My routine, give your opinion.

[dastal]

My routine

Ive seen many people put up their routine to be scrutinied by the masses(pun intended) and thought It wouldnt hurt if I did the same.
5'3'' 118 lbs
Monday - Back, Biceps, Forearms

Back

Pull ups - 3x4-6
Rows - 3x 4-6
Deadlifts 3x4-6
shrugs 3x 6-8

Bis

Chinups - 2x4-6
Curls 3x4-6
Concentration Curls 3x4-6

Forearms( not sure whats best here)

Hammer Curls 2x4-6
wrist curls 2x4-6
reverse wrist curls 2x4-6

Wednesday Chest, Shoulders, Triceps

Chest
Dips 3x4-6
Bench press 3x4-6
Flys 2x4-6
pullovers 2x4-6

Tris

Dips again (am I doing too many?) 3x4-6
Extentions 3x4-6

Shoulders
Shoulder Press 3x 4-6
Military press 2x4-6

Friday Legs, abs

Legs (do deadlifts work the hamstrings properly? I need a good hamstring exercise without machines.)

Squat 3x 4-6
Calf raises 3x 8-10
Reverse calf raises 3x8-10
Seated raises 3x8-10

Abs
4x10-12 crunches (situps dont do anything to me
Leg raises 2x4-6 (cant do anymore)
Twisting situps 2x4-6

If you havent noticed, There is no gym close by, and I make do with what I have.

I do a sh1tload of cardio too, if you want to know.

p.s. 118 sounds small, but I was 106 in january.

Anyway, give me some feedback. I wont make you read anymore.

 

[dastal]

My waist is 27'' from 26 before. Is this bad?

 

[Lifeforce]

Your routine looks good overall, but get some incline benches in there though. And STIFF LEG deadlifts is an essential exercise for the hamstrings on leg day. Do not confuse these with ordinary deadlifts.

DO NOT in any way train your forearms on back day. Deadlifts put enormous stress on your forearms, so does most back exercises. Forearm training is made on leg or chest day.

Concerning dips, you can do them leaning forward to target chest and lifting on the triceps by being straight.

The thing about doing so low rep ranges is that it's not optimal for muscle growth. Anything from 6 and up to around 12-15 is said to increase the hypertrofi off your muscles. Low reps build strenght more not so much size. What are you looking for? IMO you should try max ot when you have bulked up a little.

And last and very important. Ectos don't do cardio, drop as much as you can off it.

 

[dastal]

thanks a lot




ill bring up the reps to 10-12, what seems like a happy medium, between 6-15.
Im looking for strength more than size anyway. But dont they go hand in hand? I would think that bigger muscles would lift more, but hey, who knows? This isnt my area of expertise.

ll put in some incline presses also. About how much should the incline be? I searched it, and got a lot of different numbers. And, with this talk on Inclines, are declines useful as well?

Ectos don't do cardio, drop as much as you can off it.

I wont. Will eating more make up for the loss of calories? Say, 800-900 calories a day? I can fit that in with a third school lunch.

As I said, thanks a lot.

 

[harwell]

Originally posted by Lifeforce
Your routine looks good overall, but get some incline benches in there though. And STIFF LEG deadlifts is an essential exercise for the hamstrings on leg day. Do not confuse these with ordinary deadlifts.

DO NOT in any way train your forearms on back day. Deadlifts put enormous stress on your forearms, so does most back exercises. Forearm training is made on leg or chest day.

The thing about doing so low rep ranges is that it's not optimal for muscle growth. Anything from 6 and up to around 12-15 is said to increase the hypertrofi off your muscles. Low reps build strenght more not so much size. What are you looking for? IMO you should try max ot when you have bulked up a little.

Quit almost all cardio if your trying to gain mass (weight)

You don't really need to do that many exercises. Thats the point of doing core exercises like bench... it works chest, shoulders, triceps and even a little bicep. You should focus on really wearing yourself out with this alone on say "chest/shoulder day." Make sure you do this exercise first thing.

You dont' need to do shoulder press AND military press... it the same exercise, basically...

Incline isn't necessary if your doing bench... save that one for when you want to change your routine up so you don't plateau (~ 6 weeks down the road) then do like incline and military press... that'd be a great way to mix it up

STIFF legged dead lifts are great for hamstrings...

Work the forearms <B>WHEN</B> you do back and biceps. I'm not sure about the above but I save the stiff legged dead lifts for leg day, and i wouldn't say i get a forearm workout doing them. I guess he's refering to "grip strength." (Some people can't physically hang on to as much weight as they need to get a good hamsting workout. That should develope pretty quickly though.) You want to work them out on this day cause the goal is to work the muscles in groups... when you do say pull ups and bent over rows (below) your working your back, bi's, and forearms all at once, when you do curls your working bi's and forearms. Think of them as a "group". When you do chest exercises like bench and shld. press your working pecs, tri's, and delts (mainly).. another "group"... legs being the third and final "group"


Pull ups (not chin ups) is great for the back and bicepts (mainly back)... treat this like bench press (1st exercise). Bent over rolls with a barbell is another great exercise that hits back and biceps really well too!

