Struggling with the first dates

[Zero_to_hero]

Hello!

Long story short, I am 23 old Hard_case newbie. I am trying out the dating game, but the progress is painfully slow. I am using Tinder and I am meeting these 18-22 y/o girls. I got no problem getting theyr number and meeting up for dates, but the sparks don't fly during the date, and I cannot even get a decent kiss in the end.

I want to master a coffee date, so is there some movies, articles, videos that will show you, how should the date go?

What are some topics, where I should steer the conversation, so it becomes more intimate and attracts the girl, so she not just see me as some harmless boy. The conversations I am having is some friendly banter, how I would talk with my guy friends.

How long should such a date last, and how can I make sure, I end our date on a high point?

When should I take her hand, and what could be my excuse for doing so?

What should we talk about before kissing, that the kiss wouldn't seem out of place or forced (really struggling with this one). When should I kiss her (time spend in the date)?

Guys, please give me some technical advices. I am really a technical dude, and I have read a lot of theory, but it does get me nowhere, because I fail to apply it. I operate better on bite size info, that I can read and easily test out in the "field".

The plan is to go out with a different girl every Saturday at 20:00, have a cheap date (I am a student, so I am really low on cash). To have a pleasent date, and do it over and over by adding something "new to my arsenal" at every date, untill I perfect my approach on a first date, and to have a grate date in general, where the girl wants to kiss me and see me again afterwards aswell.

Fot all the answers, thanks in advance. Cheers!

 

[Masculinity]

If that's you in your username picture, I would take it down. You don't want people (e.g., a feminist) to misinterpret who you are (e.g., a woman hater) for being a part of this forum. I understand that a lot of people in your generation are comfortable in posting personal information and images, but I wouldn't do it here. Look at the profile pictures of the members here; they are images of random people, things or avatars.

 

[marmel75]

The main point I will make is to really analyze what went well in date and what didn't. It took me about 60 dates to become really really good but once I got there I knew the woman was going to be interested in me after our first date...and with few exceptions they were.

Try specific things out on dates and take note of what happened. Change things. Once you start having some successes then keep the things that are working and continue to change the things that aren't.

This isnt hard, it simply takes work and not being afraid to try new things and change things when they arent working.

 

[cola]

1.) Don't do coffee dates..
Boring as hell.

I know you are a struggling student but get creative with more exciting dates..

Even hiking and smoking some grass is better than coffee..& free besides the grass.

2.) If you are a college student its really gonna be as simple as talking to girls on campus.
Just start conversations and see how they go

 

[Zero_to_hero]

The main point I will make is to really analyze what went well in date and what didn't. It took me about 60 dates to become really really good but once I got there I knew the woman was going to be interested in me after our first date...and with few exceptions they were.

Try specific things out on dates and take note of what happened. Change things. Once you start having some successes then keep the things that are working and continue to change the things that aren't.

This isnt hard, it simply takes work and not being afraid to try new things and change things when they arent working.

Thanks for reply. It does seem really simple, when you spell it out like that.

It does make me feel better, that you mentioned, it took you 60 dates to get really good. I have only done few, so it is only a beginning. Atleast I am trying going for the kiss (awkwardly, but atleast doing it), when in first dates, I didn't even do that.

1.) Don't do coffee dates..
Boring as hell.

I know you are a struggling student but get creative with more exciting dates..

Even hiking and smoking some grass is better than coffee..& free besides the grass.

2.) If you are a college student its really gonna be as simple as talking to girls on campus.
Just start conversations and see how they go

Is it a ideal date? No. But it is besides the point. Guys still attract girls and get laid occasionally even in boring setting like a coffee date. Its about how well you carry yourself, and that is where I am lacking. I am not even trying to bang these girls - all I want is to have a stimulating conversation and smoothly make out a little bit without any awkward moments in the process. I truly believe, that a simple coffee date could get me that far.

When I reach my goal, I could even expand like this.

1) Go to the coffee shop for 40 mins to make her interested;
2) Go take a walk (I park my car within 10 minute walk from the coffee shop, right across a pretty cool bar);
3) Make out during the walk;
4) while we are walking we could be near the bar. I offer to have a drink in there;
5) Have a drink and talk for a bit. At that point in the evening, people are already dancing on the dance floor, so we can go dance;
6) Make out with her on the dance floor and offer her to come to my dorms, and take a look at my "rock collection". We get in my car, that is parked right across the bar, and rest you can figure out yourself.

I think this is a pretty good plan. May be have anything to tweak or add? Or just some general criticism in regards how realistic does it sound?

