What did I do wrong during this date?

[The Grue]

Once again I find myself in need of some wisdom from DJ brothers, hope you can help...

About two weeks ago I was out with a group of friends at a small bar/bistro where a Jazz band was playing live. It was a nice setting and the atmosphere was quite lively; fun was being had all around.
At some point, a woman(Christine, 28) comes in and over to our table. She was a friend of one of the people in our group, and she sat next to me. We talked a bit, and I found her attractive. She was not a knockout, but cute, about 5'5" and with very nice curves(large breasts, nice waist). With her glasses, she looked a bit like a nerdy teacher and actually, she is a teacher...
Anyway, she talked with everyone but with me a bit more, and before leaving we said we'd connect on FB.
True to her word, she sent a friend request a day later. I sent her a small message of greeting to which she replied warmly. A few days later, I ask for her number and suggest we go out to hear a friend play music(he is a Disc Jockey at a small bar). She replied that she couldn't make it on a weekday but asked if we could do something on Sat or Sun instead... I was a bit reluctant to have a first date on the weekend but agreed to dinner on Saturday. When asked were we would go, she disagreed with my choice saying it was "too far away..." so I picked a closer place. Although I can't say I liked this....

So, last Saturday I pick her up at her place and we go to dinner to this South-African restaurant. I notice that is is nicely dressed, although a bit conservative, and I also notice that while friendly, she does not seem to be "led" easily. I find that most women , when around a guy they are into, want to be led...She seemed to me to be asserting herself in a manner....
The conversation was good, but I don't notice her asking much personal info nor actually alluding to future dates(I talked about different stuff without actually inviting her so as to gauge her reaction...).

After dinner, I suggested getting drinks at a very nice place nearby. She said that would be fine but told me she'd have to be home by 2.30(she lives with her folks). When we enter the bar, I was going to sit at a table, but she asked if we could sit on stools near the bar...I wasn't crazy about this because it seemed a bit impersonal and we would be in a corridor...still, I didn't make an issue of it...drinks were going well and I started to get some positive body language...hair twirls, legs crossing..etc
However, I notice that she has her cell with her at all times, and fidgets with it during the date...at some point she sends a message to someone...again, not good in my opinion...a women should have her attention on me, not the mobile!!

After drinks we walk to the car, and while walking on a quiet lane under some trees, I grab her firmly and go in for a kiss...She appear to pull away, but I continue, and end up kissing her on her neck. She said she didn't expect I would kiss her and it took her by surprise.... I point out we ARE out on a Saturday night on a warm summer evening...and what will happen, will happen...
At that point she says "You are going too fast..I mean, what do you see in me?" BUT she was interested...My reply is that this is a good question and she retorts that we should walk a bit and talk about it. So we continue walking, and she starts to give me the third degree.
When she , yet again, asks what I see in her, I approach for a kiss once more, and this time we kiss fully...and then again. I tell her I don't know what I see in her yet, but I like her and find her fun... She then starts asking about my previous relationships, what I am looking for and other stuff which I feel is a bit heavy for a first date...It is as if she was trying to find a way to disqualify me, alluding to the fact that she had been hurt in her previous relationship... I tell her that I enjoy life and going out. I add that I cannot say where the two of us are headed because it's way too early, but we should concentrate on enjoying the night...As I was taking her home, we kissed in the car repeatedly during red traffic lights(kissing that I instigated however, but she was willing) and I left her off outside her home about 2.30 or so...Again, she drops something about me going too fast then says "we'll see how this goes..." and we kissed goodnight. I knew that things had not gone so well(because I also felt her holding back a bit during our last kiss) but I didn't put any further thought into it as I was going out with someone else on Sunday(NOTHING beats spinning plates!!)
Point: We both had had some gum after drinks so there was no bad breathe or anything of the sort...

