Who here wants to get married and why?

[sazc]

Well the same could be said of any number of us here I suppose.

I guarantee you he'll find some way to keep this going and, if that doesn't work he'll find another thread to explode on. Another thread to validate why he can't find a quality chick. Because that's all this whole thread was about for him. A man's to not take responsibility for how his life has unfolded, in terms of women.

Proving that marriage is not worth it simultaneously validates him as being "okay" for not being able to find an LTR as well as placing the blame everywhere else EXCEPT on him. That's why it was so important to win.

I saw that on page 4.

 

[BeExcellent]

To @Tenacity 's point about children:

Please allow me to inform the board about something important that has not yet been noted...for the US anyway.

Understand that in Family Court the court puts children and their interests as innocents first (tries to). If you have children AND you divorce, your parental interests and rights are legally recognized and protected.

Not so with a baby mama. Baby mama can take your kids, up and move 5 states away some night & you have no recourse because you do not have the parental rights of an ex spouse & parent. So baby mama can literally vanish with your children.

Family Court will impose residency restrictions limiting the radius the other parent is allowed to move with the kids under the custody portion of a divorce.

I for example and my ex husband are not allowed to reside outside the children's current school district where they reside and expect to retain custody rights UNLESS the other parent is notified in writing and agrees. You break that the police get involved.

Some of the hardest family law cases my father had to deal with involved this very issue. You'd have parents who never got married. They break up. The woman gets a boyfriend or a new husband and moves the minor kids far away without the father's consent. The Family Court cannot do much in such cases as they generally don't have jurisdiction. So it's too bad dad. Move and have no assurance of visitation or you're SOL.

I wish I was making this up, but I'm not. Happens All. The. Time. I have several people I have seen this happen to including a close school friend of my daughter. The girl's mom had a daughter out of wedlock, found a man to marry one day (like 2 weeks after they met - Yikes!) up and moved 1000 miles away with new hubby. Uprooted the little girl and left the father behind. It was terribly sad.

Naturally I'm glad that girl is no longer in my daughter's friend group. That girl is likely to be plenty screwed up by her late teens.

If you want kids you are wise to marry. Even in divorce your parental rights are recognized and protected.

 

[Tenacity]

I guarantee you he'll find some way to keep this going and, if that doesn't work he'll find another thread to explode on. Another thread to validate why he can't find a quality chick. Because that's all this whole thread was about for him. A man's to not take responsibility for how his life has unfolded, in terms of women.

Proving that marriage is not worth it simultaneously validates him as being "okay" for not being able to find an LTR as well as placing the blame everywhere else EXCEPT on him. That's why it was so important to win.

I saw that on page 4.

Please stop psycho-analyzing me. Why do you folks do that? And this thread isn't about LTRs, it's about whether or not someone should sign a marriage contract. And for the record, I have been in committed relationships/LTRs over the last couple of years.

To @Tenacity 's point about children:

Please allow me to inform the board about something important that has not yet been noted...for the US anyway.

Understand that in Family Court the court puts children and their interests as innocents first (tries to). If you have children AND you divorce, your parental interests and rights are legally recognized and protected.

Not so with a baby mama. Baby mama can take your kids, up and move 5 states away some night & you have no recourse because you do not have the parental rights of an ex spouse & parent. So baby mama can literally vanish with your children.

Family Court will impose residency restrictions limiting the radius the other parent is allowed to move with the kids under the custody portion of a divorce.

I for example and my ex husband are not allowed to reside outside the children's current school district where they reside and expect to retain custody rights UNLESS the other parent is notified in writing and agrees. You break that the police get involved.

Some of the hardest family law cases my father had to deal with involved this very issue. You'd have parents who never got married. They break up. The woman gets a boyfriend or a new husband and moves the minor kids far away without the father's consent. The Family Court cannot do much in such cases as they generally don't have jurisdiction. So it's too bad dad. Move and have no assurance of visitation or you're SOL.

I wish I was making this up, but I'm not. Happens All. The. Time. I have several people I have seen this happen to. It's terribly sad.

If you want kids you are wise to marry. Even in divorce your parental rights are recognized and protected.

This is not true, it depends upon how the child custody agreement is structured. If the time is split pretty even and other things are in place, no parent can just up and move the kid across the country without the other parent's consent. Also once you are divorced, the same child custody/time with the child situation comes into play, so if you are a Baby Father with very little time with the child, you could end up in this situation no matter if you were married or not.

I have dated many girls for example, where her and the Baby Father were about "even" in terms of income and child custody time. She got a job offer in Florida, but couldn't take it (moving from Michigan) because the Baby Father wouldn't allow the kid to move there.