As for strength and size... you want to get big? you have to lift big... even more so for strength. If you want pure strength increases you need to be doing 1-4 reps... you want size.. 4-8 rep range... you start going higher reps and you won't be activating the "correct" muscle fibers (called Type IIB). The muscle fibers that give you size and strength are only recruited when you start doing ~60% max weight. You will be using all of these fibers when your doing 85% max.

Think of runners... distance people have thin and skinny legs becasue there not using the Type IIB (high output, fatigue fast) muscle fibers, there using Type IA and IIA (small endurance muscle fibers used for walking jogging) Now thing of sprinters who do the 100 m. They have massive legs cause there going maximum output for short distances, just like lifting weights. They're recruiting the "bulky" Type II B muslce fibers.

And yes, strength and size go hand in hand... just look around you, the biggest guys are throwin' up the biggest weights.. (usually)

If your new to the weight room, start out doing like 10-15 reps with ALL exercises for several weeks until you build up some strength, but more importantly get your form down. FORM IS AN ABSOLUTE MUST! ONLY DO AS MUCH AS WEIGH AS YOU CAN WITH GOOD FORM! You start sacrificing your form and you sacrifice your gains (size and strength).
Ultimately thought your gonnna to have to start do the low reps, big weight if you want to reach your potential when it comes to strength.
Hope this helps! Happy Lifting!

 

[Lifeforce]

Big weights put enormous stress on your CNS in a way higher reps don't. Body builders are often pretty weak compared to powerlifters. The guide DIESEL has with 4-8 rep range is a good starting point if you are looking for both some power and hypertrofi. Muscle size and heavier weights go hand in hand, BUT it's no way the optimal way to gain strength. Lifting heavier weights has to do with the number of nerve endings that attach itself to your muscle fibers, not just increasing the size of the muscles.

Cardio burns muscle, there's no way around this. If you persist with wanting to do cardio do intense cardio off max 15-20 minutes and never combine weight lifting with cardio. Do them with some hours in between if you do them on the same day.

Concerning the dips again. doing 6 sets of dips sounds way to much. Try doing 3, they are one off those exercises where both triceps and pectoralis is worked very hard.

Don't work your forearms on back day if you don't want to overtrain them. Deadlifts, rows, pull-ups, shrugs.. almost everything train your forearms on back day. It's like kicking on someones who's lying if you put more stress on them.

=====================

Harwell. Grip strength and forearm workout is the same thing. The forearms are built up of flexors and extendors. What do you think happen when you lift ****loads of weights in your deadlifts. You rip those suckers apart.

Weighted Chin ups are the **** for developing biceps.

Above 8 reps isn't cardiotraining. Have you ever done a 20 rep squat? Most serious people who lift only for hypertrofi lift 6-12 reps or sim.

 

[Double]

Weighted Chin ups are the **** for developing biceps.

haha mate i remember the time when i asked you why you don't do close grip underhand chin ups, dont remember what you replied but you learned a lot =]

hmm regarding the forearms....in my book the (reverse) wrist curl does target the forearm muscles but other muscles than the reverse biceps curl.....am i right?

 

[Lifeforce]

Originally posted by Double
haha mate i remember the time when i asked you why you don't do close grip underhand chin ups, dont remember what you replied but you learned a lot =]

hmm regarding the forearms....in my book the (reverse) wrist curl does target the forearm muscles but other muscles than the reverse biceps curl.....am i right?

you owned my ass big time...

reverse forearm curl target the flexors of the forearms. The reverse bicep curl target the brachioradialis, I hope my memory serves me right. Might be some brachialis movement to the reverse curl too.

 

[harwell]

Originally posted by Lifeforce
Don't work your forearms on back day if you don't want to overtrain them. Deadlifts, rows, pull-ups, shrugs.. almost everything train your forearms on back day. It's like kicking on someones who's lying if you put more stress on them.

=====================

Harwell. Grip strength and forearm workout is the same thing. The forearms are built up of flexors and extendors. What do you think happen when you lift ****loads of weights in your deadlifts. You rip those suckers apart.

Weighted Chin ups are the **** for developing biceps.

Above 8 reps isn't cardiotraining. Have you ever done a 20 rep squat? Most serious people who lift only for hypertrofi lift 6-12 reps or sim.

First off I know everybody is different physically and some will respond better to different kind of exercises than others. What you have decided to train for also plays a big part in what exercises and rep scheme you choose. Obviously a powerlifter and a golfer (yes people in the PGA work out) will choose different ways to workout.

I myself am trying to gain mass and strength so I've decided to go with 4 work sets with the following reps: 6-8, 4-6, 2-4, 1-2. I try and pick a weight that will let me do that many reps but no more, otherwise its time to increase the poundage. I also dont do as many exericses as what he has listed above.

As for stiff legged dead lifts, your hamstrings and back are the ones pulling that weight up. You shouldn't be focusing on your arms at all, they're jsut along for the ride. Yes it does take strength in arms to "hold on" to the weight, but i wouldn't call that a full blown workout.

