Dating a Cluster B, a field report and a warning

[Jifto]

Wow, what a ride the last 3 months have been for me. I posted a thread last week about this when I was in a really bad place mentally and emotionally. I experienced what I am now is convinced is a Cluster B personality and the devastating effects that a relationship with a Cluster B can have on a man's psyche.

Had I not posted on this forum, and consequentially done a bunch of extra research, this relationship could have seriously, seriously impacted me. As it stands, I'm now just a little miffed at the time I wasted. I wanted to write this new thread to serve as a warning to anyone that may not know about Cluster Bs and some of the warning signs that I should have seen along the way.

Hopefully someone can get something from this!

Phase I: The Build Up
I met this girl through a friend and we hit it off. Things seemed amazing. She is beautiful, shares the same interests as me, and seemed to have a good job / her life in order.

Signs that I missed (or perhaps chose to ignore):

• She was dating a married man for two years before me. I initially thought that this was her being a victim of his lack of morals (she painted it this way), but I have since read that this is actually a pretty common trait of Cluster Bs.
• She told me how amazing I was, how special our relationship was, etc. in the first few dates. This is CLASSIC Cluster B behavior. They make you think that you are the white knight and will save them from their horrible past. I bought it. It really strokes the ego well.
• She didn't want to commit. Even after a few months of lots of dating, sex, and fun, she didn't want to be official. I didn't push hard for this, she just stated it. I attributed it to her trying to get over the guy from point 1, but now realize that, she quite frankly, wasn't as into me as she said.
• The sex was incredible. Ok, ok. This doesn't mean Cluster B obviously, but I've actually read a bunch of stories of guys that dealt with a Cluster B and this seems to be a consistent trait. Not one I hated, mind you

Phase II: The Push / Pull
This is the stage when the Cluster B flips between showing you a ton of over the top affection, and then can't stand you.

• Our first disagreement set of a chain reaction. We had a minor argument, nothing major, but I asserted a boundary and she didn't like it. She FLIPPED out and got super mad at me, in public. When I calmed her down, but I was still a bit upset, she didn't seem to care at all. She went back to normal. 100%.
• Her moods / view of me changed on a dime. One night, I was the best thing that ever happened to her. She couldn't wait to see me again. She'd plan trips and events far in the future. The next day, she wouldn't return a text, or I'd get one word responses. This started happening all the time. It was during one of these "pulls" when she didn't talk to me for two days without explanation, that I posted on the DJ forum and found out that she was likely a Cluster B. My eyes were opened.

Phase III: The Devaluation
The end of the relationship. Something happens in her mind that makes you be worthless. All those positive feelings? Gone. All those memories of good times? She probably doesn't remember them. You're done.

I didn't really experience this last phase (thank god!) but you can read more about it online. Basically, I realized her game before this could happen. Instead of going NC, I decided to just not let her game continue. I did this by suddenly letting her walk all over me. I know that this isn't the DJ way, but we have no mutual friends, the relationship is clearly over in my mind, and I viewed it as a sort of experiment. Had any of those two not been the case, I would have preferred keeping my dignity. So how did I do it? I was always available when she wanted me to be. I let her be rude and nasty over texts and answered them calmly and happily. I let her make plans with me, only to flake, then make them again, then flake again. She would do everything she could to try and make me angry and I just never let up my super nice guy vibe. This made it really hard for her to "paint me black" in her mind as the Cluster B literature discusses as part of the pull / devaluation that occurs. I think she's become bored with me, because I haven't heard from her in a while. The best possible outcome IMHO.

The Lessons:

• If it seems to good to be true at the beginning, well, it probably is.
• If you suspect a girl is Cluster B, do your homework and figure out if you can handle it. I think its totally possible to keep it a FWB situation, but if you have any expectations of a relationship you will be disappointed.
• Don't ride the waves! If a girl is over the moon for you and then is completely disinterested in you during the same day, let it go.

I was pretty pissed at her when this all started going down, but now I realize that I should feel bad for her. She clearly has a disease of the mind and it must be hell inside her head. I just hope that she doesn't hurt to many other guys in her life. While I realize this, I also do not have to be the one to 'fix her.' Its not my responsibility.

