macros

[leeroyjenkins]

okay guys, read the workout nutrition thread and I think this is right for my macros now, what do you think?

this is based on 177lb eating at maintenance, 1.2g protein/lb, 0.3g fat/lb and 3g carbs/lb

therefore 3000kcal on days I workout, 2800kcal on days I don't

since I'll be going out of my way to eat fats so they'll be between meals

Workout Day

Meal 1 - 35g carbs, 32g protein

Meal 2 - 35g carbs, 32g protein


2.5 hours before workout - 80g carbs, 25g protein

20 minutes before workout - BCAAs

During workout - 50g simple sugars, 15g whey, 3g creatine, mixed with water

Immediately PWO - BCAAs

15 minutes PWO - 100g simple sugars, 30g whey, 2g creatine, 3g glutamine, multi-vit

1.5 hours PWO - 35g carbs, 32g protein

Meal 3 - 35g carbs, 32g protein

Meal 4 - 35g carbs, 32g protein

Before Bed - 32g protein

Non-workout Day

6 meals, all 38g protein, 63g carbs except before bed, no carbs

 

[Warboss Alex]

Bro, you just gave us half the info..

Are you a fat 177 at 5'2" or a scrawny 177 at 6'4"?

What are you trying to achieve with this diet?

How old are you?

Is this an actual maintainance diet, i.e. you actually do maintain your current body composition/weight on this, or is just an estimate?

Where the hell did you get a 3g per lb of carbs and such a low fat ratio?

Anyone advocating 3g of carbs per lb for a lifter who isn't a teenager with a super metabolism and an active lifestyle should be taken out and shot. If you want to gain weight - which is what I'm assuming - such a high carb intake will ensure weight gain but it won't be all muscle by any stretch of the imagination.

Give us some more info and we can help you better. Right now all I can say is increase the protein to 1.5g per lb, but the rest will entirely depend on you and your specific needs. There can never be one set ratio for everyone.

 

[leeroyjenkins]

Bro, you just gave us half the info..

Are you a fat 177 at 5'2" or a scrawny 177 at 6'4"?

What are you trying to achieve with this diet?

How old are you?

Is this an actual maintainance diet, i.e. you actually do maintain your current body composition/weight on this, or is just an estimate?

Where the hell did you get a 3g per lb of carbs and such a low fat ratio?

Anyone advocating 3g of carbs per lb for a lifter who isn't a teenager with a super metabolism and an active lifestyle should be taken out and shot. If you want to gain weight - which is what I'm assuming - such a high carb intake will ensure weight gain but it won't be all muscle by any stretch of the imagination.

Give us some more info and we can help you better. Right now all I can say is increase the protein to 1.5g per lb, but the rest will entirely depend on you and your specific needs. There can never be one set ratio for everyone.

oops I guess I did make a big mistake! I'm 5'9, 177lb at around 14-15% BF

I read the 3g/lb on bodybuildingforyou.com forums, I guess I should lower that to say 2g/lb?

My goals are to gain lean muscle and lean out a bit too, but mainly the lean gains - therefore I decided to eat at maintenance but with high protein + a clean diet...

so if I up my protein to 1.5g/lb, should my carbs go to say 2.5g/lb and fats to 0.6g/lb?

 

[Warboss Alex]

oops I guess I did make a big mistake! I'm 5'9, 177lb at around 14-15% BF

I read the 3g/lb on bodybuildingforyou.com forums, I guess I should lower that to say 2g/lb?

My goals are to gain lean muscle and lean out a bit too, but mainly the lean gains - therefore I decided to eat at maintenance but with high protein + a clean diet...

so if I up my protein to 1.5g/lb, should my carbs go to say 2.5g/lb and fats to 0.6g/lb?

I don't believe in grams per lb except for protein. I prefer to think in terms of ratios rather than grams, i.e. a 50% protein, 40% fat, 10% carb diet for example:

if you do 1.5g per lb protein, that's about 270g protein a day, if this is 50% of your calories (1350 calories) then you need 1080 calories from fat and 220 from carbs, which amounts to 120g fat and 55g carbs.

Honestly, at 15% bodyfat and 177lbs you have no business taking in high carbs. I would put them around your workouts only and possibly low/no carb the rest of the week (40-50%+ fats), with a carb day until that bodyfat is under control.

I'd also halve your post-workout carbs and definitely not take straight sugar either, I'd go with fast+slow or just slow carbs, i.e. fruit, oats etc. Then I'd have 50-60g carbs the meal after as well, and none for the rest of the day.

 

[leeroyjenkins]

I don't believe in grams per lb except for protein. I prefer to think in terms of ratios rather than grams, i.e. a 50% protein, 40% fat, 10% carb diet for example:

if you do 1.5g per lb protein, that's about 270g protein a day, if this is 50% of your calories (1350 calories) then you need 1080 calories from fat and 220 from carbs, which amounts to 120g fat and 55g carbs.

Honestly, at 15% bodyfat and 177lbs you have no business taking in high carbs. I would put them around your workouts only and possibly low/no carb the rest of the week (40-50%+ fats), with a carb day until that bodyfat is under control.

I'd also halve your post-workout carbs and definitely not take straight sugar either, I'd go with fast+slow or just slow carbs, i.e. fruit, oats etc. Then I'd have 50-60g carbs the meal after as well, and none for the rest of the day.

why so low carbs? I know about keto but can I not just have higher carbs and lower fat? it's just that I find it a lot easier to get carbs than fat...

would I not be able to have all the carbs around my workouts? even if I change them from sugars to more complex?

thanks

 

[fatkins]

If your looking to gain I would raise protein to atleast 1.5/lbs, carbs to 50% with the remaining ~15% fat. If you go with 3k cals then your going to be doing about 17*bw, which is fine but once you stop gaining your going to have to up your overall cals to say 20.

