soreness = muscle growth?

[Starwolf]

If you're sore the next day after training this means you had a good workout
and your muscles will start to repair themselves to get even stronger/bigger.

Is the above statement correct?

If so what do you guys do to really feel that burn and soreness during/after a workout.

Do you go heavy or do u go with high reps?

i can't seem to feel anything after my workouts and i go heavy untill failure.
some tips on what i might be doing wrong are much appreciated

Thanks

 

[foreverAFC]

there are many theories and lots of conflicting information out there on the net on this topic. but in my opinion, soreness does = hypertrophy.

ive been lifting since i was 13-14 and im 32 now and im pretty happy with my body. i have some experience and ive tried different things so ill try to explain what ive learned the best that i can.

when it comes to building muscle the most important thing in my opinion is creating the micro tears in the muscle fibers and letting them heal. and it doenst matter whether you create those micro tears with high weights or low weights, hi reps or low reps but it is much easier and safer on the body to create the microtears with lower weights and higher reps. with higher weights you may not even be able to activate or target certain muscles properly. and it also doesnt matter if it takes you 2 hours to create micro tears in the muscle fibers or 20 minutes, which is why duration does not matter much either. its possible to get gains off very few sets or a very brief workout as long as you are able to tear up the muscle fiber. and this is why you want to be as efficient with your workout as possible. there are ways to combine certain compound exercises with good intensity to create substantial muscle tears in a short amount of time. for example, if you only did squats and shoulder presses for 20 minutes at a good intensity and keep hitting muscle failure over and over in those 20 minutes, you could create a substantial amount of micro tears over a large portion of your body.

this is also the reason why focusing on strength is a waste of time in my opinion. i see guys in the gym doing powerlifts at low reps expecting to get bodybuilding type aesthetics. or guys trying to build up their chest by struggling to bench press tons of weight instead of lowering the weight and tearing up the muscle easier. its easier and more effective to create micro tears with lower weights and there is much less stress on the joints. here is a video where pro bodyuilder kai green explains what im talking about a bit better. the muscle contraction is the most important thing, not the amount of weight you can lift.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=7e5_1342056496

 

[marmel75]

Not necessarily...it all depends how close to your genetic potential you are, your eating and sleeping to support muscle growth...

there are a lot of factors that come into play, not just soreness. Soreness usually is a buildup of metabolic waste in the muscle cells...at one time it was thought to be lactic acid buildup but this was found not to be the case...

 

[TheStig]

Agree with marmel. It could also indicate you've done something out of the realm of what your body has adapted to.

 

[SeymourCake]

Not necessarily. Soreness just means lactic acid build up. It goes away after consecutively working out.

 

[ArcBound]

What I found that is when I got sore, I know I got a good workout.

However, just because I did not get sore, doesn't mean I didn't have a good workout. Sometimes I wouldn't be sore and I would get growth.

 

[marmel75]

Not necessarily. Soreness just means lactic acid build up. It goes away after consecutively working out.

This was found to not be true. Its not lactic acid.

http://www.webexercises.com/2007/08/does-lactic-acid-cause-muscle-soreness.html

 

[Starwolf]

Thanks for the input guys.

I did try out foreverAFC suggestions, i lowered the weight and did more reps while focusing on the muscles.. Lol burns like hell and some soreness the next

Going to continue with this and check the results.

Much appreciated AFC!

 

[Young OG]

Are you drinking a protein or gainer shake after your workout? Your muscles need lots of protein to grow. I also recommend creatine and a multi vitamin with fish oil.

 

[marmel75]

there are many theories and lots of conflicting information out there on the net on this topic. but in my opinion, soreness does = hypertrophy.

ive been lifting since i was 13-14 and im 32 now and im pretty happy with my body. i have some experience and ive tried different things so ill try to explain what ive learned the best that i can.

when it comes to building muscle the most important thing in my opinion is creating the micro tears in the muscle fibers and letting them heal. and it doenst matter whether you create those micro tears with high weights or low weights, hi reps or low reps but it is much easier and safer on the body to create the microtears with lower weights and higher reps. with higher weights you may not even be able to activate or target certain muscles properly. and it also doesnt matter if it takes you 2 hours to create micro tears in the muscle fibers or 20 minutes, which is why duration does not matter much either. its possible to get gains off very few sets or a very brief workout as long as you are able to tear up the muscle fiber. and this is why you want to be as efficient with your workout as possible. there are ways to combine certain compound exercises with good intensity to create substantial muscle tears in a short amount of time. for example, if you only did squats and shoulder presses for 20 minutes at a good intensity and keep hitting muscle failure over and over in those 20 minutes, you could create a substantial amount of micro tears over a large portion of your body.

this is also the reason why focusing on strength is a waste of time in my opinion. i see guys in the gym doing powerlifts at low reps expecting to get bodybuilding type aesthetics. or guys trying to build up their chest by struggling to bench press tons of weight instead of lowering the weight and tearing up the muscle easier. its easier and more effective to create micro tears with lower weights and there is much less stress on the joints. here is a video where pro bodyuilder kai green explains what im talking about a bit better. the muscle contraction is the most important thing, not the amount of weight you can lift.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=7e5_1342056496

I agree with some of this and disagree with some of this.

