Lessons from 11 years of being in the game

[snowdog]

I started this thread 11 years ago:
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/threads/my-self-improvement-program.122336/

I posted the post below in there 6 years after I posted the last one. I feel there's some useful information in there, so I figured I'd post it as a thread and expand it a little bit.

A lot of things have changed in 11 years, to say the least.

I started out not being able to even look girls in the eye. Me and my friends would even play dare to walk up to women. I would go out alone, get blind drunk to get confident, only to approach one or two girls in one night. I read all the books on the subject... The Game, all the stuff that the RSD guys put out, I even attended a few of their free seminars, I watched all their videos, etc. It was an obsession for a while. And I didn't even get close to getting laid while it was an obsession.

I didn't get laid until I was 24. I started to finally really "get it" when I was 27. By the time I was 28, I was virtually unstoppable. In other words, I had to become a grown adult to be completely comfortable with myself and get confident. What a ****ing surprise.

You might not know this, but your brain is not fully developed until you're in your late 20s. I'm not saying that's the entire reason behind it, but it definitely played a role. There's a certain calm and confidence that arrives at that age. It's impossible to explain what it exactly feels like, but you'll know exactly what I mean once you're there, too. So don't be too hard on yourself when you're frustrated and confused. Things will likely get better with time.

In the last few years, I have traveled half the world and slept with dozens of women from virtually every continent. Pretty much all the sexual fantasies I've ever had came true. I re-read my self-improvement thread just now and I can hardly recognize myself in my writing. It's been a struggle for sure, but things have worked out better than I could ever imagine on this front. They really, really did. I almost forgot how ****ty the place was where I came from.

I've started my own business around the time I made the last post and it is really growing into something. It's not making me rich yet, but it makes me happy, and no-one's telling me what to do. Satisfaction is here, and I'm confident the money will follow eventually.

Life has brought its triumphs and tragedies as life does, but I managed to make the most of it and have an overall good experience. I have managed to stay on the right path most of the time and it has lead to good things.

And the girl I talked about in my second-to last post? I'm marrying her soon. I can't wait to start the next chapter in life with her, and I can't believe I want to settle down because hooking up with random women is boring to me at this point. I'm looking forward to the prospect of starting a family and having children.

This might sound horrible and lame to you now as you read this, but you need to understand that being in your early 30s brings a different outlook on life than being in your late teens (when I started this thread). Again, you'll probably understand when you get there, even though I'm well aware that that makes me sound like an old ****.

That's fine.

To stay in-line with the format I established a while back:

Takeaway/things I've learned in 11 years "in the game"

• Be in good physical shape. It's achievable by everyone who's willing to work for it.
• The people who say that's not true and wussies who aren't willing to put in the work. You can do this. But you got to want it, and be willing to hurt and sweat for it. Several times a week.
• There's no excuse for a young guy to be out of shape. I'm in my early 30s at this point and I still manage to be super fit even though I work all the time. If you're in your early 20s, you can do this way more easily because you have a lot more time, and testosterone is raging through your veins. Don't miss the opportunity of youth to become as strong as you can be. You owe it to yourself.
• Go to NerdFitness.com and read everything on there. No need to get into the paid stuff. The free articles tell you all the basic things you need to know. Google and Bing will help you find the rest if you want to get deeper into it.
• Join a boxing/jiu jitsu/krav maga/mma gym. Go there 3 times a week. You'll be amazed what it will do to your body and your character.
• In my personal experience; paleo diet + martial arts will lead to having the body of a Greek God.
• If you're afraid of martial arts, that's a sign it's exactly for you. Go do it. Now.
• Hard work leads to results.
• Sometimes not the results you were initially looking for, but results regardless.
• This is true for every endeavor.
• You will fail.
• Fail.
• Fail.
• Fail again.
• Then something great will happen.
• Then you'll fail again.
• And again.
• And again.
• And ****ing AGAIN!
• When you really feel you want to quit, that's the universe/god/whatever you believe in testing you.
• Life is not fair. Life is hard. Life is tragic.
• Accept it because it will always be true no matter what.
• Do the right thing (you always know deep down what the right thing is) when badness befalls you. It inevitably will, at multiple points in your life at the worst possible timing. Don't walk away, be in denial, or be a b1tch about it. Be a man.
• You have a goal; so stay on the path. When you feel defeated, that's the exact moment where you need to be strong and push on.
• And then things will slowly change.
• And you'll still fail.
• But it won't matter so much anymore.
• And girls will notice that.
• You'll develop a different aura around you that's very attractive to women.
• And other people, too.
• Opportunities will open themselves up to you as a result. Not only in the form of women being attracted to you, but also people who want to be friends with you or give your business/employment opportunities.
• It is something that needs to be earned, like respect.
• And you'll only earn it by failing a million times, and staying on the path despite of that.
• There's a big chance that the things you learned from failing will be useful at a completely unexpected moment, sometimes years later. It's a tired cliche, but there is truth in failing your way to success. So embrace it, don't be afraid of it.
• The final takeaway of this 11-year-old thread should be: Work hard and good things will come to you eventually, regardless what you pursue.
• I get it, you want to bang chicks, but always keep your morals in check. Willingly doing people wrong will come back to haunt you. Be it directly through real-life drama, or through your conscious when you look at yourself in the mirror, sometimes years later, which is even worse. Either way, it's all bad. Don't go down that path, because it's not worth it. Ever.
• And if you have to lie, cheat, and con to get laid, you really are doing it wrong.
• Because the best sex you'll have in your life is with someone you genuinely really like and who genuinely really likes you, even if it's just for one night.
• Meaningless sex can be as boring and stupid as jacking off. Even if it's with a physically attractive woman. Just trust me on this.
• Be an interesting person first and the rest will follow. Including women you couldn't even dream about.
• Stick to it. Don't give up. If I can do it, so can you.

