Should I stay or move on?

[Alerosa]

My first wife died suddenly in 1993 after 24 years of marriage. In mid 2001 I began dating a widow whose husband died in late 2000. We married in June, 2003. I am now 59 and semi-retired; she is 54 and is retired. She is an only child, and has no siblings.

It seems while I was dating her we got along marvellousley. We enjoyed many activities together such as golf, movies, dining, travel, etc. Our sex life seemed terrific, I thought. I was a bit apprehensive at the time that she was just "on the rebound" after her husband's death, but we discussed that, and she disagreed that would be a problem in our relationship.

She has a son and daughter from her first marriage. In late 2004 her daughter gave birth to a son, and my wife agreed to look after the baby two days each week while her daughter worked at her career. I was not a part of this decision...my wife told me she was doing this. Both her daughter and son-in-law work full time.

Now it seems my wife is devoted to her grandson and daughter's family at every moment. When she is not away at her daughter's, she is on the phone with her, or doing something for her grandson. On weekends, she cooks dinner for them and has them over. Maybe I am just being selfish, but we seem to spend less and less time together doing things. I do not discuss sex with her unless she initiates it, since she is tired when she comes home from looking after her grandson. I have two daughters from my first marriage, but they live far away. I still see them, but not on a daily basis. I am just uncomfortable having her family in my face on a daily basis. Perhaps a reflection on my rural upbringing, while she has lived in the city all her life. As well, her first husband was never at home (worked as a fireman and housebuilder), and she finds it uncomfortable having me around the house when I am not working.

I don't know what to do. We took marriage counselling a year ago but did not seem to change much. Basically I was told to adjust to her family or leave the relationship if I was unhappy. Can you give my some advice? Did I make a mistake? More and more I feel this to be so. I find that we really do not have many similar interests. I sometimes feel I got used—that she needed a man around to help when she needed it—but now that she is secure, she can pursue her own interests. Is it time to move out and move on? Any help appreciated. Thanks.

 

[MacAvoy]

Sounds like you need to find a hobby. Start spending more time doing things that you enjoy. Its only natural for two people to get tired of each other if they spend too much time together.

I think if you start doing things for yourself, you'll see an improvement in your relationship and your own outlook on life. Spin more plates. Become the prize, you've become too reliable for her.

 

[Bad_Lil'Pixie]

You lost your wife at a young age, so you know first hand what it means to live life to the fullest.

Are you???

I don't think so, I think it is great that you gave this relationship a lot of effort with communication and counceling. You didn't turn your back on it or throw in the towel without a good try.

But you need more. Sure you could go to your grave without stirring up trouble or creating hurt feelings, you could go on denying what you need for everyones sake. Not me buddy, I will slide in the grave sideways yelling, Holy Sh*T, what a ride!

You need more from a woman, more then your wife seems willing to give.

My opinion is to end it, seek out a woman that will focus on her man, his needs and his desires. You only have one ticket to this life, there is no second chances.

Listen to these guys too, I am just a chick, what do I know! *winks* LOL

I am glad you are here and wish you the best!

 

[Desdinova]

Man, this is a tough spot you're in. Sounds like your relationship has fallen into a rut. The biggest question is, how did it get there?

Something happened along the way where she started losing her respect for you, and lost interest in you. Your relationship is stuck in the "comfort zone" where the two of you are together because that's the way your lives are, not necessarily because you love for each other.

It's usually easier to start fresh with a new woman than to fix your problems with the old one. If you're willing to take on a huge challenge, then work on the rebuilding. However, don't expect overnight results.

It's rather difficult to tell exactly where things went wrong with your relationship, and what you need to correct to avoid making the same mistakes again. Try reading the various posts on here made by guys who's relationships have failed, and read the responses to why the relationships failed. Do a search for "LTR" (Long Term Relationship). You should get a good idea of what happened in yours.

The only thing I can really suggest for starters is to think back to the time that you were dating. Think of the things you did back then, the places you went, and the things you said. What you did back then attracted her to you. What are you doing different now?

You might have to make an appointment to take her out for a fun night, since her schedule is full of her family.