Intensity is the number 1 difference maker in the gym. Lifting more weight in less time. The reason why so few people workout intensely is because its physically draining. Not just when you are doing it but for at least a day after, if not longer. It's hard work and a lot of pain. And most people just don't want it badly enough to put up with that type of stuff. They want the result without putting in the work and dealing with the pain. They want to eat the 7 course meal but do none of the work preparing it. No amount of time spent or weight lifted or "cool" new exercises done can replace intensity. And this is why you will see so few people getting the results they want or are capable of.

However, every type of training has its purpose. Different types of weight/rep ranges target different types of muscles. Heavy weights and lower reps especially in compound type movements have a tremendous "thickening" effect on the muscles. After you've been in the gym and seen enough people you know what this looks like. Look at a guy sideways. The heavier weights he lifts, the thicker he will be when looking at him sideways---traps, chest, back, shoulders, etc...heavier weights build bigger muscles, period.

There is no way a person deadlifting 250 lbs 12 times for 5 sets is going to be as thick or as strong looking as a guy deadlifting 550 lbs 3 times for 3 sets is. Just not happening. Those dudes that look like Brahma Bulls got like that for a reason---they lift heavy weights. Now, if that isn't the goal you want to achieve, then there is nothing wrong with that. But to say there is no purpose for them to be lifting heavy is downright ridiculous and simply wrong. Not only that, but those heavy lifting sessions translate over when you go back to lifting lighter weights because you will be able to lift much more weight than you initially would be able to for the same rep count. So for instance, if you are repping 275 lbs Deadlifting for 12 reps for 4 sets, then do 6 weeks where you are lifting 400 lbs for 3 sets of 3, and then go back to doing 12 sets of 4, you will probably be able to do the same 4 sets of 12 reps but with heavier weight than initially. Why? Because you have gained strength and muscle from lifting heavier.

 

[foreverAFC]

There is no way a person deadlifting 250 lbs 12 times for 5 sets is going to be as thick or as strong looking as a guy deadlifting 550 lbs 3 times for 3 sets is. Just not happening. Those dudes that look like Brahma Bulls got like that for a reason---they lift heavy weights. Now, if that isn't the goal you want to achieve, then there is nothing wrong with that. But to say there is no purpose for them to be lifting heavy is downright ridiculous and simply wrong. Not only that, but those heavy lifting sessions translate over when you go back to lifting lighter weights because you will be able to lift much more weight than you initially would be able to for the same rep count. So for instance, if you are repping 275 lbs Deadlifting for 12 reps for 4 sets, then do 6 weeks where you are lifting 400 lbs for 3 sets of 3, and then go back to doing 12 sets of 4, you will probably be able to do the same 4 sets of 12 reps but with heavier weight than initially. Why? Because you have gained strength and muscle from lifting heavier.

actually, my experience has been the opposite. i noticed there were quite few guys at my gym deadlifting and benching much more weight than me for lower reps, but they all looked like they didnt even work out. they were only doing reps in the 1-3 range, all for power, while i had way more hypertrophy all over my body from doing higher reps and really working my muscles instead of focusing on lifting more weight.

for me i dont care about lifting more weight or doing more reps unless it helps me get better contractions and cause more mictrotrauma in my muscles. its not my primarily goal. all i care about is stimulating hypertrophy. however, i do mix it up and always like to add two or three quick low rep heavy sets after i have torn up the muscle properly with higher rep sets. i find those heavy reps at the end can help to cause even more microtrauma in the muscle groups as long as i have worked them with lower reps. so yeah why not mix them up and do both.

here is what cali muscle has to say about hi reps
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHqC9t8lfgw

 

[marmel75]

actually, my experience has been the opposite. i noticed there were quite few guys at my gym deadlifting and benching much more weight than me for lower reps, but they all looked like they didnt even work out. they were only doing reps in the 1-3 range, all for power, while i had way more hypertrophy all over my body from doing higher reps and really working my muscles instead of focusing on lifting more weight.

for me i dont care about lifting more weight or doing more reps unless it helps me get better contractions and cause more mictrotrauma in my muscles. its not my primarily goal. all i care about is stimulating hypertrophy. however, i do mix it up and always like to add two or three quick low rep heavy sets after i have torn up the muscle properly with higher rep sets. i find those heavy reps at the end can help to cause even more microtrauma in the muscle groups as long as i have worked them with lower reps. so yeah why not mix them up and do both.

here is what cali muscle has to say about hi reps
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHqC9t8lfgw

Kali Muscle is on so many grams of gear, insulin. HGH, and albuterol, etc that no matter what he does it doesn't matter...dude does gay for pay to fund all his gear purchasing apparently as well...

http://forum.simplyshredded.com/topic/11007/page/1/kali-muscle-being-exposed/

 

[foreverAFC]

Kali Muscle is on so many grams of gear, insulin. HGH, and albuterol, etc that no matter what he does it doesn't matter...dude does gay for pay to fund all his gear purchasing apparently as well...

http://forum.simplyshredded.com/topic/11007/page/1/kali-muscle-being-exposed/

i know, all those guys are on juice. even mike ohearn, and all the others who claim to be all natural on youtube. the point is, even at his size he recommends higher reps for building muscle. he clearly said that higher reps arent just for steroids users. he takes lots of drugs for sure, but i dont and higher reps and focusing on muscle contractions over the amount of weight being lifted is what worked better for me, though like i said i like to combine both higher rep sets with a few heavy ones at the end, but only for the purpouse of creating more mictrorauma in the muscle groups.

if you look at this ridiculous old school arnold instructional, you can see all the lifts are in the higher rep ranges for stimulating hypertrophy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wMQrCkjmGvk