Is there anyway to correct this situation or should I just simply exit?

[Sebastian0001]

So, I recently met this girl and we went on like 4 dates or so. She is an intellectual type, born in another country, conservative on relationship things like sex and living with a guy, and has a good personality and bubbly and fun. She is a physician and she moved to my city and we began talking. Actually we began talking before she moved here about a few months ago once she found out she was moving here. Things were going well and it felt like we were vibing well. Then once she moved here, we went to dinner and it was good. But, there was no kiss and it felt like she was the type to go slow and I was ok with it. Then we went on mini golf date and then she invited me to her place for drinks and we were alone. But, it was still very hard to make a move as she was not responding to any of the kino and escalation steps. There was not a bad response or a good response but really just no response. Finally, I concluded that because it was the 4th date that if I did not try to kiss her, it would go to friend zone. So, I asked her if I could kiss her goodnight and she, to my surprise, said yes. But, generally, I never ask for a kiss because I think it is against the escalation principles.

Fast forward a week, and now she has pulled back. Basically, I think I really kind of screwed things up. I started liking her more than she might have liked me and I asked her to hang out too frequently - every weekend and maybe once a week during the weekdays. I think she felt pressured and now she suddenly said she enjoys spending time with me but, after more thought, she thinks its more as a friend. I think she was definitely more interested before and it felt like got less interested after she probably concluded I was coming on too strong. She probably felt pressured on the kiss too in which I had asked her for. She said she would love to continue spending time together as a friend and I told her I wasn't interested in that.

So, long story short, do I have no choice but to exit this situation? Or is there any way to correct the wussy behavior and still get things back to dating as it was before? This is not a girl that really puts herself out there a lot so I don't necessarily think she will just jump to dating someone else and she is not super hot (but decently good looking). Really, I just kind of like her personality and quality of character. I know that sounds wussy but its just how I feel. Any advice?

 

[bat soup]

So, I recently met this girl and we went on like 4 dates or so. She is an intellectual type, born in another country, conservative on relationship things like sex and living with a guy, and has a good personality and bubbly and fun. She is a physician and she moved to my city and we began talking. Actually we began talking before she moved here about a few months ago once she found out she was moving here. Things were going well and it felt like we were vibing well. Then once she moved here, we went to dinner and it was good. But, there was no kiss and it felt like she was the type to go slow and I was ok with it. Then we went on mini golf date and then she invited me to her place for drinks and we were alone. But, it was still very hard to make a move as she was not responding to any of the kino and escalation steps. There was not a bad response or a good response but really just no response. Finally, I concluded that because it was the 4th date that if I did not try to kiss her, it would go to friend zone. So, I asked her if I could kiss her goodnight and she, to my surprise, said yes. But, generally, I never ask for a kiss because I think it is against the escalation principles.

Fast forward a week, and now she has pulled back. Basically, I think I really kind of screwed things up. I started liking her more than she might have liked me and I asked her to hang out too frequently - every weekend and maybe once a week during the weekdays. I think she felt pressured and now she suddenly said she enjoys spending time with me but, after more thought, she thinks its more as a friend. I think she was definitely more interested before and it felt like got less interested after she probably concluded I was coming on too strong. She probably felt pressured on the kiss too in which I had asked her for. She said she would love to continue spending time together as a friend and I told her I wasn't interested in that.

So, long story short, do I have no choice but to exit this situation? Or is there any way to correct the wussy behavior and still get things back to dating as it was before? This is not a girl that really puts herself out there a lot so I don't necessarily think she will just jump to dating someone else and she is not super hot (but decently good looking). Really, I just kind of like her personality and quality of character. I know that sounds wussy but its just how I feel. Any advice?

My advice is to stop talking to her and forget her completely.

You overlooked the red flags and rationalised her lack of cooperation because of her culture, but the reality is that she was kokblocking you from the beginning.

Generally, you don't want to be having "great conversation" with a girl that's deliberately avoiding any physical contact.

It's also not a good idea to keep going out on dates and getting to know a girl if she's not cooperating. Women like that are not worth getting to know.

I wouldn't say her personality it great at all. I'd say she's a manipulative attention whoare that took advantage of you and wasted your time.

She delayed showing her cards as long as possible by acting conservative. Now that you've forced her hand she's saying "I like you as a friend" which means that she wants zero physical contact whilst you continue to give her attention and adoration to boost her ego.

 

[RusMwas]

Spin another plate, don't negotiate for desire to escalate like you wish. It is better if she corrected the situation if genuinely desired by overtly showing desire now that she nows you had an interest on her.