About 2-3 days pass, and I call Christine at around 2pm last Tuesday to set up a date, but no reply on the mobile...In fact, she didn't answer the call all day...I knew this was very negative, especially for a woman who has her mobile with her at all times(like during our date!).
Still, I gave her a call around 10.30pm. She was out somewhere noisy, so we couldn't speak, but I said I'd call the following day, hoping to get to the bottom of things...
And that brings us to today...I call her around 2 and she picks up immediately... She explains that she saw my call on her cell but it was late(which it wasn't) and she couldn't get back to me...This , of course, is not true since I called her back at 10.30 the same day....
Again, I decide not to make an issue of it and invite her to go for a seaside drink tomorrow evening. She replies that she will be going out with friends, and that she has some interviews and will be a bit busy this week...but that maybe Saturday afternoon would be OK and if she can message and inform me about this...
At this point, I am a bit pissed as I see the beginning of a runaround and I tell her that I don't do the message thing...and my Saturday afternoon is closed for playing basketball with my buddies...
She replies that we must talk about a few things, but I have understood where this is going and decide to cut through her crap...
Thus, I just say,
"Christine, all I want to know from you is if you want to go out, have some good times and get to know each other a bit, otherwise, there is no reason for us to waste each others' time..."
Possibly I was a bit abrupt, but just a little....and I really did not want to waste time with a woman who is not into me...
She replies that I am "not what she is looking for...". I then reply that there is no reason to meet up and that we "don't have anything else to say really.....goodbye.

Now, my pride definitely has been hurt from this rejection on her part. Especially since this is a woman who , in my opinion, is not good enough to be rejecting me....
Of course, I understand there is an age difference and this may bother her, but she never mentioned or alluded to it....plus, I live in Athens, Greece where age differences are not so narrow as in the US....

Final point: I don't think I was going too fast; my belief is that a woman who is into you will WANT you to kiss her...she wants things to progress quickly too, why wouldn't she?

I plan to continue my spinning plates, but I would like to know the opinions of fellows DJ's here about this situation and my handling of it.

- Did I do something wrong in my approach to Christine, or was it just a case of a woman who was not that interested...?

- She says she concluded a relationship recently which hurt her...she may possibly still be in love, could it have been this?

- Should I just forget she exists and concentrate on other plates or did I force her into something with my ultimatum?

Thanks for reading and for any advice,

 

[betheman]

what did you do wrong? you didnt pick up on the lukewarm responses she was giving you, you should have bailed much earlier

 

[Iceberg]

- Did I do something wrong in my approach to Christine, or was it just a case of a woman who was not that interested...?

Not interested. You did nothing wrong. Sometimes things just don't work.

- She says she concluded a relationship recently which hurt her...she may possibly still be in love, could it have been this?

Probably not. Even if you're hurt by a previous relationship, it won't stop you from being with a person who excites you.

- Should I just forget she exists and concentrate on other plates or did I force her into something with my ultimatum?

You already said that she's not that great of a catch and that you're better than she is.

Concentrate on other plates. What else can you do? Chase after this one? She's not worth it.

You win some. You lose some.

 

[backbreaker]

she's 28 years old still lives with her parents and when you tried to game her up she picked out a specific south african restaurant that she wants to eat at.. come on man i dont' have to call law and order detectives to figure this one out. lol a south african restaurant is a tad bit too specific to just randomly come up with off the top of your head.



you were a pay date. you did nothing wrong she just did not like you in the first place.

this is why the first date is always cheap or free. she would have screened herself out. she wanted someone to take her out and pay for some **** she coudln't afford to pay for herself.

 

[The Grue]

Actually, I picked up the restaurant tab and I chose the south african place..she just mentioned that she didn't want to go very far....plus, she picked up the drinks tab afterwards... I spent a bit more of course, but not that much...

 

[AAAgent]

I read half the article and got the feeling that she wasn't doing what you wanted and it frustrated you.....

on the other hand, its a first date. Don't be a pushover in any means but don't set yourself up for failure. Make the date smooth by choosing a place that's convenient for her and you (if possible). Instead of asking for a certain weekday, just ask if she's available to catch a certain show next week as you know a certain DJ is playing (she will respond with a yes or no and lead you closer to a day she is available if she does want to go).

If she literally ask's what day your DJ friend is playing, tell her the day. If she can't make it that day (which you should be prepared to answer), tell her X&X is also happening that weekend as well and you'd think it'd be fun. Ask her if she'd like to come. If she's interested at all or curious she will only say no to one of them. It's also a type of sh1t test to see if you can blow past rejection.

Also, it seems like you tried to force the lead. I never force the lead. I will take the lead and if she follows, then great, if not, no biggie. I will aim to walk and get to the door first but if she gets there first then let her open it. If you try to order first or set her up and she's okay, then great. If she cuts you off and orders then let her go and go at your own pace.