We took marriage counselling a year ago but did not seem to change much. Basically I was told to adjust to her family or leave the relationship if I was unhappy.

So in other words, you were told that everyone else is more important in this marriage than you. The two most important people in your marriage are you and her. Unfortunately, she doesn't see it that way.

 

[Wyldfire]

I'm a bit confused about a few things you've written...there are a lot of contradictions. First you say that your wife watches her grandson two days a week and that they come over for dinner on the weekend. It sounds like 3 days out of 7 the way you explained it. The baby was also born the end of 2004 and you went to marriage counselling a year ago...which would be when the baby was only a few months old.

To me, that sounds like you were upset right from the beginning about your wife spending time with her new grandson. I'm going to attempt to explain how I'm guessing your wife was viewing things. I think that might help you figure out where the problems started and what the real source of them are.

Your wife has a new grandson (perhaps her first grandchild?)...and mothers tend to look forward to the day they become a grandmother. Of course she wants to spend time with him. If she is retired and wants to watch her grandson two days a week she shouldn't have to ask you if that's okay. It's her grandson...she's enjoying watching him. If you got mad or resentful of her for wanting to do that and it showed in how you behaved towards her or treated her...she had to feel like you were trying to ruin her happiness of spending time with her grandson. The fact that you went into counselling SO quickly after the baby came indicates that this is exactly what you did. As a result, you just ended up pushing her further away from you and closer to those who she's happy around...her daughter and that grandson.

Yes, he's not your blood grandson and you don't have to act like a grandfather to him...but you probably should have. It's not like you would be financially supporting him or raising him...he has a father. Grandparents get to do all the fun stuff...and then send the grandkids back to Mom and Dad for the unpleasant things. The little boy's maternal grandfather is dead and your wife is probably just as hurt that you aren't attempting to share in something so important to her as her grandson as you are that she seems to have lost interest in sharing in things that are important to you. In fact, I would almost guarantee that the two are inter-related.

A marriage is a two way street. You can't just expect your partner to be the only one to make an effort to care about what is important to you...you also need to make the effort to care about what is important to them.

Try to put yourself in your wife's position for a moment. Let's say it was one of your children who lived nearby and had a new baby. How would you feel if your wife got jealous of your grandchild and you ended up in counselling over it? How would you feel if your wife resented your family coming to visit or talking on the phone.

So, there is now a little toddler boy who you could be taking fishing, teaching to play golf and doing fun things with right along side your wife. However, because of how you handled it in the beginning you now have a wife who feels like you can't stand her children and grandchild and she feels like you don't want them around. Since they are a big part of who your wife is, she has to be feeling that she's not very welcome either...so she spends more and more time with those who act like they want her around and love her...unconditionally.

If you want your marriage to straighten out and for things to work you need to make some kind of effort to show that you care about her happiness and understand that you need to share her with the other people she loves.

 

[Alerosa]

Gee, I wish I had found this site sooner! I have only been here a few hours and you have responded to me with such good advice! Thank you folks!
I did take up the hobby thing and started a part time job again, but so far this has not seemed to improve my happiness level. The more I ponder this, the more I think the best thing is to leave and start over, even at my age. I thought I had found the right one even after being single again for 8 years and dating a number of women. I should have followed my intuition! Anyway, I will give this a little more time. Thanks again for your kind responses. I look forward to any further comments you or others may have. Have a nice day there!

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

ALEROSA: I can't begin to tell you how often I've listened to stories like your own from men your age in my internship. You want companionship into your retirement and the commonality of experiences you shared with your (now) wife most likely led to your proposing marriage to her. The problem is she's turned you into a security blanket now rather than a husband. One very common theme I experience among older couples is the woman occupying herself with outside activities at the expense of the husband's attention. This usually comes in the form of 'created' family responsibilities or sometimes even a seemingly unhealthy devotion to a pet. These are generally what I call a 'fillibuster' technique. They legitimize a woman keeping a husband they're experiencing a waning desire for at a convenient distance, but not so much as to become a guilty party should he complain or decide to end the relationship.

