Why Illinois is Broke

[Bible_Belt]

https://www.illinoispolicy.org/madigans-middle-class-pain-for-the-many-perks-for-the-few/

The above link is a political piece written by a think tank, which is not an unbiased news source. However, the authors still make a lot of good points.

Illinois is going into its 10th month without a budget. Education is feeling it the worst, from elementary school to university. Public schools in rural areas typically get the majority of their funding from the state. All of that has been cut off. Teachers have to buy all of their own supplies, even down to paper to write on. The junior college near me just fired all of their best professors to save money. The university is next. They're saying 180 jobs will be cut, a lot of classes will no longer be offered, and the library can't afford to stay open on weekends.

My state is starting to feel like Greece, or some other weak economy crashing down under the weight of all its entitlement and pension obligations.

 

[speed dawg]

https://www.illinoispolicy.org/madigans-middle-class-pain-for-the-many-perks-for-the-few/

The above link is a political piece written by a think tank, which is not an unbiased news source. However, the authors still make a lot of good points.

Illinois is going into its 10th month without a budget. Education is feeling it the worst, from elementary school to university. Public schools in rural areas typically get the majority of their funding from the state. All of that has been cut off. Teachers have to buy all of their own supplies, even down to paper to write on. The junior college near me just fired all of their best professors to save money. The university is next. They're saying 180 jobs will be cut, a lot of classes will no longer be offered, and the library can't afford to stay open on weekends.

My state is starting to feel like Greece, or some other weak economy crashing down under the weight of all its entitlement and pension obligations.

Illinois, California, New York. All the other states will follow that same path unless they get rid of the liberal leeches. See Texas and Florida as a model for what SHOULD happen.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Illinois elected a Republican governor, and he is a piece of sh!t everyone now hates. The government worker unions are breaking the state, but they have political power, so he has declared war on private sector unions, the guys who actually work for a living, like electricians, pipe-fitters, and construction workers. Those are the last good jobs left for working poor people, and he is on the warpath to turn them into minimum-wage positions.

There's no money for schools, but we have boondoggle, pork barrel construction projects going on everywhere. The construction companies paid their political contributions to get those state contracts, so they get their contracts whether we need them or not. It's not like any state politician is going to refuse their money.

 

[yuppee]

so why are you still THERE, hmm? you are funding the leech unions and politicians.

 

[Tictac]

I think that private sector unions are a good thing. But from the time JFK permitted public unions until now, the have all but assured that most governments and government agencies will remain insolvent. There were no economic actors on either side of the table for public union negotiations as work lives shortened (cops and firemen need to get out after 20 years. But toll collectors, desk jockeys....?)

Both current and post-retirement benefits are completely out of control and have been for a long time. There is no way all that can be paid if governments are to actually provide services with the budgets they have.

 

[phillies]

Illinois, California, New York. All the other states will follow that same path unless they get rid of the liberal leeches. See Texas and Florida as a model for what SHOULD happen.

But florida had zero unions which isn't right. Unions other then labor unions are a good thing to an extent.

Big corporations will take advantage of people if they can get away with it. But that doesn't mean they always Will.

Unions can get to powerful also. What's needed is balance.

Also. Hasn't Illinois been run by liberals for decades? Especially Chicago? That could be the main reason they're so fvcked.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Tomorrow, Illinois will be the first state to achieve junk-bond status.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-illinois-may-be-the-most-messed-up-state-in-the-u-s/
Why Illinois may be the most messed up state in the U.S.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

Illinois elected a Republican governor, and he is a piece of sh!t everyone now hates.

People are generally short sighted morons who in believe in free shyte. Politicians promise WAY MORE than is possible. Then some guy says we need to cut spending, and everybody hates him, and blames him for the problem.

Nobody cares if somebody a couple of generations later has to pay. But they scream bloody murder when THEY have to suffer.

That's like blaming the accountant when a company goes bankrupt.

