Why Pua's will always fail

[Oxide]

It had been a long time since I read the game, or even read any pickup advice, but from every experience I've had with "Pick up artists" and DJ's, these conclusions were drawn.


You are a good guy who is just shy >>> Game >>> Turn into a cool sociable good guy.

You are already cool guy >>> Game >>> You are better

You are an insecure, wretched fvck >>> Game >>> You are still the same insecure, messed up guy with now ANOTHER layer on top of him.

To be honest, although I've known a few very cool guys who were in the community, most of the people I've encountered were DOUCHEBAGS. It wasn't about their skills or abilities to get women, they just sucked as PEOPLE.

And the funny thing, there are many of you just like that you are reading this post right now, but you will not realize or admit it because that will force you to look deep inside and ask yourself. "Am i a miserable fvck that needs to sort things out?"


This whole post got inspired by this quote:

"In the process of dehumanizing the opposite sex, I had also been dehumanizing myself." - Neil Strauss

This is very very true. There was a brief period of time where I was just playing the game with these girls. It got considerably easier to deal with them, but it was FAKE. Go down this path for too long, and you will end up in the ocean of misery - not knowing how to do the most important thing humans need to do - socialize and develop real emotional connections.

We've been hammering about "Becoming the Man!" for a long time on this forum. Those of you who are still caught up in the illusions of becoming the next "pink boa - purple cowboy hat - mascara wearing - script giving machine" need to look deeper inside and figure out WHY and find the answers.

 

[PigAdlemPimp]

This is the best thread I have read on here for a long time, keep up the good work, sarge on.

 

[Taviii]

Oxide I think you got it wrong mate, this site is about self-improving, becoming a better man, pushing people to overcome their fears (thats what DJ means), not about some techniques to hide your fear and trick some girls to fück you.

First understand why you are here, then decide if you want to be a Don Juan or a pua.

Cheers!

 

[CrunchyNut]

Oxide I think you got it wrong mate, this site is about self-improving, becoming a better man, pushing people to overcome their fears (thats what DJ means), not about some techniques to hide your fear and trick some girls to fück you.

First understand why you are here, then decide if you want to be a Don Juan or a pua.

Cheers!

I agree; Im not sure that Oxide was targeting solely this site, as opposed to the general PUA community. I for one wish to improve myself. I have a series of goals set for this year in order to improve my confidence, health and academia, and aim to stick to them. Yes, among other things I do hope that this will lead to greater success with women, but I wouldnt call myself a PUA, and I believe that the same goes for others on this site as well.

If you are on here simply to learn lines and how to pick up girls quickly and easily, then I agree-you will end up being miserable. If it is a function with which you are aiming to improve your entire life, then well done!

 

[Oxide]

Does this site say "Pick Up Artists" at the top?

Then what makes you think I am talking about the way this site operates? I would say only a marginal portion of this site is involved into the Pua mindset... and thank god for that.

 

[CrunchyNut]

Im not. Im saying that you are NOT targeting the way that this site operates. Im saying that you are targeting PUAs and not Don Juans.

Yay, 50th post!

 

[Taviii]

Does this site say "Pick Up Artists" at the top?

Then what makes you think I am talking about the way this site operates?

...this:

We've been hammering about "Becoming the Man!" for a long time on this forum. Those of you who are still caught up in the illusions of becoming the next "pink boa - purple cowboy hat - mascara wearing - script giving machine" need to look deeper inside and figure out WHY and find the answers.

Anyways I think you got my point from the first post.

Cheers!

 

[MindOverMatter]

The way I see it, if you're gonna memorize so many scripts, routines, and sets just to pick up girls, you may as well just become a quarterback. you'll get more ass and make way better money.

I've worked in comission based sales for several different companies, and each one of the companies had a different book of selling beheaviours you needed to learn in order to be amongst their "top salesmen". Each company had a different set of ways on how to open conversation with a client, how to establish rapport, how to develop trust, how to close, etc. And in every company, the best salespeople never went by the book. The reason is, all these guys have been in the business way before companies started doing this type of market research and coming up with these selling behaviours. They learned through trial and failure their OWN behaviours, and what worked for them.

What people have to realize is that some successful pick up artists, DJs, and macks are who they are not because of the material they teach, but because of the life experiances that got them there. You can't use someone else's blueprint for success because you two will have completly different lives and various X factors will not be in common. Instead, go back to square one, and do your own thing. Learn through trial and failure and forget blueprints for life.

 

[Oxide]

I agree with Mind, and I want you guys to focus on this:

You are an insecure, wretched fvck >>> Game >>> You are still the same insecure, messed up guy with now ANOTHER layer on top of him.

This will ALWAYS happen when you look to the false idols instead of looking inside yourself and listening to your gut.