I can only be so accurate in my assessment of your situation from the description you give in your initial post, but it seems as if she is conveniently using her assumed family duties to put you on hold. I can also gather that you both attempt to live in some semblance of an egalitarian equality in your relationship rather than observing traditional gender roles. This is obvious in her 'telling' you what she was going to do with regards to her grandchild and not including you in the equation. I can also determine that as widowers and older people, you are both accustomed to a degree of personal independence. Your wife is not ready to let go of this in favor of respecting your position as the Man in the house. In fact there really is no Man or Woman in the egalitarian household - only two persons cohabitating and sharing domestic responsibilities.

I can understand WYLD's point of view in that a new grandchild has it's importance to mother and grandmother, but you still need to communicate to your wife that you are aware of her waning interest in you (however temporary this may be). You cannot do this in an OVERT fashion - I can't emphasize this enough; if you do so by sulking or trying to have some heartfelt confession of how you think you're being treated, you will only put yourself into the position of being another "baby" for her to look after. Women respond to COVERT communication, they must feel as if they are "figuring you out" and adjust they're behaviors accordingly. The minute you spill your guts on the table, her perception of you changes and you lose confidence in her sight.

I think you're on the right path, stick to your guns and wait her out a while longer. She can't be with the kid ALL the time, so in those times she is aware of you, make the most of them. She will eventually tire of the grandma duties. I'd also suggest occupying your time with things that will bolster your esteem. Hit the gym, pick up something that you can do well and apply yourself to it. She will eventually come back around looking for that husband she remembers having, be a better you when she does.

Lastly, let me again state that you need to be the Man. Egalitarian equality in any relationship is a recipe for divorce. The sexes were intended to be complimentary to each other, not adversarial. Don't be afraid to appear "old fashioned" or "sexist", it's the Man who does what a man ought inspite of these appearances that makes the difference in his family.

 

[Wyldfire]

Rollo...to me, it sounds like how he initially handled the new grandson and his wife's very normal and natural desire to spend time with the new baby is at the root of the distance problem he's experiencing right now. Women are reactive to how the man acts. I do agree that, to an extent, she is now using the baby and her daughter as a wedge and easy out of spending time with him. That being said...I also think he helped create the situation he's in now by handling it poorly in the beginning. A marriage is give and take and if he wants her to retain sincere interest in what matters to him then he really does need to be able to show sincere interest in what matters to her as well. It would have prevented this whole problem if he had of done that from the beginning.

I think he can still salvage things and turn it around...and the way to do that isn't through how he treats his wife but how he views that grandson. If he continues to view the little fella as a competitor, it's going to get worse. If he can learn to view the baby as a precious, dear and very loved person to his wife instead of an interference in his own life I think he'll be better off for it.

 

[Alerosa]

A bit further...I appreciate both your comments Wyld and Rollo. I agree, my biggest mistake was how I intially handled the problem. After our conselling, I did really attempt to improve my relationship with her children. In fact, right now it is not too bad, and I do get along real fine with her little grandson, and I play with him a lot when we are together. That has helped a lot with the relationship with my wife and her children. My problem is my feeling of being "left out" by my wife just don't go away. At the moment her whole life is tied up it seems with her family. My hope is like Rollo says, she might tire a bit of being the grandma, and turn back to sharing and doing a few things together. We do have other problems in our relationship, this just being one of them.
I had hoped when I retired my wife and I would do things together, realizing that each needs some space, but this one does need a lot of space it seems, and when not grandmothering, she is busy shopping for clothes, attending a spa, massage, or visiting her doctor, exclusively "her activities." Right or wrong, I seem to be developing a "checklist" where the cons exceed the pros by a wide margin. Feels like a leaky pail....just too many holes to plug to make a fix.

 

[Bad_Lil'Pixie]

Alerosa - Needless to say, the decision will ultimately be yours to make. You know all the details and those involved. I am sure there is so much more that could be said about your life with your current wife then can be portrayed in a few paragraphs of text. I also think you have put a lot of thought into your situation before presenting it today.