 

[AttackFormation]

There is only one thing we do know: she's not interested. Whether she is or isnt a professional attention drainer is speculation at this point, and whether you assume the worst or not is up to you. However, i assume this woman is past her early 20s. If she really was bubbly and fun, had a good personality, intellectual, was actively dating, and "conservative" - how is she still single at her life stage? To me that's fishy until an understandable reason confirms otherwise.

We cant know whether there was something that turned her off which you did or didnt do. Maybe you didnt escalate, maybe you escalated in an awkward way. Maybe it wasnt you at all, but something like her starting to think more about her exes or the other guys she's seeing, or her hormones shifting, or her friends smearing you, or her changing her mind about hooking up with you in the last second, or something else. I wouldnt micro obsess over it too much.

 

[zinc4]

So, I recently met this girl and we went on like 4 dates or so. She is an intellectual type, born in another country, conservative on relationship things like sex and living with a guy, and has a good personality and bubbly and fun. She is a physician and she moved to my city and we began talking. Actually we began talking before she moved here about a few months ago once she found out she was moving here. Things were going well and it felt like we were vibing well. Then once she moved here, we went to dinner and it was good. But, there was no kiss and it felt like she was the type to go slow and I was ok with it. Then we went on mini golf date and then she invited me to her place for drinks and we were alone. But, it was still very hard to make a move as she was not responding to any of the kino and escalation steps. There was not a bad response or a good response but really just no response. Finally, I concluded that because it was the 4th date that if I did not try to kiss her, it would go to friend zone. So, I asked her if I could kiss her goodnight and she, to my surprise, said yes. But, generally, I never ask for a kiss because I think it is against the escalation principles.

Fast forward a week, and now she has pulled back. Basically, I think I really kind of screwed things up. I started liking her more than she might have liked me and I asked her to hang out too frequently - every weekend and maybe once a week during the weekdays. I think she felt pressured and now she suddenly said she enjoys spending time with me but, after more thought, she thinks its more as a friend. I think she was definitely more interested before and it felt like got less interested after she probably concluded I was coming on too strong. She probably felt pressured on the kiss too in which I had asked her for. She said she would love to continue spending time together as a friend and I told her I wasn't interested in that.

So, long story short, do I have no choice but to exit this situation? Or is there any way to correct the wussy behavior and still get things back to dating as it was before? This is not a girl that really puts herself out there a lot so I don't necessarily think she will just jump to dating someone else and she is not super hot (but decently good looking). Really, I just kind of like her personality and quality of character. I know that sounds wussy but its just how I feel. Any advice?

You had to close when she invited you back to her place. You got to be aggressive in that situation physically.

That was the 4th date? And you asked for a kiss? Never ask. Take.

You should have been escalating physically after the first 15 to 20 mins of arriving there until she either submits or screams for you to stop. Way too timid.

Now she doesn't see you as masculine enough probably. Never get psyched out by all that conservative talk.

Which country is she from?

 

[Sebastian0001]

There is only one thing we do know: she's not interested. Whether she is or isnt a professional attention drainer is speculation at this point, and whether you assume the worst or not is up to you. However, i assume this woman is past her early 20s. If she really was bubbly and fun, had a good personality, intellectual, was actively dating, and "conservative" - how is she still single at her life stage? To me that's fishy until an understandable reason confirms otherwise.

We cant know whether there was something that turned her off which you did or didnt do. Maybe you didnt escalate, maybe you escalated in an awkward way. Maybe it wasnt you at all, but something like her starting to think more about her exes or the other guys she's seeing, or her hormones shifting, or her friends smearing you, or her changing her mind about hooking up with you in the last second, or something else. I wouldnt micro obsess over it too much.

very astute observation! She is 36 so yes I fully agree that it is odd that she is still single at this life stage. Instead of micro-obsessing (which you are correct that I'm doing), what next steps would you suggest that I pursue? Her friends are not smearing me as her friends don't know me and live in another state, she is not seeing any other guys, and I have no clue on hormones lol.

Bottom line, do you think I should simply exit? Or what steps can I take to get this going in the right direction?

 

[Sebastian0001]

You had to close when she invited you back to her place. You got to be aggressive in that situation physically.

That was the 4th date? And you asked for a kiss? Never ask. Take.

You should have been escalating physically after the first 15 to 20 mins of arriving there until she either submits or screams for you to stop. Way too timid.

Now she doesn't see you as masculine enough probably. Never get psyched out by all that conservative talk.

Which country is she from?

