quads/vertical leap

[madgame]

If I just started working my legs out recently and Im able to increase my leg press (havent started squats yet because of my knees...) by about 50% (just an example) does this mean Ill be able to jump higher, if (everything else stays the same) ?

I know working out calves help 2, but I read that most of the power really comes from the hips, etc. when you jump. Besides I know that doing legpresses in a fast motion is done to improve your vertical also, but I read that increasing your maximum strength (ordinary squats, leg presses, etc.) will help you a great deal in jumping. Has anybody made experiences like that? Like they could definetly jump higher after increasing their squats for example?

 

[Templeton]

I would ditch the leg press and not be overly concerned with calf work in order to increase your vertical jump. Concentrate on your quads, hams, glutes and lower back. So squats definately. Deadlifts, Good Mornings and assuming you have access to one, a good lying leg curl - the quality from one make to another varies massively.

Also try Glute/Ham Raises if you can, one of the hardest exercises you will ever do. Kneel on the floor with a partner holding your ankles down, hands on hips or across chest then go forward from the knees as far as possible then come back. Try not to bend at the waist. You may only be able to go forward an inch or two when you first try it. Do a search and see if you can find a pic, far more useful than me trying to explain it.

 

[The Natural]

Go To www.t-mag.com. They have an article called "The Pro Maker" they interview this guy who trains pro athletes and guys who want to make it. He talks about Vertical leap and how to improve it. Check it out


ps If you like the NBA check out slamonline.com and read The Links by lang Whitaker. Dude brings you the latest **** and behind the scenes info everyday.

 

[bogman2121]

Originally posted by Templeton
I would ditch the leg press and not be overly concerned with calf work in order to increase your vertical jump. Concentrate on your quads, hams, glutes and lower back. So squats definately.

leg press is fine to do in fact i would use it over squats if you dont have anyone to lift with and you plan on using heavy weight just as a safety precaution because it works the same muscles and isn't as rough on your back.

 

[Person]

Originally posted by bogman2121
leg press is fine to do in fact i would use it over squats if you dont have anyone to lift with and you plan on using heavy weight just as a safety precaution because it works the same muscles and isn't as rough on your back.

Obviously, you are not fast nor have a good verticle because the leg press is virtually useless in sport training.

madgame- why can't you do squats if you can do leg press? How are squats any different on your knees?

Go here for good information on weight training and increasing your verticle. http://www.defrancostraining.com/articles/archive/article_fab15.htm

 

[madgame]

Man I know what u thinking..I just started working out my legs..had done like 4 workouts for them and yesterday I squatted once..dont get me wrong..it might sound like im opposed to doing squats which im really not..but yesterday i did 3 sets of leg presses and 1 single set of squats and today I have my left knee hurting again ..just a little though..no biggie but i prefer being careful bout that (used to have an injury on my left knee). I mean maybe it was related to something different (got little sleep last night for example) but...this is the first time i squatted and now my knee`s hurting a little again...I know this osunds like a major excuse, but Im really not the type of guy to do the more convienient exercises and making excuses for them...for example Ive never worked out my upperbody with anything different but barbells..no machines or anything at all..cause first of all i prefer free weights and besides everybody says they`re better than machines anyways (cuase of the other little muscles which stabilize)...........Anyways I just did one set of squats and now my knee is hurting again. So Im gonna do leg presses for the next 3 months (till my next cutting phase) and after that cutting phase im hopefully gonna be able to start squatting.
If u say leg presses are useless for sports performance i dont really get u cause they mostly work out the same muscles as squats (except for the stabilizing muscles) and I bet if i can increase my leg press by a lot Ill also be able to squat more...get what I mean? Anyways I didnt really think squats were more harming to my knees or anything, but know Im kinda doubting what I thought......or at least I seem to not be ready yet..I really hope on being able to start them soon tho...its probably just that my leg muscles are too weak compared to the rest of my body...

 

[mikel]

I tried the Jump Soles when I was about 16, My vertical leap right now is about 39-40 inchs, the jump-soles didn't move it 1 INCH. But Squats do help your strength when you jump alot, because I started squatting for football and in basketball games I was able to jump up and slam it down with 2 people hanging on me, but my leap in inch didn't go up much enough to note.

The way I got my leap up was one summer when I was about 13 I started trying to throw it down on a 9 foot goal ALL day, Then I just moved it up to 10 foot and did it after about a week of trying.

But My mom was a college volleyball player and my dad was a college football player So I think alot of it is genetics.

 

[Person]

How tall are you mickel?

BTW the leg press is useless for many reasons. You do not get nearly the same range of motion, you do not work the stabilizers (THE MOST IMPORTANT THING IN YOUR LEGS PRACTICALLY), and leg presses make it easier to cheat. You may feel like you are doing everything right, but one little arch in your back and you have another 25+lbs. on there. I've seen many "leg press allstars" who can do 500+ but then on squats they can barely eek out 225lbs, if that. I was wrong in saying they're totally useless, but by the way 99.99999% of people doing them it is. For rehabilitation, I can understand, but no other reason. I'd go with leg curls to hit the hamstrings too if you can do that.

