Need advice on how to pull this off.

[Ready_2_Rock]

So I met this girl in one of my college classes about a month ago, I think shes one of the best women that I have chosen to spend my time with. She comes home with me and we sit in my room sometimes between classes, and tends to seek me out in places on campus she knows I will be. Yesterday she came over to do homework of which we never ended up doing, we laid on my bed and ended up in a tickling match, that turned to cuddling, hand holding and hugging.I kissed her on the cheek and forehead then went for the lips and she turned her head. but then continued to hug me. Now for the big problem...shes engaged to a guy shes been with for a year and a half, she has told me that she is having second thoughts about being with him. Today we talked about it and she said I scared her when i tried to kiss her lips, so I told her i did nto mean to do that and thought she was intrested in me. She wrote back and told me that she is intrested in me and hugging her and the kissing on the cheek and stuff is fine but she does not want to start anyhitng with someone while she is with someone else and that she wants to take our friendship slow and get to know each other more. I could use some advice for how to handle this to make sure im the one that gets the girl...so bring it on friends.

 

[ENIGMA16]

She's keeping you around because she wants to get in your pants but she's afraid to get in your pants because she still wants to be with her fiance. Escalate and go for it or next her.

 

[I'm in the Mood]

No. You should play hard to get and take interest away from her (without being an a$$hole.)
Let her miss spending all that time with you.

Don't take your friendship slow and let her get to know you so easily - that will most likely land you in the friendzone.

 

[Skydiver43127]

Escalate again.
Not moving away after rejecting your kiss means that she's not afraid from a next attempt. She's afraid if she lets you kiss her that easily you're going to think she is a sl*t. So she'll reject you several times just to be on the safe side, but eventually submit.

 

[I'm in the Mood]

Escalate again.
Not moving away after rejecting your kiss means that she's not afraid from a next attempt. She's afraid if she lets you kiss her that easily you're going to think she is a sl*t. So she'll reject you several times just to be on the safe side, but eventually submit.

She's not afraid of being a slvt by you kissing her, it's that she has a boyfriend and is interested in another guy at the same time.

If you want to date her, DON'T try to escalate.
You are on the right track with this one at the moment, and your next move could destroy attraction depending on what you do.

It's much harder to advance physically when girls have boyfriends, and you will come off as needy (unattractive) if you try too many times while her answer remains "no."

She said you SCARED her. This is a red flag, pull back.

You can't scare a woman into a relationship with you.

 

[Skydiver43127]

"She said you SCARED her. This is a red flag, pull back."

What she says doesn't count. Especially what she says on the next day after hours of thinking what a good girl should say in such a situation. Only what she does counts.

Anyway, you lowered your chances significantly by not making the next attempt a short time after the first. Then you would achieve two things:
1) You'd get an sincere emotional reaction and you'd know what's going on instead of listening to us argue about it.
2) You'd have made your sexual interest clear, making her know you take responcibility for escalating and are not just testing the waters
Oh, and 3) she might have kissed you back

Taking action and being rejected is better than not doing anything.

My advice for now would be to wait a few days keeping your distance, until she starts wondering what's going on. In the meantime date other girls, cold approach, ect. - don't just stand arond idle. As long as you do that you can postpone the next date - but when it comes make it one where you can escalate, not platonic. And DO escalate.

 

[thecurtainfalls]

She is attracted to you. If you really want her, escalate further. You have encountered two lovely acronyms with one girl - ASD (Anti Slut Defense) and LMR (Last Minute Resistance). Neither is the end of the world. Good luck!

 

[I'm in the Mood]

What she says doesn't count. Especially what she says on the next day after hours of thinking what a good girl should say in such a situation. Only what she does counts.

What she did: reject his kiss attempt and continue to hug him.

What this means: "I like you but I can't have a relationship with you right now."

What you should do: Yes, by all means pursue other girls. Do NOT get involved with this one until she dumps her boyfriend. Everyone here is telling you to escalate, but I'm telling you NOT to escalate, because as long as she has this boyfriend she can fall back on, your chances are EXTREMELY low.

An alternative would be, when things start to escalate, tell her that you don't want to be just friends and won't do anything with her until she's single. Then you should probably leave to create some tension.

Good luck..

 

[Igetit!]

What she did: reject his kiss attempt and continue to hug him.

What this means: "I like you but I can't have a relationship with you right now."

What you should do: Yes, by all means pursue other girls. Do NOT get involved with this one until she dumps her boyfriend. Everyone here is telling you to escalate, but I'm telling you NOT to escalate, because as long as she has this boyfriend she can fall back on, your chances are EXTREMELY low.

An alternative would be, when things start to escalate, tell her that you don't want to be just friends and won't do anything with her until she's single. Then you should probably leave to create some tension.

Good luck..

This is THE BEST advice in the whole thread thus far...


+1 rep.




Now personally,I thought it was already over after just the first 2 or 3 sentences.



Man,I HATE IT when guys get involved and DECEIVED like this. They get deceived by what appears to be IOIs.