She is born in India but came to the US as a little child at age 5 or something. I did indeed escalate immediately after coming to her place. But, I wasn't getting the signals back so I didn't know what to do. It was also a work night so it was getting late for her because she goes to sleep very early and we were up past that time significantly. I asked the kiss because I thought it was over anyways and she would say no but it was surprising that she said yes. But, I agree, asking for the kiss is not the way.

 

[AttackFormation]

very astute observation! She is 36 so yes I fully agree that it is odd that she is still single at this life stage. Instead of micro-obsessing (which you are correct that I'm doing), what next steps would you suggest that I pursue? Her friends are not smearing me as her friends don't know me and live in another state, she is not seeing any other guys, and I have no clue on hormones lol.

Bottom line, do you think I should simply exit? Or what steps can I take to get this going in the right direction?

Yeah mate, those reasons were just to illustrate the point that you cant know exactly what it was. All you can do is try to refine your overall personality and approach over time.

Personally, i think this woman sounds like a waste of time. It would be one thing if she had left the future open, but she has confirmed that she only wants you as a so called "friend". You combine that with her track record that i made my observation about, and to me, it adds up to a deleted number. It might be different if she had come from a sheltered background but was far younger and didnt confirm her rejection of you, but that's not the case here.

 

[darksprezzatura]

I didn't need to read your situation.

The moment you ask yourself this question is when you should ask yourself this:

Do you lack options right now?

If yes, get options and recalibrate your approach.

The right answer will present itself.

 

[Sebastian0001]

I didn't need to read your situation.

The moment you ask yourself this question is when you should ask yourself this:

Do you lack options right now?

If yes, get options and recalibrate your approach.

The right answer will present itself.

yes, as of now not a lot of options. Just curious but how would you recalibrate the approach if you were in this type of a situation?

 

[CAPSLOCK BANDIT]

Indian men are basically known for throwing themselves at women so that's what they expect of all men in those situations, like they'll approach you but she prob won't initiate sex for a very long time

 

[dude99]

So, I recently met this girl and we went on like 4 dates or so. She is an intellectual type, born in another country, conservative on relationship things like sex and living with a guy, and has a good personality and bubbly and fun. She is a physician and she moved to my city and we began talking. Actually we began talking before she moved here about a few months ago once she found out she was moving here. Things were going well and it felt like we were vibing well. Then once she moved here, we went to dinner and it was good. But, there was no kiss and it felt like she was the type to go slow and I was ok with it. Then we went on mini golf date and then she invited me to her place for drinks and we were alone. But, it was still very hard to make a move as she was not responding to any of the kino and escalation steps. There was not a bad response or a good response but really just no response. Finally, I concluded that because it was the 4th date that if I did not try to kiss her, it would go to friend zone. So, I asked her if I could kiss her goodnight and she, to my surprise, said yes. But, generally, I never ask for a kiss because I think it is against the escalation principles.

Fast forward a week, and now she has pulled back. Basically, I think I really kind of screwed things up. I started liking her more than she might have liked me and I asked her to hang out too frequently - every weekend and maybe once a week during the weekdays. I think she felt pressured and now she suddenly said she enjoys spending time with me but, after more thought, she thinks its more as a friend. I think she was definitely more interested before and it felt like got less interested after she probably concluded I was coming on too strong. She probably felt pressured on the kiss too in which I had asked her for. She said she would love to continue spending time together as a friend and I told her I wasn't interested in that.

So, long story short, do I have no choice but to exit this situation? Or is there any way to correct the wussy behavior and still get things back to dating as it was before? This is not a girl that really puts herself out there a lot so I don't necessarily think she will just jump to dating someone else and she is not super hot (but decently good looking). Really, I just kind of like her personality and quality of character. I know that sounds wussy but its just how I feel. Any advice?

I'm glad you said you weren't interested in friendship. She is new to the area and looking to lock up free attention and orbiters. She blocked you advances and gave zero back, that is a sign of low interest. Culture or not she would have given signs she would want you to continue. Sexh may not happen right away but you would feel her interest.

This how you move forward. You pull back.

She pulled back. You pull back. Withdraw 100 % attention and focus on new women.

If there is.anything she will reach out. If not then you won't waste weeks chasing her in the friendzone.