 

[Desdinova]

1) Go to the coffee shop for 40 mins to make her interested;
2) Go take a walk (I park my car within 10 minute walk from the coffee shop, right across a pretty cool bar);
3) Make out during the walk;

Why do guys insist on taking women to bars? That's usually the last place I take a woman unless I feel the need to demonstrate social proof, and then I take her to my regular hangout.

I want to master a coffee date, so is there some movies, articles, videos that will show you, how should the date go?

I do coffee dates when I don't know the girl very well. I like to start off with something non-threatening, and women generally won't bail on a coffee date.

However, the coffee date shouldn't last very long and you should have a plan of where to take her after the coffee date. You need to basically progress with the second date immediately after the coffee date. You need to take her somewhere interesting and/or fun. I generally like taking them to a store that has things you can chat about. Thrift stores are great. I've also taken them to asian food stores to look at the unusual food items. If the coffee date goes extremely well and you feel like best buddies afterwards, then you can immediately take her on an action date. I usually opt for mini golf in that case and then do the thrift/food store afterwards.

Coffee dates aren't exactly fun. The purpose of them is to have a starting point to build basic rapport. If you already have good rapport with the girl, then a coffee date will be a step backwards.

 

[Zero_to_hero]

Why do guys insist on taking women to bars? That's usually the last place I take a woman unless I feel the need to demonstrate social proof, and then I take her to my regular hangout.

Why bar? My logic is that in the bar, you can have a few drinks and than go dancing. Girls usually love to dance, and it is all touchy, touchy. I naturally feel, that it would be easier to make out with her after dancing, and if it goes well, take her home.

I do coffee dates when I don't know the girl very well. I like to start off with something non-threatening, and women generally won't bail on a coffee date.

However, the coffee date shouldn't last very long and you should have a plan of where to take her after the coffee date. You need to basically progress with the second date immediately after the coffee date. You need to take her somewhere interesting and/or fun. I generally like taking them to a store that has things you can chat about. Thrift stores are great. I've also taken them to asian food stores to look at the unusual food items. If the coffee date goes extremely well and you feel like best buddies afterwards, then you can immediately take her on an action date. I usually opt for mini golf in that case and then do the thrift/food store afterwards.

Coffee dates aren't exactly fun. The purpose of them is to have a starting point to build basic rapport. If you already have good rapport with the girl, then a coffee date will be a step backwards.

Minigolf isn't a thing where I live, but pool goes to mind. I am a half decent pool player, and it did not accour to me as a possibility to go play pool right after we have had a coffee. That may even work better, because slow coffee date and a bar would be as a night and day, but pool does go somewhere in the middle. I can even make it out to be "spontanious idea".

I will try this out in my next date. The only question - what would be the best time to kiss her?

On my date yesterday I drowe her home, and we were sitting in my car, an just right before she was about to get out, I feel such a pressure to go in for a kiss (because you must kiss a girl on the 1st date), but it just feels out of place. Also, my car sucks for that, because it has this panel between drivers and passangers seat, so you must make it pretty abvious, that you will go in for the kiss, and does not end up smooth at all.

 

[Desdinova]

Why bar? My logic is that in the bar, you can have a few drinks and than go dancing. Girls usually love to dance, and it is all touchy, touchy. I naturally feel, that it would be easier to make out with her after dancing, and if it goes well, take her home.

Girls like to have fun. Dancing is just one way to do it, and they usually like to do it with their friends. A woman will make out with you if she has a good time with you. I find bars are places where you have to submit to the atmosphere. The music is usually too loud and you cannot converse with her. It's a great place to randomly make out with women and possibly take a piece of ass home, but I would NEVER take a woman there for a date.

Minigolf isn't a thing where I live, but pool goes to mind. I am a half decent pool player, and it did not accour to me as a possibility to go play pool right after we have had a coffee.

Just make sure you don't take her to a noisy bar to play pool. A pool hall would be a better option. You can also take her bowling, to the park, feed ducks, and lots of other simple things.

The only question - what would be the best time to kiss her?

One of two things will happen. She will either initiate the kiss, or she will wait for you to initiate the kiss. If she breaks away without doing this, then the date did not go very well.

You SHOULD initiate kino sometime during the date. Put your hand on her shoulder while telling her something, grab her hand and lead her somewhere to show her something, put your hand on her back to "guide" her through a doorway, or any type of non-sexual touch. You may also notice her initiating kino. Women will commonly lean their arm or leg against yours to show that they want to touch.

On my date yesterday I drowe her home, and we were sitting in my car, an just right before she was about to get out, I feel such a pressure to go in for a kiss (because you must kiss a girl on the 1st date), but it just feels out of place.

