So she showed High IL, you AFC, she runs, You ignore her, Now she's back, Now What?

[Likeathink]

Concisely,

• Girl shows all signs of High IL
• I AFCed b/c I didn't know better
• She loses IL, mentions LJBF
• I stop calling her
• She calls 13 times and says "she's worried, are you okay?"
• We start talking again
• I find sosuave.net
• I realize I was doing things completely wrong, so I try to change my ways. I'm not very good at C&F, but I think I'm being a little too cold compared to before. She wonders why I don't always get the phone like I used to. She started to act AFC towards me as she wonders why I'm not giving her the same attention. But I'm a lot colder than before and don't want to turn her off completely

What's your advice, gentlemen?

Background info
I will change slowly and surely as I apply the principles of "successful living" from the DJ Bible to my life. BUT I'm really just starting out, I'm terrible with girls still, technically have no plates, and hoping this would work out with her as a ltr or fwb.

I'm sure some of you will say just walk away, but I do really like her, and want to try at least try and not give up without being AFC (if that isn't too much of an oxymoron), and build some experience.

 

[MacAvoy]

Keep your contact to a minimum. Only talk on the phone to set up dates with her, this is even more so important in your case because you've already been LJBF'd.

If she asks why you don't always pick up, or whatever, just tell her that your busy. Remember you are the prize, she has to chase you. But don't get sucked into her traps of talking and seeing how your doing, she's just doing that to string you along so she can always have control and power over you, so she can have the last word.

Thats why no contact is so powerful and effective. Two more pieces of advice, start spinning new plates (find new women to start dating at the same time) and read the bible, its the most valuable part of this site, not the advice any one on her gives you.

Knowledge is power and the knowledge that anyone shares with you here is found in the bible, and explained much more clearly.

 

[Likeathink]

We're going out on a date today, does that mean I still don't show signs of attraction, and withold?
I guess it depends on how she acts?

(flirting, kino,etc)

 

[My Name is Nobody]

I would definetely try to escalate if it's a date.

 

[MacAvoy]

My advice was for when your not with her. Do your normal stuff during a date, c/f, flirting, kino, etc...

 

[CGE333]

Also, as far as the date goes, get in, make sure both of you have a great time, and get out. In other words, amp it up a little, bust on her w/ the C & F, add some kino, and then end the date. Keep her wanting more.

 

[Mr. Me]

She just may want the attention and when you stopped calling her, that's when she went after you to get you to call her with the "I'm worried about you" ruse.

Her agenda may be all about keeping you as one of her orbiting male satellites.

It's YOU, not HER, who thinks you're being a "a little too cold compared to before", so there's nothing to be concerned about. Keep it up.

If she's expressed her curiosity as to why you don't jump on answering the phone like you used to, that's because she's fishing for an answer as she's bothered that you don't jump at her bait anymore.

Getting out of the Friend Zone is near impossible, but that being said, just in case this can still be reversed... On your date with her, I'd act cool and not show signs of interest, or at the very least, send mixed messages. If there's anything there on her part, she'll likely pursue you if you do that. I'm afraid that if you show signs of interest, her curiosity and her ego will be satisfied, and she'll back off again. This date may be about her doing reconnaissance work to find out where you're at.

 

[Latinoman]

I wouldn't even date her. I would date ANOTHER woman. And then...and only then (assuming it does not work with the other)...I might consider her.

You going out with her...after she put you in the LJBF...is a clear indication that SHE is important to you. But if you would have gone out with her...AFTER dating another woman (or few others)...it will force her to qualify herself.

My bet is that she is going to LJBF you again in the near future...or if you manage to be with her...she will probably swing branches in the near future.

But I might be very wrong too.

 

[joekerr31]

when a woman sees you as a stud, when she sees you as an alpha male, when she sees you as a MAN she won't ask questions like 'are you alright?"

she sees you as an orbiter. she's only asking if you are alright to check on your status as an orbiter.

right now she's probably a little frustrated and thinks she might lose you as an orbiter. so she is going to go out on a date with you and see if she can get you all worked up over her again.

when a woman knows you are a man, and knows that you have other options if you so decide, they won't say 'are you alright?' they will say 'i've been missing you. when can we get together?"

here is the thing, go out with her, BUT, you need to flip the script on her. when you go on this 'date', in your own mind you need to pretend that its like you are going out with one of your male buddies. keep it super light, joke around, HAVE A GOOD TIME!

do not make any moves on her. if she starts to flirt, reciprocate, but not with flirting, but rather 'palling around' like you would with a male friend.

at the end of the date do not kiss her. just say 'thanks for the fun time. i'll catch ya around' and leave. (note: DO NOT create any awkward lulls. act just like you would if you were dropping a buddy off at home. make it a quick pleasant goodbye)

then don't call her or answer any of her calls right away.

trust me, if she has a great time with you and you don't fall for her flirting and attempts to put you back in your orbiter role, she'll start to think that she has to earn your interest. that batting her eyelashes isn't enough.

