I'm a fvcking child

[Die Hard]

I just always need to have the upper hand over girls and can't get over my foolish pride. For example, a while ago some girl gave me her number and I decided to WhatsApp her a few days later, but she just ignored it. A week later, I texted her again and she ignored it again. Buyer's remorse I guess, or maybe she had a boyfriend, whatever...her reason doesn't matter. But to me, it feels like I'm being direspected hard. I don't care what other people think about this behavior...to me, someone staying silent when I talk to them on WhatsApp, feels the same as sthem staying silent when I talk to them in real life.

Imagine someone stands in front of you, you talk to them and then they just ignore you without saying something back? Major disrespect, right? Well, I feel the same when someone does that on WhatsApp. So I feel the need to do something back lol. What I do, is remove her as a contact in my phone. I have WhatsApp set up to only show my profile pic to my contacts, so when I remove her as a contact she will nog longer see my picture (still able to see when I'm online, still able to send me messages, just not able to see my pic). It's sort of a passive-aggressive act of mine. In a way, very childish but at the same time it does make me feel better. Feels like I stood up for myself or something... Like I didn't allow someone to just treat me like shyt without fighting back. I guess it feels like a little kid who gets bullied at school and decides to fight back, even though he's no match for the bullies anyway and they'll steal all his lunch money ANYWAY haha. But at least he stood up for himself!

Another girl was really into me at a party, did some hot and steamy grinding on the dancefloor, she acted very interesting in conversation and gave me her number before I went home. We started texting and pretty soon she asked me how old I was, turned out she was 13 years younger than me. She became distant after that so I simply asked her if she wanted to stay in touch or not. She responded "that depends on your intentions, coz the age gap between us is beyond what I find acceptable". I tell her: "How many different kinds of intentions can you think of? Let's be clear, I'm not intending to be just friends haha" She responded that she's tired and can't think right now....

Pretty much sounded like she lost interest (saying the age gap is too big) but at the same time it seemed like she hadn't completely made her mind up yet (tired now, can't think. Seemed like she had to thik about it). But whatever, bottom line is: I asked her if she wanted to stay in touch and she didn't give a clear answer. I just can't accept that, I can't handle being in that situation. I mean, she wanted to end the convo and go to sleep without giving a clear answer. So that means I would have to wait and hope that she would contact me in the days coming? Or maybe she would never contact me again and I would keep hope. Like some fvcking dog waiting all day at the front door, hoping his owner will come home and feed him.... I cannot deal with that, I'd rather break off contact myself then, at least that way I have closure knowing that this bytch and me are through. So I told her "Alright, I won't text you anymore from here on then. When you understand that age is just a number and you want to get in touch with me after all, then let me know."

Afterwards, I felt like a loser saying that. As I explained earlier, I hate being the one who has to wait for the other... It's very much possible that she would rethink everything "Hmm, I did have a good time with him and was attracted to him when I didn't know about his age yet. Kinda stupid to write him off just because I now know that he is much older than me, why would it matter? If I find him attractive I find him attractive, right?" Perhaps she would decide to get in touch after all. But man, I just can't accept being in that situation where I have to be waiting and hoping for her to decide that she wants to see me. It feels like I'm going down on my knees and asking a woman to marry me and then just sit there looking up to her hoping she will say "YES". That vulnerable situation, as if your fate rests in her hands, I despise it.

It's fear of rejection, really... I always want to be the one who decides over the fate of others, not the other way around. I want to be in the position where I decide whether to accept or reject her, I can't handle a position where she decides whether to accept or reject me!!

So after that text convo ended, I also felt like removing her from my contact list. Even though there was a chance that she would make up her mind and get back in touch with me, I wanted to show her that I was "gone" by deleting her contact and thus my profile picture not being visible to her anymore. It's this urge inside me, hoping that she will wake up the next morning, open her WhatsApp and see that my picture is gone, I hope it makes her feel like "Damn, he's gone.... Stupid me, I liked him and had a great night with him, he looked attractive, he acted attractive and he made me feel good, but I decided to focus on his age and now he's gone..."

I fvcking know that these are beta thoughts and that it shows a lack of inner game. I even recognize that this is a dynamic that I experienced with my mom when I was a little child, it's a behavioral pattern stemming from childhood which becomes activated in my interactions with women as a grown-up. But even though I know all this, I just can't get rid of it.

I mean, shyt... sometimes I can control myself and not give into such urges but overall it influences my behavior a lot and I feel like I've lost many opportunities with women just because this stuff pops up inside of me. In a way, I'm a BPD myself... They're afraid to get rejected by a guy so they reject that guy before he can do it to them, even though he's not planning to reject her at all! So they ruin their "relationships" out of a fear of getting rejected, they're constantly executing pre-emptive strikes.