My rule is that the kiss needs to happen before the end of the second date. Occasionally I won't get one at the end of the first date, but she's still interested. Sometimes, women will move a bit slower. If you get a second date with her, then she's still interested. However, you CANNOT end the second date without a kiss. If you get past the second date without a kiss, then you're just a friend.

As for the end of the date while you're in the car and the pressure is on, you have absolutely nothing to lose at this point. You either make a move, or you lose her. Put your hand on her leg/hand and tell her you had fun. Doing this breaks the sexual barrier and opens the doorway for the kiss.

my car sucks for that, because it has this panel between drivers and passangers seat, so you must make it pretty abvious, that you will go in for the kiss, and does not end up smooth at all.

You're not looking for smoothness, you're looking to break the sexual barrier. Sometimes it's flawless, sometimes she will initiate it out of the blue, and sometimes you're going to feel the tension before it happens. When it gets to the end of the date and she's waiting for an official end to it, you have to make the move no matter how awkward it may feel. If you're a good kisser, she'll forget about the awkwardness and be more concerned about leaving a wet spot on your passenger seat.

So what do you have to lose at the end of a first date? Are you worried that you'll leave a bad impression because of how awkward you started your first kiss? If you worry about that, you're guaranteed to have a night of wild masturbation instead of a second date. You can either end the date with an exciting first kiss and proceed to a second date, or you can just let the date end awkwardly and risk her dating some other guy instead.

In other words, you either say "fvck it" and take the jump to see what happens, or you just lose out and regret not doing anything.

 

[marmel75]

Why do guys insist on taking women to bars? That's usually the last place I take a woman unless I feel the need to demonstrate social proof, and then I take her to my regular hangout.



I do coffee dates when I don't know the girl very well. I like to start off with something non-threatening, and women generally won't bail on a coffee date.

However, the coffee date shouldn't last very long and you should have a plan of where to take her after the coffee date. You need to basically progress with the second date immediately after the coffee date. You need to take her somewhere interesting and/or fun. I generally like taking them to a store that has things you can chat about. Thrift stores are great. I've also taken them to asian food stores to look at the unusual food items. If the coffee date goes extremely well and you feel like best buddies afterwards, then you can immediately take her on an action date. I usually opt for mini golf in that case and then do the thrift/food store afterwards.

Coffee dates aren't exactly fun. The purpose of them is to have a starting point to build basic rapport. If you already have good rapport with the girl, then a coffee date will be a step backwards.

Why do guys insist on taking women to bars? That's usually the last place I take a woman unless I feel the need to demonstrate social proof, and then I take her to my regular hangout.



I do coffee dates when I don't know the girl very well. I like to start off with something non-threatening, and women generally won't bail on a coffee date.

However, the coffee date shouldn't last very long and you should have a plan of where to take her after the coffee date. You need to basically progress with the second date immediately after the coffee date. You need to take her somewhere interesting and/or fun. I generally like taking them to a store that has things you can chat about. Thrift stores are great. I've also taken them to asian food stores to look at the unusual food items. If the coffee date goes extremely well and you feel like best buddies afterwards, then you can immediately take her on an action date. I usually opt for mini golf in that case and then do the thrift/food store afterwards.

Coffee dates aren't exactly fun. The purpose of them is to have a starting point to build basic rapport. If you already have good rapport with the girl, then a coffee date will be a step backwards.

Because scientifically its been shown attraction levels rise after consuming alcohol. Whether its enough to make a difference or not im not sure, but anything that gives you any kind of advantage in taking.

 

[penkitten]

When I was in my early 20s, the most fun place to take a new date to was the go cart track.
It may sound lame to you, but it was always a winner.

 

[Mike32ct]

You need to have some physical contact during the date so that there is a natural buildup towards a kiss. Just having a great conversation but being "hands off" won't work. I made that mistake too many times to count.

1. Maybe a quick hug to greet her. "Hey good to see ya. Did you find the place alright?"

2. Touch her forearm during the date while making a point. "Oh yeah, I got a good one for ya. I hear the funniest thing the other day..."

3. Touch her shoulder for a second when you get up to go to the bathroom. "I'll be right back."

4. Put your hand on her lower back while you walk her out to the car at the end or try to hold her hand on the way out. (She will either take it or she won't.) "Yeah, so are you parked towards the end of the lot?"

These are just examples, not a precise recipe, but it helps a lot.

Please don't do the completely hands-off gentleman date. It SOUNDS good, but it totally leads to friend-zone. It becomes no different than hanging out with a buddy.

Lastly, what you talk about doesn't matter. As long as you avoid potentially gross or offensive topics, you're good.