I firmly believe that in a relationship lovers have to keep each other first and foremost, in front of extended family, friends and yes, even their children. Balance can be achieved, a happy medium can be found, IF both are willing. I do not see this happening in your life. Sure there are temporary situations that can distract one another, but this does not seem to be temporary. She has made her choice in the direction of her devotions and that choice is not you.

To me you have a "roommate marriage". I am sure there are days (and nights) you feel more like her roommate, her brother or worse yet, her child.

You and her need more then each of you are giving. She is aware of your feelings, she is aware you want more for your relationship, yet she chooses to apply herself to her child over you.

I am guessing she wants less grief, she probably wants to give more and may hold back to appease you, she may want less guilt, less stress and more freedom to be with her children.

I have to think this grandchild just brought out the differences in you and her. You married her NOT knowing this would happen; she wasn't a grandmother at the time. People change and lives take turns that cannot be seen until they happen. If a balance can not be achieved, then to me, the marriage will not be successful

Again, life is short and should never be lived unfulfilled.

 

[Desdinova]

If he continues to view the little fella as a competitor, it's going to get worse. If he can learn to view the baby as a precious, dear and very loved person to his wife instead of an interference in his own life I think he'll be better off for it.

This is a good point, Wyld. It's kinda like when you wanna steal a woman from her bf.... spend time with the guy!

 

[Wyldfire]

She won't ever tire of her grandchild or being a grandmother...but eventually she will start to show more interest in other things as well. And yes, she also needs to show some interest in things that are important to you. She's not innocent in this, either.

You've already been to counselling, and I'm guessing you got all the resentments and bad feelings out in the open by doing that. What many people do after counselling is just leave all that stuff out in the open and not bother resolve it or even talk about it after counselling...but it's still floating around in both of your heads.

Here is what I would do...

Sit her down and tell her that you're not happy with how things are between the two of you and that you suspect she isn't either...and you want to see if you can fix that. Acknowledge that you handled the new grandson poorly and that you are really trying to improve that...as it sounds that you have. From there you need to tell her that it's important to you that you enjoy these years of your life and that your partner want to share their life with you as well and that you just aren't feeling like she's wanting to do that now. Ask her if she is willing to work with you to fix that or not. If she isn't willing then tell her that even though you have made mistakes, you can't fix things by yourself and since she is unwilling to do her party you feel it's best that you part ways. Unless she has a change of heart and is sincerely ready to do her part to fix things, you should probably get divorced.

Just handle the situation so that you are showing equal respect for both her AND you. If she's not willing to do her part, then divorce is probably the only recourse, because no one should be married and still feel alone.

 

[Desdinova]

My problem is my feeling of being "left out" by my wife just don't go away.

I know it doesn't go away, but remember, she's the one who's missing out on spending time with a great guy! Until she realizes this, start focussing on your own projects and take up some new ones. While she's busy ignoring you, keep yourself busy. After all, the only thing that really matters is yourself. This woman may stay around or she may go, but you'll always have yourself. This is the sole reason to take good care of yourself! Do things that you enjoy. Focussing on her for your source of happiness won't work because it's not a steady supply. The only person who can bring you happiness is yourself. Everyone else can push your moods in a different direction, but your moods and feelings come from inside.

Don't rely on other people to make you happy. If this woman didn't exist in your life, where would you get your happiness from? Simple answer: YOURSELF.

I had hoped when I retired my wife and I would do things together, realizing that each needs some space, but this one does need a lot of space it seems, and when not grandmothering, she is busy shopping for clothes, attending a spa, massage, or visiting her doctor, exclusively "her activities."

Well, let her have her activities. Begin doing your own things, but always ask her if she'd like to join you. Show her that you're going to continue living your life whether she comes along or not. If she sees what a great time you're having canoeing, fishing, building a gazebo, she'll be more inclined to join you because she KNOWS she's missing out.

 

[Alerosa]

Lil'Pixie, you have it right 100 percent! Exactly right

 

[Alerosa]

Thanks for all your help! Sorry my last post got cut off. I will wait a little longer and work some more at it.