then just cut that off then and there and walk away. Don't be a d1ck about it, just move on because she is communicating to you that she is not interested in you. It is normal for a woman to talk about her ex on a 1st date, what she is telling you is want she doesn't like. But if she keeps doing this, then you don't have a shot. NEVER NEVER make any comments about dudes she dated... you can't keep her from running her mouth... but do not contribute. The only thing you should say about another dude is "Well, he couldn't be that bad since you are clearly hung up on him." Then change the subject.



I would rather sit home alone and save money than do on-line dating. The pandemic is tough and for over a year I didn't go out on any dates with new women because of this... I pretty much just re-heated leftovers (women I dated in the past). I'm too old to learn that new trick... so I can't give you any advice on how to make OLD work for you... accept to say just move through these woman as fast as you can, if she won't meet you on a date, just move on. You just have to do this a lot.... The problem with OLD is that MOST women are just on there to get an ego boost.



You are getting ahead of yourself. Don't worry about this sh1t, figure out what you like to do and get involved with that. You are trying to figure out what chicks might like... fvck that... You are also trying to figure out what kind of activities gives you the best shot at intimacy... again fvck that.... It really doesn't matter what you do, if a chick is into you she will figure out a way to make something happen. Ask yourself "What do I like to do?", then invite chicks along... works out much better.



When this happens to me, AND YES, this does happen to me. I always just thank them for honesty, wish them luck, then I delete the number and forget about her. You don't need to be a d1ck about it, just move on. It NEVER NEVER hurts you to be polite... I know a lot of men that will become some butt hurt little b1tch. There is nothing wrong with being a 'nice guy', it only becomes a problem when your 'niceness' cause you to sacrifice your time and resources with a chick then it becomes a form of manipulation.



Keep working on yourself. Stop worrying so much about getting women. Be the best version of yourself you can be. Use this emotional energy to build a better life for yourself. Learn an new language, use the extra time to get a side gig and make money. Be selfish, plan doing things you want to do, involve yourself with organizations that you care about. Try to make dates and see what happens... but otherwise don't worry about it.

Thank you, your feedback is helpful, along with some of the others on here also. I definitely am working on being the best me I can be, and since my separation my life is significantly different. These things take some time, I am not where I want to be yet, but am well on my way. I wrote my first post in a lower moment of frustration, but I felt also that maybe hitting a moment like that can be the catalyst for change, and that was what I was hoping for. I have typically bottled up how I feel and not had anyone to really talk to, so it's good to have men to share with, especially ones who have been there and are (possibly) in a better place.

I know the general feeling about online dating and I see and agree with it. I won't expect much from it going forward but I think I will use it to just experiment, and in the meantime grow myself and put myself in more social situations where there will be more attractive women around. I had it pointed out to me with a life coach yesterday that those who want something too much do not tend to get it, and I could sense it.

The thing with a lot of dating advice that I have found is that you tend to get advice that is kind of on opposite extremes of the spectrum. For example, a girl LJBF'ing someone, and often the advice is to drop them like a hot stone, and I understand the rationale. On the other hand, I had read in a book that being in the friend zone is also a great place to be as it helps to expand your social circle and social credibility, and maybe you can meet her friends.

I had met a girl on Tinder who was very active in recreation and sports and for my first meeting with her, she invited me to go bouldering. I did go and meet her and tried it, and the girl was cute but she was the least attractive one in the place, and I found the exercise to be very challenging and I noticed that no one in there was out of shape, man or woman. I thought it was a good complementary activity to my main sport and although I had some degree of interest in the girl, she spends 10 hours a day doing sports and exercise and I have a job and like my sleep, so I told her that I thought we would be better off as friends, and she agreed. She then also invited me out to try a dance class she attends once a week and I had been wanting to do that but never could get myself to take the initiative to go out and find and pursue it myself. I have always been extremely uncomfortable with dancing, and again at the class there were a number of really attractive women again. If I dropped her immediately the first moment that I didn't get a sense that something could happen, I wouldn't have gotten those experiences, and I have had experiences where I went from initially in the friend-zone and within a few weeks of further contact, the girls would start to get flirty and touchy with me. I had hints that it could happen with this girl even. I am not trying to be friends with her to just orbit her or devote my efforts in the hope that she may like me, I am still meeting and trying to meet other girls at the same time. But I have thought about the idea of pro-actively putting girls in the friend-zone like I did this one also, as I feel like as they become familiar and comfortable with me that they start to like me, and in the vein also of not being needy or appearing desperate.