 

[Murk]

You need to have some physical contact during the date so that there is a natural buildup towards a kiss. Just having a great conversation but being "hands off" won't work. I made that mistake too many times to count.

1. Maybe a quick hug to greet her. "Hey good to see ya. Did you find the place alright?"

2. Touch her forearm during the date while making a point. "Oh yeah, I got a good one for ya. I hear the funniest thing the other day..."

3. Touch her shoulder for a second when you get up to go to the bathroom. "I'll be right back."

4. Put your hand on her lower back while you walk her out to the car at the end or try to hold her hand on the way out. (She will either take it or she won't.) "Yeah, so are you parked towards the end of the lot?"

These are just examples, not a precise recipe, but it helps a lot.

Please don't do the completely hands-off gentleman date. It SOUNDS good, but it totally leads to friend-zone. It becomes no different than hanging out with a buddy.

Lastly, what you talk about doesn't matter. As long as you avoid potentially gross or offensive topics, you're good.

All of this.

Just touch her naturally throughout the date. I went on a date last Wednesday with an Australian I met a couple Friday before and the only thing in my mind to prepare was to be funny, find out about her, touch her and kiss her. Everything else falls into place.

It did help that I took her to a nice quite bar and bought a bottle of red, she bought the next bottle which was a big tick I’m my book. We stole two glasses from the bar and drank the second bottle in a cool outdoor place I know in central London with a water feature, amazing view etc. By then we were pretty drunk and it was easy to ask her to come back to mine for another drink.

I’m more of an alcohol dater, never done a coffee date.

 

[That_dude]

All depends on the girl and the vibe/connection you have going on. I've had some dates that ended with a kiss on the cheek and others that turned into make out sessions. If things are going well and you're feeling confident, go for it.

As for dates.. I'm not into the bar scene and drinking. Not really compatible with chicks who are. In my experience they've always been trouble I prefer something outdoors and fun on the first date

 

[Zero_to_hero]

Thank you for all the answers. It really helps to put things into perspective and gives me a better idea what to focus on during the date.

Gokarting sounds fun, but, actually a coffee date with hour of pool is all ready maxing out my nights budget. Right now only difference of me and a Hobo is that I dress and smell a bit better.

I mean, i do try to touch the girl I am seeing. I give a kiss on her cheek when I meet her while lighty placing my right arm on her lower back giving a soart light halfhug. I try to lightly "lead" her in and out of building. I do these safe touches to forearm and shoulder while talking, and also when we are walking, I tend to point things out and introduce touch there. Up untill that point usually everything is ok. Girl is laughing and telling me things. Speaking way more than I am and there are almost no awkward pauses. But it is not an intimate conversation, just a friendly banter how I would talk with my guy friends or somebody at work. No flirting going on at all.

All goes down hill, when we are walking and talking, when I start to think, that now I should hold her hand. I just get weirded out by the taught of it. Then I get nervous and my speaking skills suffer aswell and the conversation just becomes awkward. Probably that is why the kissing feels so unatural aswell.

If we are going side by side, what would be a good reason to start holding her hand? I feel it is creepy to just grab her hand without saying anything and without any context. I mean, if she would ask:"What are you doing" or "Why are we holding hands" I got no answer for her...

 

[Trump]

Love all the posters who have responded to the OP, especially the ones who claim they have slept with hundreds of beautiful girls within minutes of meeting them.

Way to detailed and contrived to be real. OP is making of a fool of you guys. But keep responding.

 

[Macaframalama]

Hello!

Long story short, I am 23 old Hard_case newbie. I am trying out the dating game, but the progress is painfully slow. I am using Tinder and I am meeting these 18-22 y/o girls. I got no problem getting theyr number and meeting up for dates, but the sparks don't fly during the date, and I cannot even get a decent kiss in the end.

I want to master a coffee date, so is there some movies, articles, videos that will show you, how should the date go?

What are some topics, where I should steer the conversation, so it becomes more intimate and attracts the girl, so she not just see me as some harmless boy. The conversations I am having is some friendly banter, how I would talk with my guy friends.

How long should such a date last, and how can I make sure, I end our date on a high point?

When should I take her hand, and what could be my excuse for doing so?

What should we talk about before kissing, that the kiss wouldn't seem out of place or forced (really struggling with this one). When should I kiss her (time spend in the date)?

Guys, please give me some technical advices. I am really a technical dude, and I have read a lot of theory, but it does get me nowhere, because I fail to apply it. I operate better on bite size info, that I can read and easily test out in the "field".