Well, I have often times ruined my chances with women out of a fear of getting rejected, even though perhaps the girls weren't planning to reject me at all. I'll never know though, because I decided to eject from the situation before I could even be rejected.
That's what I always do.... I need to know that I have her, that she likes me, that she's into me... I need to be certain of that, I need her to confirm it. If I get a slight notion that the situation is otherwise, I pull up my guard and have my finger ready to press the eject button. I can't handle uncertainty... Does she like me? Will she text me back? Will she accept my offer to hang out together? With all those questions, I am depending on her reaction. And when her reaction takes too long and I have to stay in that uncertainty too long, I'd rather eject from the situation altogether, break contact with her myself. At least I know what I've got then and it was MY decision, I am in control, even though the outcome is that I'm alone lol.

Basically, this means I suck at handling shyt tests then. There are times when I do handle such situations well, but it takes a lot of effort because that urge to eject is so strong. So I can handle them, but it requires a lot of restraint....... When women shyt test me, I tell myself "She is acting disrespectful. Sure, I can choose to pass her shyt test, it will take me some effort but I can do it.... However, why would I allow someone to put me through that? If I decide to pass her shyt test, I'm basically playing along with her game. Fvck off! Who is she to impose her game on me and what a fool am I if I go along with her game?! I won't do it! She can stick her shyt test up her azz!! I'll withdraw myself from her completely now, she has lost me, I won't pursue her at all now, goodbye!" And so I delete her number, write her off and forget about her. I tell myself "See, bytch?! That's what you get for fvcking with me! I liked you and you could've had me, but you drove me away and now you don't have me. It's your own fault, now sit on it!"

I know this is all projection. Why would I get so riled up about a girl I hardly even know? Or even girls who are not that pretty, say HB6.5 or something. Why do they stir up so much unrest inside of me? It's not really because of them..... I'm just projecting a childhood psychological conflict I had with my mom onto these bytches. It's really just the re-experiencing of the continual conflict I went through with my mother as a little kid. I'm reliving that shyt, only now that bytch from the club is substituting for my mom.

I need to grow the fvck up..... Sometimes I cringe from my own behavior and want to kick myself in the nuts... I am disgusted by my own weakness and failure to live up to my own expectations. But I can't get it under control....

 

[The Duke]

I just read your first paragraph and let me tell you this... I get a number at least once a week. Most of the time they don't amount to anything. The ones that give out their number and never reply back after your text/call do so because they don't want to make you feel bad on the spot when you initially ask for it. They choose the path of least resistance. They will give you the number almost every time even when they have no intention of talking to you ever again because it keeps them from feeling hurt when they refuse to do so and the average guy gets angry. Its keeps any awkwardness, angry-ness, altercation, etc from happening. She stays safe that way and you go away happy.............for the moment. Once you are out of her face she doesn't care. She can block you when you blow her up and she doesn't respond.

Accept it for what it is. Don't take it personal. She is not interested.. Women are very covert/inderect communicators. They don't want to hurt your feelers and thats why they do what they do. Men lie about accomplishments...........women lie about their feelings for you.

Get a bunch of them lined up and none of this will matter.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

Lie about your age if all you want to do is fvck. It sounds like she was down till she heard an age. How old do they think you are? Maybe 5 yrs older than them? Lie about it.

 

[Spaz]

It's good that you're able to look within and admit your shortcomings.

Change always starts from there.

Apply new stronger life principles now to bury your past. The past won't go away but it can be overcome with new principles.

Just remember when each time a new principle is broken by your childhood programming, re strengthen it with another new principle atop the last one.

Repeat and cycle the process until your childhood programming is unable to rear it's ugly head - when tested.

It can be done. Just put your mind, body and spirit into it.

 

[jaymbrs]

Lie about your age if all you want to do is fvck. It sounds like she was down till she heard an age. How old do they think you are? Maybe 5 yrs older than them? Lie about it.

It's a no ****ing brainer, IMO.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

It's a no ****ing brainer, IMO.

For sure. Find out how old those hoez naturally think you are and work with that. The first 3-6 months is just banging and hookup anyway.

 

[Die Hard]

Thanks for the responses, guys. Much appreciated!

Just remember when each time a new principle is broken by your childhood programming, re strengthen it with another new principle atop the last one.

Can you be more specific and explain this with an example perhaps?

 

[Die Hard]

Here's an example...

Got a match on Happn. Sent her a funny message and asked a question in it. No response... This was three days ago and I can see that she's been online everyday since then. In other words, she's simply ignoring my message.

Obviously low interest. So I should just leave it as it is.

However, every fibre in my body is telling me to erase and block her profile. Doing that will make no practical difference, it will just prevent her from ever talking to me again. On the other hand, if I keep her in my list, who knows someday she might decide to say something after all. Kind of wishful thinking but what I'm saying is: All things considered, keeping her in my list is potentially better than deleting her. And it basically means I do nothing.... She's there in my list anyway and if I do nothing she will stay there.