On the other hand, I also am starting to experiment with just telling girls to come over. Since my breakup, almost all of the girls I have met I just had not felt comfortable asking that early on. I tried this tactic on a cute little 20 year old last night and had her seem to be considering it. I just pushed and pushed until I wrote something that I guess may have pushed her out of her potential comfort zone and then she wrote "lol wtf" and blocked me. At least it was fun and I learned that I can push it as far as I want and the worst thing that can happen is that they stop talking to me, but some will surely bite. It was one of the first times that I felt like I was playful since I started dating. I would often joke in talking with women, but it was the first time I felt like I was playing.

 

[eli77]

This is my first post on this forum, and really any forum about relationships with women, but it's time to unload. I hope that being in this forum can help me to be the man I want to be.

I have been aware of these types of topics for about 20 years. I understood these things and I felt like it helped me somewhat at that time, but not to the extent that I would have liked. I still suffered a lack of self confidence and I had very little going for me at the time, but had some success with fairly unattractive women.

Eventually I ended up meeting my soon-to-be ex-wife. She really seemed to like me...but she turned out to be a sociopath, and I played the martyr role for a long time. I lost a lot in that time, and it was only at a certain breaking point that I had the backbone to end it, and even that decision was one I was so afraid of making at the time.

Since that time, I have been working on getting my life together. She was a hoarder and I eventually got all her **** out of my home, and bought some new furniture, got it clean, money is coming in fairly well, and I have a sense of happiness and self worth that I haven't felt in a long time, if ever.

The first 5+ months of separation, I just was still living with her hoarding crap in my home, and I just didn't feel ready to date, but I was reading and preparing for it. I felt like I was re-gaining a good grasp on myself and felt like I was much more desirable and had a lot more going for me when it came to relationships with women. In recent weeks, I started bouldering to improve my fitness (plus the girls in those places are ****ing amazing). I have also started to learn how to dance, and just started to learn the guitar. Even with me trying to get fitter, I am not overweight and I am a fairly good looking man, but I would like to become some degree of "ripped" both for myself and for my SMV. I generally try and take good care of my health as well and I think I look good and healthy for my age (early 40s).

I was a loner growing up and during the course of my marriage I had continued to shut myself off from the world, partly due to my ex trying to isolate me from people for purposes of her control over me, and partly shame over how my life was. I also developed a really bad social skills when I was a kid. I had been bullied and my solution was to wall myself off and even when girls seemed interested in me, I was unfriendly with them out of fear that they were just setting me up for a prank. I also didn't dress very well and when kids would tease me about it, unlike most kids who would take a hint and make changes, I just steeled my resolve to not cave to the pressure. I also didn't drink or smoke or use drugs and I was uncomfortable with and judgemental of the kids that did.

Anyways...to present day. About 5 months ago I tried to start dating again. Except for 2 women, virtually every date that I went on keeps on saying "I don't feel a connection". I am aware of what that means, and I have read enough to understand the "general" way women are. My sense of what it means is that they aren't getting ***** tingles when they meet with me. The exceptions were one girl who I was not interested in but she kept coming back to me. I ****ed her but she was OCD about cleaning and my home was not that clean at the time. She didn't want to see me again after that and I wasn't disappointed.

The other was really into me at the start but I ended up repeating some of the mistakes of my marriage with her, and after 2 weeks of dating and lots of sex, she told me that she was taking an antidepressant and was stopping it. Within days, she became mean, angry, and hateful. I really enjoyed the frequent sex, but other than that I thank God that it ended.