 

[stovepipe]

Plenty of good threads on these little demons. Brad wrote a very good one on toxic women.
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/threads/the-most-toxic-damaging-type-of-woman-of-them-all.239396/

I first felt sad for my ex at first, but know I only feel bad for anyone who falls victim to her bs. She is more than aware of what she is doing, yet wants to deny it while acting like a victim. I cant fell sorry for someone like that.

Only feel sorry for the ones who are aware of their toxic behavior and attempt to work hard on themselves to change.

Unfortunately I was probably one of the stupidest men on earth to have to stayed with her as long as I did. Either way, I can't undo the past, only learn from it.

If another BPD came in my life, I'd now know within mins. Might have some fun with her a few times, then delete all existence of her being.

Or, leave the sec I realize the honeymoon phase is over. But, one thing I would also do differently is to only spend 2-3 days a week with her, not every single fukn day like before.

 

[Twodogs]

Welcome to sosuave Op, and thanks for sharing your story.
I experienced the exact phases in a 3 month period as well.
She gave me a little hint when she told me she "had a fear of abandonment".
I googled that very phrase and ended up here. The lightbulb came on at the same time my jaw dropped and the guys here set me straight.
They can really do a number on you in even such a short time, I pity those that have endured years or had kids with one

Miss the sex though, no sane chick I've had has ever fvcked like that!
Still not worth the sh1t though IMO.

I'll give you the usual advice, get out and meet more women and be thankful you've learnt an important lesson while getting out relatively unscathed.

 

[SmooveMooves]

Just because a chick isn't that into you doesn't mean she has a personality disorder. Instead of citing pseudo psychology from Web MD & forums you should do some introspection.

You can't date a cluster b. Cluster b is not the name of a disorder. It's the name of 1 of 3 classifications of personality disorders. Cluster b incoporates antisocial, borderline, histrionic and narcissitic disorders. Approximately 1.5 pecent of the U.S population has such disorders. I don't expect this number to be any higher anywhere else. These people are rare, relatively speaking. Your description of the relationship does not sound like you were dealing with someone with a rare dehabilitating mental disorder, it sounds like you were a boring nice guy who was manipulated because you allowed it.


It's like that guy who reads a bunch of sociopath symptoms and decides that just because he expressed that one symptom that one time all of a sudden he's a sociopath.

 

[SgtSplacker]

I wonder if women are on their forums talking about cluster B dudes, or if it's just them complaining some dudes don't deal with their cluster B crap.

 

[stovepipe]

Just because a chick isn't that into you doesn't mean she has a personality disorder. Instead of citing pseudo psychology from Web MD & forums you should do some introspection.

You can't date a cluster b. Cluster b is not the name of a disorder. It's the name of 1 of 3 classifications of personality disorders. Cluster b incoporates antisocial, borderline, histrionic and narcissitic disorders. Approximately 1.5 pecent of the U.S population has such disorders. I don't expect this number to be any higher anywhere else. These people are rare, relatively speaking. Your description of the relationship does not sound like you were dealing with someone with a rare dehabilitating mental disorder, it sounds like you were a boring nice guy who was manipulated because you allowed it.


It's like that guy who reads a bunch of sociopath symptoms and decides that just because he expressed that one symptom that one time all of a sudden he's a sociopath.

To each their own. I disagree, her behavior seems that of someone with a PD. You can date Cluster B, they are all so similar it doesn't matter which one they are. We label them as such as non of us are qualified to make a diagnosis, but we all know Cluster B patterns well enough here.

Love bombing, devalue, discard. Amazing sex, being the white knight, mirroring his likes, inflating his ego, I can go on, but you get the idea. The love bombing usually lasts 3 months and that is when most see a huge change and wonder wtf is going on. Manipulation is one thing, but its everything else mentioned that points to a PD. While it may be rare, doesn't mean we won't come across a few in our lifetime. Heck, there are some that only seem to attract those kind.