Things I wish I had heard/seen when I started this
If I were aware of this wisdom back when I was struggling with this issue, I'm confident I'd "gotten" it a lot sooner. I still managed to find my way out of my problems, but it took a long time.

The things these men discuss in the youtube clips below are pure gold nuggets of wisdom that apply to this and many other aspects of life. I believe things would had fallen into place a lot sooner for me if I were aware of this wisdom.

Sit down, don't do anything else, and listen to this. It will more than likely change your view on everything. And If you like what you see in these, go down the rabbit hole from there. There's a ton of very profound wisdom to be found here.

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4
• 5
• 6
• 7

If you have any questions about anything at all, I'll be more than happy to answer them.

I'll check into this thread every now and then.

 

[mellow_yellow]

Hey @snowdog great to see a returning veteran drop by with some pointers.

I'm on my own journey after a bunch of false starts over the past decade. I'm finally moving in the right direction. I'm 2 months strong on my workout regimen and been consistently chipping away on my goals. I know that I can never stop eating right, working out consistently, or accomplishing my goals for the rest of my life. There is no question that this is long and challenging journey. One of the spreadsheets I keep is a daily journal where I record my mood and realizations. Lately, I've felt more determined and focused versus feeling angry. It's a roller coaster of emotions, particularly when I get angry about how I'm underemployed and have so little dating experience that I'm in a Catch-22 -- without experience, I don't get a chance with the girl and without the chance, I get no experience. The anger is less frequent, but still there. It's been getting better. I'm noticing that an occasional woman or so is eyeing me and my mood is improving probably due to gym / more testosterone. With this said, I wanted to ask:

1. How did you manage your negative emotions after nonstop failure and rejection?
   
2. Did you work on your goals everyday or follow another approach?
   
3. Did you experience any major breakthroughs or was the change so gradual that one day, you realized you were in a better place compared to years ago?
4. What were the most important things that elevated your game to its absolute peak? Practicing cold approaches week after week, focusing only on your goals, building social circles, etc.?
5. In your experience, is developing SMV (looks/money/status) the priority over game, is game/mindset everything, OR did you have to find your own unique balance of SMV and game?

Thanks man.

 

[Visionist]

Hey @snowdog

1. In your experience, is developing SMV (looks/money/status) the priority over game, is game/mindset everything, OR did you have to find your own unique balance of SMV and game?

In my experience, there is no game without SMV.

By focusing on improving yourself, through working and building experiences to improve your finances, building up your looks consistently and unflappably through eating right, a regular exercise regime, and exploring your own tastes in fashions till you feel great for looking great, and by therefore becoming assertive and dominating your chosen field(s), you consistently improve your game by becoming more confident, engaging with more people, and as a result, more women by default, until you succeed more and more and care less and less.

