Selector/Selectee

[Ranger]

Selector/selectee
This is an odd subject. Biologically men are the selectors and the women dress to kill in the hopes of attracting a high value man. Her ability and attractiveness are tools but her best agency is always sex.
I suspect that I still have a little bit of beta programming in there somewhere.

It’s been said that “you just have to work on yourself and increase your value.”

I understand. But that doesn’t rewire a programmed thought process in a man. I know lots of high end men that are total AFC’s.
Despite being the cream of the crop.

So I do understand how women are trained to think they are the “selectors” but how do we buy into it? What are the mechanics of that coming from the feminine imperative.

Sexual successes I’ve enjoyed had a certain feel to it. Like I instinctively knew I was the selector. It flowed easily and effortlessly. And I know that the woman was making herself available for it to happen. Sometimes overtly because she wanted to be selected for breeding. Badly.

So how did we get to this place where women flipped the script? Why do men default to being the selectee? Do they think that women really are that precious?
This has been a sticking point for me.

 

[Soflobro#3]

Selector/selectee
This is an odd subject. Biologically men are the selectors and the women dress to kill in the hopes of attracting a high value man. Her ability and attractiveness are tools but her best agency is always sex.
I suspect that I still have a little bit of beta programming in there somewhere.

It’s been said that “you just have to work on yourself and increase your value.”

I understand. But that doesn’t rewire a programmed thought process in a man. I know lots of high end men that are total AFC’s.
Despite being the cream of the crop.

So I do understand how women are trained to think they are the “selectors” but how do we buy into it? What are the mechanics of that coming from the feminine imperative.

Sexual successes I’ve enjoyed had a certain feel to it. Like I instinctively knew I was the selector. It flowed easily and effortlessly. And I know that the woman was making herself available for it to happen. Sometimes overtly because she wanted to be selected for breeding. Badly.

So how did we get to this place where women flipped the script? Why do men default to being the selectee? Do they think that women really are that precious?
This has been a sticking point for me.

You choose each other. However women have more options at any given time so theres that. Yes beta males treat women like they're precious.

 

[rber]

This could be explained by simple supply & demand don't you think?
If I recall correctly - 90% of women go after the top 10% of men.
That means 90% of men are fighting over 10% of the women.

Of course as life progresses people settle, smvs change, etc, but that's the core of the dynamic as far as I understand.

Why is the dynamic even like that? I believe it has to do with the sexual market deregulation. The moment the world became a free for all f*ck fest that's what you get, natural selection at its best.

 

[Ranger]

I think you’re both right but how does that solve it for a man? What is his leverage, so to speak?
If it’s just plain economics, why are so many of the cream of the crop beta cucked?

 

[Ranger]

Tomassi talks about how the feminine imperative turned it around backwards to facilitate the optimization of Hypergamy or if you don’t believe in Hypergamy, to protect and mask her natural slvt tendensies.

 

[Ranger]

You choose each other. However women have more options at any given time so theres that. Yes beta males treat women like they're precious.

Does she choose or does she filter out betas? She runs her filter, or rather her biology does.

 

[rber]

I think you’re both right but how does that solve it for a man? What is his leverage, so to speak?
If it’s just plain economics, why are so many of the cream of the crop beta cucked?

That top 10% is not defined by plain economics - I think it's defined by alpha traits, or otherwise by men that are closest to meeting both sides of hypergamy, in which economics are indeed a factor.
The only solution I see is climbing to the top of the social ladder and becoming that guy that women want - being their best option.
That or looking for a different social ladder somewhere else in which you'll have a higher value as you are now - i.e. being their best option in that specific ladder.

 

[Ranger]

That top 10% is not defined by plain economics - I think it's defined by alpha traits, or otherwise by men that are closest to meeting both sides of hypergamy, in which economics are indeed a factor.
The only solution I see is climbing to the top of the social ladder and becoming that guy that women want.
That or looking for a different social ladder somewhere else in which you'll have a higher value as you are now.

I’m in agreement with this even before I posted this thread. Maybe I need to communicate it differently. How did it get flipped on us, if indeed we are the selectors and women are the filters?

 

[AJ84]

Selector/selectee
This is an odd subject. Biologically men are the selectors and the women dress to kill in the hopes of attracting a high value man. Her ability and attractiveness are tools but her best agency is always sex.
I suspect that I still have a little bit of beta programming in there somewhere.

It’s been said that “you just have to work on yourself and increase your value.”

I understand. But that doesn’t rewire a programmed thought process in a man. I know lots of high end men that are total AFC’s.
Despite being the cream of the crop.

So I do understand how women are trained to think they are the “selectors” but how do we buy into it? What are the mechanics of that coming from the feminine imperative.

Sexual successes I’ve enjoyed had a certain feel to it. Like I instinctively knew I was the selector. It flowed easily and effortlessly. And I know that the woman was making herself available for it to happen. Sometimes overtly because she wanted to be selected for breeding. Badly.

