Major Learning Last Night

[flowtheory]

Because I live so far from my family, my actual Christmas isn’t until the 28th. So last night I decided to spend the night with a woman whom I have interest in.

We were lying in her bed. Post heavy makeout. Hadn’t yet had sex yet, but it was on its way.
My jeans were beside the bed; phone in a pocket. My tinder goes off. Two new messages, and a new match. This sound instantly sparks her *competition anxiety* and before I know it, she’s sitting upright, asking me how many woman I’m seeing and if I’ve had sex. I don’t want to lie so I tell her the truth.
She starts getting a little huffy and now we’re in a ‘heated discussion’ which eventually takes us away from the bedroom. The whole time I’m asking her and trying to understand to make sense why she’s mad, because we never talked about exclusivity and it’s only been 5 dates!
She calls me duplicitous and that I should have came out and told her I was having sex on the second date with other women on my own volition. (Like wtf! Haha get a grip. That’s like asking me to blow off my own leg) Says she can’t trust me.

Now I’m getting annoyed, because this is really ridiculous and I’m not going to be berated like this for literally doing nothing wrong and actually telling her the truth when she asked, out of respect. I told her she shouldn’t ask questions she may not want answers to.
I get up and say “I’ll make this easy for you”. I grab my jeans and shirt then start putting them on, go straight to my duffle and pick it up. Immediately she’s up on her feet and clearly in panic. She says “you’re leaving!?” And then essentiay tell her how how I’m not gonna do this and it isn’t what I want to be accusesed of things I’m not, And then tell her how it’s gonna be and show her I’m willing to walk away.

The point of this story:
- Competition anxiety is legit a thing, for anyone who second guesses it. You don’t need to soften some blows and instantly validate her when she has a little panic because of it (most guys fail here, reassuring too quickly)
- Show her you’re willing to walk away!

After I was willing to walk, the whole dynamic changed. She instantly became more feminine, softer, pitch in her voice was higher and lighter, more “cuddly”. I literally couldn’t believe it. She was also trying to anchor me down a bit (not full exclusivity but essentially “don’t see anyone else! Because I’m not”)

We then went back to her bed and had sex.

For newbies or lurkers.. there’s a lot of good information in here. It’s one thing to understand it, but another to employ it and actually see... women are ALWAYS testing your value and seeing how far they can push. So if you do not know your value, learn it.

Alpha Male Strategies also has really good information. That guy knows what he’s talking about (can be a little intense for me at times but his points are valid)

 

[lamath]

Good info, you handle it the right way.
You will prob get better sex too

 

[flowtheory]

It was also the most peculiar thing - maybe you guys have seen it as well. Or maybe I was just tired as fvck.. but.. after I had laid down my law.. her whole face changed and did for the rest of the night until I walked out that door.
She turned in to a little girl. Her body language. Her face. It’s like I could see she was just a scared little girl inside this woman’s body and was looking to be led. Her face was so soft, she was so sweet, she was so... malleable and feminine. It’s weird thinking about it, but I understand it.

Anyone else experience this?

 

[AlphaSoldier]

Put the fvcking phone in airport mode, for God's sake

 

[marmel75]

Had something similar happen. We were in this chicks bed and she kept denying me going any further so I heard a message on my phone, got up and checked it...it was another girl who i had been banging asking if I wanted to stop by.

Didn't say a word, started getting dressed, and she asked where I was going. Told her obviously nothing is happening here and I had someone else who was interested in something more so I was heading over there. Had put my phone on her dresser so I went over to grab it on the way out and when I turned around she was standing in front of her bedroom door with this look of absolute lust in her eyes like she wanted to swallow my c0ck whole. I get up to her and she says "You're not going anywhere", shoves me down on the bed and proceeds to fvck the living hell out of me for a few hours...

Amazing what being willing to walk away does for you sometimes.

 

[flowtheory]

Put the fvcking phone in airport mode, for God's sake

Actually don’t agree with this. Because had my phone not went off, she wouldn’t have revealed ALL of her cards last night.
In her eyes my value went up a solid 1 point because; 1. Other women are gunning for “what’s hers” (her words); and 2. I asserted that I was willing to walk away which put her in a submissive position.
Had my phone not went off, yes there would have been less melodrama on her part, and we probably still would have had sex, however i wouldn’t be as valuable as I am right now to her. There would be about 10% less intensity.
Now she’s FULLY aware there are other women in my picture, and she’s not just imagining it like she was before. So her behaviour will change.

When phones go off when you’re with someone who you’re hoping to be intimate with, we can’t help but get a little anxious if we like that person. Because we generally assume it’s another person. This goes for men and women. So it actually plays to your advantage assuming you’re with someone who has high interest

 

[Glassguy]

And it all started by having a strong frame and being honest with her regarding your intentions and actions.

Amazing how that ALWAYS works for me too......

 

[R.U.G.]