As for the kiss. She clearly was losing interest in you during the dinner since she didn't answer anything personal but maybe you just weren't able to open her up. You knew she was a teacher so that gave you plenty of info to work with before the date and prepare to have a good convo.

What's it like to teacher teenager's, kids, etc.....listen and listen then smile and listen...joke with her, inspire her (you teacher's who actually care, etc.)

I had a teacher who told me i was trash since i was a trouble maker. I'm not trash i just wanted to play and got into trouble alot. Another teacher use to teach me about hunting and gardening. He took the time out to spend time with a deliquent and treat me like a human. He even made me and 2 other friends of mine promise to never do drugs. I kept that promise till end of college because everytime i tried to get into drugs, his face came up. He's helped me get to where i am today. My best friend at the time who also made that promise wasn't so lucky.

Relate to her and tell a story, then ask more questions and listen. At the end of the date you'll realize that you know everything about her and she knows very little about you except for a few stories and how you're a great listener.

Don't fall into anyone else's pace except for yours. Don't force anything.

I'm an advocate of paying for the bill if you can afford to. Why? If i don't like her, i paid for the food and i will no longer feel obligated to owe her anything if i did. She ate my free food, that's all she gets. If i like her, i'll also pay for it because then she'll say atleast let me pay my half, or i'll get this one, etc.

you can say "you can get the next one." this implies you will see her again but not when. if she says something like "how do you know i want to see you again?" well you don't. i've answered "I don't but if you don't, that's fine with me too." and continue on. Go at your own pace and never validate yourself.

Girls will throw their sh1t tests at you. Whether its rescheduling or not opening up, rejecting a kiss, etc. learn to go at your own pace and don't let their actions phase you. Work on your own schedule but also be respectful.

girls also always want to "Talk". "Can we talk about something?" "We need to talk" "Do you have a few minutes?" Well they clearly have something to tell you and you probably know along the lines of what she might say if you think hard.

It's not your job to prepare questions to tell her and you don't even have to answer her questions technically. You took time to hear her out if she is planning on wasting your time to interview you, then let her know you're leaving. don't answer all her questions on a whim which you did. You basically blurted out your feelings.

Shouldn't worry about her past/stories unless its something crazy. If she mentions it to you, tell her you don't care, because you're not that guy. You're you and if she wants to hang out with you, she should stop treating you like him.

I wouldn't bother contacting her anymore unless she contacts you. If she does contact you i wouldn't invest too much time into it besides just answering her curtly/respectfully.

generally forcing things on women doesn't work well that's why i always go at my own pace but if you do force an ultimatum, you have to be in a position to do so. A position of power.

 

[floydb25]

This is one of those instances where, for whatever reason, you simply didn't click. I see nothing you did wrong. She showed signs of disinterest, but it sounds more alluded to low self-esteem on her part than anything else. She lives at home (at 28), isn't stunning, probably dated a bunch of losers, etc. She might not even expect for anyone to like her. "Why do you like me? I'm no one special. You can do better than me."

Another possibility is that she's a nice girl, and you seem to be more of a party / player type. She's conservative, is a teacher, dresses classy, etc. So that could be a reason for incompatibility, as well. It sounded like she was grilling you to see what your intentions are, and wasn't interested in just fooling around. Is she a quality girl? I can't really tell if she's a loser with low self-esteem, or a nice girl. Game and social nonsense doesn't work on everybody, you know.

Either way, it doesn't matter. If she's not feeling it - she's not feeling it. Don't take it personally, or think there's something you did wrong, or that you're not good enough for her. This is the wrong mindset to have. A lot of times, it has nothing at all to do with you. You can do the same things with other girls, and be very successful. So, don't look at it as a failure - just a missmatch. It happens a lot - even for us. We don't like every girl who wants to date us, either. Just the way it is.

This sounds like an ego issue. You're upset because a not-so attractive girl rejected you. It should be in the bag. You've dated better than her. Etc. Again, wrong mindset. None of that stuff matters, and she might not even look at it in those terms (ie, "I can do better than him"). You don't need to prove anything. Keep chugging along, and find others.

 

[backbreaker]

why do so many people try so hard on the first date? i don't even attempt to kiss a girl on the first date. i dont' know if i WANT to kiss her on the first date is my point. **** just go out talk laugh have s ome drinks go home.

so many guys put so much pressure on a woman and themselves to get at some mythicial step in the relationship.

the first date IMHO is about setting the hook. i'm not even trying to reel it in on the first date.