 

[Bingo-Player]

You are overthinking it too much.....and that is shown by your actions around her and why she has kicked you into the freindzoned

she has had too much time to think because you are overthinking and not leading her to your desires

Novices with women always make the fatal mistake of thinking they need to act a certain way so that she will like you

The truth is you should act however you like the more direct , flirty and outrageous she will be more attracted to it regardless of what she says

Confidence is king with women the can not deny its appeal

 

[Sebastian0001]

OP your too nice.
This crap doesnt exist. She wants your loaded gun. Learn how to escalate to sex or blowout. Its the only way to avoid what got you here.
Then you will know. I cant speak for everyone on this board but its my experience that most women have a latent little slutt in them waiting to come out.

If you knew how bold you could be with these girls you would not believe it. Im not talking misconduct like sexual assault. Im talking verbally.

Dont fall for this new age dont objectify ne crap. She WANTS to be your slutty little object you man handle and stretch all her holes.

Then why are there all these women who refuse sex until after marriage and really do live true to it? They may want it deep down but because of cultural upbringing, they often really do wait to have sex until after getting married.

 

[zinc4]

Then why are there all these women who refuse sex until after marriage and really do live true to it? They may want it deep down but because of cultural upbringing, they often really do wait to have sex until after getting married.

First off. She moved to the US when she was 5.

Wake up man. I doubt she is actually that conservative.

Or if she is even that still means you can probably do everything under the sun besides full vagina penetration.

Most indian women in the US who grew up here tend to be undercover freaks in my experience.

Everyone in this thread has been saying that she just used you for an orbiter or attention but i disagree. That is your status now with her but i think you had a very good chance in the beginning.

I have never had a girl/woman invite me over to her place and not want sex or at least a very strong push for it.

That is a huge green light for me and i assume she wants it. So she can move away or say no as many times as she wants but if she is in my house or if i am in hers i am escalating until she either submits or leaves/kicks me out.

They ALWAYS submit in my experience. Their nos are **** tests. Fact is she invited you to her house and you failed to properly escalate. That is key to this story imo. So now you are friendzoned/orbiter status.

I used to do a lot of cold sales and it was the same principle with that. Once you step foot in their house you arent taking no for an answer. Same exact thing different pretenses. Keep diverting after the no....just go around it/joke/tease her then push again shortly after.

Like say if you try to graze your hand against her lower back as if to guide her from the kitchen to the living room. Then say if you both sit down...make sure she is in close proximity say something goofy like you want to read her hands lines. If a woman is slightly interested she will always let you do this. But you should have done a few very light kino before this like your hand against her lower back very subtly followed by a few more very subtle gestures at first.

From there it is extremely easy to escalate if you get her hand to read her lines or whatever. Start joking about her future and tracing the lines with your index finger very subtly. Graduate that into literally caressing her hand tell her how small she is then move up her arm and shoulder go for the kiss. I promise you if there is any slight attraction towards you on her part she is already getting wet from this.

If she shakes her head and says no or pulls away then dont let it phase you. No big deal. Play it off...bring up something funny then wait a min or two and try again. You are in her house ffs. The worse she can do is kick you out. Force her hand always in these private situations.

 

[Sebastian0001]

First off. She moved to the US when she was 5.

Wake up man. I doubt she is actually that conservative.

Or if she is even that still means you can probably do everything under the sun besides full vagina penetration.

Most indian women in the US who grew up here tend to be undercover freaks in my experience.

Everyone in this thread has been saying that she just used you for an orbiter or attention but i disagree.

I have never had a girl/woman invite me over to her place and not want sex or at least a very strong push for it.

That is a huge green light for me and i assume she wants it. So she can move away or so no as many times as she wants but if she is in my house or if i am.in hers i am escalating until she either submits or leaves/kicks me out. They ALWAYS submit in my experience. Their nos are **** tests. Fact is she invited you to her house and you failed to properly escalate. That is key to this story imo. So now you are friendzoned/orbiter status.

okay so is there anything i can do now or do i just straight up exit? For example, could i just ignore her for a little bit and then ask her to hang out again and then try again to escalate with a better plan and more assertiveness? She said she loves hanging out but wants to do it as a friend but we all know that is just what she says and not necessarily the final word. Can I try for another date with her but this time be more assertive and effective to get her to submit?

 

[zinc4]

okay so is there anything i can do now or do i just straight up exit? For example, could i just ignore her for a little bit and then ask her to hang out again and then try again to escalate with a better plan and more assertiveness? She said she loves hanging out but wants to do it as a friend but we all know that is just what she says and not necessarily the final word. Can I try for another date with her but this time be more assertive and effective to get her to submit?

Honestly, i feel like you had your chance now she has already labelled you in her mind.

It just feels like too much work at this point. I am not saying it is impossible. But why put yourself through that much trouble for a woman saying she only wants you as a friend after 4 dates?