 

[joekerr31]

fyi, i agree with latino, which is why you have to LBJF her first! when you do that they often end up desperately wanting you.

 

[Bible_Belt]

she sees you as an orbiter.

lol @ "oribiter." That is a good term. My gf has a flock of those. I call them her "stable of fawning losers." She has admitted to me that it is a recent revelation in her life that she can still get men to do what she wants without giving them sex. What she has essentially discovered is the AFC nature of most men. I am the only guy who will drop her as soon as I stop getting what I want, which is why she is in my bed as I type this, not theirs. To me, that is the dividing line between DJ and AFC.

To the OP, fwiw, the 'too busy' routine is in part an implication that you might have another girl. I have another gf who is crazy about me, and she is getting a perfect 'too busy' routine out of me, because I really am busy with another girl. If a woman senses that she has to compete, it raises your value in her eyes and puts her on her best behavior. That other girl, the only thing she ever says to me is "OK!" and about all we do is have sex. That's what you're trying to achieve with the tactics you are reading about here.

 

[guru1000]

I believe anything is possible. I believe with the correct FORMULA and action, there is a possibility to have her right where you want her. The problem is FORMULAS only work temporarily, GENUINITY is permanent.

However for me, I could never go back. Its contradicts who I am. I feel to go back with a woman who just LJBF'ed you, compromises your Integrity as a MAN.

For a woman to say LJBF, she is really saying "I know you have strong feelings for me, but I just do not feel the same for you". She is also saying "I think I can do better." This is her GAME now. She took CONTROL and you are following along.

Now what is your goal? To prove to yourself that you are good enough. Are you striving for EXTERNAL VALIDATION?

You need to take a step back and evaluate who you are. What are you willing to compromise in life? Is this girl that important that you will compromise your BOUNDARIES as a MAN? If so, the relationship is already lost.

Now all of a sudden, you stop contacting her. She no longer recieves her EXTERNALLY VALIDATED CONFIDENCE. You are a great source of that. SO she calls you back numerous times because she knows she has a HOLD on you. Remember, this is her GAME now. Eventually you answer, and now you have another date.

This is what she will now do. Follow me. She will reel you back in, establish RAPPORT, recieve her EXTERNALLY VALIDATED CONFIDENCE and then LJBF you again.

This is the CLASSICAL " You need to learn the HARD way".

It seems like your mind is made up about your course of action. When this is all said and done, ESTABLISH YOUR BOUNDARIES AND NEVER COMPROMISE THEM AGAIN.

 

[Likeathink]

Profound posts, thanks bros.

If it's cool, I'd like your complete input on what happened.

Although I did Not get to read this before I left on the date yesterday, here's what happened.

It is what it is. And I'll swallow my pride and say it exactly how it was.



She definitely thinks she has the power.
I tried to throw her off by not supplicating to all her confidence seeking validations, but with my (currently improving) low experience and slow wits, I wasn't able to turn the tables around.

She was pretty carefree, funny, outgoing, and was really being herself... wasn't nervous, shy, shared fun and interesting stories, and wasn't afraid of what to say. She always tries to pick up the tab which I love (we ended spending about $100 each yesterday). And she looked damn hot yesterday. She was being touchy in a flirty way, leaning into me, did some kino,holding my hand as a tease, then letting go, slapping me on the rear...damn broad. When I had my arm around her, she'd remove it from time to time. She did look bored a lot.

Me: I was being nervous, and am naturally a good listener, so ended up only feeding back things once in awhile. I wasn't myself and hated it. When I felt down, I tried to psych myself out positively, met that with some good results, and later freed up much more after a couple of drinks in the evening. She also doesn't listen attentively when I'm talking. And bro's, you'll hate me for this but I was listening to her about her close female friend who hurt her trust. She let me hold her briefly at the end of the night, and we said our goodbyes.

**** And you know what? I found out through her indirect communication, that she gives her key out to a male who "walks her dog" for her when she's out at school or work. I know he's not a BF, but the fact that he called her from her place at 11 at night, has the keys to her house, and she mentioned that he is "mean to her" but "loves her dog." --- (WTF do you make of that? To me it sounds like the guy is getting some, I tried to deny it before but it's quite obvious, is it not? Even though she tried to play the innocent card in the beginning when she showed high IL in me.