 

[drellum]

why do so many people try so hard on the first date? i don't even attempt to kiss a girl on the first date. i dont' know if i WANT to kiss her on the first date is my point. **** just go out talk laugh have s ome drinks go home.

so many guys put so much pressure on a woman and themselves to get at some mythicial step in the relationship.

the first date IMHO is about setting the hook. i'm not even trying to reel it in on the first date.

Spot on advice!

I was on a first date last night and did exactly this. In the past I have built up the first date so much that I was almost sick.

Now I don't have any game plan as such. I just go and talk about whatever, add a bit of kino and gauge the reaction. Last night we kissed on the cheek and said goodnight, following up with an attempted kiss on the lips which I deflected to another kiss on the cheek Before I had got home I had a txt asking when we were meeting again :yes:

There is no magic formula to click with anyone so just go out, try it on a bit and have a good time....no pressure. If she likes you then.....she will like the real you.

D

 

[Desdinova]

I was a bit reluctant to have a first date on the weekend but agreed to dinner on Saturday.

The day doesn't matter. I'm an advocate of jumping at the first opportunity while the iron is still hot and the IL is still high. However, I'm pretty much opposed to 'dinner' for a first date. I leave 'dinners' for celebrations and prefer to do an action date especially for the first date.

The conversation was good, but I don't notice her asking much personal info nor actually alluding to future dates(I talked about different stuff without actually inviting her so as to gauge her reaction...).

Sounds boring. The great thing about action dates is that there's fun built into the activity. There are usually opportunities to flirt and initiate kino. With an action date, the woman will generally have a positive impression of you, and see that you are a fun and interesting individual. Dinners can cause the 'little things' that she won't like about you to come out early (chewing with mouth open, licking your fingers, smacking your lips, etc) and if your conversation is boring, it's just going to amplify all your minor imperfections. If she has a positive impression about you by the time you go out to dinner, she'll forgive all that little stuff.

After dinner, I suggested getting drinks at a very nice place nearby.

You should have ended with dinner. The ONLY times I relocate the woman on a first date is if:
1) we're on a coffee date and it's going extremely well and
2) if the date's not going well, I'll relocate her to a place where I have mad social proof

Other than that, I like to eject a bit early and let HER wonder if I like her enough to take her out again.

However, I notice that she has her cell with her at all times, and fidgets with it during the date...at some point she sends a message to someone...again, not good in my opinion...a women should have her attention on me, not the mobile!!

I make it a point to shut off my phone in front of her when I'm on the date. Generally, the woman gets the message and does the same. If she insists of fvcking around with her phone on the first date, she does NOT get a second date with me.

while walking on a quiet lane under some trees, I grab her firmly and go in for a kiss...She appear to pull away, but I continue, and end up kissing her on her neck. She said she didn't expect I would kiss her and it took her by surprise

The first kiss should be the most natural thing on earth. If a woman has enjoyed her time with you she will automatically kiss you. If she's still uncertain about the whole thing and doesn't go for the kiss, I'll leave it until the end of the second date (if there is one). If there's no kiss by the end of the second date, I ditch her and move on.

Forcing the kiss at the end of the date makes her uncomfortable and does not leave her with a good impression. You're better off to wait it out until the end of the second date.

At that point she says "You are going too fast..I mean, what do you see in me?"

By this point, you should see that she's not interested in you and it's time to end the date and throw away her number.

When she , yet again, asks what I see in her, I approach for a kiss once more, and this time we kiss fully...and then again.

She went along with the kiss to get it done and over with. She didn't enjoy it and she's not planning on doing it ever again with you.

Unfortunately, you decide to drag things out even more by asking her out twice more and then force her to vocalize a rejection. None of this was necessary. Women would rather have you 'get the hint' than vocalize the obvious.

Final point: I don't think I was going too fast; my belief is that a woman who is into you will WANT you to kiss her...she wants things to progress quickly too, why wouldn't she?

Of course she will. But the first date is where you need to sell your personality to the woman. A formal, boring dinner is not going to get you anywhere unless the woman has low self-esteem and is desperate to have a man in her life. A fun-filled action date will make your personality come alive and allow her to see that you DO have something to offer, and have given her a slice of the interesting, fun life that she could very well be part of.