Deleting her is doing something, it's a deliberate action. And to what point? Which brings us to my main concern. See, I just want to delete her to somehow do something negative back to her. The fact that she simply ignores me and my message, it feels insulting and disrespectful to me. It's a negative reaction to me and I'm kinda programmed to hit back when hit at.... So I want to delete her, knowing that she will see my profile disappear as a result. It's like I'm signalling to her "You choose to ignore me? Fine, then you lose me completely and don't ever get the chance to talk to me again" and this somehow makes me feel better, it gives me peace of mind. I know it's childish but my feelings don't care about that, haha. The fact of the matter is I feel better after doing it.

But I know that I shouldn't feel this way. I should be like "Oh well, she has no interest. NEXT!"and simply move on to the next fish in the sea. I actually have a date next week with a girl who is showing very high interest, why be bothered by this silly occurence of a girl not responding to my message? But I just can't lol. I just HAVE to delete her profile, it's like a compulsive urge that I can't control. I can't accept anyone treating me negatively and not responding in kind. If I don't do it, I just feel kinda anxious and it keeps bugging me in the back of my mind...

I don't like this about myself. I wish to be stoic and unaffected, the moment you allow yourself to be provoked by someone, you give that person power over you. I want to be able to brush things off, like dust off my shoulder. This girl didn't even try to intentionally provoke me or anything, she simply has no interest, that doesn't mean she's intentionally trying to act negatively to me. So I shouldn't feel affected by her behavior... Which I know with my mind, but my feelings are popping up like an automatic response "You got disrespected, show them you don't take disrespect from anyone!!!!" and I just feel the urge to "hit back".

So I guess I'm gonna fight that urge and NOT delete her haha. Baby steps....

 

[BeExcellent]

Advice from the old lady:

You have a pattern here DieHard. The pattern is you care WAYYY too much what random strangers think. You are seeking external validation from stranger females you don’t know and you are butt hurt when they ignore you.

Why is that?

Solve that riddle and your hamster wheel (that is running frantically and constantly as evidenced by this thread) will come to FULL STOP.

@Howiestern could care less if chicks respond to him. Some will, some won’t, so what? Adopt that attitude and quit investing so much bandwidth into the opinions of strangers. Improve your opinion of yourself and quit worrying about what some random chick does. They don’t know you & they owe you nothing. Nada, zero, zilch.

You are seeking external validation. Stop. Let it go. Who cares? Move on. You’ll be happier, more attractive & less obsessive if you just cut it out & move on to the next opportunity no harm, no foul.

Cheers

 

[Die Hard]

Were you always like this? Or just after being in the Game many years?

There was a time when I was the opposite, nothing could phaze me. But at some point I decided that that was cowardly... It's like when someone tries to make fun of you, you can respond by controlling yourself and not being affected by it. Or.... you can smash his fvcking face in. Both methods may work but the latter feels more empowering and more pro-active. So a long time ago I decided to never go for that first response again, it felt weak and I wanted to be STRONG. I said to myself: "If someone pushes me, I will push back 10x harder and totally crush them!!"

This has become an automated response and I guess I've gone way too far in that direction. Look, I lived under constant emotional/psychological attacks from my mother as a child. There's not much you can do as a helpless child against an adult, I couldn't control her actions. So I learned to control my response to her actions, that's all I could do. Stay calm and in control of your emotions, don't let it affect you. Doing this for years, it became ingrained in my personality and habits.

But basically, I was supressing an urge to hit back all those years. It's like when someone is loudly shouting insults in your ear while standing an inch from your face... You can force yourself to stay unaffected but deep inside you just want to grab his head and smash it into the ground. So imagine having to supress that urge for years. What I'm saying is, I supressed my urge to fight back for a loooong time. When I got older I left my parents' house and went living on my own. Now I could reprogram myself from that habit that was ingrained in my personality. So I went far in the other direction, decided I would NEVER control my reaction to someone's negative behavior again, but would crush their behavior instead. No more Mr. nice guy, from now on no one would fvck with me again. That's all I focused on and now that became ingrained in my personality, the exact opposite of controlling my own response. In doing so, I kind of lost the ability to control my own response.

So basically I unlearned the habit of controlling my own response and focused on controlling other people's actions. But now I have to unlearn some of that latter habit and end up in the middle between the two. Some situations require you to restrain yourself and control your response to other people's actions, other situations require you to control other people's actions. One should be able to assess which approach is appropriate and then be able to execute that.



More observations:
Funny thing is, dealing with negative behavior from women is less of a problem in real life for me. I always display higher value through body language etc. And when a girl disrespects me, it doesn't phaze me that much in real life. I guess that's because I can show to them and others surrounding me that I am above it. Somehow that matters to me... I don't just want to be above it, I want the girl and other people to know that I'm above it too!