 

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

Doesn't make Marriage SMART.

That is what we are talking about. Not the social skills of random SS members.

Doing all this work, vetting and deep analysis of the women you're f*cking just so you can sign an unnecessary CONTRACT seems idiotic to me.

Your original question that is asked in huge bold letters at the top of the screen states “Who here wants to get married and why?” and that was the one I was answering. I can see you are beating around the bush though and doing so more for the ego trip rather than actually trying to find an answer, hence why I said that this thread should be closed several pages ago. But to answer this new question you have posed for me (even though I already have in a previous post), here is my response:

Unless you have found a woman to fit the criteria I’ve mentioned in another previous post, or had the characteristics of the 5 women I’ve met who were worthy (before they’ve degenerated that is), marriage is dumb.

If you come across such a woman though, squandering your time trying to plate her or just leaving her to let her rot and waste away in the grasps of this fvcked up society of ours would be even more idiotic. Letting someone else take her would be equally foolish because very few men are worthy of women in general, much less a rarity. Plus, they will only ruin her because of their failures at being a man. Letting such a woman leave your grasp is foolish. Why would you give up a brick of gold for a million plain stones? Someone else will take that gold immediately and run away with it.

 

[BeExcellent]

Please stop psycho-analyzing me. Why do you folks do that? And this thread isn't about LTRs, it's about whether or not someone should sign a marriage contract. And for the record, I have been in committed relationships/LTRs over the last couple of years.



This is not true, it depends upon how the child custody agreement is structured. If the time is split pretty even and other things are in place, no parent can just up and move the kid across the country without the other parent's consent. Also once you are divorced, the same child custody/time with the child situation comes into play, so if you are a Baby Father with very little time with the child, you could end up in this situation no matter if you were married or not.

I have dated many girls for example, where her and the Baby Father were about "even" in terms of income and child custody time. She got a job offer in Florida, but couldn't take it (moving from Michigan) because the Baby Father wouldn't allow the kid to move there.

Tenacity if you aren't married you can't always GET a custody agreement. Often there isn't one.

My dad was a prominent family law attorney for many years. I KNOW what I'm talking about.

Call a lawyer. See for yourself.

 

[Tenacity]

Tenacity if you aren't married you can't always GET a custody agreement...

Of course you can. I'm black @BeExcellent, trust me, I'm VERY familiar with how child support works because most of my family, friends, and other people I know are not married but they have kids galore. There's no way in the world you need to have been married in order to get a child custody agreement lol.

 

[BeExcellent]

Of course you can. I'm black @BeExcellent, trust me, I'm VERY familiar with how child support works because most of my family, friends, and other people I know are not married but they have kids galore. There's no way in the world you need to have been married in order to get a child custody agreement lol.

What I said still stands. Read case law. It happens all the time.

Never mind the risks children (especially girls) are exposed to from mama's new hubby or boyfriend(s).

Marriage is a better vehicle for child rearing. Period. There are plenty of studies showing how much better the old school nuclear family is...so many that it's pointing out the obvious.

 

[Tenacity]

What I said still stands. Read case law. It happens all the time.

No it doesn't......I don't even know why you are sitting up here telling complete lies? All one has to do is just LOOK at how many Baby Daddy/Baby Momma child custody situations we have today. The black community is 75% Baby Momma/Baby Daddy with child custody agreements as the foundation of the majority of black households.

Never mind the risks children (especially girls) are exposed to from mama's new hubby or boyfriend(s).

As if a chick can't get divorced and the same risks are there. As if a chick's husband can't bring in the same risks. Come on now.....

Marriage is a better vehicle for child rearing. Period.

No "period". If you have a marriage from hell with multiple issues within it, then how is that a good vehicle for child rearing?

Lol, listen I think I've provided all of the information I can provide on this topic. Guys are going to have to make their own individual choices, at this point the discussion/debate isn't even of quality anymore.

I'm out.

 

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

@BeExcellent I have 2 questions for you, and I will preface this by saying that while much of this post may sound very condescending and patronizing, I don’t intend it to be as such, however much of an ass I am towards you. Just understand my skepticism, as I have dealt with far too many frauds and heard way too many lies & half-truths in my life for only being 18.

Now to the question.....You imply to everyone on the board that you are of high value. And because of that reason, you also are oftentimes surrounded by high value men. You claim that if we just raise our value, that we would have no problems. Yet you are divorced and don’t plan on marrying again either, despite proclaiming that there are many high value men around you. Many of these supposed high value men have tried to court you at one point or another, and you turned them down. If so many men of supposed high value have tried courting you and have failed, how can we expect to find a high value woman and succeed in courting her as well?