 

[yuppaz]

Sorry if this was already covered. I didn't read the other posters replies. There were a couple things that I see as possibly going on here:

1. She sounded boring and like she had too much baggage. I've dated girls in that position and it really isn't worth it at all. Good boundaries are fine but huge walls are absolutely not fine.
2. What the f*ck was up with all of her rules? No fun at all. Not worth it
3. She did seem like she had luke warm interest at best. I would have been pretty turned off by that. I want to be able to show I'm into the girl and I want her to show that right back (not necessarily act on it, but I should be able to tell she's excited about me).
4. Her being disrespectful / hesitant about where to go / hesitant in general would have made that a 1 dater, never to be heard from again by me.

Onto your end of things

1. You should have cut things off with her when you noticed that she wasnt all that into it.
2. You shouldn't have surprised her with a kiss, you should have been leading up to it and building her anticipation through touch.
3. You shouldn't have been so needy to try to kiss her over and over and over....that ruined the mystery with her and thinking back she probably thought you were too easy and possibly needy (not saying you are, just saying what she probably thought)
4. She DEFINATELY thought she was the prize in this whole thing...not at all good. She needs to feel like she is trying for your affection / attention ( a bit). When you see that kind of behavior and notice that kind of smugness / disenfranchisedness coming from her then you need to step back.

5. learn from what happened and just simply don't spend any effort if she doesn't seem to like you much. If it just happens to turn out like that, then learn to show her that you are the man, but if she isn't into it, just forget about her.

Hope that helps

 

[Greasy Pig]

Yep, I had similar issues when I was rejected by a girl I would class as a 6.5 at best. The sex was great and she was as smart as a whip.
That's what attracted me to her. So when this 6.5 brushed me, I was deeply affronted and angry.
But the truth is, (as others have said) sometimes people just don't click. You can't force attraction, if she doesn't feel it, well that's it.
It's hard but you have to try and accept that it's her problem, not yours.

And love backbreaker's tip for first dates. Just set the hook, then reel it in at a later date and feast on your catch at your leisure.

 

[The Grue]

I have just read the posts and am digesting the info! There is lots of great advice here, I still have a lot of learning to do....sometimes it can be a fine line between being assertive and sexual in contrast to appearing forceful and needy...

 

[The Duke]

Grue- my best advice is to keep dating. This girl wasn't very conforming at all. If a girl is truly into you she will be like puddy in your hands. That should have been your first clue she wasn't into you. Everywhere you turned she was positioning things so it was on her terms. The fact that she was kissing you doesn't always mean a lot. Girls will sometimes do that when under pressure and don't want to upset you.

The only thing you should be upset with is that you didn't take the early warning signs into account. Don't expect women to spell it out for you in words. Look for the non verbal clues she threw out multiple times. Now you'll know better next time. And no point in taking girls out to eat on a first date.


I went thru the same schitt when I first started playing this game. Made the same mistakes. Make them work for it. You are the prize, not them.

 

[The Duke]

I suggested getting drinks at a very nice place nearby. She said that would be fine but told me she'd have to be home by 2.30(she lives with her folks). When we enter the bar, I was going to sit at a table, but she asked if we could sit on stools near the bar...I wasn't crazy about this because it seemed a bit impersonal and we would be in a corridor...still, I didn't make an issue of it...drinks were going well and I started to get some positive body language...hair twirls, legs crossing..etc
However, I notice that she has her cell with her at all times, and fidgets with it during the date...at some point she sends a message to someone...again, not good in my opinion...a women should have her attention on me, not the mobile!!



The positive body language you did witness was probably due to the alcohol!
Always take that into account. But congrats on paying attention.

She was probably texting her girlfriend telling her how she wanted this date to end asap. Yeah girls are cruel like that.

 

[backbreaker]

look

a week ago I had a client for my web design business that was looking to have an adult video download website built. for whatever the reason may be (smirk) we do a lot of adult work, like 1/4th of our entire portfolio is adult work, so when i want an adult project, i usually get it.

so this guy comes along, tells me what he wants, i know we can do it, i show him where we have done it before, i put together a proposal for him showing how long it will take, how much it will cost, etc the guy calls me and says he is going to have to pass becuase it's not what he was looking for.

on the site where i found him, he comes back and re posts his ad a few hours later telling everyone that he is specifically looking for someone very very cheap and if you are gvoing to try to charge him market rate don't bother to contact him.