Through texting etc. you can't show that. Maybe that's why I am affected by it more in that case.... See, if a woman ignores me or rejects me in real life, I just carry on and have fun with whatever I'm doing, I don't care about her and am able to let it go. I SHOW this and therefor peolple KNOW that it doesn't affect me. Now compare that with social media etc. Suppose you ask a question through text and the bytch doesn't respond, she just remains silent and basically leaves you hanging. If you double text, she knows you're a loser and if you stay silent she may think of you as a loser too. Coz she cannot see how you handle the fact that she just ignored you and left you hanging. Somehow I care about that, about how she perceives me and whether she thinks she has assumed a dominant position over me. The bytch may think she is dominant over me by ignoring me and that thought will stay in her mind, coz she won't see how I handle it. Somehow this really bothers me and I want her to know that she DID NOT assume a dominant position over me. I will carry on just fine without her, there are more bytches in line haha. But she doesn't know that! I want her to know that!

But it's silly and makes no sense. Just like BeExcellent says, who cares about what some girl thinks of me? It's like I'm insecure and need external validation. Again, I obviously know all this through my rational mind, it's just an emotional/instinctual response. Just like you know you shouldn't eat a whole box of chocolates if you're trying to lose weight, but when that box is opened and stands in front of you, you don't listen to your rational mind and just follow your urge haha.

So you have to train yourself in showing restraint. Don't do it, even though there's a strong urge. If I don't give into it, it eventually fades away. So that's what I'm training myself to do. But I needed to throw it all out first and express my frustration over my own behavior, hence this thread. I'm fed up with my own behavior and want to improve my responses to situations, so I needed to articulate that and address it by writing out my thoughts here. Basically I'm just having a dialogue with myself in this thread, lol.

But your responses do help me in the process! So thanks for your posts, markfromeurope and BeExcellent!

P.S. I got a PM of someone misinterpreting this thread..... Look, I'm deliberately writing down momentary outburts of deep thoughts and emotions here, moments where I'm "letting it all out". Don't be foolish in thinking that these posts are an example of who I am during the other 99% of time that I'm alive and not forcing myself to "let it all out". For example, I also force myself to cry a few times a year, as it has a positive effect, helps to process some things. If you only saw me at those specific few moments of the year, you'd obviously think I was an emotionally unhinged crybaby hahaha. Same thing here, you're witnessing self-induced therapeutic moments in these posts, just keep that in mind I'm not really writing to seek advice, I'm writing as a way to get things out of my system, express my inner thoughts and read them back to stimulate my own thought process, having a dialogue with myself.

 

[Atom Smasher]

I think a lot of that stems from the mistaken idea that we men can and should be universally attractive to women, just as women can be universally attractive to men. The fact it that every single one of us will only appeal to a subset of women.

Therefore, it is absolutely inevitable that most women will not be attracted to us. Therefore, those felt “rejections” should be statistically insignificant to us.

One of the biggest sources of pain for men is the illusion that we can be universally attractive. This is utterly impossible. The opposite is not true for women. They can in fact be universally attractive.

We must understand the numbers (which are inevitable) and work them to our advantage. It’s a lot like sales being a numbers game... I need to talk to X amount of prospects to make one sale...

However, a man can approach perhaps a 50% attractiveness rate if he really gets his act together. That’s because before he has it together, he is invisible to upper echelon women. Once he becomes visible he realizes that 50% is total abundance.

 

[Alvafe]

I have some news for you guys, everyone is a child, most just play mature, and even more fail to even play that, just a small number of people don't care, guess the one who is better in life is?

you being ignored is not the end of the world, that tell more about how educated a person is, if she gave her number just to make you go away, don't matter, she should not even be on your care

btw totally unrelated, so you can block someone on whats app and you don't see they pics, but everything else is ok? that explain some things here lol

 

[Mazer]

Here's an example...

Got a match on Happn. Sent her a funny message and asked a question in it. No response... This was three days ago and I can see that she's been online everyday since then. In other words, she's simply ignoring my message.

Obviously low interest. So I should just leave it as it is.

However, every fibre in my body is telling me to erase and block her profile. Doing that will make no practical difference, it will just prevent her from ever talking to me again. On the other hand, if I keep her in my list, who knows someday she might decide to say something after all. Kind of wishful thinking but what I'm saying is: All things considered, keeping her in my list is potentially better than deleting her. And it basically means I do nothing.... She's there in my list anyway and if I do nothing she will stay there.

Deleting her is doing something, it's a deliberate action. And to what point? Which brings us to my main concern. See, I just want to delete her to somehow do something negative back to her. The fact that she simply ignores me and my message, it feels insulting and disrespectful to me. It's a negative reaction to me and I'm kinda programmed to hit back when hit at.... So I want to delete her, knowing that she will see my profile disappear as a result. It's like I'm signalling to her "You choose to ignore me? Fine, then you lose me completely and don't ever get the chance to talk to me again" and this somehow makes me feel better, it gives me peace of mind. I know it's childish but my feelings don't care about that, haha. The fact of the matter is I feel better after doing it.