Goes to the old saying, the one who cares the less has the power in the relationship. However, flowcontrol, next time, just put the phone on silent. Another woman, such as a latina, could had cut your d!ick off. lol

 

[R.U.G.]

Had something similar happen. We were in this chicks bed and she kept denying me going any further so I heard a message on my phone, got up and checked it...it was another girl who i had been banging asking if I wanted to stop by.

Didn't say a word, started getting dressed, and she asked where I was going. Told her obviously nothing is happening here and I had someone else who was interested in something more so I was heading over there. Had put my phone on her dresser so I went over to grab it on the way out and when I turned around she was standing in front of her bedroom door with this look of absolute lust in her eyes like she wanted to swallow my c0ck whole. I get up to her and she says "You're not going anywhere", shoves me down on the bed and proceeds to fvck the living hell out of me for a few hours...

Amazing what being willing to walk away does for you sometimes.

Why did you get married then? Seems you're missing out on the free pvssy you're leaving on the bed.

 

[sazc]

Male sh1t test, lol

Oh...wait...I mean 'great frame' there

Lol regardless, good job for standing the ground you believe in. It did pay off, last night.

Sometimes they will let you walk. Be sure of the frame your want to assert. Be confident in your standards.

 

[marmel75]

Why did you get married then? Seems you're missing out on the free pvssy you're leaving on the bed.

This was while I was married...wife was actually out of town for the weekend

 

[Roober]

Well done. I think you handled things well with the exception of letting her know about the other women. What I have found, especially with less experienced women, they dont like the idea too much that you were poking around with other women before and after you hook up with them. If they are only looking for casual encounters, then they likely dont care. However, if they are not part of the hookup culture, this could be a quick reason to flip the script and head the other direction.

It's best if you dont bring it up, or even mention the other women. Let the competition anxiety evolve form your interactions with other women when you are around. Trust me, they are always watching other women. When she randomly gives you some public display of affection, theres a good chance she saw another woman checking you out or flirting with you.

 

[Mazer]

Nice frame

 

[HughJasolphd]

It was also the most peculiar thing - maybe you guys have seen it as well. Or maybe I was just tired as fvck.. but.. after I had laid down my law.. her whole face changed and did for the rest of the night until I walked out that door.
She turned in to a little girl. Her body language. Her face. It’s like I could see she was just a scared little girl inside this woman’s body and was looking to be led. Her face was so soft, she was so sweet, she was so... malleable and feminine. It’s weird thinking about it, but I understand it.

Anyone else experience this?

You were the man; you took charge, took the lead, & made it clear that if she didn't take her role as the woman that she would be left behind. These days guys are afraid to ruffle a few feathers & possibly get rejected after getting their foot in the door. If you frame it as what you're willing to tolerate from a woman as a man instead of "oh I hope this doesn't screw things up with her" it instantly puts you in a different league than majority of men out there. She knew if you walked that she'd get someone willing to kiss the floor after every step she took & would be upset about it.
I think you put yourself in a good position going forward, man.

 

[flowtheory]

Well done. I think you handled things well with the exception of letting her know about the other women. What I have found, especially with less experienced women, they dont like the idea too much that you were poking around with other women before and after you hook up with them. If they are only looking for casual encounters, then they likely dont care. However, if they are not part of the hookup culture, this could be a quick reason to flip the script and head the other direction.

It's best if you dont bring it up, or even mention the other women. Let the competition anxiety evolve form your interactions with other women when you are around. Trust me, they are always watching other women. When she randomly gives you some public display of affection, theres a good chance she saw another woman checking you out or flirting with you.

Yea I literally had no choice there. I didn’t want to tell her about the other women. But she sat up as we’re laying in her bed half naked and point blank asked me what was going on and if I had been on dates or sleeping with others. I’m not going to lie to her and in turn myself; not what I want.
I learned she hasn’t seen anyone since me or has no desire to. But she mentions that she has options if she wants (which is a tactic to show me her SMV I know, but I could care less)

 

[fastlife]

Good stuff. Make sure to take a moment to internalize this knowledge: The more comfortable you can get covertly (and sometimes overtly) communicating to girls that you are seeing other girls, and subsequently holding frame, the more freedom you have to exercise your intent & the less pain you will cause. It's scary at first, since it goes so far against what you've been socially conditioned to believe. In the future, you'll be able to have this kind of exchange with less drama. I just leave an opened box of condoms next to my bed: it makes things very clear.

Also, re: your other thread: You made the right call calling her today. Fvck all that, If she likes you she'll call you stuff: When a girl submits to your frame in a profound way and you've established significantly higher value, unless it's just a one night stand, you reward her with comfort. This is how you stop buyer's remorse from happening, plus you want (hopefully) her to enjoy this type of experience. And even if it's just a one night stand, you want to leave her feeling good about things, even if it's just something like: 'You're awesome. Gonna sleep good tonight.'