It looks like what Horaholic said about a guy being a "surrogate boyfriend" applies here as well.




This girl is getting all of her emotional needs met by the OP...

the need to feel desired/wanted by a man

the need for emotional intimacy




She's getting basically all this from the OP,but her need/desire for sex is SOLELY RESERVED for her boyfriend/fiancee.





It's EASY TO TELL when a girl is playing you for emotional need because everything else will be there minus sexuality.




That's why she turned her head when he tried to kiss her.





And all these other things...


"Thinking she the best girl YOU'VE CHOSEN to spend time with"

"Comes to your house and sits in your room between classes"

"Tickling matches"

"Kissing her on the cheek/forehead"



If all of that was in addition to a sexual relationship,that would be good,REAL GOOD.



That would mean you two have a strong relationship. But all that without sexuality just screams "Friendzone" to me.




And this:

She wrote back and told me that she is interested in me and hugging her and the kissing on the cheek and stuff is fine but she does not want to start anyhitng with someone while she is with someone else

So she told you it's ok to hug her and kiss her on the cheek,which are both signs of affection,NOT sexuality or sexual attraction.




Basically what she said there that she's interested in getting affection from you,not anything sexual.


Her fiancee handles the sexual part.




And her statement about taking things slow...


Translation:"I want to keep you on the hook for as long as I can. So the slower I can drag this thing out,the more attention and emotional affection I can get".




A romantic kiss is a sign of sexual intimacy. She wouldn't kiss you. She rejected you when you tried.



That means she rejected your attempt at sexual intimacy with her.





Personally,I'd just move on...unless you're content with tickle fights,cheek and forehead kisses,and such.

 

[Gangster Of Love]

She is attracted to you. If you really want her, escalate further. You have encountered two lovely acronyms with one girl - ASD (Anti Slut Defense) and LMR (Last Minute Resistance). Neither is the end of the world. Good luck!

Those two acronyms don't necesarily apply to this type of context.

Anti Slut Defense would apply even two months later, in the mind of a chick with a boyfriend.

LMR? More of a FMR, First Minute Resistance, in this case. LMR is right before having sex, going all the way.

This one is playing games with both him and her boyfriend.

To the OP. Don't state, imply, or communicate that you want an exclusive relationship with a woman who is not available for one. If played right, you might get a friends with benefits type of situation for now. If (BIG IF)she's attracted enough to you, she might agree to that, given you are not pressuring her to leave her boyfriend and keep it discreet. Looks more like you are playing the companion without sex role in her life. I would cut out the time with her and start actively prospecting.

 

[thecurtainfalls]

It depends what the OP is interested in. If all he cares about is hooking up with this girl (and based on her actions, that's all I'd be interested in), then why on earth shouldn't he try and escalate further when the attraction is clearly there?

From what some of you guys are saying, you'd think that nobody ever hooks up with a chick that has a boyfriend, and that any initial resistance to the idea is a firm NO and the girl is instantly an attention wh0re. Now, we don't necessarily know the particulars of the situation, but I've been involved in similar situations where YES, the girl was exhibiting Anti-Slut Defense. She is attracted to you but feels guilty because she has a boyfriend. Boo hoo - she's still spending time alone cuddling with you. She wants it. But don't take it from me, there's clearly a consensus steering you in the other direction Good luck.

 

[Igetit!]

It depends what the OP is interested in. If all he cares about is hooking up with this girl (and based on her actions, that's all I'd be interested in),

Well he already said what it was he was interested in.



In his second sentence,he said...

I think shes one of the best women I have chosen to spend my time with.

Then he went on to say how she comes over to his room between classes,tracks him down on campus,etc.



From that,it's clear to me he'd like a relationship with her,since HE HAS CHOSEN to spend time with her.

then why on earth shouldn't he try and escalate further when the attraction is clearly there?

He ALREADY did that. He ALREADY tried to escalate.




He said that they spend time together,talk,she goes over to his place,tickle each other,hug,gives kisses on the cheek,etc,etc.




To me,the next step in escalating would be to kiss her...romantically.



Well,he did that. Got denied. He escalated,as you suggested he should do,and got turned down.



So she hugs him,
talks with him,
walks with him,
visits him at his place,
seeks him out on campus,
let's him give her "Grandma" kisses on the cheek...


She does ALL THAT,but she won't kiss him,yet you say the "attraction" is clearly there?

From what some of you guys are saying, you'd think that nobody ever hooks up with a chick that has a boyfriend,

Well of course not. It clearly happens all the time.

and that any initial resistance to the idea is a firm NO and the girl is instantly an attention wh0re.

Initial resistance??? He said he met her a month ago.


If all this has been dragging on this long,and he hasn't got a kiss after a month,yet she's still going to his place,tracking him down on campus,and all the other things she's doing,I'm sorry,I say AW.

Now, we don't necessarily know the particulars of the situation, but I've been involved in similar situations where YES, the girl was exhibiting Anti-Slut Defense. She is attracted to you but feels guilty because she has a boyfriend.