But I know that I shouldn't feel this way. I should be like "Oh well, she has no interest. NEXT!"and simply move on to the next fish in the sea. I actually have a date next week with a girl who is showing very high interest, why be bothered by this silly occurence of a girl not responding to my message? But I just can't lol. I just HAVE to delete her profile, it's like a compulsive urge that I can't control. I can't accept anyone treating me negatively and not responding in kind. If I don't do it, I just feel kinda anxious and it keeps bugging me in the back of my mind...

I don't like this about myself. I wish to be stoic and unaffected, the moment you allow yourself to be provoked by someone, you give that person power over you. I want to be able to brush things off, like dust off my shoulder. This girl didn't even try to intentionally provoke me or anything, she simply has no interest, that doesn't mean she's intentionally trying to act negatively to me. So I shouldn't feel affected by her behavior... Which I know with my mind, but my feelings are popping up like an automatic response "You got disrespected, show them you don't take disrespect from anyone!!!!" and I just feel the urge to "hit back".

So I guess I'm gonna fight that urge and NOT delete her haha. Baby steps....

I would delete. Bishes love to show their gfs all these orbiters she has in her contact list and you are on it. Be honest with yourself, you are hoping by staying on her list, there might be a chance she contacts you and instead of going out finding new girls. Delete and go find new women.

 

[Die Hard]

So here's another situation that pops up now and then... I already know guru1000 is gonna scold me for bringing it up haha, telling me I'm still asking n00b questions and not acting from an abundance mentality etc. I've already adressed the issue before but can't find the thread so here we go again... I guess I need the answer ingrained into me by repetition...

So you meet a girl, she shows VERY HIGH INTEREST, you exchange numbers, you send her a text and..........she stays silent for days. This is an issue in itself, coz you can either call her out on it or stand your ground and stay silent until she responds, even if it takes months lol.

Calling her out, means double texting, which is not advicable as a ground rule. But every rule has its exception, if you ask me. For example, some girls are very insecure and they just want to see some confirmation that you really like them. So in this case, when she stays silent and you stay silent too, she might interpret it as: "He only texted me once and when I didn't respond, he just moved on. I guess he wasn't that interested in me, then..." Stupid logic, but some girls do think this way. I've experienced this many times, some girls just need the confirmation that you really like them and they want to see you make an effort to win her over.

Sure, as a general rule it's not advicable to supplicate to women and chase them as if they're the prize. YOU are the prize and they need to win you over etc. But like I said, sometimes women want you to expose yourself a little. I guess this especially goes for women who perceive your Sexual Market Value as higher than theirs. They can get insecure if you act too aloof, thinking: "This guy can get plenty of girls, why would he want to be with me? He doesn't even care when I withdraw my affection or attention from him. He probably perceives me as just a toy to pass his time with and will drop me as soon as he finds a prettier girl"

Therefor, they will try to make a dent in your armor, so to speak. And when they succeed at that, it's a sign to them that you like them. Then they'll feel happy instead of insecure and this allows them to open up to you and let down the wall around their feelings, so they'll actually get closer to you. I guess this is what guru1000 calls beta-game, correct?

But balance is key. Don't be too aloof, but don't show too much vulnerability either. And the right balance is different with every girl you interact with. So how do you find it? I must admit that I suck at finding it.

Anyway, I have this situation with one girl right now. We met at a party, she showed very high interest and I acted aloof, made her chase me. For example, we live quite far apart so I told her I was hesitant to ask her number because of it. This made her the one to chase me, lol. She responded "No, you should DEFINITELY ask my number!" So I granted her wish and asked it

She was there with her girl friend and at one point she announced that they would leave in a few minutes. So I told her I was gonna stay and that we would stay in touch through text. Again I didn't chase her, while I had the urge to accompany her outside and end the night with a short make-out session in front of the club. But fvck that, I don't want to come across as being too eager to "score", so I do the opposite and act like I am in no hurry. I keep partying and tell her we'll stay in touch through texting.

I don't know if this is the right thing to do, maybe I'm overdoing it and coming across as if she means nothing to me. Actually, she was very hot haha, but I act towards her like she's just an HB6 who barely interests me lol. We did do some close dancing and grinding, however, and my dyck got really hard, pressing against her. So that should tell her enough about my interest level haha.

