The System vs He's Just Not That Into You

[Charmaine]

For those who follow the rules in Doc Love's "The System" by trying to be a "Challenge" and playing hard to get, here are what women are told by Greg Behrendt in the book "He's Just Not That Into You: The No-Excuses Truth to Understanding Guys":

"Don't spend your time on and give your heart to any guy who makes you wonder about anything related to his feelings for you"

"If a guy truly likes you, but for personal reasons he needs to take things slow, he will let you know that immediately. He won't keep you guessing,
because he'll want to make sure you don't get frustrated and go away."

"Don't you want the guy who'll forget about all the other things in his life before he forgets about you?"

"A man who wants to make a relationship work will move mountains to keep the woman he loves"

"If the guy you're dating doesn't seem to be completely into you, or you feel the need to start 'figuring him out', please consider the glorious thought that he might just not be that into you. And then free yourself to go find someone that is."


Challenge is what women want the most from a relationship? It seems like it is what men want, not what women want. What most women want are attention, affection and love, not challenge, which appears to be more likely a projection from men from their own perspective.

 

[betheman]

women love to have a man or men who will move heaven and earth for them, the flowers, the chocolates etc etc. it puffs up their ego, it sends out messages to other women and the world...'see what power I hold, see how desirable I am', however that is not readily what they are attracted to, yes gold diggers are attracted to the wealth, the lifestyle but actual attraction for a man, desire, lust even, cannot be negotiated, it cant be bought.

Many men fail because once they have attracted the woman and they enter an LTR, they turn into the provider and the power slips, the game changes. To keep the attraction, you have to keep a degree of challenge, she has to be aware she can lose out

 

[Charmaine]

Moving heaven and earth...it would be more likely they would see that as a demonstration of your love to them than anything ego related if they truly love you. Not all women see chocolates and flowers as something to show off others to. It is more likely they would see those in that direction if they don't love you that much.

Challenge is not ultimately what keeps the attraction of most women. It would be more likely for me to leave any potential relationship due to the man not interested enough in me than the man not giving me enough challenge.

If women are only attracted to you because of challenge. What they love is the challenge, not you.

Whatever bait you use, whatever fish you get. You get gold diggers if you use wealth as bait. You get egocentric women if you use challenge as bait.

 

[Pandora]

I do not necessarily agree that all most women are attracted to a challenge. We need to stop over generalizing with women. As much as they are the same they are also very very different. Many women just like a man that is extremely physically attractive to them. They then put up with anything he does. He recognizes that he can get away with anything and he acts up. We from the outside think that the women likes him becuz of the fact he is a challenge, but actually he is being a challenge becuz he knows he got her ( is it confusing lol).

Some women do like a challenges but for a lot of women they knew that they liked you from the moment they saw your face. I know its hard to believe but go and ask women and you will see that this is true. All this challenge stuff is waaayyy overhyped. Yes you should not be a pushover or she will lose interest. But its not primarily challenge that attracts women. Its primarily looks. Especially young superficial American hot women.

The book He Is Not That Into You is a great book. You will be surprised how many men give off mixed signals to women . Girls have legit guy problems too. Its mainly becuz the guy does not find her physically attractive enough so he gives her mixed signals. The same principle applies to women much of the time. Most of the time mixed signals is due to that fact that She is Just Not That Into You. She thinks your ok looking but ehhhhh she is not enamored with you. She rather hold out for Johnny Depp look alikes or sumthing.

 

[betheman]

]Moving heaven and earth...it would be more likely they would see that as a demonstration of your love to them than anything ego related if they truly love you.[/I]

Challenge is not ultimately what keeps the attraction of most women.
no one is saying it does, but attraction will fade away and die without a degree of challenge

challenge in its self isnt attractive, nobody likes a doormat

 

[BraddH]

A man who tries to be a challenge for women has already made women a challenge.