 

[madgame]

Yeah Im working out my hamstrings with leg curls too. I hope I can switch to squats instead of leg presses in a while also, cause Ive always preferred free weights actually.

But Squats do help your strength when you jump alot, because I started squatting for football and in basketball games I was able to jump up and slam it down with 2 people hanging on me, but my leap in inch didn't go up much enough to note.

Sorry, but I dont really get this. You're saying it helps your strength when you jump a lot, but your vertical wont go up?
If thats what u mean, did you witness your (maximum) squat (or maximum squat for a certain number) of legs go up significantly? Because you said u did that at 13 or so..and I still remember when I was working out at that age I didnt really know enough about weight training to really get any results, cause I didnt even have the idea that you might have to be able to increase the weights your lifting, nor the amount of protein you have to take in, etc...so all I did was work out but not properly and thus thought I just didnt get stronger, cause I was still too young to pack on muscle mass.

 

[Person]

Originally posted by madgame
Yeah Im working out my hamstrings with leg curls too. I hope I can switch to squats instead of leg presses in a while also, cause Ive always preferred free weights actually.



Sorry, but I dont really get this. You're saying it helps your strength when you jump a lot, but your vertical wont go up?
If thats what u mean, did you witness your (maximum) squat (or maximum squat for a certain number) of legs go up significantly? Because you said u did that at 13 or so..and I still remember when I was working out at that age I didnt really know enough about weight training to really get any results, cause I didnt even have the idea that you might have to be able to increase the weights your lifting, nor the amount of protein you have to take in, etc...so all I did was work out but not properly and thus thought I just didnt get stronger, cause I was still too young to pack on muscle mass.

What will probably help more than squats, leg press, etc. are power cleans and snatches. They are olympic lifts which take a lot of power, which is what you need for a good verticle. Plyometrics would probably also be a better way of going about things. No doubt squats are extremely important, but cleans, snatches, and plyos are probably more important to your particular goal. Why do you just want to increase your verticle anyway? If you're playing bball, why not work on your midrange jumper and shooting skills, which most players, even pros, lack.

 

[madgame]

Nah increasing my vertical isnt my priority goal, I know it helps your game, but I think shooting skills are more important to be able to pull of fancy dunks or jump a little higher. I was just wondering if strengthening your legs would help you jump higher (just a theoretical question...).

 

[Person]

Strength will only carry over if other GPP and SPP work is done with it. This includes plyometrics, olympic lifting, ballistic movements, and various on court work.

 

[mikel]

.

Im about 6-3-1/2' and 6-4'.

What I meant was that I noticed more spring in my leap but my vertical never went up. Dont really know how to explain it other way, thats was just my expierence.

 

[bogman2121]

Originally posted by Person
Obviously, you are not fast nor have a good verticle because the leg press is virtually useless in sport training.B]

obviously im not fast and dont have a good vertical because im not a varsity sprinter on my track team. i dont know what i was thinking, leg press is virtually useless in training because it works all the same muscles as squat and does it without putting too much pressure on your back. from now on i'll keep my obviously inferior facts to myself and let geniuses like you dish out flawed information to people who ask for help and expect knowledgable answers.

lets see here squat uses - QUADRICEPS (RECTUS FEMORIS, VASTUT LATERALIS, VASTUS MEDIALIS, VASTUS INTERMEDIUS), HAMSTRINGS (SEMIMEMBRANOSUS, SEMITENDINOSUS, BICEPS FEMORIS), BUTTOCKS (GLUTEUS MAXIMUS)

and leg press uses - QUADRICEPS (RECTUS FEMORIS, VASTUT LATERALIS, VASTUS MEDIALIS, VASTUS INTERMEDIUS), HAMSTRINGS (SEMIMEMBRANOSUS, SEMITENDINOSUS, BICEPS FEMORIS), BUTTOCKS (GLUTEUS MAXIMUS)

looks to me like they work the exact same muscles. LEG PRESS IS FINE

just incase anyone feels like looking this is for squat

and leg press

 

[madgame]

I usually prefer free weights too and I guess squats might be a little better than leg presses, because they work the "stabilizers" or what they're called, but I think saying leg presses are useless and squats are the **** is definetly exaggerated...

 

[victor von doom]

Originally posted by madgame
I usually prefer free weights too and I guess squats might be a little better than leg presses, because they work the "stabilizers" or what they're called, but I think saying leg presses are useless and squats are the **** is definetly exaggerated...

to improve your vertical leap you must do the following:

1. work on your calves

2. be as lean as possible.. less fat weight = more hops

3. jump squats (work on your fast-twitch explosiveness)

4. heavy squats

5. do vertical leap drills

6. With all this training chances are you are not going to put 10inches on your vertical.

vertical leap is basically genetic and primarily determined by your ratio of fast-twitch fibers in the body. There is only so much training you can do improve your vert.. if you're not born with serious hops, chances are you'll never get them.

 

[Templeton]

Why is this thread still going? Read the t-mag article "The Pro Maker" that The Natural linked and be done with it.

Rather than argue the merits of the leg press or what not, read what a recognised expert in the field says.