I can think of only three possible answers. Either you and these men aren’t as high value as you implied, or you were lying, or some third answer that I am unable to discern from my own intuition. I ask you this question because I am hoping it’s the third.

I recall that a while ago, you said that the only person you’ve ever felt attracted to after your divorce was your ex-husband, though you aren’t going to marry him again due to what occurred between you two. And if I recall correctly, he is still struggling to rebuild himself again and is no longer what most people would describe to be a high value man, at least not nearly to your purported level. Yet you still hold at least some attraction towards him. Now considering all of this, how does it make sense to us that simply improving ourselves can grant us the high value, dream women we desire?

I can think of 6 possible answers to this question. One of them being that female attraction is illogical and irrational. Another being Desdinova’s High Score Theory. The next being that part of you subconsciously regrets having left him. The fourth being some combination of the above. The fifth that you actually HAVE had men outside of your ex that attracted you, you just lied or were trying to convince yourself that you don’t like them, for one reason or another. And the last being that like previously, I am unable to discern the truth from my own intuition. Again, I hope it’s the last one.

I await your response.

 

[The Duke]

I know that you have mentioned this before, but my memory fails me. What caused you and your ex to divorce? Who came out on top? And is there anything that you could have done to prevent it?

Her cheating on me is why I filed for divorce, but there was a break down in our relationship that led to that.

-We basically quit making our relationship a priority.
-Her and I are both very independent personalities. No one needed the other.
-We got busy getting our careers going in our late 20's and we also had our own hobbies that took time away from the relationship. The relationship was no longer the common goal.
-I quit satisfying her need for attention/validation. She looked elsewhere to get it and when you are an HB8, its not hard to find.

After my heart healed and I got my head back on straight, I came out on top. She road a lot of cahk after our divorce, even tried being a lesbian. Then she got depressed and fat. She still struggles 9yrs later.

Financially, I took a small hit. I had to pay her some "hush" money to make her go away and keep the lawyers out of it. Most of the equity in our house was money I put down by cashing in savings bonds that were gifted to me. By law, an ex wife is not entitled to that equity. She did get a little of the equity earned during the 3yrs of making monthly payments.

I should have tried harder at making our marriage work. I quit trying the last year. I got tired of listening to her biatch about her job and immersed myself deeper into my hobby and hung out in $tripperville more often. I didn't give her the attention she needed. I also didn't understand women like I do know and how to keep attraction. There are several things I've learned on SS over the years that would have served me well.

Its not that I am anti-marriage, I just don't see how men benefit from it if you aren't looking to raise a family. I think Tenacity and Urbanyst have made some very valid points. The Pro-marriage side(BeExcellent and Guru) hasn't presented a strong enough argument to convince me that its a good idea other than for raising children. I think deep down they realize that too. ;-)

 

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

Her cheating on me is why I filed for divorce, but there was a break down in our relationship that led to that.

-We basically quit making our relationship a priority.
-Her and I are both very independent personalities. No one needed the other.
-We got busy getting our careers going in our late 20's and we also had our own hobbies that took time away from the relationship. The relationship was no longer the common goal.
-I quit satisfying her need for attention/validation. She looked elsewhere to get it and when you are an HB8, its not hard to find.

After my heart healed and I got my head back on straight, I came out on top. She road a lot of cahk after our divorce, even tried being a lesbian. Then she got depressed and fat. She still struggles 9yrs later.

Financially, I took a small hit. I had to pay her some "hush" money to make her go away and keep the lawyers out of it. Most of the equity in our house was money I put down by cashing in savings bonds that were gifted to me. By law, an ex wife is not entitled to that equity. She did get a little of the equity earned during the 3yrs of making monthly payments.

I should have tried harder at making our marriage work. I quit trying the last year. I got tired of listening to her biatch about her job and immersed myself deeper into my hobby and hung out in $tripperville more often. I didn't give her the attention she needed. I also didn't understand women like I do know and how to keep attraction. There are several things I've learned on SS over the years that would have served me well.

Its not that I am anti-marriage, I just don't see how men benefit from it if you aren't looking to raise a family. I think Tenacity and Urbanyst have made some very valid points. The Pro-marriage side(BeExcellent and Guru) hasn't presented a strong enough argument to convince me that its a good idea other than for raising children. I think deep down they realize that too. ;-)

If you don’t mind me asking, how long was she cheating on you for? And how did you two meet and how old were both of you then? How old were you and her when you got married? Do you regret getting married? And do you think you would have still married her knowing about women like you do now?