Like I said everybody has their own way of working out, but for me I try and group my exercises together so that i'm working "groups" of muscles each session instead of several times a week... that way I get a great workout for each group once a week. For me thats all I need to make good progress.

For me:

Monday
-Bench Press
-Shoulder Press
-Dips

Wednesday
-Squats
-Stiff legged Dead lifts
-Calf raises

Friday
-Pullups
-Bent over rows
-standing dumbell curls
-reverse grip bicep curl (with ez-bar)
(I do the last two back to back with a good rest between each set)

I do use some machines to do one burnout set after I'm done with the main exercises, so I do do a little more than the above, but thats the jist of it...

You sound like an intelligent person and I'm not trying to get in an argument over "who's right." i agree with basically everthing you said except that i would focus on forearms on "back and bicep day" since thats what your working to begin with.

 

[Double]

you aren't that deadlifting?then you are owned anyway! and you can work forearms twice a week lifeforce is right no argument needed.

 

[Lifeforce]

Hey it's nothing like that. It's just I've been there done that on the forearm part. You don't even deadlift so you might want to try that before you advice on this. In deadlifts the first to give away is your grip. No I'm not talking about stiff legs, I'm talking about the real ones. When you get up some poundage on the deadlifts you really get the sourness in the forearms.

If you are talking about reverse grip on the biceps curl, then by all means go ahead and do them. The guy who started this talked about WRIST curls. The wrist flexors and extensors being the major mass on the forearms together with the brachioradialis which make up a small part off it. Doing wrist-exercises after deadlifts is stupid.

 

[harwell]

I've done both, currently I'm doing stiff-legged deadlifts... I've also never had a problem with either, lossing my grip before my legs or back gave out. One hand supinated, the other pronated... works like magic...

I dont do any forearm exercises after deadlifts, those come two days later in my routine.

 

[dastal]

I put forearms that day for the hammer crls, which work both. Thats all. so if I move it to chest day, would I do hammer curls again?

And a new question, how slow do I do the deadlifts? I take ten seconds per rep, 4 up, 4 down, and 2 holding it up. I think its more intense that way.

Im not stopping cardio, I run cross country. and thats a higher priority than size. I do it 5 days a week, not on leg day or the day after. I looked it up on the internet, and I burn only 300 calories with that. I eat 3500 a day. Where does it all go? in the Toilet?

 

[Lifeforce]

Ok, let's focus on the guy who started this thread instead. Wrist curls after deadlifts = bad. Reversed grip biceps curl after deadlifts = ok. IMHO it's better to put the static holds, wrist curls, farmer's walks on chest or leg so you can train the forearms twice a week instead off murdering them on one day. This has worked very well for me even though I haven't been able to deadlift for a while. From my experience I've noted that forearms are very easy to overtrain this is why it's better to split the training on the forearms into two sessions and this is why I persist on the issue. I guess it's up to the starter off the thread to decide.

If you never have had any problems with grip then you're either extremly strong in your grip or lift too light. I have never met a person who hasn't had gripping issues with the deadlifts, not even if they use alternate grip opposed to overhand.

 

[Lifeforce]

Originally posted by dastal
I put forearms that day for the hammer crls, which work both. Thats all. so if I move it to chest day, would I do hammer curls again?

And a new question, how slow do I do the deadlifts? I take ten seconds per rep, 4 up, 4 down, and 2 holding it up. I think its more intense that way.

Im not stopping cardio, I run cross country. and thats a higher priority than size. I do it 5 days a week, not on leg day or the day after. I looked it up on the internet, and I burn only 300 calories with that. I eat 3500 a day. Where does it all go? in the Toilet?

I'm wondering the same thing =) Then I discovered I had a nuclear reactor inplanted just above my ass.

Anyway... hammer curls are all cool to do on the back day, they train the big elbow flexor, not the actual forearm.

On the deadlifts I have no idea. Try experimenting. I've heard from people to go down controlled but fast. I do it pretty similar to you and it has worked for me. If you come up with something feel free to give me a PM.

 

[dastal]

Okay. If I put forearms for two days, do I do only 3 sets each day?

I have a wierd bar with a fancy grip shape thing

you're either extremly strong in your grip or lift too light.

probably the latter. Ill work on it.

I guess he's refering to "grip strength."

are you? I think so. Know any exercises besides squeezing the big magnetic clips? what day should I do it?

After this, I think I can make it.

 

[Lifeforce]

"Okay. If I put forearms for two days, do I do only 3 sets each day?"

you can probably manage up to 5 to 6 sets. I usually go for four or five sets. 3 set Static holds and some wrist curls behind the back.

"probably the latter. Ill work on it. "

That comment wasn't for you mate

"are you? I think so. Know any exercises besides squeezing the big magnetic clips? what day should I do it?"

There are many exercises you can do. Grip training with grippers is good, most powerlifters do that. Static holds where you just stand and hold a db or bb is good. Wrist curls work your flexors/extensors too. To me, forearm training and grip training is the same thing to some degree. Stuff that require heavy grip = journy to overload city = bigger forearms.