You know what is the most amazing thing? Deep inside you already know everything you must do. Your gut, whether you believe it or not, is the best teacher you have - it tells you exactly what's going on. So, listen to yourself more often. Ask yourself "Do I like her?" Look at her carefully and say "What do I see without the pink goggles?" Listen and see if you hear "I WANNA TALK TO HER RIGHT NOW!" Don't suppress the voice of reason.

 

[da_hunter]

Since I started gaming, in the past year I met a few people from my local lair(s). I met a few cool people, the great majority of people were nondescript/didnt register with me. There were a couple of situations where they acted like total douchebags, and made me not want to continue hanging out with people from the lair:

1. We were out with a couple of lair guys. I buy drinks for our table. On the way out, one guy shakes my buddy's hand - then looks at me like I am scum or something (for what reason, I have no idea, this guy is just a f0ck) and quite obviously decides not to shake my hand, then they walk out.

2. Big meeting of lair guys at a local club. I am in the middle of a 2 set. Some douche from the lair *I had never talked to* breaks in, hugs me, and basically pretends like we are best friends from way back when. I was like 'um girls, this is um ... my friend ... um' because I didn't even know the guy's name. When the girls bail, of course, since he ruined the set, the dude lectures me on how to smoothly introduce him even if I don't know his name. How about getting to know me and at least introduce yourself to me before trying to break into my set, assh0le?

 

[Babnik]

Thats so true. Until I changed my ways with people, I could not get girls.

I actually wrote a list of things down that I have to change about myself.

NUMBER ONE - be interested in people! Be interested in what they do and how EVEN THOUGH it may really be interesting to you and you may get no benefit from that information.


NUMBER TWO - stop bragging about yourself.

NUMBER THREE - be AVAILABLE. These things about not being availabe makes chicks chase you - BS. They LEAVE and lose interest thinking "He's got a GF, lets go" because I had a girl SAY THAT to me!!! She asked if I did and I said I did and she got discouraged and left!

 

[TillTheEndOfTime]

It had been a long time since I read the game, or even read any pickup advice, but from every experience I've had with "Pick up artists" and DJ's, these conclusions were drawn.


You are a good guy who is just shy >>> Game >>> Turn into a cool sociable good guy.

You are already cool guy >>> Game >>> You are better

You are an insecure, wretched fvck >>> Game >>> You are still the same insecure, messed up guy with now ANOTHER layer on top of him.

To be honest, although I've known a few very cool guys who were in the community, most of the people I've encountered were DOUCHEBAGS. It wasn't about their skills or abilities to get women, they just sucked as PEOPLE.

And the funny thing, there are many of you just like that you are reading this post right now, but you will not realize or admit it because that will force you to look deep inside and ask yourself. "Am i a miserable fvck that needs to sort things out?"


This whole post got inspired by this quote:

"In the process of dehumanizing the opposite sex, I had also been dehumanizing myself." - Neil Strauss

This is very very true. There was a brief period of time where I was just playing the game with these girls. It got considerably easier to deal with them, but it was FAKE. Go down this path for too long, and you will end up in the ocean of misery - not knowing how to do the most important thing humans need to do - socialize and develop real emotional connections.

We've been hammering about "Becoming the Man!" for a long time on this forum. Those of you who are still caught up in the illusions of becoming the next "pink boa - purple cowboy hat - mascara wearing - script giving machine" need to look deeper inside and figure out WHY and find the answers.

You touched on everything that has been going on in my head for a while about this forum. Now that I am no longer in the AFC midset I was in 2 years ago, I can more clearly analyze the way things are going.

I see a philosophy going around here sometimes that goes like this:
Sex becomes the goal, the "new years resolution to lose my 'v-card'/virginity"
"if I just have sex and lose my virginity, I will suddenly be cool and an improved man."

No you won't. If you're a loser, losing your virginity won't make you any less of a loser. You will still be a loser. Just a loser who lost his virginity and possibly a loser with a new STD. Realize that being a virgin isn't what got you to where you are right now socially. It is your state of mind that did. Having sex won't change that. Stop focusing on the ENDS and focus on the MEANS -- improving yourself. The benefits are not just girls, but more/better friends, and more success in business relations Vs jsut focusing on sex.

Next is what oxide mentioned, the PUA. A PUA basically takes social interaction with the opposite sex as a JOB. That is retarded. Yet some people actually admire these people? As was already mentioned, turning social interactions into a job dehumanizes you and crushes your ability to form meaningful emotional bonds....a very dangerous road to travel. We ARE emotional/social creatures by nature. It is human nature.

There is little difference between a PUA and an AFC if you think about it this way:

They both waste their time obsessing over women.

That's the bottom line folks.

 

[L777]

Oxide I think you got it wrong mate, this site is about self-improving, becoming a better man, pushing people to overcome their fears (thats what DJ means), not about some techniques to hide your fear and trick some girls to fück you.

First understand why you are here, then decide if you want to be a Don Juan or a pua.

Cheers!