 

[BeTheChange]

You're absolutely dead wrong lol

She isn't wrong. Unless UK law is drastically different from the US, which I doubt.

Unmarried fathers have NO legal rights unless their names are on the birth certificate, which is entirely the choice of the mother. Of course they are still subject to child support payments regardless so all downside and no upside.

If you try and steer this argument towards parental rights and obligations the anti-marriage camp has no chance of winning.

My step brother's baby momma uprooted his son with her new boyfriend. He hasn't seen his kid in two years and there is nothing he can do. The police are aware of where the mother is but legally they can't tell him anything. He has zero rights.

 

[Tenacity]

She isn't wrong. Unless UK law is drastically different from the US, which I doubt.

She's dead wrong. So wrong that arguing with her (and you) about it would be a complete waste of time.

 

[The Duke]

If you don’t mind me asking, how long was she cheating on you for? And how did you two meet and how old were both of you then? How old were you and her when you got married? Do you regret getting married? And do you think you would have still married her knowing about women like you do now?

-She hung out with him for probably 6months. I was immersed in my hobby/work and didn't even notice until the final 2months.
-We met in high school.
-Married in mid 20's. She is 1yr younger than me.
-No, have zero regret. We had a lot of very good years together. Up until the final year, we had a pretty awesome relationship, one that people strive for. She doesn't even have that with her new husband.
-Had I known then what I know now about women, I would have still married her. Out of the 53 girls I have been with she is in my top 5 that I would consider marriage worthy.

As some of you younger guys cycle thru girls you will come to the realization that there will be only a few that are worth having long term. My advice is to not get too greedy/selfish and throw away a good thing when its eating out of your hand. Girls worth keeping are rare.

You can run the streets for too many years and what happens is you end up seeing too much. Just like girls who spend too many years on the cahk carousel end up with too much emotional baggage. Guys who spend too many years chasing pu$$y end up with too much awareness and become emotionally/mentally hardened. It pretty much takes a damn unicorn for me to put much energy into relationships anymore.

 

[BeTheChange]

She's dead wrong. So wrong that arguing with her (and you) about it would be a complete waste of time.

I wasn't nor do I have any desire to argue with you. Stop attention wh0ring.

 

[Urbanyst]

very few men are worthy of women in general, much less a rarity.

I can't take anyone who believes this seriously.

Blue pill sh*t.

Plus, they will only ruin her because of their failures at being a man. Letting such a woman leave your grasp is foolish. Why would you give up a brick of gold for a million plain stones? Someone else will take that gold immediately and run away with it.

Women change over time.

How do you factor this in with making marriage SMART? You are assuming this woman will stay frozen in time. You understand she will GET OLD right? Lol.

 

[Urbanyst]

Not too smart, heh?

Marriage is an individual decision based on an individual's particular need and circumstance and how the potential marriage contender could meet such a need.

The most rudimentary example would be:

Man is insolvent and not likely to ever earn money. Contender is wealthy with assets. By getting married, he lives financially better.

Yeah.. I said this several pages ago. You obviously don't read sh*t lol.

This is an extreme example served as a hyperbole. Underneath this ceiling are thousands of other scenarios (a dozen already named in this thread) where marriage makes sense for the man and woman depending on each others' personal needs and circumstance.

Name FIVE.

I'll wait lol.

 

[Urbanyst]

I can give you a list but you wouldn't accept it. The short version of FACTS is this:

1. Because marriage is the best environment for child rearing.

Not a FACT. That's your opinion.

I'm asking for FACT based reasons.

2. Because marriage confers tax advantages

I've give you this one. But at what risk and cost?

3. Because married couples accumulate greater wealth

Sometimes they do and sometimes they don't.

4. Because married men live longer

Indoor cats live longer than outdoor cats.

Zoo animals live longer than animals in the wild.

Would you rather spend your life in a cage just to get an extra few years? The answer for me is NO.

Furthermore.. correlation does not equal causation. No one has ever PROVED married men live longer because of the marriage itself.

Furthermore.. DIVORCED people have the shortest lifespan of all people. Shorter than those who never got married.

Chew on that lol.

Those are some factual advantages that you can fact check.

There is a reason men here say only get serious with women who do not have divorce in the family. Has to do with family values & upbringing.

Yours is a larger problem. You think you can fit relationships into a logical frame work. Relationships, including marriage, are endeavors of emotion, not logic. Trying to put emotional endeavors into a logic frame is doomed to fail.

I'm not even going to talk about the benefits of intimacy and sexual monogamy. You can't comprehend those concepts.