This same process plays out in every society that has collapsed since the dawn of the agricultural revolution.

Politicians promise more than can deliver in exchange for political power. Then when people are finally forced to wake up and realize it was a con all along, they blame whoever happens to be in charge.

Whenever 10-20 years max, all of western society is going to be like Illinois or Venezuela.

It's all based on the same musical chairs premise.

Promise free shyte until it's no longer possible.

When the music ends, the music ends.

If somebody doesn't see this coming, and doesn't get ready, well.

If you're argument is that the government lied and it's not your fault, well, that's what happens when you believe in promises that are economically impossible.

Socialism is great in theory, but eventually you run out of other peoples money.

That's what's happening in Illinois, and that's what's going to happen to ALL "democracies."

Because after all, what IS a democracy?

It's an advanced auction of stolen goods.

You can believe in political fairy tales all you want, but the laws of the jungle is always in effect.

If you don't kill, you don't eat.

When the majority of people in a society consume more than they produce, then GAME OVER is coming.

 

[Bible_Belt]

hoo-ray, we finally have a budget, making us the highest-taxed state in the country, when all taxes are combined. The new budget does not address hundreds of millions in unfunded pension liabilities and other unpaid bills of the state. It also counts "closing corporate loopholes" as a large part of the revenue expected, which makes the assumption that those corps would not just find another loophole, or leave the state altogether. The new budget is another house of cards.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

we finally have a budget, making us the highest-taxed state in the country,

It sucks to finally have to pay for all those allegedly free lunches...

Don't you just wish other people would just keep giving you their money like they are supposed to?

 

[Bible_Belt]

The bulk of the problem is in pension liabilities. Big promises were made to teachers, prison guards, and cops, who are all very politically connected as groups. But now the money isn't there. A state cop in IL works 20 years and retires at something like 80% pay. We're promising 40 and 50 y/os $80k a year for life, plus health care. The people who have worked for a living are a much bigger welfare drain on the state than the people who haven't.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

The people who have worked for a living are a much bigger welfare drain on the state than the people who haven't.

It doesn't matter WHO is "more" of a drain.

Free lunches need to be paid for eventually.

The STRUCTURE of U.S. "Democracy" is promise free shyte to get votes.

The TOTAL amount "promised" is over 100 TRILLION. This with an average tax receipt of 4 Trillion a year.

NO WAY this problem goes away. People who were promised free shyte (and believed it) are going to get screwed.

(And now folks are floating the idea of universal income for the millions who will be laid of due to robots....)

 

[Bible_Belt]

And now folks are floating the idea of universal income for the millions who will be laid of due to robots....

And that's good. Universal income is the only thing that will keep society from falling apart after no one has a job.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

And that's good. Universal income is the only thing that will keep society from falling apart after no one has a job.

So you think it's a problem to promise people free money for retirement but not free money to people in generally.

Where, exactly, will all this money come from?

Less workers (more robots) means less to collect in taxes.

And at the same time, you want more money coming out of the government?

How is this mathematically possible?

 

[Bible_Belt]

Hell, we ought to tax the robots. I would be fine with that.

A government that provides for the basic needs of its people does not have to be "unsustainable free stuff." The alternative is billionaires in their fortress castles and the rest of us governed by the local war lord.

Leave it to Finland to lead the way: http://money.cnn.com/2017/01/02/news/economy/finland-universal-basic-income/index.html

Notice that they don't take away the money if the person still works, too, which is far too progressive for US minds. We like to believe that anyone on welfare is lazy, while at the same time creating a system who punishes anyone who does work. I have friends in public housing and on food stamps. If they get a job, their benefits get reduced practically dollar for dollar. It's like having a 100% income tax. They're not lazy for not working; they're smart.

 

[Bible_Belt]

There will be an entire robotic, cybernetic, and biotech revolution which will create enormous wealth and jobs.

It will create jobs for the robots and more wealth for the billionaires. That's the revolution.

