Screwed up the lay

[tihash]

Met a girl on a cold bookstore approach. It wasn't fireworks from the get go, but wasn't awkward either. She is a college senior, I am 33. She doesn't know my age. Between her being out of town for Easter and and being busy with this and that, it took a while for our first date. We live about 45 min apart, and meet halfway at a bar. First date ends with us doing oral on each other in the bar parking lot.

After about a week since date #1, she finally agreed to come to my place tonight, but it was a disaster. She left 45 min late, and it took her longer than she thought. She was in a bad mood when she arrived. We arranged to watch a movie, and in retrospect I think I was stupid to put the movie on. The TV was on when she arrived and I think in retrospect I should have tried to make out with her within 10 minutes given what happened on our first date. I put my arm around her about 30 min in and she didn't seem receptive. 45 min in I kissed her but she didn't kiss back all that much. I should have plowed through but was stupid and did not. 10 min before the movie ended she was saying how "tired" she was. When the movie ended I tried a make out and got her to kiss with tongue but she stopped and said how she had to go. She left with no action. I am so mad at myself. I don't get how a girl can give you head on the first date and be sorta cold on the second date. I really think it was b/c she had a long drive.

I guess I was stupid to not make the ho say no from early on, but I could feel she was sorta distant.

After date #1, I would have told you it was a sure thing if I ever got her alone in my house. Boy was I wrong. PS-- my house is nice, clean, doesn't smell, etc. She was grumpy on the phone on the way over and seemed annoyed to have to drive over even though I had earlier offered to come over her way.

How do you guys handle these things? I feel like I should be learning a lesson from this...

 

[samspade]

The lesson you learn is that a lay is never a sure thing - even if she blows you on the first date.

You say she "finally agreed" to come to your place. To you, it seems like a natural progression: 1st date suck off, ergo second date crazy sex. Think about it from her perspective for a second. She knew you were champing at the bit after a pretty crazy first date. Nevertheless I think you pushed the envelope too fast; by inviting her over to your place you showed how eager you were to hit it. You're a 33 year old guy, and she deals with desperate 22-year old man-boys in college all the time. A little patience on your part would have turned her on far more than you realize.

I know it doesn't seem fair, that a girl could be slutty enough to do what she did and then not seal the deal. When you're dating younger women, you have to act like you've been there before (which I'm sure you have). Don't worry so much about the outcome. Teenagers and frat boys are preoccupied with getting laid. I think you should have taken her out again, capitalized on your previous success, and then, if you two were feeling it, taken her back to your place. Remember, women who behave like sluts still don't want to be thought of that way (until you're actually nailing them).

 

[Falcon25]

1st date and encounter has nothing to do with the next encounter. This has happened to many of us.

 

[jophil28]

After about a week since date #1, she finally agreed to come to my place tonight, but it was a disaster. She left 45 min late, and it took her longer than she thought. She was in a bad mood when she arrived. We arranged to watch a movie, and in retrospect I think I was stupid to put the movie on...

My guess is that sometime after the first date she developed a case of "Buyer's Remorse".
Certainly, from your account above, she is showed some common signs of lowered interest, regret , considerable reluctance to meet up again, and a distain for further sexual involvement.

Why did she do a 180 ?
Who knows what other unknown factors are at work here..She may have an on again/off again B/f .She might be on the rebound ...

Her lateness in leaving her place to meet you was a sign of her reluctance (or at the least,ambivalence) to make the trip to see you.
Your need to pursuade her to meet you at all was another sign. In fact it was a red flashing light.
Her grumpy mood is a sure giveaway too. Women who are eager to see you act excitedly and are on their sunniest behavior.
Women who dig you also welcome your physical advances (or initiate some of their own )

My final thought is that her behavior in the carpark is what I call "Ship cruise " behavior. When women are away from home and unlikely to be scrutinized by familiar friends or neighbors, they frequently behave in unrestrained and even damn slvtty ways.

TIHASH, I can't see where you made any tactic errors - write this encounter off to experience and cross her off your card list at Christmas.

 

[boomerick]

As soon as she showed signs of being grumpy or being annoyed at the drive I would have just told her that the date was no big deal and I would have suggested that she turn around and I'll just call her later.

Generally this type of stupid reverse Psycology crap works and she will all of the sudden feel de-valued / rejected which in turn drives her to all of the sudden re-value the date and her time with you. Instant attitude turn around.

Basic power of indifference.

If she takes you up on the cancel suggestion and flakes no big deal she probably saved you from her future mental madness.