Just move on to the next one and learn from this one.

In the future always assume sex if at your place or hers. You are a red blooded man. All women know what you are really thinking in that situation. Demand it with your actions not words.

But start subtlety and gradually escalate and escalate more. Also....you should be kissing her or going for a kiss by the 2nd date at the absolute latest. I always do first date unless i just know for a fact she is not interested. But sometimes you never actually know until you try.

 

[Modern Man Advice]

So, I recently met this girl and we went on like 4 dates or so. She is an intellectual type, born in another country, conservative on relationship things like sex and living with a guy, and has a good personality and bubbly and fun. She is a physician and she moved to my city and we began talking. Actually we began talking before she moved here about a few months ago once she found out she was moving here. Things were going well and it felt like we were vibing well. Then once she moved here, we went to dinner and it was good. But, there was no kiss and it felt like she was the type to go slow and I was ok with it. Then we went on mini golf date and then she invited me to her place for drinks and we were alone. But, it was still very hard to make a move as she was not responding to any of the kino and escalation steps. There was not a bad response or a good response but really just no response. Finally, I concluded that because it was the 4th date that if I did not try to kiss her, it would go to friend zone. So, I asked her if I could kiss her goodnight and she, to my surprise, said yes. But, generally, I never ask for a kiss because I think it is against the escalation principles.

Fast forward a week, and now she has pulled back. Basically, I think I really kind of screwed things up. I started liking her more than she might have liked me and I asked her to hang out too frequently - every weekend and maybe once a week during the weekdays. I think she felt pressured and now she suddenly said she enjoys spending time with me but, after more thought, she thinks its more as a friend. I think she was definitely more interested before and it felt like got less interested after she probably concluded I was coming on too strong. She probably felt pressured on the kiss too in which I had asked her for. She said she would love to continue spending time together as a friend and I told her I wasn't interested in that.

So, long story short, do I have no choice but to exit this situation? Or is there any way to correct the wussy behavior and still get things back to dating as it was before? This is not a girl that really puts herself out there a lot so I don't necessarily think she will just jump to dating someone else and she is not super hot (but decently good looking). Really, I just kind of like her personality and quality of character. I know that sounds wussy but its just how I feel. Any advice?

This is a simple case of neediness/clinginess. The solution will always be no contact.

Cut contact, live your best life, and stop thinking about her. If its meant to be, she will see the gap you left in her life and she will reach back out. But don't count on that or think about that.

Live and learn.

Modern Man Advice

 

[Sebastian0001]

Honestly, i feel like you had your chance now she has already labelled you in her mind.

It just feels like too much work at this point. I am not saying it is impossible. But why put yourself through that much trouble for a woman saying she only wants you as a friend after 4 dates?

Just move on to the next one and learn from this one.

In the future always assume sex if at your place or hers. You are a red blooded man. All women know what you are really thinking in that situation. Demand it with your actions not words.

But start subtlety and gradually escalate and escalate more. Also....you should be kissing her or going for a kiss by the 2nd date at the absolute latest. I always do first date unless i just know for a fact she is not interested. But sometimes you never actually know until you try.

ok so lets say its the end of the 2nd date, we just had dinner and now its at the end of the date and I am dropping her at her apartment. She doesn't invite me upstairs and there are no clear signals she wants to kiss but also no clear signals she doesn't. How would you proceed in this situation? Maybe walk her to the door of her apartment? and then? I feel like it would be difficult to just lean in and go for it when there are no signals?

 

[Sebastian0001]

I dont buy it. The first rule you shoukd dicipline your mind with. Is
Never believe what a woman says literally. Write it on a postit and stick on your forehead until its buried deep in the chambers of your knowledge vault.
Right time
Right place
Right guy

Ooops it just happened.

Once you tap a virgin her mind starts to wonder. Marriage is no barrier to the SMP.
They want what they want "right now" and that will slways be in flux.

I agree with you but then why do women often friend zone guys who are attractive? I mean, yes they probably screwed up and acted like weak men but still, the woman could still hookup? We as guys would not friend zone a woman who is attractive? Sure maybe we wouldn't want a relationship but we would at least hook up? Yet women have no problem friend zoning and they have no problem making friends with a lot of guys and keeping it platonic. As guys, we don't want platonic female friends, we don't see any value in that. But women do? And i know a lot of stories where my friends were in a long-term relationship with a woman and it was clear they were going towards marriage but the woman said she wants to wait to have sex until after married and the guy was frustrated but had to wait until marriage.