 

[Von]

The problem in tech evolution.... it's that alot of states or regions never prepared itself for a change or evolution...

Look at the car industry... in Ohio and Ontario.... all the plants are gone... the economy crashed... and poverty zone were created where you had alot of blue collar, full-pension, unionized, 100k salaries.... Chicago was also hit... Illinois is still really agricultural.. thus depending on State support

Even among professionnal jobs (lawyer and finance especially), we are facing challenges from the evolution and robotization.

The economy shifted and an entire region was laid to waste.... it's common through history.

Heck, even the ''America great again'' is all about the evolution of the economy.... USA is going down? Nah, the competition just got stronger and they came from further,... further where they could invest in the brand new super advanced USA made technology (China Steel factories were build by American engineer).... while the old dog (USA) has to spend 3 times more to modernize.

In World War 1 and World War 2.... the German had only to new the newest and latest.... while the British Army had to renew all its stock ...

Always cheaper to buy new than recycle,...

Illinois will be the futur in 20 years... so hold on until than

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

When we peel a layer from that onion, underneath we find all the new engineering jobs, software jobs and biomechanic jobs revealed that are needed to support the new field of robotics. Additionally there will be higher demand for metals and more mining required.

Lastly, the increased supply of goods and competition for customers (us) to buy the products will drastically lower the prices of those goods.

Any kind of disruptive technological advance WILL eventually create more (different) jobs and lower prices, which IN THEORY makes it better for everybody.

The sticking point is people would rather get a free "basic income" than go through the trouble of learning new skills.

AND governments make it harder for workers to learn new skills when they have minimum wage laws and american workers expect fat benefits to go along with ANY job.

Americans have been conditioned to think in terms of "be trained" which implies SOMEBODY ELSE is doing (and paying for) the training, instead of actively LEARNING new skills so they can survive in the new economy.

The "idea" was "invented" back in the 60's (or maybe 70's) that the PURPOSE of businesses is to "Provide" jobs to people. As if people just need to sit around and wait for these businesses (who allegedly have all this hidden money stacked up in some secret place) to "provide" the jobs and "provide" the training.

The American Worker has been "conditioned" to expect to just show up, be told what to do, and get BIG FAT paychecks and benefits as a result.

The PROACTIVE mindset that would make new technology beneficial for everybody has been brainwashed out of the average citizen.

Think of the average student graduating high school and college today. How many of those would be capable of working any kind of STEM "support" job for the coming robotics revolution?

 

[Bible_Belt]

Any kind of disruptive technological advance WILL eventually create more (different) jobs and lower prices, which IN THEORY makes it better for everybody.?

If that were true, there would be more jobs every year, and not less. The work force shrinks every year, and the number of unfilled positions does not nearly account for all of the job losses. Technology and automation destroy many more jobs than they create. There is no way you can argue otherwise. The billionaire corporate overlords are the ones taking the jobs away for the sake of their own profits, not lazy people wanting handouts; they are not the ones making the rules and running things.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

If that were true, there would be more jobs every year, and not less. The work force shrinks every year, and the number of unfilled positions does not nearly account for all of the job losses. Technology and automation destroy many more jobs than they create. There is no way you can argue otherwise.

Maybe you should read my whole post before replying. That only happens (more jobs being created with more technology) WITHOUT government interventions.

People want MORE MONEY so they petition the government to RAISE the minimum wage. Corporations RESPOND by building robots that are CHEAPER than workers.

The cost of labor is ARTIFICIALLY HIGH.

The reason NAFTA happened in the first place was U.S. workers (unions, benefits, wage laws) were TOO EXPENSIVE.

But this is all moot anyway, more robots will come, more people will be displaced, more people will be UTTERLY DEPENDENT on the government for their LIVES.

The billionaire corporate overlords are the ones that RUN THE GOVERNMENT.

Any argument in favor of MORE government power and laws is also for MORE CORPORATE POWER.