There is another woman who I met in the early days of dating and became platonic friends with, and there have been times that I would have agreed to a relationship with her if she wanted me. However, she spent the whole time hung up on another guy who neglects her. He spent the last 4 months in Mexico surfing and she would go weeks without hearing from him. She said from the moment she met him that she felt amazing "chemistry" She has admitted that he has said things that make her feel like she is "one of many." I told her that it was a great idea for him that he go to Mexico, that I should do the same, and that the girls will be all over him down there. I have no doubt he was having a good time there, but when I suggested to meet her one time she shot me down, and said she was waiting for him to get back. The girl is very sweet and I don't have many friends and I have valued her friendship, and I am OK with it as it is because I also feel like I can do better, and I feel if she can't see the man that I am that she does not deserve me.

These women that I have met have been from dating apps. I understand that it is not the ideal way to meet women, but partly due to the pandemic, partly just finding a starting point, and partly that I feel it is a legitimate way to meet women, it is where I am right now. I don't drink and I am only just now starting to learn anything about dancing, so clubs and bars have been awkward for me. I also seem to have a difficult time hearing anything a woman (or anyone) says in these places.

I feel like I am stuck for good activities to meet girls where it is fun and sort of intimate. I find meeting a girl for coffee or even dinner to be ****. Small talk is boring. I found some success with movie theatres. I am in a cold weather area and this time of year is not great for outdoor activities, and I don't feel recreational activities are necessarily great ways to increase intimacy.

At the end of the day, at this point in time, I don't want a serious relationship with a woman. I just want to ****, and I want to **** a lot. I was OK with one woman when I was getting it 3 times a day. If I can become an expert in ***** tingles, then I am confident that I would not be looking to settle down unless she either let me continue to do that or joined me. The first couple weeks of that relationship I thought I was in love, and I have also felt at times like I loved the friend with the neglectful BF, but I am conscious of one-itis and I can very well imagine that if I had 6 gorgeous women readily available to **** that I would never choose to give that up for the affections of one, no matter how sweet she may be.

Tonight was just another breaking point for me. A fairly average, kind of chubby girl with a skin pigment issue met with me for coffee. She seemed friendly and engaging, and was decent enough that I would have been willing to **** her. However, after we left she texted me and said it was nice to meet me but "she didn't feel the connection." I have been through this rodeo enough times but I found it laughable that she felt she could do better. I normally respond politely with confidence to such messages, but what good has being nice ever done for me? As an aside I have read most of "No More Mr. Nice Guy" and read A Rational Male and a couple other books already.

I thought I would take a different approach. I wouldn't see her again anyway. I replied with the most honest thing that I could think of. I wrote "lol, no problem, after meeting you, I was only interested in ****ing you." I didn't enjoy it frankly, but it was true and that was one important lesson I was trying to implement from the book. She didn't take it well, but that didn't bother me. She spoke her truth, and so did I.

I see advice to just keep going out and get back in the saddle, but its clear that whatever I am doing is not working and that I am just a sucker for punishment because I am horny and am spending too much time pursuing women and not having any success. I feel like I just need to step back for a bit and figure out the equation to make a ***** tingle and then go out to the lab and test it again. But I am stuck. I will keep reading and I saw some of the additional suggested materials on the forum, but I have read a lot, learned a lot and come a long way but it's clearly not getting results.

Further, high in the funnel of ***** attraction, I don't have an idea of what to write on my profile that would get the most interest, and I haven't had a lot of photos so I don't have a lot of good ones. I tested a few on photofeeler and get good feedback that they are not great photos. I could go hire a photographer but then it would look too canned, so I need to figure out my "branding".

NMMNG has recommended connecting with men as a way to improve my manliness, and I think its a good idea but I play a racquet sport and do associate with men somewhat there and have for years, although I don't have any guy friends where we just kind of hang out or whatever. It is something I am going to figure out.

I am determined to figure this out so that I can enjoy this aspect of my life that I feel is missing. Miss sweetiepie sometimes says things to me that give me the feeling that she is floating in her mind the idea of me as a husband/provider type, but I don't want to settle for it. I want to feel like a man, I would rather feel a woman's lust than feel a woman's love.

Any suggestions? Free

I know how you feel I suffer from one ideas feel free to DM me if you want to talk

 

[Willie Naylor]

You may not really have a chance in todays marketplace.

You are on the wrong forum.

Please stop trying to pollute the minds of other men here.

 

[corrector]

You are on the wrong forum.

Please stop trying to pollute the minds of other men here.

You are right, false hope is better than nothing.