Yea I agree with this but I also know what the thread starter means. I think there's 2 types of "PUA".

1. The ones that are highly insecure, emotionally scarred whatever, but learn lines and routines stacks and approach enough to get enough sex to kid themselves that they are having a good life.

2. The ones that get rid of insecurity and self-hatred, take steps to improve as people, then start approaching, usually without the use of scripts etc. They feel a genuine connection to the women they fvck, they actually feel emotion, and they aren't closed to the possibility of a relationship if they find a quality woman, just to maintain their "PUA" status.

I'm in the process of becoming a number 2 (lol)...I don't wanna be a cold-hearted pimp or whatever, just a cool, happy guy who gets laid.

 

[Distant Light]

I know exactly what you mean.

I once talked to snow plowman on AIM an he was talking about something similar about the routines and stuff. He was telling me about the new era of PUAs coming up. He then told me about RSD and their plans for 07 and telling me about the new "Natural Game".

I must say this elimnates everything that your talking about. When you do routines and stuff its not the real you as Jlaix would say "It's like putting a band-aid on a larger problem."

All I know RSD are doing big things this year. Not one instructor uses routines anymore due to there deep identity. Basically the new era will start whenever the Blueprint book and dvd comes out. Soon enough you'll be seeing many PUAs who don't use much routines if not any. But as always you'll never see routines and stuff going away because it's so popular.

I do agree on what you're saying though, because back when I used to practice MM, I ended up always looking for reaction. As RSD puts it "Button pushing". I even catch myself trying to get the reaction and then it ends up not even working.

 

[Falcon]

I agree with this thread. But aren't we all in the right place? If one looks hard enough, there is plenty of material for improving yourself on this forum. That's why I chose this forum over others. At one point, this whole forum was about improving yourself and getting the most out of life. Wasn't that considered top priority? Sometimes I feel a lot of the newer posters are swaying the pendulum back to the pua techniques and methods.

 

[Jay Jay]

Quality Post Sir Oxide.

This is one of the coolest threads I have ever read here and am mightily impressed.

JJ

 

[wayword]

You are a good guy who is just shy >>> Game >>> Turn into a cool sociable good guy.

You are already cool guy >>> Game >>> You are better

You are an insecure, wretched fvck >>> Game >>> You are still the same insecure, messed up guy with now ANOTHER layer on top of him.

Good summation - although PU does emphasize that you also need to become successful as a person and in life if you ever want any real, lasting success with women. I mean, a lot of PU is bluffing and false confidence. That can definitely win you a few rounds. But it will also backfire when you have to eventually show your cards at some point...

When you truly got a great hand though, you don't need to bluff anymore.

However, that takes years...and can be considered your long game, vs just learning how to PU more chix which would be your short game in the meantime...

 

[Pappadapolis]

Too many folks look at the advice on this site as "all or nothing". When it doesn't work for them or they strike out with women, they get bitter and label everyone as fakes. Some things work for differently people.

A lot of what is in the DJ Bible is about how to be a MAN. That's the problem nowadays, men aren't men anymore. When we are, we're told we have to apologize for it. Chicks are not gonna change. The advice is good to learn how to recognize their bullsh!t and not be suckered by it.

I do agree that the "seduce anyone" and "make any woman want you" gurus are full of ****. But a lot of the advice is useful, as long as you are realistic. If you're a 5' 8" 300 pound dude, you're probably nothing going to pull a HB no matter how tight your game is.

 

[Solomon]

great thread

What people have to realize is that some successful pick up artists, DJs, and macks are who they are not because of the material they teach, but because of the life experiances that got them there. You can't use someone else's blueprint for success because you two will have completly different lives and various X factors will not be in common. Instead, go back to square one, and do your own thing. Learn through trial and failure and forget blueprints for life.

M-O-M

I couldn't have said it better myself, this is the best way to learn, through your own mistakes, this is how I learned, I can proudly say that, Unlike most or some. i didn't read a gazillion books (Including the DJ bible) I went out there and learned from my mistakes, hell I'm still learning but trust, I'm a lot better then what I use to be

to many kids/guys trying to find an easy fix, there ain't one, unless you pay for a hooker, forget about some guru helping you, I know guys who have paid thousands for a Guru to help them, and still didn't get no where.

enjoy life, live and learn, get your inner game tight!

and don't be afraid to try, I rather fail trying then beat myself up not trying

Solo

 

[Hughman]

I'm sort of with Oxide here. I don't like the concept of PUA. 'Faking' it is just that, a fake social mindset.

However, I love the DJ mindset and what it stands for. I don't need a woman. I don't even want a woman. They are merely the cherry on the cake - not needed but very nice to have as and when it suits you. The way this site has encouraged me to learn about human psychology, the evils of the media and Selfish Capitalism, and to recognise it and fight against it, has been my making.

Seeing the Matrix for what it is hurts at times. But I will always take the red pill over the blue pill.