I don't like low carbs, some people do some people don't just preference. I believe carbs are meant to be our main source of energy. Inevitably you'll gain fat bulking, mostly muscle if your eating is spot on, but if you gain too much all you have to do is scale back your carbs (if carbs are making you fat) or fat.

 

[Warboss Alex]

it's not a keto diet, you will take in carbs from green vegetables and a little fruit, plus a carb up day. at 15% bodyfat your carb tolerance and insulin sensitivity is not as good as it could be, and eating more carbs will mean more of the weight you gain will be as bodyfat.

why is it easier to get in more carbs? fat has over twice the calories than carbs do, in a gram. way easier to get more fats. a tablespoon of olive oil has about 14g fat in it, add two tablespoons to a protein drink and that's an extra 28g of fat or 250ish calories, the equivalent of 60g carbs, that's a cup of oatmeal. what's easier to get down, oats or oil?!

you can go the high carbs route if you wish. but if you're worried about LEAN gains then I wouldn't advise it. if you want a middle of the road solution, you can go for a mod carb/mod fat diet. see what works for you.

 

[Warboss Alex]

I believe carbs are meant to be our main source of energy. Inevitably you'll gain fat bulking, mostly muscle if your eating is spot on, but if you gain too much all you have to do is scale back your carbs (if carbs are making you fat) or fat.

No, carbs are not meant to be our source of energy.. fats are a superior energy source and always have been, long before agricultural carbs came along.

the place for carbs is around the workout in controlled amounts, and periodic refeeds. chronic mod-high carb diets are not a good idea.

again, you say 50% carbs so out of 3k calories that would be 1500 calories, or 425g carbs.. not as bad as 500+ but still way too high, especially for someone of 15% bodyfat.

once you know how many carbs you can personally tolerate at a certain leanness, you can add them to your diet and gain muscle with no/little fat, but unless you are at the point of knowing this then a randomly estimated high carb diet is suicide.

 

[leeroyjenkins]

wow...I had no idea there was so much fat in that stuff! in that case, I totally agree, it'd be daft to go with high carbs!

given this, should I be doing...?


- 3000kcal on workout days
- 2800 on non-workout days
- 270g protein/day :. 1080kcal from protein

- high carb around workouts + carbs from fruit/vegetables but otherwise all energy from fats




I know about nuts, olive oil and flaxseed oil but what other good fat sources are there?

 

[Warboss Alex]

wow...I had no idea there was so much fat in that stuff! in that case, I totally agree, it'd be daft to go with high carbs!

given this, should I be doing...?


- 3000kcal on workout days
- 2800 on non-workout days
- 270g protein/day :. 1080kcal from protein

- high carb around workouts + carbs from fruit/vegetables but otherwise all energy from fats

I know about nuts, olive oil and flaxseed oil but what other good fat sources are there?

The calories look good, but a few more on workout days wouldn't hurt, try 3200-3300. Keep the non-pwo carbs to 40-50g a day.

Other fat sources: fish oil (essential), egg yolks, beef, chicken skin, cheese, avocado, cream.. avoid corn/canola/safflower/sunflower oils and trans fats, but the rest are fair game.

Try to get in an equal ratio of saturated:unsaturated fat, and less saturates on the higher carb days.

 

[leeroyjenkins]

The calories look good, but a few more on workout days wouldn't hurt, try 3200-3300. Keep the non-pwo carbs to 40-50g a day.

Other fat sources: fish oil (essential), egg yolks, beef, chicken skin, cheese, avocado, cream.. avoid corn/canola/safflower/sunflower oils and trans fats, but the rest are fair game.

Try to get in an equal ratio of saturated:unsaturated fat, and less saturates on the higher carb days.

oh gaw...all the foods I hate lol...this is gonna be difficult but hopefully rewarding

cheers for the help

btw one more question - a high fat diet won't be bad for my skin will it? just wondering...

 

[Warboss Alex]

btw one more question - a high fat diet won't be bad for my skin will it? just wondering...

you hate chicken wings? fried eggs with runny yolks? peanut butter? protein shakes with raw eggs and cream? CHEESE?! WHO HATES CHEESE?!

and if anything, a high fat diet will be BETTER for your skin than a lowfat diet.. skin, nails, hair, teeth everything. this generation is obese and heart-disease/diabetes ridden because of a lack of fats.

that reminds me, I need to get cooking, I've got two chicken legs drowned in OO and butter waiting for me dinner..

 

[leeroyjenkins]

you hate chicken wings? fried eggs with runny yolks? peanut butter? protein shakes with raw eggs and cream? CHEESE?! WHO HATES CHEESE?!

and if anything, a high fat diet will be BETTER for your skin than a lowfat diet.. skin, nails, hair, teeth everything. this generation is obese and heart-disease/diabetes ridden because of a lack of fats.

that reminds me, I need to get cooking, I've got two chicken legs drowned in OO and butter waiting for me dinner..

I do hate peanut butter, eggs and cream...I like chicken wings and cheese (melted on things) though

but point taken

 

[Warboss Alex]

you should try and get some eggs in, they're the most anabolic food source out there. throw some raw in your protein shakes and you can't taste that they're there.

by the way - don't JUST eat chicken wings and cheese.. but don't restrict yourself to fish and olive oil either.