Anyway, waited a few days and sent her a superficial text, basically just saying hi and asking how she was doing. Blue ticks in WhatsApp an hour later, but no response... Waited another day, still no response. So this is where I get a bit confused and don't know what to make of it:

A. She wasn't that interested. Maybe she was just in the mood to flirt and in need of some male attention that night. I fit the job, we danced and she made me get a hard on, which validates her ego. But in fact, she was just in party mode that night and was attention wh0ring. Now that life is back to normal and she's sitting at work looking at my text, she thinks "Nah, I had some fun that night but let's keep it at that, I'm not gonna respond to his text"
B. She has a boyfriend. She had some fun on her girl's night out, but she doesn't want to go beyond that and meet up with me, so she decides to ignore my text.
C. It's a case of what I explained earlier in this post. She noticed that I was quite aloof and not eager to chase after her that night. It makes her feel insecure and feel like I'm not that interested in her. So now she puts me to the test and wants to see how much I like her. So she ignores my text and wants to see if that makes me chase her further, which would prove in her mind that my interest level is high enough after all.
D. She's shyt testing me and wants to know if I get insecure when she doesn't respond. If I show her that her silence is affecting me, if I show her that I am afraid of losing her, if I show her that I'm disappointed that she doesn't respond, I fail the test and come across as a beta loser. So she'll now that I'm not a great catch and she'll move on to the next guy in line....

I really suck at determining which of the above applies and what would be the best response. I've been in this situation many times before. At one point I made it a hard principle to never double text in these situations. But you know, many times when I stayed silent, the girl would remain silent as well, weeks months, years lol. Other times, I asked the girl what was the matter and she gave a bullshyt excuse but at least we were communicating again and eventually the continuation of the conversation led to meeting up after all. So in those cases, it did kinda pay off to double text, you see? And other times when I stayed silent, the girl would respond after a week and the conversation would lead to meeting up.

So sometimes staying silent brings you nothing, sometimes double texting leads to a meetup and sometimes staying silent leads to a meetup. So how do you know what is the right response?

Eventually, I decided that if it was case A or B, then it wouldn't matter whether I sent her another text. If it was case C, it would be best to chase some more and thus sent another text. If it was case D, I should stay silent.

So I went with a mixture between C and D. I called her out on her silence, which would be good if case C was applicable. But I did it in a way that didn't come across as very needy or insecure, so I wouldn't really fail the shyt test if case D was applicable.

I told her something to this extent "Uh oh... Usually when a woman stays silent to a guy, it means she's pissed off at him haha. Did I say/do something that night, which pissed you off?"

Added some emoticons, made it sound playful and carefree, not too serious. The idea behind this text was framing the situation like she was the one who was angry/disappointed in me, as if I had hurt her feelings and me basically asking her if that was the case. So I'm positioning myself as the jerk who probably hurt her feelings, instead of me being the beta loser who is sad and disappointed about the fact that she didn't respond to me. With other wording it could come across very weak as if saying "Baby, please tell me what I did wrong? Why won't you talk to me?" But it wasn't like that because of the carefree way I worded it, adding the emoticons and half making it sound like a joke.

Sometimes I ask myself what the fvck I'm doing, playing such games. I mean, really? Do we have to come up with these kind of witty psychological tricks to get girls? Calculating intricate schemes to pass her shyt test and win this game? Fvck, can't we just say "I like you", "I like you too", "Okay, let's meet then", "Sure, see you there and there". THE END. Why do things have to be complicated? Then again, it's often said that if things are too complicated, there is low interest level and that you should only go for girls with high interest level who make it easy for you to get them. But that's bullshyt too... I've been through some veeeeeeeery complicated shyt with certain girls before they finally decided to meet up with me haha. But from there on they showed very high interest and I eventually banged their brains out and they got infatuated with me!!!

Anyway, I got a response WITHIN TWO MINUTES, lol. Whereas she didn't respond for more than a day when I first texted her, and maybe never would have responded at all..... She said "Haha no you didn't, I'm just very busy. How are you?"

 

[Die Hard]

I still don't know what to make of it. She responded very fast and asked me a question (which invites for further conversation), so it's kinda positive. But still, this doesn't clearly tell me if it's case A, B, C or D. Is she just responding coz she likes the attention (and I showed that I am willing to give her that attention by double texting, so now she expects that I will be a steady supply of attention, while she fvcks other guys who she does perceive as real alphas as opposed to me?)

Furthermore, I just get pissed off at this bullshyt excuse of being busy. No one is too busy to answer a simple "How are you" text within more than a day. I've seen her stinkin azz been online for long periods of time after I texted her, surely she could've typed "I'm fine, how r u?" in 2 seconds. Have you ever seen how fast chicks can type on their phones, by the way? They got mad skillz, yo!!

Now this is actually why I started this fvcking post haha!! I wasn't even planning to talk about all the above stuff. I was aiming to ask you guys how to deal with this type of lies... I mean, she obviously LIED when she said she didn't reply coz she was busy. They all do it, you have to ignore it if you want to get her, I guess. Coz when you call them out on their lies, they usually get pissed off and won't admit it anyway, tell you you are falsely accusing them and make you out to be the bad guy, they start disliking you for it and it basically creates a giant defence wall around their pvssy, lol.