Win Win.

 

[logic1]

I think it was the atmosphere.

The first meeting was in a vibrant place. All her senses were being stimulated, probably some alcohol involved. Most likely lots of talking. People moving around and maybe some music playing. She was excited just as you were.

2nd date....... a dull atmosphere. Think about it. most likely the same as sitting in a movie theater. blah...... boring ..... IE non stimulating. AShe was bored and knew she would be bored when she arrived. She is a college student.....................action, adventure.

You would have been able to bang her if you took her on a night time action date. Maybe a small snack followed by a dance club and some adult beverages within reason. Throw in some socializing with possible friends... And, by the end of the night you would have been tapping her...... All from making her feel alive.

Im old and could hardly muster sitting on the couch watching a movie with a new fling.

 

[tihash]

Thanks for all of the insight so far. I will just add a few things that I didn't put in my original post that may be relevant...

It was sorta hard getting the first date from her. She rescheduled last minute, etc. We were in a very hip bar on the first date, it was loud, a club-like atmosphere. When I took her after date #1 to the parking lot and walked her to her car, I kissed her and she kissed back and I suggested we go to my place and she said it was too late to drive that far. I think it if was 5 min away she would have. That is why I wanted to get her at my place on date #2. And that's why I had to do what I could with her in the car on the parking lot that time.

And she graduates this May and then moves away in late July to another state for grad school.

You know how you can meet a girl on a cold approach, everything goes well, you have her laughing, you get the number, you set up a date, and then POOF she flakes last minute and you just scratch your head? I've had that happen a few times. Well, I'm thinking this may be the sexual version of that phenomenon. Maybe there just is no explanation other than it could have been anything and girls will be girls. But I do think next time I am in a situation like this I will be more aggressive (if we had oral or had sex previously) and do it earlier to either force the sexual encounter or to not waste my time.

And for the heck of it I'm going to keep texting this one and see if I can get her to meet up for drinks again maybe this weekend... but at a bar close to where SHE lives.

 

[SoldMySoul]

Tihash, I had a chance to read over your approach journal and found it to be quite entertaining, but it seems you spend A LOT of time and the bookstore man. I am not hating on for it, but some folks may think you work there as much time as you are in there.

Anyways, keep on rolling with what you are doing because it seems to be overall working for you. You get my respect... You are out there doing!!!

 

[Greasy Pig]

I've been a casualty of 'buyer's remorse' more times than I can remember. Saturday night I'm in a nightclub sleazing onto some hottie but by Monday she has gone from 'you are sooooo sexy' to 'I'm busy EVERY night this week'. Weird.
Don't waste time trying to decipher women's mood and attitude swings, if she was really keen it would be easy to schedule another meeting. She would not only declare herself unavailable but also suggest an alternative that might suit the both of you. If it's just a flat refusal, just walk away.

 

[Colossus]

The lesson you learn is that a lay is never a sure thing - even if she blows you on the first date.

Yup. Don't over-analyze it.

Your first date she was obviously feeling it and this date she wasn't...could be a variety of reasons. The long drive, her mood, she had some time to think about what a slvt she was being, etc.

If there is a lesson to learn, it's that if you sense she isn't feeling it, don't push the envelope. Remember escalation is all about keeping the momentum with her feelings and the overall vibe. I know that sounds esoteric but your house-date was kind of a bad setup from the beginning. I've been there.

I always try to remember that women--no matter what their initial interest--can flake at the last minute for any reason, not necessarily because you ran bad game. Usually it's because they have time to think about what's happening and don't feel comfortable.

 

[scorpio1138]

If you knew she was in a foul mood on the way over, I might suggest you work on something to talk with her when she got there to change her mood.

If you could get her to laugh and get her out of that bad mood it could have turned out different.

I had this happen to me a few weeks ago. It caught me off guard and I didn't get her to laugh or change her mood, so no action that night.

 

[tihash]

Update

So we texted a couple of times today. Then out of the blue she texts me: "BTW, how old are you?"

I lied and said, "30. You?"

She says are you for real, OMG I'm only 22, blah blah.

I'm guessing that was on her mind, too. She did seem surprised I owned my own house. Most girls who come over for the first time are like, "Oh, you have nice house" etc. She made no such comment. Maybe she is used to 22 y.o guys with a futon and college-type decor.

A few weeks ago I got a same-day lay from a 21 y/o. At the bar she asked me how old I was. I told the truth. She still slept with me later that night. So everyone is different.