The key is environment. If you hate your location, you must ask yourself why and change it if the hate has nothing to do with your own shortcomings. My biggest issue is literally finding an environment where quality women congregate in numbers. There are many environments; there's nightgame with its bars & clubs, there's daygame with its myriad locations, including holiday/vacation spaces where tourists congregate, and of course there's online.

Nightgame was never my thing, as I have no love of alcohol and with the quality of music you hear consistently these days in an establishment, let's just say my lack of nightgame has everything to do with my own shortcomings as stated above. I also have a complete aversion to online game after multiple bad experiences. That leaves daygame. Am I in a vacation spot?

No I'm not. That's what I need to change.

 

[Von]

I started this thread 11 years ago:
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/threads/my-self-improvement-program.122336/

I posted the post below in there 6 years after I posted the last one. I feel there's some useful information in there, so I figured I'd post it as a thread and expand it a little bit.

A lot of things have changed in 11 years, to say the least.

I started out not being able to even look girls in the eye. Me and my friends would even play dare to walk up to women. I would go out alone, get blind drunk to get confident, only to approach one or two girls in one night. I read all the books on the subject... The Game, all the stuff that the RSD guys put out, I even attended a few of their free seminars, I watched all their videos, etc. It was an obsession for a while. And I didn't even get close to getting laid while it was an obsession.

I didn't get laid until I was 24. I started to finally really "get it" when I was 27. By the time I was 28, I was virtually unstoppable. In other words, I had to become a grown adult to be completely comfortable with myself and get confident. What a ****ing surprise.

You might not know this, but your brain is not fully developed until you're in your late 20s. I'm not saying that's the entire reason behind it, but it definitely played a role. There's a certain calm and confidence that arrives at that age. It's impossible to explain what it exactly feels like, but you'll know exactly what I mean once you're there, too. So don't be too hard on yourself when you're frustrated and confused. Things will likely get better with time.

In the last few years, I have traveled half the world and slept with dozens of women from virtually every continent. Pretty much all the sexual fantasies I've ever had came true. I re-read my self-improvement thread just now and I can hardly recognize myself in my writing. It's been a struggle for sure, but things have worked out better than I could ever imagine on this front. They really, really did. I almost forgot how ****ty the place was where I came from.

I've started my own business around the time I made the last post and it is really growing into something. It's not making me rich yet, but it makes me happy, and no-one's telling me what to do. Satisfaction is here, and I'm confident the money will follow eventually.

Life has brought its triumphs and tragedies as life does, but I managed to make the most of it and have an overall good experience. I have managed to stay on the right path most of the time and it has lead to good things.

And the girl I talked about in my second-to last post? I'm marrying her soon. I can't wait to start the next chapter in life with her, and I can't believe I want to settle down because hooking up with random women is boring to me at this point. I'm looking forward to the prospect of starting a family and having children.

This might sound horrible and lame to you now as you read this, but you need to understand that being in your early 30s brings a different outlook on life than being in your late teens (when I started this thread). Again, you'll probably understand when you get there, even though I'm well aware that that makes me sound like an old ****.

That's fine.

To stay in-line with the format I established a while back:

Takeaway/things I've learned in 11 years "in the game"