The plan is to go out with a different girl every Saturday at 20:00, have a cheap date (I am a student, so I am really low on cash). To have a pleasent date, and do it over and over by adding something "new to my arsenal" at every date, untill I perfect my approach on a first date, and to have a grate date in general, where the girl wants to kiss me and see me again afterwards aswell.

Fot all the answers, thanks in advance. Cheers!

Being able to bullchit with a woman like she is one of the guys is good. Don't change that. You just have to show her your intentions and that she's just not one of the guys by touching her. Around here we have big arcades that also serve beer. Pool halls, bowling alleys, etc. Examples, would be showing her how to shoot a pool shot or a free throw on one of the games and touch the small of her back or arm. If you guys get to cracking up over a knee slapper pull her into you for a split second. If you stop during a walk for a second, put your hand on the small of her back and lead her. When, you guys grab a beer at the counter, hand her hers, while putting your hand on the small of her back for a second. If she's about to get out of your car grab her by the hand and pull her in for a kiss. Be aware of any opportunity to touch her and do it. It will come naturally after awhile.

 

[Macaframalama]

If that's you in your username picture, I would take it down. You don't want people (e.g., a feminist) to misinterpret who you are (e.g., a woman hater) for being a part of this forum. I understand that a lot of people in your generation are comfortable in posting personal information and images, but I wouldn't do it here. Look at the profile pictures of the members here; they are images of random people, things or avatars.

Why would you cater to, out of fear of someone else's misinterpretation of you? That's their problem.

 

[Macaframalama]

Thank you for all the answers. It really helps to put things into perspective and gives me a better idea what to focus on during the date.

Gokarting sounds fun, but, actually a coffee date with hour of pool is all ready maxing out my nights budget. Right now only difference of me and a Hobo is that I dress and smell a bit better.

I mean, i do try to touch the girl I am seeing. I give a kiss on her cheek when I meet her while lighty placing my right arm on her lower back giving a soart light halfhug. I try to lightly "lead" her in and out of building. I do these safe touches to forearm and shoulder while talking, and also when we are walking, I tend to point things out and introduce touch there. Up untill that point usually everything is ok. Girl is laughing and telling me things. Speaking way more than I am and there are almost no awkward pauses. But it is not an intimate conversation, just a friendly banter how I would talk with my guy friends or somebody at work. No flirting going on at all.

All goes down hill, when we are walking and talking, when I start to think, that now I should hold her hand. I just get weirded out by the taught of it. Then I get nervous and my speaking skills suffer aswell and the conversation just becomes awkward. Probably that is why the kissing feels so unatural aswell.

If we are going side by side, what would be a good reason to start holding her hand? I feel it is creepy to just grab her hand without saying anything and without any context. I mean, if she would ask:"What are you doing" or "Why are we holding hands" I got no answer for her...

Man, it sounds like you've got alot of it down, other than knowing when to shut down all the internal questioning of yourself and start feeling and being in the moment. Just say fvck it, shut all the logical thinking down, embrace the feeling and vibes and let the chips fall where they may.

 

[Masculinity]

Why would you cater to, out of fear of someone else's misinterpretation of you? That's their problem.

It's not catering. It's self protection and prevention of defamation, IMO. You're free to post your own picture, if that's what you choose though.

 

[TheMonkeyKing]

the most fun place to take a new date to was the go cart track.

This is true. Creating competition is an aphrodisiac also. Amusement arcades are good; you can compete against each other - you might have to let her win - have a few games for the price of a couple of coffees.

Coffee dates are always going to be a bit lame. Getting coffee is something she does every day with her colleagues, girlfriends, orbiters and gay besties. You're going to have to work too hard to set yourself apart from those people.

I would almost always do Three Bar Bounce on a first date. You can escalate quickly and moving around gives a sense of three dates in one. Just chose cheap bars and you don't have to spend more than 20, especially if she buys as well, which she should. Even if you only take a girl out once every two weeks, a coffee costs as mush as a beer these days, and to be perfectly honest, coffee won't make a girl horny

Other more practical tips:
-Always sit next to a girl, rather than opposite her like an interview.
-If you're nervous about touching a woman, you can get more comfortable by using games like palm reading.
-Give instructions rather than making requests. 'Come with me', and 'Lets go to my place' help you gain compliance and agreement without sounding like you're asking for permission from your mother.
-Learn to recognise when a woman is aroused, go for what you want and if you get rejected don't apologise for it. As is said above, you have to test different things out and reflect on each experience until your confidence builds.
-You will fail so don't get down about it; as soon as you start having a few big successes, your confidence will go through the roof. You're a good looking lad, so embrace that and believe in yourself.