 

[flowtheory]

Good stuff. Make sure to take a moment to internalize this knowledge: The more comfortable you can get covertly (and sometimes overtly) communicating to girls that you are seeing other girls, and subsequently holding frame, the more freedom you have to exercise your intent & the less pain you will cause. It's scary at first, since it goes so far against what you've been socially conditioned to believe. In the future, you'll be able to have this kind of exchange with less drama. I just leave an opened box of condoms next to my bed: it makes things very clear.

Also, re: your other thread: You made the right call calling her today. Fvck all that, If she likes you she'll call you stuff: When a girl submits to your frame in a profound way and you've established significantly higher value, unless it's just a one night stand, you reward her with comfort. This is how you stop buyer's remorse from happening, plus you want (hopefully) her to enjoy this type of experience. And even if it's just a one night stand, you want to leave her feeling good about things, even if it's just something like: 'You're awesome. Gonna sleep good tonight.'

It is kind of scary at first telling a woman you have high interest in you’re seeing other women. But it is very freeing and empowering. Even when I’ve had women tell me what I told her, I died a bit inside because I was butthurt but her value shot up like 25% and I wanted her that much more. So the reverse would be true and maybe even more-so.

Yea, about the call. I keep going back to some earlier advice on a different thread — have to keep getting in to the habit and simply “do what you want to do! You’re the man!” As it’s in touch with ones masculine energy and gets you out of submissive waiting mode. Because at the end of the day we’re creators, can’t wait for anyone to create what we truly want. Build the frame and pull people in to that. Takes time, strength and continual doing

 

[Roober]

Yea I literally had no choice there. I didn’t want to tell her about the other women. But she sat up as we’re laying in her bed half naked and point blank asked me what was going on and if I had been on dates or sleeping with others. I’m not going to lie to her and in turn myself; not what I want.
I learned she hasn’t seen anyone since me or has no desire to. But she mentions that she has options if she wants (which is a tactic to show me her SMV I know, but I could care less)

It definitely can be difficult to navigate once you've been caught. I would suggest keeping your phone on silent all the time. I refuse to live by an electronic leash, therefore my phone is always on do not disturb mode. I thought I may miss opportunities by doing this, but realized I havent missed anything but have freed up so of my time.

And for the future, I would suggest finding ways to navigate a line of questioning by changing topics, playing games, playing dumb, etc. There are many ways to get around questions without ever answering her questions. Her interest may have increased temporarily, but I imagine so has her interest in other c0cks as well.

 

[flowtheory]

It definitely can be difficult to navigate once you've been caught. I would suggest keeping your phone on silent all the time. I refuse to live by an electronic leash, therefore my phone is always on do not disturb mode. I thought I may miss opportunities by doing this, but realized I havent missed anything but have freed up so of my time.

And for the future, I would suggest finding ways to navigate a line of questioning by changing topics, playing games, playing dumb, etc. There are many ways to get around questions without ever answering her questions. Her interest may have increased temporarily, but I imagine so has her interest in other c0cks as well.

Usually I would agree with the latter paragraph, however she seems very monogomous and does not have ANY interest in pursuing others. She’s been super open about everything going on in her dating world.
Just because I opened up and have given her more of me, doesn’t mean her interest in others goes up. That would only be a valid statement if I became a wuss bag and started being needy. None of which will happen. Exclusive, relationship or whatever, the name of the game is to keep increasing my own value outside of the relation with her. And in doing so her interest will still climb.

And when she initially questioned I went silent. Then simply kissed her. Changed the topic to something else and she said “don’t be evasive answer the question.” And we got in to it from there. Note: she’s also a lawyer so good luck with redirection.

Do not disturb on the phone is a good way to live but also has downside as well on the whole, not just concerning women.

 

[highSpeed]

It is kind of scary at first telling a woman you have high interest in you’re seeing other women. But it is very freeing and empowering. Even when I’ve had women tell me what I told her, I died a bit inside because I was butthurt but her value shot up like 25% and I wanted her that much more. So the reverse would be true and maybe even more-so.

Yea, about the call. I keep going back to some earlier advice on a different thread — have to keep getting in to the habit and simply “do what you want to do! You’re the man!” As it’s in touch with ones masculine energy and gets you out of submissive waiting mode. Because at the end of the day we’re creators, can’t wait for anyone to create what we truly want. Build the frame and pull people in to that. Takes time, strength and continual doing

I think that only works in the short term though. If you had any notion of exclusivity at some point with this girl, she's going to remember you leveraging your other women to elicit a response from her that she might not have intended to give. Maybe that wasn't your actual intention but that will be her interpretation of your actions.

Believe me, if you try to get serious with her at some point, she's going to remember this. She might try to do the same thing to you once she's got you locked down. Kudos to you, this definitely works and will work well, but only if you intend on any of these relationships being short term.