I admit it. Right now I am not at the point I want to be in , in my life. If it was me six years ago when I was at my prime, I could've easily had a fully good time yesterday. But depression wrecked me for the last few years, although this is the year where I'm going to be seeing many positive changes. :yes:

The good news is: I now see her as a piece of meat, and I don't feel all fvcked up and goo-goo ga-ga by her not returning feelings. It's' all good.

Bros, any insight and comments ALWAYS appreciated.

 

[CGE333]

My feeling, you probably have no shot here. Unless you are her Dr you will never see this lady naked. Continue to work on improving yourself. Just think about how confident you would've been last night if you were juggling a couple of other women or at the very least had met some women last weekend and got a few fresh numbers. Don't get so hung up on one woman and put her on a pedastal-otherwise in a few weeks you'll be the chump walking her dog

 

[Mr. Wise]

Wow, I been there over and over again though haven't quite gotten the right results because of my behavior. You care about her so that makes everything different. When I don't care about the chick my attitude is "ok, come back, leave whatever you want is fine". When I do care, I try to make things better and try to prove to her that I'm of value which apparently makes things worse - a situation I'm in now.

If you get another chance with her, make sure she sees your attitude is "whatever you want babe is fine with me". I notice the girl keeps coming back for more after that.

Edit: Referring to your last post. If you're writing here discussing your problem with a chick, she without a doubt, DOES have the power.

 

[Mr. Wise]

This is SOOOO true. I can't tell you how many LJBF can turn into more if you start spinning plates and dating other girls.

It's like the key to them realizing they made a mistake.

Sorry, I haven't read through all the posts but saw this response.

You know what? This is a prime opportunity to give her what she wants. If she LJBF'ed you and wants to go out again, then you can actually turn this thing around by giving her exactly what she wants.

ACT AS IF she's just a friend to you and no longer a female of interest. Tell her, "hey, up until this point I bought all the fvckin' drinks, now that we're just friends you buy the fvckin' round!!!". Make her wonder how the heck she lost you.

 

[Latinoman]

Edit: Referring to your last post. If you're writing here discussing your problem with a chick, she without a doubt, DOES have the power.

Depends.

If the person is simply sharing an EXPERIENCE (and that person has good control of his life)...then what that person is doing is educating others based on his experience. And that's actually good as it allows us to understand things that with might have not experience.

 

[Mr. Wise]

ACT AS IF she's just a friend to you and no longer a female of interest. Tell her, "hey, up until this point I bought all the fvckin' drinks, now that we're just friends you buy the fvckin' round!!!". Make her wonder how the heck she lost you.

Ok, you don't have to be this harsh but you get the message. What I'm getting at is to say things you'd say to one of your buddies, just leave out the swearing and meaness or she'll get the feeling that you're bitter about the whole situation - which shows she got to you. Send her a message WITHOUT SAYING IT or being uptight about it, that you just want to be friends with her.

Latinoman: I agree, and may have jumped the gun on that one.

 

[Likeathink]

As an update,

I almost thought I would fall for her, wait and keep trying when she said,

"I need to know if you really like me first, before we take this further..."

"It takes me so long to fall in love with someone, because I've been hurt in the past, and I can't trust most guys."

"You are such a close friend to me..."

======

But I cut her off. DAMN it's hard but this is what I decided and I NEED to do this to move forward and build my confidence back up, rather than letting her pick it apart every time she would meet me.

This falling apart was good in an ironic way, because I found this site while agonizing over her a few weeks back, and now the BIBLE has given me some optimism and life tips to take me into the next phase.

I'm seeing a couple of girls this week, although I have NO inner game right now. I'm doing it to try to remind myself that there are other good girls out there.

I hate thinking that I'll be remembered as the @$$h0le that cut her off (in her mind) but I feel I did the right thing.

Moving Forward :box:

 

[reset]

I had a girl like this once and just flat out refused to be friends with her. I didn't know any better either, I was just looking out for me, wasn't really thinking of her. She told me the same type of stuff, that's what they say to keep you around.

I was honest with her and just said "no, I don't make friends with girls. Nothing personal. I just won't do it. I can't handle something like that. We are not friends"

And she threw herself at me a few days later and we started making out and a few months later I wanted to die. Girls like this need attention.

She sounds like a player dude. Don't worry about her feelings. Trust me, you are not the first to be in this situation with her.