• Be in good physical shape. It's achievable by everyone who's willing to work for it.
• The people who say that's not true and wussies who aren't willing to put in the work. You can do this. But you got to want it, and be willing to hurt and sweat for it. Several times a week.
• There's no excuse for a young guy to be out of shape. I'm in my early 30s at this point and I still manage to be super fit even though I work all the time. If you're in your early 20s, you can do this way more easily because you have a lot more time, and testosterone is raging through your veins. Don't miss the opportunity of youth to become as strong as you can be. You owe it to yourself.
• Go to NerdFitness.com and read everything on there. No need to get into the paid stuff. The free articles tell you all the basic things you need to know. Google and Bing will help you find the rest if you want to get deeper into it.
• Join a boxing/jiu jitsu/krav maga/mma gym. Go there 3 times a week. You'll be amazed what it will do to your body and your character.
• In my personal experience; paleo diet + martial arts will lead to having the body of a Greek God.
• If you're afraid of martial arts, that's a sign it's exactly for you. Go do it. Now.
• Hard work leads to results.
• Sometimes not the results you were initially looking for, but results regardless.
• This is true for every endeavor.
• You will fail.
• Fail.
• Fail.
• Fail again.
• Then something great will happen.
• Then you'll fail again.
• And again.
• And again.
• And ****ing AGAIN!
• When you really feel you want to quit, that's the universe/god/whatever you believe in testing you.
• Life is not fair. Life is hard. Life is tragic.
• Accept it because it will always be true no matter what.
• Do the right thing (you always know deep down what the right thing is) when badness befalls you. It inevitably will, at multiple points in your life at the worst possible timing. Don't walk away, be in denial, or be a b1tch about it. Be a man.
• You have a goal; so stay on the path. When you feel defeated, that's the exact moment where you need to be strong and push on.
• And then things will slowly change.
• And you'll still fail.
• But it won't matter so much anymore.
• And girls will notice that.
• You'll develop a different aura around you that's very attractive to women.
• And other people, too.
• Opportunities will open themselves up to you as a result. Not only in the form of women being attracted to you, but also people who want to be friends with you or give your business/employment opportunities.
• It is something that needs to be earned, like respect.
• And you'll only earn it by failing a million times, and staying on the path despite of that.
• There's a big chance that the things you learned from failing will be useful at a completely unexpected moment, sometimes years later. It's a tired cliche, but there is truth in failing your way to success. So embrace it, don't be afraid of it.
• The final takeaway of this 11-year-old thread should be: Work hard and good things will come to you eventually, regardless what you pursue.
• I get it, you want to bang chicks, but always keep your morals in check. Willingly doing people wrong will come back to haunt you. Be it directly through real-life drama, or through your conscious when you look at yourself in the mirror, sometimes years later, which is even worse. Either way, it's all bad. Don't go down that path, because it's not worth it. Ever.
• And if you have to lie, cheat, and con to get laid, you really are doing it wrong.
• Because the best sex you'll have in your life is with someone you genuinely really like and who genuinely really likes you, even if it's just for one night.
• Meaningless sex can be as boring and stupid as jacking off. Even if it's with a physically attractive woman. Just trust me on this.
• Be an interesting person first and the rest will follow. Including women you couldn't even dream about.
• Stick to it. Don't give up. If I can do it, so can you.

Things I wish I had heard/seen when I started this
If I were aware of this wisdom back when I was struggling with this issue, I'm confident I'd "gotten" it a lot sooner. I still managed to find my way out of my problems, but it took a long time.

The things these men discuss in the youtube clips below are pure gold nuggets of wisdom that apply to this and many other aspects of life. I believe things would had fallen into place a lot sooner for me if I were aware of this wisdom.

Sit down, don't do anything else, and listen to this. It will more than likely change your view on everything. And If you like what you see in these, go down the rabbit hole from there. There's a ton of very profound wisdom to be found here.

• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4
• 5
• 6
• 7

If you have any questions about anything at all, I'll be more than happy to answer them.

I'll check into this thread every now and then.

Beautiful thread and great to see a look back at 11 years of evolution.

Your post connected to me (even to the martial arts).

I feel also for the "newer Members" there's a Lesson: 1. Don't be sickly obsessed cause it will just damage your chances.
2. Be Game aware
3. Always Act every day on your goal (health,lay,girls)

 

[oldmanofthesea]

Congrats Snowdog, and great post.

Question for you guys who are into martial arts.....

I've tried it several times in my life but kept getting away from it for two reasons:
1. Some seriously douchey dudes make up 70% of the people there (usually the lower-level guys... instructors and high-level guys were always awesome stand-up people but you have to deal with everyone). I just had a hard time enjoying myself when surrounded by those kinds of people.
2. I kept getting injured. Injuries were minor (sprains mostly) but kept me away from other activities I enjoy like working out and sports. I'm also getting older so it takes longer to heal and I worry about injuries stacking up and preventing me from playing the sports I currently enjoy.

How have you guys dealt with these things?

 

[Von]

Congrats Snowdog, and great post.

Question for you guys who are into martial arts.....