So yeah, playing along and acting like you believe them (even though you know she's lying through her teeth!) is the way to go, I guess. But still man, I find this so goddamn difficult!! I mean, how do you usually respond when someone lies to you??? You call them out on it, right? Why would you play along and act like you believe them, while actually you don't believe them coz you goddamn KNOW that they're lying?

It's like, oh you're dealing with a woman now, so you have to throw out all the normal rules and behaviors that you apply to all other people and social situations. Basically, when you're dealing with women, you have to make an exception..... This goes so much against my nature, I hardly can bring myself to it. Why the fvck do I have to play along with their game and play by their rules? They should play by my rules, goddamnit. Act normal, stupid bytch, don't lie to me and if you do I will call you out on it.

Sigh, I'm just venting. I'll play along with it, lol. Just shake it off... I often get my "revenge" when I'm fvcking them. Choke her, slap her azz and pound her senseless, feels like I'm punishing her for being a stupid lying bytch before...

Anywayzzzz, I don't know how to play this game for shyt.... I read her stupid azz text, so she can see the blue ticks haha. Now what? I'm gonna wait a while before I respond anyway. I gues this is where the Fvcking child inside of me comes in again (what this thread is about). See, I feel like she didn't respond for over a day before... So now that she has responded, I feel like paying her back. Here, I'm gonna read your text, you're gonna see the blue ticks and know that I've read it, and then I'm gonna wait a long time with responding, just to let you know that two can play that game and I always respond in kind when people fvck with me.

See? There is that urge again, the one I started this thread about... I need to keep that under control and not let her draw me into that game, right? Coz it will start a cycle of her ignoring me and me ignoring her, almost like a competition of seeing who can get under whose skin and who of us is best at igoring the other person's attempts to get under his/her skin. While the aim should be to have fun together haha.

I'm not myself lately, lots of introspection, stirring up negative memories from my childhood etc. Which is necessary to process negative childhood experiences, move on from them and grow as a person. But it creates chaos and it reflects on my dealings with women as well. Like this stuff I just mentioned, where you almost get into a competition with a girl to get under each other's skin. I mean, this was the game I played with my BPD mom throughout my childhood and which I played with all the countless BPD women I dated in my life. So am I projecting that dynamic onto every new girl I meet, coz that's just what I'm used to and bascially all I know?

I mean, here I go... I'm already half into playing that game with this current girl through texting. Waiting with my response to pay her back for the fact that she waited with hers. Will that signal to her that I won't just accept her behavior without fighting back? Like, you wanna mess with me, I'll repay you in kind... As if to show her that I am not weak and won't let people walk over me. With the underlying assumption that this shows that I'm "strong" and "not beta", so it will prevent her interest level from dropping. I think that's kind of a subconscious assumption within me, that I need to do this in order to not come across as weak to her....

But maybe that actually shows that I AM weak! Coz if I were alpha, I wouldn't be affected by some childish passive-aggressive behavior from some girl (meaning her not responding for over a day). Right?

Is it this or is it that? Should I respond like this or should I respond like that? Am I doing this because it's the right thing to do, or am I doing it because I'm just repeating negative patterns of interaction ingrained into my system throughout years of living under a BPD mother? I get fvcking sick of trying to figure it out. Sometimes I feel like getting women is a science more difficult than quantum physics.... Jesus!

I don't even care about this chick anymore. Probably a BPD too, like all the girls I attract. And even if she's not, then I probably messed up by double texting anyway, or if that's not the case, then I mess up now by waiting a while with my response and piss her off with that, or if it's not that, perhaps I screw things up by responding to her question "how are you" by saying "yeah, I've been doing this and that, life is good, blahblah" and not asking a question back. Which is my inclination, to be honest. I mean, she didn't even respond to my first text where I asked how she was doing. I almost feel like it's stupid to answer that same question from her, then..... So if I do answer it, I feel like I'm already doing more than she did, pffffff. So I'm not gonna ask something back on top of that. Fvck you, let's see if you show enough interest in me by asking a follow up question to keep the conversation going, even though I didn't ask you a question! Let's see if you make an effort to deserve me!

I don't want to act like that, but I almost feel like I have to in order to win her respect, or in order to show her that I'm of high value, or in order to 'grab the frame'. Always hidden motives, hidden games, power struggles, trying to be the one who cares the least, therefor controlling the frame, per Rollo's advice... I feel like a fvcking chess computer trying to calculate all the right moves to win the game. Cavemen had it better, just knock her out, drag her to your cave and rape her. Eventually she'd develop Stockholm syndrome and start loving you

Or yeah, maybe it's all my own fault for being too aloof the night we met. Maybe I overdid it and made her feel like I was not very interested, and this current texting dynamic was set in motion by that. Maybe if I just went outside with her and made out with her, she'd now be blowing up my phone with texts asking me when she is gonna see me again.