so basically we charged him too much. but we really didn't in fact i thought i could have chraged him more. the guy wanted a site that hosts videos, wanted me to integrate an ecommerce merchant system for him and wanted to be able to manage the videos, etc and he wanted it all for like under 1 thousand dollars. lol good luck with that.

what does that have to do with this post? i mean look... if I REALLy anted to get the guys business i could. he loves our work i could contact him and say look i will do this for say, 800 dollars. but more than that, i'm not going to toss and turn everynight beucase 1 client did not like or did not see the value in what we do. what if i changed my sales pitch up after every rejection? you can't win them all. it's not possible.

some women, just won't like you. there is nothing YOU did wrong about it. everytime you get cold sholder on a date it's not necessarily something YOU did wrong. that reeks of low self esteem. and frankely if you tried to conunter what you did to every girl's wishes you won't be happy in the end.

yeah i lose clients but becuase of the way i do business i dont' have bad or unrealistic clients. i let my natural screening process weed out the bad clients.

 

[cordoncordon]

Overall you did not do too much wrong, I just don't think she was that into you for whatever reasons.

A few things I would suggest though:
1. No dinner on the the first date ever. Usually drinks at a fun place is perfect.
2. It looks like you may have forced yourself on her a tad. Not much, but you were all over kissing her, and it sounds like she kind of resented that. Make her chase you some as well.
3. No after date texts or calls that apply pressure to her or give her ultimatums. She was already kind of thinking in her head that you were kind of a pushy guy, a needy guy, and those calls after and then what you said confirmed that in her mind and made it easy to say no more dates with you.

 

[Mike32ct]

It was over when you initially exchanged FBs instead of phone numbers.

If she won't give you her number when you first meet her, walk away.

Fayceboook is the consolation prize when she isn't attracted enough to give you a mobile/cell number, but she still feels obligated to "throw you a bone" and allow herself to hide behind FB.

Yes you got her number later, so there was some interest, but unfortunately it was mediocre interest at best.

You did the best you could. She just wasn't into you.

 

[backbreaker]

Look, i don't think you really did very much wrong. let me rephrase that, you did some things wrong but I do not see what you did to where she should develop a negative opinion of you already.

To put it simply, you aren't being a challenge. To put it in a more complex explanation, a woman can't play offense and defense at the same time.

see, when a woman does what she did to you, she is working off the (correct) assumption that your attraction into her is already sealed. to her at this point, this is a given. she knows you want her. and the way I see it or understand how the gmae works, its' not so much that women like a challenge more than they like a walkover but, a woman or man for that matter can't sit and wonder if they like you while at teh same time wondering if you like them. they are either busy nitpiking screening you for the littlest or silliest of ****, or they are worried about trying to make sure that you approve of them, but they never do both at the same time.

this is why, at least how i understand it, you see some women with some of the most questionable men because by the time they have proven themselves to to the guy they are happy that they got what they wanted, to the point where they have not even sat down and asked themselves is that what they even want.

this type of game only comes from experience with dealing with women there is no manual for it. the second i would have noticed that she was not clicking with me like that or, better stated was not even giving me the opportunity to click, i would have started doing the unpredictable. maybe get up and leave for 15 mins or something or just cut the date short alltogether or go to another table and hit on another girl or soethign, anything to break up the monotony of the date that is crashing right before my eyes. anything ot make her say to herself.. wait.. **** does he even like me like that?

with that said, in my experience, women who i have to resort to these type of childish tactics to bed or sleep with aren't worth it and are pretty stupid and bad LTR material, not beucase they don';t like me but beucase they are too dumb to even give a guy sitting in front of them a healthy shot. so once i had sex with them i generally lost interest.


I mean, a guy friend of mine just got this new "girlfriend" and i use that term loosely, met her what, last week, has taken her out on one date to a stakehouse, and is on thep hone with her constantly and has asked her to move in already lol. and he wont' listen to anyone "this is the one".

be thankful you aren't that guy. you don't want " a woman" you dont' want to sale yourself for *****. you want women on your own terms. i woudl rather you or any guy be single for an extended amount of time than to end up going the route my friend is going or whatever he is, is going.

 

[TonyBaloney]

Come on Grue, for fooks sake, havent you learnt yet at your rip old age about rejection? God, that i would say is THE FIRST RULE a dj has to learn!!!! It is always the ones where a strong impression has been made - its strange really.....

If you can learn to take a knock back and let go of your pride, you'll be a happier man for it!