So how did we get to this place where women flipped the script? Why do men default to being the selectee? Do they think that women really are that precious?
This has been a sticking point for me.

Women are the selectors when it comes to who they choose to have sex with, but men are the selectors when it comes to who they choose to have a relationship with.

We all want validation in some way from the opposite sex, even if some of us here won’t admit that. Heck, to some extent we want validation from everyone in our lives do we not? To be seen as having value. Or maybe that’s just me lol.

People see validation in a negative light but I don’t think it’s always a negative thing, if it leads to behaviours and feelings that benefit both the person seeking it and the person giving it.

The relationship is what matters more to most women, not just the sex, which women can get anywhere/ anytime. Women usually don’t get validation from sex because they know it could mean absolutely nothing for the guy, just a warm body to bust a nut in. Validation comes from being chosen to be his exclusive partner. She was selected out of others he could of chosen. This is the end goal for most women. She is the selectee and you are the selector where it really counts for most women.

I may be off here, but it seems that men are more likely to get validation for being selected to have sex with her out of others she could of chosen, but making a commitment to her means giving up something of himself that may put him at a disadvantage. In that regard he may not see the same kind of value in committing to her that she would see in him choosing to do so. So selecting her doesn’t have the same ring to it as her being selected.

Is that accurate for you guys or am I way way off? Interested to learn more about your perspectives on this.

 

[Ranger]

Women are the selectors when it comes to who they choose to have sex with, but men are the selectors when it comes to who they choose to have a relationship with.

Except, who they feel attracted to is out of there control. If they got to choose who they wanted to have sex with, only the tall dark and handsomes would be getting sex. Attraction is a biological response. Not a conscious decision. She doesn’t have that light switch control.

 

[AJ84]

Except, who they feel attracted to is out of there control. If they got to choose who they wanted to have sex with, only the tall dark and handsomes would be getting sex. Attraction is a biological response. Not a conscious decision. She doesn’t have that light switch control.

Isn’t that out of control and a biological decision for men too though? If you got to choose who you could have sex with would it not be the hottest fittest healthiest girls?

It seems that there is a biological aspect to physical attraction that is not in men nor women’s control, but beyond the physical more logical aspects come into play.
I mean look at guys/ girls who put up with crap behaviour from hot girls/ guys vs guys/ girls who don’t.
The ones who don’t put up with it are going beyond the aspects of attraction that are outside of their control and using their logic (logically is it worth putting up with this sh*t just because he or she is hot?). To me that illustrates control.
Most people are not dating from within a basic biological context (breeding, passing on the best genes etc), even if that is our basic biological purpose.
I’m not sure if I’m articulating this the right way, I’m a little sleepy.

 

[Mike32ct]

Women are the selectors when it comes to who they choose to have sex with, but men are the selectors when it comes to who they choose to have a relationship with.

We all want validation in some way from the opposite sex, even if some of us here won’t admit that. Heck, to some extent we want validation from everyone in our lives do we not? To be seen as having value. Or maybe that’s just me lol.

People see validation in a negative light but I don’t think it’s always a negative thing, if it leads to behaviours and feelings that benefit both the person seeking it and the person giving it.

The relationship is what matters more to most women, not just the sex, which women can get anywhere/ anytime. Women usually don’t get validation from sex because they know it could mean absolutely nothing for the guy, just a warm body to bust a nut in. Validation comes from being chosen to be his exclusive partner. She was selected out of others he could of chosen. This is the end goal for most women. She is the selectee and you are the selector where it really counts for most women.

I may be off here, but it seems that men are more likely to get validation for being selected to have sex with her out of others she could of chosen, but making a commitment to her means giving up something of himself that may put him at a disadvantage. In that regard he may not see the same kind of value in committing to her that she would see in him choosing to do so. So selecting her doesn’t have the same ring to it as her being selected.

Is that accurate for you guys or am I way way off? Interested to learn more about your perspectives on this.

Women are the initial selectors for both sex and relationships. If she doesn’t want to date or F him, that man has zero relationship power over her. The guy’s relationship power comes second, only after clearing the initial attraction hurdle.

I agree with all your validation comments 100 percent.

 

[Ranger]

So selector is mostly passive here - there are guys interested but only one of the will be chosen. Usually the strongest option available.

I have uncertainty in my mind because of similar conflicts of data. So let’s seperate the TWO seperate concepts.
1) the selector/selectee concept
2) the chaser/the one being chased concept.

These are linked but they are not identical. In fact they are miles apart.

 

[Ranger]

I think there is some beta in every post so far. Including my confusion.
Frame. I’m looking at frame right now. So a well put together man, a Rational Male, completely unplugged man who is himself and not his social programming has a stronger frame than a plugged in man.

So who has the stronger frame. The chaser or the one being chased?

 

[Mr Wright]

So who has the stronger frame. The chaser or the one being chased?