 

[Charmaine]

I do not necessarily agree that all most women are attracted to a challenge. We need to stop over generalizing with women. As much as they are the same they are also very very different. Many women just like a man that is extremely physically attractive to them. They then put up with anything he does. He recognizes that he can get away with anything and he acts up. We from the outside think that the women likes him becuz of the fact he is a challenge, but actually he is being a challenge becuz he knows he got her ( is it confusing lol).

In that case the woman is then attracted by his physical attributes, not by the challenge.

I would say physical attractiveness do not usually get past the initial stage if you are looking for a longer term relationship.

Some women do like a challenges but for a lot of women they knew that they liked you from the moment they saw your face. I know its hard to believe but go and ask women and you will see that this is true. All this challenge stuff is waaayyy overhyped. Yes you should not be a pushover or she will lose interest. But its not primarily challenge that attracts women. Its primarily looks. Especially young superficial American hot women.

The book He Is Not That Into You is a great book. You will be surprised how many men give off mixed signals to women . Girls have legit guy problems too. Its mainly becuz the guy does not find her physically attractive enough so he gives her mixed signals. The same principle applies to women much of the time. Most of the time mixed signals is due to that fact that She is Just Not That Into You. She thinks your ok looking but ehhhhh she is not enamored with you. She rather hold out for Johnny Depp look alikes or sumthing.

Except for younger teenager girls and probably girls in their early 20s, in general, women are not attracted by looks as much as men are. I would say for most women, it is the vibe, temperament, character, the mix of all of those than just the face alone.

 

[Charmaine]

challenge in its self isnt attractive, nobody likes a doormat

Not being a doormat doesn't necessarily mean a challenge though. You can still show your affection and love but still has your own hobbies and your own values, as long as the woman doesn't think you love those more than you love her. After all, women like men whom they can respect and admire.

no one is saying it does, but attraction will fade away and die without a degree of challenge

Attraction can be pumped up by having little surprises every now and then. Relationship fades usually because the two persons do not have anything in common. You need to have some common interests which you both enjoy doing together and have the same values so you can chase the same dream together. Challenge does nothing to keep the attraction alive if the two people don't even have any common grounds to start with.

Moving heaven and earth...it would be more likely they would see that as a demonstration of your love to them than anything ego related if they truly love you.

Why would you want to move heaven and earth for someone who doesn't truly love you though?

 

[Charmaine]

A man who tries to be a challenge for women has already made women a challenge.

To have a successful relationship in itself is a challenge.

 

[BraddH]

To have a successful relationship in itself is a challenge.

Certainly. But the people here in this forum wants a successful without any effort. Tell them that what you just told me and they will fight you untill their last breath.

 

[MikeOck]

What most women want are attention, affection and love, not challenge

That is an overly simplistic view of relationships, to say the least. If all women wanted was attention, affection and love, every single nice guy would be in a happy relationship. Time and again, we see the nice guy ending up alone and the a-hole with multiple partners. However, to simply say be an a-hole to attract women is overly simplistic as well. What is it that the a-hole has that the nice guy doesn't? Challenge, excitement, uncertainty.

There was an interesting post around here a few months ago, it was a hyperbole which replaced men with women and sex with love. Women want love, affection and attention, but they don't want a man who just offers his love up to everyone (as the nice guy does), just like men want sex but they don't want a woman who just throws around sex to everyone (at least not for a relationship). How do men demonstrate that they are are selective with their love, and how do women demonstrate that they are selective with sex? By being a challenge.

Finally, to say that women just want love and attention and men just want sex is really only the primal level of relationships. Ever since I finished school, every woman I've dated wanted much more. They want a man with money, with power, with ambition, a man with social skills. This doesn't mean they are gold diggers (necessarily), it means they are thinking about my ability to provide for children and her in addition to my ability to love (but not love just any woman).

This is a complex topic that can't be summed up in a few (or a thousand) forum posts. Books have been written, phd's have been obtained, and there is still no clear cut, one size fits all solution.