 

[Plums]

I think that viewing a person as having a serious mental health problem because she doesn't connect with you is naive.
It can be difficult to have a relationship with someone who has mental health problems but most problems that occur during relationships are due to lack of experience and self control of the people involved.
Just because you find a woman sexually attractive, does not mean she is right for you.
There has to be more if you want a relationship. You have to give yourselves time to find out if you actually like each other. She may well have a form of BPD, but it is a very difficult condition to diagnose for a professional let alone a disappointed lover.
It sounds from what you say that she liked bits of you but not enough to make a good relationship. So her behaviour reflected the parts of you she really doesn't like. It seems like she was trying to test these parts to see if you would change. People do this when the penny drops that they have invested a lot of emotional energy in a person that they don't really like.
She was not honest with you because she didn't want to appear foolish in her mistake.
She is at least very emotionally immature. Probably because she has not taken time to know herself. She probably doesn't even like herself very much and no wonder when she treats people like this.
Her lack of self knowledge and rejection of you is not a reflection of you at all, but of her.
If you seriously want a good relationship then develop the friendship first. Let it go on for several months before you have intimacy. If you start a physical relationship too soon it adds all sorts of hidden emotional pressures on the relationship. Sex removes barriers that are not ready to be removed. Its a risky investment.
Ask yourself why sex with her was the best.

 

[SmooveMooves]

but it is a very difficult condition to diagnose for a professional let alone a disappointed lover.

This is my point. Licensed psychiatrists still often misdiagnose after thorough examinations yet we have people claiming women have rare personality disorders because she didn't talk to them.

 

[bigneil]

Subtitled: OP actually scored for once!!

UK Subtitle: She lost interest and he had no other women so he spent 2 hours typing this.

We label them as such ...

Because we struck out in historic fashion and our ego just can't accept the fact she lost interest. Ask me how I know.

If you were as hot as you think, other girls would be good in bed too. No, she figured out she was above you and dumped your sorry as-s, and instead of joining the gym, you created another f*cking account here.

That does, it, I'm going to consider writing software to detect SS members with multiple accounts and become a SS-impostor serial killer. Anyone who creates another account here for any reason is f*cking totally deceptive. To those who have done this: THAT is why you are single.

 

[cityboy989]

This is my point. Licensed psychiatrists still often misdiagnose after thorough examinations yet we have people claiming women have rare personality disorders because she didn't talk to them.

Its more than just that. I think you may be taking offense because you're a woman and you feel that these guys believe that they have "figured out" particular women. If women have these certain traits and attachment styles, it's indicative. If they match merely one symptom of these disorders, they probably don't have the disorder. But if their symptoms match multiple symptoms of a disorder, chances are they have that disorder.

 

[SmooveMooves]

Yes. We will have to agree to disagree but I will rebutt.

To each their own. I disagree, her behavior seems that of someone with a PD.

Says who? How are you qualified to make such an assessment? You've read symptoms online? To me it sounds like she wasn't as interested as OP suspected.

You can date Cluster B, they are all so similar it doesn't matter which one they are.

No. No you can't. That's like saying you can "date a type II." Its a classification. If it didn't matter there wouldn't be specific names based on specific symptoms. Histrionic and antisocial disorder are similar in how much they vary from the other clusters, hence the cluster organizational structure.

We label them as such as non of us are qualified to make a diagnosis,

Exactly my point. It takes 8 years to become a licensed psychiatrist and even they often get the diagnosis of cluster b disorders wrong.

but we all know Cluster B patterns well enough here.

How? From WebMD? From mygfwascrazy.com? A lot of pseudoscience going around.

Love bombing, devalue, discard. Amazing sex, being the white knight, mirroring his likes, inflating his ego

Have you ever considered that these behaviors may be attributed to something else like.... his own behavior. When most relationships are fresh there is a period of "love bombing" and "amazing sex" before it was called the honeymoon phase, now its signs of a serious mental disorder.

I can go on, but you get the idea. The love bombing usually lasts 3 months and that is when most see a huge change and wonder wtf is going on.

Wow, what a coincidence that the honeymoon phase typically lasts 3-6 months up to a year.

Manipulation is one thing, but its everything else mentioned that points to a PD. While it may be rare, doesn't mean we won't come across a few in our lifetime. Heck, there are some that only seem to attract those kind.

I understand this. However, as I mentioned before, this to me sounds like a chick who wanted to get her rocks off and wasn't interested in OP as he expected. After the excitement dies down, how compatible both are on the sexual market starts to become a factor.

 

[bigneil]

• She was dating a married man for two years before me. She wasn't that attracted to me.
• She told me how amazing I was, . She wasn't that attracted to me.
• She didn't want to commit. She wasn't that attracted to me.
• The sex was incredible. She wasn't that attracted to me.