I don't even know what I'm doing anymore... I'm definitely not having fun interacting with women if it's like this, I can tell you that. Take a break then? Yeah, done that many times. It'll be a bit better when you get back in the game after a break, but eventually things become complicated once again...

I don't know man. Maybe you guys can talk some sense into me. Shyt just ain't right... I'm pretty good at attracting girls, but after the initial attraction I often lose my direction. I try to apply everything I've learned at this place, everything I've learned from my own experience etc. But the outcomes are not consistent enough. Sometimes when I get the girl, I think I would've gotten her no matter what I did, coz her interest level was simply very high. So it wasn't because I had good game, maybe my game even sucked, I was just lucky that her interest level was very high...

Other times I definitely feel like I do have good game. I'll be in the zone, where I just vibe and almost instinctively know the right thing to say or do. But like I said, I'm not consistent...coz other times I'm acting like a moron and messing things up haha.

Perhaps the answer is indeed that it all stands or falls by the degree to which you're outcome-dependent. If you don't give a shyt whether you get the girl, you just say and do the right things. But if you're afraid of messing up your chances with the girl, it makes you over-analyze things, you start hesitating about what is the right thing to say or do and it all becomes a mess.

Is that the answer to this whole wall of text I just wrote, plain and simple?

TALK SOME FVCKING SENSE INTO ME, SOMEONE!!!

 

[Bullbearpig]

I think a lot of that stems from the mistaken idea that we men can and should be universally attractive to women, just as women can be universally attractive to men. The fact it that every single one of us will only appeal to a subset of women.

Therefore, it is absolutely inevitable that most women will not be attracted to us. Therefore, those felt “rejections” should be statistically insignificant to us.

One of the biggest sources of pain for men is the illusion that we can be universally attractive. This is utterly impossible. The opposite is not true for women. They can in fact be universally attractive.

We must understand the numbers (which are inevitable) and work them to our advantage. It’s a lot like sales being a numbers game... I need to talk to X amount of prospects to make one sale...

However, a man can approach perhaps a 50% attractiveness rate if he really gets his act together. That’s because before he has it together, he is invisible to upper echelon women. Once he becomes visible he realizes that 50% is total abundance.

I find this to be totally off base. There was a time in my life when I was young and had what is known as the irrational self confidence. EVERY chick I came across was attracted, and even if they tried to hide it, they couldn't for Long. Those days are long gone, but still there isnt a girl out there that doesnt find me handsome. I just dont have the confidence i once had to effortlessly get any girl I want like back then.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

I find this to be totally off base. There was a time in my life when I was young and had what is known as the irrational self confidence. EVERY chick I came across was attracted, and even if they tried to hide it, they couldn't for Long. Those days are long gone, but still there isnt a girl out there that doesnt find me handsome. I just dont have the confidence i once had to effortlessly get any girl I want like back then.

Do you think ots depressed because your waiting on them to validate you?

 

[Bullbearpig]

Do you think ots depressed because your waiting on them to validate you?

Yes I think that has something to do with it.
Back in those days I was in the Marines and I spent ALL my free time drinking with and socializing with all kinds of college women. I truly had an IDGAF attitude. I always spoke my mind and women's beauty never affected my frame. I had a lot of game that I didn't even realize was "game" until I read MM years later. The thought that I wasn't the coolest, funniest, smartest guy in the room just didn't compute with me. Hot ass women would throw themselves at me and I just didn't care. I was very young in those days and life hadnt sufficiently beaten me down yet.

 

[ubercat]

Mate I struggled with your wall of text. But I suspect these two points are relevant.

1. Like howie said getting numbers is pure sales funnel. Why would you be upset about unqualified Prospect?

2. Move the focus from the girl to the process. Men are good at planning and tactics. Go after different niches of girl and try different approaches. Have fun with it and remember it is a game it's all there for your self amusement.

That will give you the proper zero fux attitude with no mental gymnastics

And re the net chicks. They are swamped with messages. she's not ignoring your message she's responding to all the chads. I used to do really well online but I'm pretty sure it's turned to sh1t. If I put up a profile I would go passive. tweak the photos once in a while and make new accounts all the time. Once or twice a week bulk message the chicks who message you first. I don't think it's worth more than a couple of hours of your week these days. Any of the guys who slay it online and aren't good looking feel free to correct me.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

Yes I think that has something to do with it.
Back in those days I was in the Marines and I spent ALL my free time drinking with and socializing with all kinds of college women. I truly had an IDGAF attitude. I always spoke my mind and women's beauty never affected my frame. I had a lot of game that I didn't even realize was "game" until I read MM years later. The thought that I wasn't the coolest, funniest, smartest guy in the room just didn't compute with me. Hot ass women would throw themselves at me and I just didn't care. I was very young in those days and life hadnt sufficiently beaten me down yet.

You probably had bros you hung with too. So you didn't need the females attention. You did it for fun.