I've tried it several times in my life but kept getting away from it for two reasons:
1. Some seriously douchey dudes make up 70% of the people there (usually the lower-level guys... instructors and high-level guys were always awesome stand-up people but you have to deal with everyone). I just had a hard time enjoying myself when surrounded by those kinds of people.
2. I kept getting injured. Injuries were minor (sprains mostly) but kept me away from other activities I enjoy like working out and sports. I'm also getting older so it takes longer to heal and I worry about injuries stacking up and preventing me from playing the sports I currently enjoy.

How have you guys dealt with these things?

To answer your questions:

1. I've never had the issue, in muay thai, BJJ, aikido, Aikijutjitsu.... It really depends on the quality of your gym, location/art/management... A DJ answer is: How you deal with them. (I had intense partners who go really intense.. more than you wish)... make your intentions clear on the ''level of intensity''.... they will listen or avoid you for futur sparring. Issue solved

2. Everyone in Martial Arts got injuries... I have been carrying some for 10 years now (they all healed but the knees still snap once in a while... its funny when you bum into someone by mistake and suddenly your legs collapse and you crash . yet you are the heavy one lol) ... To avoid injuries: Stretching, Good WarmUp, avoid sparring, TAKE YOUR TIME in techniques, communicate with your training partner (your intentions, injuries, speed capacity), avoid crazy morons (douche)

Also, for 2... get in shape before hands (respect your limits).

Most people want just to practice in peace, have their workout.... The learning of ''self-defence'' and ''getting healthy'' is what 90% of the people want.

Answer 2.1: Find a soft martial art (limited sparring or totally controlled one)... BJJ is a good for that (you are on the ground wrestling... you can't fall... only deal with locks),kungfu etc.. I would even add KravMaga, Aikido, Aiki etc...

All martial arts that avoid ''competition mayhem and beating the crap out of each other''

What keeps me away from Martial Arts: It's time....

 

[ubercat]

@oldmanofthesea I guess as an older guy I can talk to this. To be honest I've seen injuries in every martial art even Aikido.

I don't train now but I did for 20 years.

So make sure classes have some warm up and stretching component.

And some of the Chinese martial arts like tai chi or Wing Chun r low injury risk.

What particular martial art do you think might suit you and then we can give some more specific advice?

 

[oldmanofthesea]

Thanks for the replies.
@ubercat , I have done 6 months of Aikido, 6 months of Kung Fu, a couple months of Kendo, and just a couple weeks of BJJ. BJJ had the worst crowd, which is not surprising since it is so popular with MMA fans.

I'd want to learn something I could use in a real-world scenario, and had low risk of injury. Aikido was awesome but just not practical in the real-world.

 

[ubercat]

Bit tricky. Filipino martial art or Silat r best self defence IMO as they cover knives and grappling. Problem is if you are injury prones tick sfighting component could be an issue.

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

11yrs game. And is getting married.

BRB guy's, swearing away half my ****.

Curious hold old she is? $100 bet says she's nearing 30.

 

[Red Legg]

? I'm marrying her soon. I

OP has been here 11 years and hasn't learned a God damn thing proof that you can be here for years and be as sharp as a sack of wet mice.

 

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

You might not know this, but your brain is not fully developed until you're in your late 20s.

Wrong. It’s some time in your 40s. The PRUNING process is completed in your 20s though.

 

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

I do relate to much of what you post. But sometimes, the universe does have a different plan in store for you. You can fight it if you want. But if you try not to compromise, the universe won’t either, and catastrophe will hit. I just learned that within this past year really.

And I also wholeheartedly agree with your bit about morals. It WILL come back to bite you in the ass somehow some way. Always. That took me a while to realize too, and it why I always say that the sociopathic/psychopathic mindset is limited. It’s only good for the time being. But later on it screws you and people will leave you.

 

[Roober]

Congrats for you man!

 

[zekko]

I don't agree with everything the OP said, but it was a good post nonetheless.
I enjoy staying with and reading this message board, partly because I enjoy the topic. But another reason is I find things like this to be a good source of motivation.

I will say that some guys will not necessarily fail as much with women as indicated though. It depends on where you start out, really. And I guess some might fail more

 

[skinnyguy]

Great post man. I’ve been working out over 10 years and I’m still not in shape. I am committed to working harder this summer and getting the best body of my life. I know I can do it cause when I was 20 I was in really good shape and pulling hotties at parties.