The person who is invested least has the stronger frame. So if you're looking generally, it's women who hold the frame, so they get the provide the narrative about how the seduction plays out. This is the reality for the vast majority of guys. But it's the "chosen" few men who have their choice of women who get to provide the narrative in their interactions. These guys are the ones who pump and dump, the guys who have multiple girlfriends and are seemingly never without an option. Don't forget how sexually scarce most men are, that's what makes them desperate. It's this mindset that makes all the difference.

But I agree with the notion that women are the selectors at the start, as a man you need to pass a threshold test. Past that test, get her into bed then the ball is in your court. The biggest indication on what kind of guy you are and how well you pass that threshold test is how quickly you bang the cute "good girls", the girls who have slept with 2-3 guys in their life. If you bed those girls quickly, you are something women want. That is a man who can walk into a room, pick a girl he likes and make things happen with her. This is not every guy, women may only meet one or two guys like this in her life.

 

[Ranger]

The person who is invested least has the stronger frame. So if you're looking generally, it's women who hold the frame, so they get the provide the narrative about how the seduction plays out. This is the reality for the vast majority of guys. But it's the "chosen" few men who have their choice of women who get to provide the narrative in their interactions. These guys are the ones who pump and dump, the guys who have multiple girlfriends and are seemingly never without an option. Don't forget how sexually scarce most men are, that's what makes them desperate. It's this mindset that makes all the difference.

But I agree with the notion that women are the selectors at the start, as a man you need to pass a threshold test. Past that test, get her into bed then the ball is in your court. The biggest indication on what kind of guy you are and how well you pass that threshold test is how quickly you bang the cute "good girls", the girls who have slept with 2-3 guys in their life. If you bed those girls quickly, you are something women want. That is a man who can walk into a room, pick a girl he likes and make things happen with her. This is not every guy, women may only meet one or two guys like this in her life.

Well the reason I asked this question is that let’s say I’m going out. If the intent is to meet women...the frame is allready wrong.
Women get dressed up and vie for attention or selection from men. Their competition is actually amongst other women.
So if they are the selectors, why would they care what other women are doing? They would just go out and grab Mr. Brad Pit and it’s a done. True I know it’s more complex than that.

Women are bored and they get chased like rabbits. Obviously they don’t want men that chase. There’s no challenge. So, here’s my point. They want to have to work for the guy, right? At least that’s what has been claimed. Why would they work for a guy if she’s the selector? Wouldn’t she just get closer to the guy, walk by more often, in some covert way let him know she’s there? This is an opening for him to select her. Now obviously her filter is running in the background in case he’s a chump.
Do you see the disconnect? Both can’t be truths. Either one or the other or both must be wrong.
Ockham’s razor.

So if a man rejects her it’s much worse for her than for us. So she has to be coy and subtle to give herself an out. Ego preservation. It’s just too much to bear.

 

[Ranger]

From the female perspective, which is your analysis, even if they have 10000 male 10s it doesn't matter because "they don't want those guys." The one guy she wants is her only optoon.

Right. She doesn’t see 1000 10’s. So how can she be the selector? She can’t be. That one she wants but is having trouble getting him has to be the selector. Not her. She’s the selectee.
With men running around thinking...I have to do this, that and stand on my head and do tons of training to be selected is not inside the right paradigm. It’s the wrong model.
A guy goes out and chases. He gets 10 numbers but so few Pan out because he was on a hunt. That’s the wrong model.

 

[Ranger]

Because the actual relationship dynamic is her maintaining harems of orbiters and not investing. Actions not words.

I’m probably not communicating this well.
I can see the truth that the orbiters are selectees. That’s their model. I have to be selected. But they aren’t selected, at least not normally. Maybe in a pinch.
The selectee model doesn’t work. Self evident. Done. Full stop.
To get the man she really wants she will not select a chaser. Full stop.
Thus she doesn’t even want to be the selector. She wants her filter to tell her who to present herself to for selection by any various means of covert presentations. Full stop.

How can she then be the selector? Full stop.

 

[Ranger]

You point about disliking the chaser is way overstated and there is an underlying presumption of monogamy that does not exist anymore. My experience is women monkey branching from one alpha to another, or harems of alpha males.

I agree. Completely. I’m looking at base science.

A chaser WOULDN’t be a guy who walks up to her as the selector in the proper male dominance model and lets her know that he exists by smashing (metaphorically) her filter and then ending the interaction first.
That would not be my definition of a chaser.

Because chasers are hungry and don’t get laid. They never make it through her filter. They dont really exist.

So does she select? Or does she dress up, hide her flaws and show her assets in the hopes that a dominant man will enter her sphere and decide she is attractive enough, based on her actual SMV to be selected?

Betas aren’t even in this equation. They don’t exist. They are background noise to try and filter through to get to the candy.

 

[Ranger]

Think of her filter like a little girl that was out trick or treating on Halloween. She comes in and dumps her candy on the carpet and picks out all the good stuff and then gives all the junk candy to her fat little brother who will eventually get it all down.
Based on her assumed SMV and what she can attract, betas are non-entities. Debris floating in the river. Background noise that irritates her a lot of the time. Unless she needs help moving or needs a quick ego stroke.