 

[Drum&Bass]

The reason seems obvious to me why you failed..Yea she gave you head the first time you met..thats cause she probably liked you for whatever reason..

She was in a bad mood because she knew as all girls know that when a girl has sex on the first date it sets the stage for the way things will be. (not that always holds true but you played right into the stereo type thus making you worthless in her eyes, because guys like you are a dime a dozen.

She probably wanted you to treat her more like a person and make her feel good, but you didnt even think to see her as a human being and so it hurt/insulted her and she left.

No matter how slutty a girl acts, always remember that she is a person. Treat her like a human being and you will be able to enjoy ANY women ANY time you want.

its kind of funny...but reading your posts makes you look like a creep..work on being a genuinely cool guy that people enjoy being around. DO NOT work on stupid tricks to get what you want in the moment (unless of course they yield a high succes rate).

 

[tihash]

Hmmm.. not sure why it is creepy to meet girls on cold approaches, date them, and try to f them. I also think it is sorta normal to invite someone over to your place to watch a movie or for dinner on a second or third date.

 

[quicklearner]

Agree with above posters.

___

Tihash,

Your on the right path.

As other have suggested and having been in your shoes before, if a girl ever demonstrated disinterest irrespective of the setting (i.e. bar, my apartment, on date, party) or anytime during the relationship (days/months/weeks), it was an automatic NEXT for me.

Genuinely interested women (the one’s that you have long/enjoyable brief/long relationships with) go out of their way to please you and keep you happy.

There are no exceptions to INTERESTED WOMEN. They either are or aren't.

Don’t dispense too much effort on this girl. Keep approaching and move on.

 

[Falcon25]

Hmmm.. not sure why it is creepy to meet girls on cold approaches, date them, and try to f them. I also think it is sorta normal to invite someone over to your place to watch a movie or for dinner on a second or third date.

Not really. You should, at your age, do this at about the sixth or seventh date. The less you act like you want it, the less she knows about you, the more sex you will get. You are over thirty, your attraction to her is patience and experience. You can NEVER go too slow with a woman. If she likes, she will fuvk you, even if she is dating someone else.

 

[quicklearner]

__
Tihash,

A few more suggestions.

As many who posted have learned, early action is not a guarantee of future sexual escapades.

As you will learn with women, distinguishing between “disinterest” and “interest-with resistance to sex” is an art and comes with experience.

Women in general operate at much slower pace with regards to sexual advancements.

However, it is always advisable to err on side of caution. If can’t figure out a womens interest level, then SHE HAS NO INTEREST.

Move on.

 

[tihash]

Wow. I'm not being argumentative, but I am sorta shocked that some of you are not inviting a girl to your home for 6 or 7 dates. I didn't think that was "standard operating procedure." I was always of the mind that after a connection was established (whether that was after one date or two) then it was time to have a comfy night on the couch in a private setting that is conducive to making out or more. If a girl isn't into me after a date or two then I move on.

 

[DMSR76]

Don't worry, tihash. I don't think inviting a chick over is unreasonable at all. Especially if the intention is only to nail. Why wine and dine someone who can only rise to the level FB at best? In fact, why wine and dine ANYONE for 6 or 7 dates before sealing the deal if that's what you want?

If anything, her agreeing to hang at your place can give you a better indication of her IL and whether or not she simply views you as a meal ticket. Nothing wrong with inviting a chick over for dinner in or whatnot.

 

[jophil28]

Reluctance is it's own message.

__
Tihash,

However, it is always advisable to err on side of caution. If you can’t figure out a womens interest level, then SHE HAS NO INTEREST.

Move on.

Good advice ^^.

When the OP asked her to come over to his place she balked. He had to plead, pursuade and convince her to do so - he missed (or ignored ) the message that she was sending in her reluctance ( LOW interest )

Then she was 45 minutes late leaving her place ( she was emotionally and physically DELAYING coming over at all - shows LOW interest .)

She was in a grumpy mood ( LOW INTEREST again- high IL women are all sunny and smiles )

She resisted his sexual advances at his place ( the ultimate display of LOW interest )

TiHash, there is nothing wrong with asking a girl over to your place on the second date PROVIDED you ask a girl who is keen to participate - your woman was not.

I would have changed tactics as soon as I felt any resistance to the "DVD at my place" invite. Women who do this are sending this message ," I do not want to be alone with you in your house. "
They have either changed their mind about you, or their buying temp has dropped some.

SOP for me says to take them out on a public date once or twice and raise their IL and rapport before you go for the couch again..