Phase II: The Push / Pull
This is the stage when the Cluster B flips between showing you a ton of over the top affection, and then can't stand you.

• Our first disagreement set of a chain reaction. She wasn't that attracted to me.
• Her moods / view of me changed on a dime. She wasn't that attracted to me.

Phase III: The Devaluation
The end of the relationship. She wasn't that attracted to me.

I didn't really experience this last phase (thank god!) but you can read more about it online. She wasn't that attracted to me.

The Lessons:

• She wasn't that attracted to me.
• If you suspect a girl is Cluster B, do your homework and figure out there is a f*cking 98.5 percent chance you are blowing smoke up your own butt.
• She wasn't that attracted to me.

I was pretty pissed at her when this all started going down, but now I realize She wasn't that attracted to me.' Its not my responsibility.

Confessions of a multi-account S-She-male with no career ambition:

Its not my responsibility.

Its not my responsibility.

Its not my responsibility.

Its not my responsibility.

Its not my responsibility.

Its not my responsibility.

Its not my responsibility.

Its not my responsibility.

No, it was YOUR responsibility she wasn't that attracted to you. You should have been dieting and working out but you were lazy and she found a hotter guy.

(Expect OP to now reveal it's the same poster with their strong anti-bigneil reaction).

 

[SmooveMooves]

Its more than just that. I think you may be taking offense because you're a woman and you feel that these guys believe that they have "figured out" particular women.

Nah, I'm a dude. Chick in my bio is Dani Mathers the playboy model. Im disargeeing because more often then not it was just a incompatibility or disinterest, rather then a personality disorder.

If they match merely one symptom of these disorders, they probably don't have the disorder. But if their symptoms match multiple symptoms of a disorder, chances are they have that disorder.

I fit mutliple symptoms of a sociopath. That does not make me one. Humans show traits of every disorder. Just because you know someone who is self absorbed does not mean all of a sudden they are a narcissist.

We should refrain from armchair WebMD diagnosis, as it makes everyone who had a failed relationship assume it was due to some personality disorder.

 

[bigneil]

FACT: There is a 98.5% chance your girl was NOT BPD.

But here on SS, 98.5% of men dumped say their girl was BPD (and most are the same man).

 

[stovepipe]

No. No you can't. That's like saying you can "date a type II." Its a classification. If it didn't matter there wouldn't be specific names based on specific symptoms. Histrionic and antisocial disorder are similar in how much they vary from the other clusters, hence the cluster organizational structure.

No different than saying I drive a Honda. They are all Japanese cars, just vary in size and options, but its still a Japanese car. All 3 labels of Cluster B are very similar, but have the same affects on their victims. Love bombing, devalue, discard.

 

[bigneil]

No different than saying I drive a Honda. They are all Japanese cars, just vary in size and options, but its still a Japanese car. All 3 labels of Cluster B are very similar, but have the same affects on their victims. Love bombing, devalue, discard.

stovepipe created 10 SoSuave accounts this month in order to convince SS that his girlfriend was crazy.

 

[AlexKaiser]

What is a Cluster B, what is Spinning Plates and what is SMV/RMV? I hear these terms but haven't caught on yet (or skimmed too hard.)

 

[Jifto]

Confessions of a multi-account S-She-male with no career ambition:



No, it was YOUR responsibility she wasn't that attracted to you. You should have been dieting and working out but you were lazy and she found a hotter guy.

(Expect OP to now reveal it's the same poster with their strong anti-bigneil reaction).

You're right. I played this one wrong and I wanted an easy answer / someone to blame. In reality, I need to improve on my shortcomings. I have many. Thanks for the reality check.

 

[btownbuck2012]

You're right. I played this one wrong and I wanted an easy answer / someone to blame. In reality, I need to improve on my shortcomings. I have many. Thanks for the reality check.

Don't thank this clown. There are things this woman did in the 3 months that you knew here that clearly indicate something is wrong with her. She may or may not be a true cluster b, but even women exhibiting a few symptoms can be extremely damaging - subclinical is the term.

 

[Billtx49]

Ditto, the gut check has Extreme importance with damaged women as discussed in the thread. If you don't rely on your gut and eject early, there's a high chance you will get emotional damage yourself, just from being involved with her if you stay too long.