ASD is a woman wanting to avoid FEELING like a slvt. It has NOTHING TO DO with her having a boyfriend or not.



She can be single,and get ASD. ASD is her not wanting to FEEL like a slvt,not her trying to avoid guilt for cheating.



A girl can cheat and NOT have ASD with the guy she's cheating with.

there's clearly a consensus steering you in the other direction Good luck.

Well you're right about how we don't know all the particulars here,therefore we're basing on responses on what the OP HAS said.



Personally,I think he's in the friendzone,and it's over with...as far as dating her.



But if he wants to go for it,I won't tell him not to.

 

[Skydiver43127]

If all this has been dragging on this long,and he hasn't got a kiss after a month,yet she's still going to his place,tracking him down on campus,and all the other things she's doing,I'm sorry,I say AW.

It's hardly the girl's fault he waited a month to try and kiss her. What is she expected to do, try to kiss HIM?

All this is besides the point though. The point is:
You escalate, you get rejected, but the girl's still there and you can escalate again if yoy wish. Then what?

I say assume the rejection is not final and escalate again. What other choice do you have anyway? Talk about it? Wait for her to chance her mind? Pressure her into satisfying some moral standard? (breaking with the bf).

And what's the worst that could happen? Get a stronger, final rejection and be forced to move on? Hell, that's a win-win situation if you ask me.

I've had a girl reject me kissing her 3-4 times over multiple dates. First 1-2 she just rejected the kiss. I tried the same later. The next 1-2 times she said "not now". I tried the same later. Big surprise - around the 4th or 5th attempt she kissed back.

I've also definitely had cases where I gave up after the first try. Nothing good came out of this. One time I even continued contact with the girl and eventually got oneitis on her.

 

[Ready_2_Rock]

I thank you all for your responses its giving me alot to think about, Is there any reason to think that she would like to be with me but is doing the respectable thing and not cheating on him? and not just leaving him because she wants another? or maybe just is waiting to know for sure I am worth leaving for? And to clear things up we have been in the class together for a month things just got to the stage of this in arount the last week or week and a half. Before that it was pretty much just saying hi to each other and id crack a joke here and there to make her laugh.

 

[Igetit!]

I thank you all for your responses its giving me alot to think about, Is there any reason to think that she would like to be with me but is doing the respectable thing and not cheating on him?

If she wanted to be with you and not with him,the respectable thing to do would be to break up with her boyfriend instead of cheating,then date you.



I'm kinda iffy on women having "respect" when it comes to dating/sexual relationships.



I believe that if she really wanted to be with you,she'd make it happen.

She'd find a way to break up with her boyfriend,then see you.





Besides,if she really wanted to be "respectful" towards her boyfriend,she wouldn't be going back to your place,laying on the bed with you,hugging,cuddling,and handholding with you WHILE SHE'S ENGAGED TO BE MARRIED.

or maybe just is waiting to know for sure I am worth leaving for?

There may actually be some merit to this because women do this...A LOT.

However,the real question is...


How long are YOU WILLING to be put on the backburner while waiting for her to decide if she wants to date you or not?



I'd hate to go through 2 more months of this only to have her decide she wants to stay with her fiancee...or worst,another guy.

 

[Gangster Of Love]

It's hardly the girl's fault he waited a month to try and kiss her. What is she expected to do, try to kiss HIM?

All this is besides the point though. The point is:
You escalate, you get rejected, but the girl's still there and you can escalate again if yoy wish. Then what?

I say assume the rejection is not final and escalate again. What other choice do you have anyway? Talk about it? Wait for her to chance her mind? Pressure her into satisfying some moral standard? (breaking with the bf).

And what's the worst that could happen? Get a stronger, final rejection and be forced to move on? Hell, that's a win-win situation if you ask me.

I've had a girl reject me kissing her 3-4 times over multiple dates. First 1-2 she just rejected the kiss. I tried the same later. The next 1-2 times she said "not now". I tried the same later. Big surprise - around the 4th or 5th attempt she kissed back.

I've also definitely had cases where I gave up after the first try. Nothing good came out of this. One time I even continued contact with the girl and eventually got oneitis on her.

Sure, if you have time to play games, "will she kiss back, or she wont?" type of stuff. He's playing "kissing games" while her boyfriend is jack-hammering her. He can instead get working on other prospects, which he should already be doing.

 

[Ready_2_Rock]

OK, heres the update...she was over 2 days ago and I went to kiss her and she did not turn this time. We made out for close to an hour. The next day she tells me that its all she can think about. She keeps bringing it up when we talk. she also kept talking about her shirt smelled like me and it made her miss me. How do I get rid of this other guy? it seems like it will probly happen naturally but I kinda want to rush it. any more advice?

 

[Danton1975]

How do you get rid of the other guy? By not thinking about HIM, not bringing him up in conversations, and definitely not mentioning him to her. This will position you as very secure and mature to her. Also, YOU don't get rid of the other guy. SHE does. You simply make sure you are having fun together and try to flip as many of her attraction switches. Go about it as if she were single rather than engaged. Bear in mind though, she may not be LTR material.