Everyone is not built the same way emotionally. What emotionally benefits BeExcellent might not emotionally benefit Urbanyst.

Same as how some people get excited when they see a celebrity while others don't give a sh*t lol.

 

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

I can't take anyone who believes this seriously.

Blue pill sh*t.



Women change over time.

How do you factor this in with making marriage SMART? You are assuming this woman will stay frozen in time. You understand she will GET OLD right? Lol.

It’s true. Most men aren’t worthy of women which is why most men struggle.

And like I said, those who have the traits of those 5 women are worth marrying because they don’t change unless you do first. Remember how the man is supposed to lead? Well if you change, she will follow your lead an change too. So you better cause her to change for ge better.

Also, last I checked men get old too

If you think you can attract hot college cheerleaders when you’re 60, you are an idiot.

 

[BeExcellent]

I have 2 questions for you, and I will preface this by saying that while much of this post may sound very condescending and patronizing, I don’t intend it to be as such, however much of an ass I am towards you. Just understand my skepticism, as I have dealt with far too many frauds and heard way too many lies & half-truths in my life for only being 18.

No worries. I am happy to respond. It will be lengthy so be advised.

You imply to everyone on the board that you are of high value. And because of that reason, you also are oftentimes surrounded by high value men. You claim that if we just raise our value, that we would have no problems. Yet you are divorced and don’t plan on marrying again either, despite proclaiming that there are many high value men around you. Many of these supposed high value men have tried to court you at one point or another, and you turned them down. If so many men of supposed high value have tried courting you and have failed, how can we expect to find a high value woman and succeed in courting her as well?

The answer is that high value and compatibility are different things. Just because a man is high value and I am high value does not mean we are well matched. High value people have many options and therefore many choices. What any particular individual is looking for in a relationship is specific and I would suggest that it becomes more specific the more life experience one has. So when two people meet and begin the initial stages of spending time together each is also evaluating the other in subtle ways. And this evaluation goes on in the context of each individual's criteria, and also in the context of the other choices they have in the marketplace. So the two people are looking at compatibility, goals, desires, and criteria and seeing if the other person is a good "fit." This is normal. In my case I first must weed out men who are looking for casual sex or STR only. That actually weeds out about a third to a half of the men I meet right off the bat. But even once that portion is set aside then there are myriad things to look at objectively and decide about. I'll give you a few examples.

Assuming a man is interested in something more meaningful then I want to know whether a man has children already or not. If he doesn't have kids does he wish he did? Why is this important to me? Because if he is childless he may in fact one day decide he would like kids. I cannot have more children (tubes are tied) so I can never fulfill that desire for a man (really I'm too old now anyway). I'm quite pragmatic about this. I had some dates with a physical therapist who is deeply religious a while back. He's 47. He really would like to eventually have children. Although he liked me and we got along well, I cannot meet a deep desire of his. Best to discontinue seeing him and let him find a younger woman he can have a family with if that is important to him.

Then there are habits. Does a man drink excessively? Does he smoke weed? (I'd rather not date a pot smoker) Does he eat junk food or expect to have pasta every night (I cannot eat that way or I'd be fat.) Is he an embarrassment to himself under the influence? I had some dates with a retired professional hockey player who is a multimillionaire. He liked me A LOT. He had a generous nature, was a handsome man's man and was fun to hang out with. We went out with some friends of his for his birthday to a white tablecloth expensive restaurant. He drank far too much, became embarrassingly vulgar and inappropriate to myself, to the waiter, and to tables seated nearby and was a general embarrassment to himself. I had to gently threaten to leave the venue unless his behavior improved. It did and he later expressed gratitude that I handled the situation with class, but I was so put off by his behavior that I quit seeing him. If he does that once, he does it routinely. No thank you.

Then there is compatibility in hobbies and interests. There is a wealthy man I know who has asked me out numerous times who raises prize dogs. He has a dozen of these dogs who live in his house with him at any given time. It's about a 2M house. He is passionate about his dogs. He is a successful good looking wealthy man who thinks I'm a "10" and has told me so without apology. He's a great guy. He's not for me. I was raised without pets in the house and as a landlord I greatly dislike dealing with the messes the pets of my renters create in my properties. I have no desire to deal with dog hair, dog poo, dog vomit, or dog pee on a routine basis in my home environment. He's not someone I could LTR with. I can't get into the dog obsession, so he's not a good match for me.

And none of the 3 men noted above dance latin or ballroom or country western, so I would have to give up one of my passions to be in relationship with any of them. See how random the selection process can appear?

I will answer the other question in the next post.