FRAME DISINTEGRATING INTO OBLIVION IN PRESENCE OF EX - HELP!

[Alvafe]

I'm 25 years of age and 8 weeks ago broke up with my 26 year old girlfriend (first relationship) of approx. 1 and a half years as an AFC beta that failed more than enough **** tests and lost my frame early on.

We met up again last week twice.

Within those 8 weeks I rigorously studied game theory, read The Rationale Male and applied what I'd learnt with great success. Maintaining frame and getting girls in my bed wasn't an issue although I didn't meet any that compelled me to such a degree that my ex had.

What I noticed is that within her presence a couple days ago it's almost as if all that I'd learnt went to ****. I returned back to an anxious, hesitant frame. I literally feel like I can't be myself around her. Potentially its the prior conditioning of me pedestalizing her as "the dream girl" and the subsequent fear of being perceived as inadequate or unworthy that cripples my true extroverted self.

We both confessed that we still love each other.

Do you guys think in some cases there are certain women that you'll always have a sense of anxiety induced expressive restriction around because of a mismatch in personalities or is it only and always an inherent reflection of a lack of confidence and insecurity within the man's character?

It could also stem from an intuitive feeling that she isn't as committed. Any comparative stories or advice and potential ways to break free some this plight? apart from the usual lift weight, focus on yourself and read. I don't have problems in the slightest with other women, although I don't care about them either. tyxoxo

who did the break up? that is alwyas important, so i'm guessing her

HAHA, I appreciated your forwardness. She left a polaroid photo of myself on my windscreen and wrote on the back of it "not a day goes by". I reciprocated by sending a link to essentially the song we fell in love to (can you feel the cringe?).

We spoke a few days later, decided to meet up the same night and we hung out for 4 hours. We both agreed to not see each other for two weeks and I ran into her in the street a week later. She was resenting the fact that one of the topics I brought up that night was polyamory and that I hadn't considered how that'd make her feel (she is extremely selfish). I basically told her to stop crying, grabbed her and we passionately kissed in the parking lot. We then grabbed some green tea and after that is where I could feel the angst and tension within my own mind.

Part of me feels she more so loves how I validate her rather than actually loving me whether that's unconscious or not. On the phone before we met back up that first night, she also said just promise you won't leave me like that again because when we broke up I completely dropped off the raider (I told her that was a selfish notion and she agreed). Before I left I said "when are you going to show me your new place". she responded "can I get back to you".

are you really 25? too much teen drama, you know what I do when I meet a ex? I ignore, there is no reason to talk and there is no reason to waste time on her, even more if you are with someone else (funny I always did)

drop the "cute" love song, burn the photo and move on, one thing you newbies need to understand, whn you think you finally get it what all you read, you really don't, you will only "get it" when you do it without thinking about it anymore, and when you finally don't waste time with crap like this

 

[thealphabeta]

Lots of assumptions based on little background information on the relationship prior to the break up. What we know is that he is hung up on this girl and she seems to be conflicted about being with him but is sending annoyingly mixed signals.

What was the context of the break up and who initiated it?

Also, you mentioned polyamory and that she reacted to that with resentment due to her “extreme selfishness”.

More info on these two things may help us understand where she may be coming from.

Firstly, thank you all for investing your energy into this thread and saving me cash on a therapist

The break up slowly disintegrated over roughly 2-3 months. Her mother passed away 5 months prior and she was the only biological relative and the women the raised her so this obviously had a monumental affect over her being and in turn the relationship, coupled with her intense personality. We both could see it coming. Not getting into the nitty gritty but it was obvious she'd lost respect for me long before we actually broke up because I didnt embody the dominant protector archetype, was too open about everything, destroyed all mystery and let her get away with too much. I had no concept of game/intergender dynamics and was living the fairy tale of just love and be completely open and honest about everything, friendship is the foundation! Reflecting on this **** makes me bitter.

I could tell she was falling off, then I pushed because her birthday was around the corner, surprised with skydiving and we got an apartment. Had a great weekend apart from the fact she shamed me the morning after I couldn't pay for dinner on our anniversary (the day after her birthday) because I'd spent my last $1000 on skydiving and the apartment for her birthday (drugs and sleep deprivation were involved so she was extra volatile but there's no excuse. I know I'm not painting a pretty picture here but she eventually did show some form of regret regarding her behavior, albeit with dubious sincerity.)

Two days later in my mind after ruminating on that, I decided I was going to break up with her or at least opt for a prolonged break. I was amping myself up on the drive to go see her, we met in the park and hung out for a bit. I couldn't do it, she was just in a great mood and we were enjoying each others company although she could sense that something was off on my end which inevitably spawned another argued which resulted in her more so pushing to end it.

8 weeks later she send puts the polaroid with the message "not a day goes by" on my car. She's been in 3 serious relationships and always tells me she's never loved somebody the way she loves me. When we met up again and spent 4 hours together, stared into each others eyes, you could tell there was still love of some degree there. Maybe it was just the pure curiosity that led her to reconnect but after she picked up on subconscious beta vibes her idealization shattered, who knows. Definitely oneitis, but this is more calculated than a classic case imo. Ive met thousands of women, none have affected me like this.

Ran into her again the second time the next week, felt completely out of my frame when we had green tea. Ended with me stating "so when are you showing me your new place" and her respond "can I get back to you".

It's been 5 days, im about to send her a message with something along the lines of "I didn't offer to give you my time for you to entertain your new prospects while having me there as an option. you reached out to me. your desire to explore the 'alleged' love that brought us back together isn't a matter of negotiation".

I probably should just detach but you know what they say, rejection is better than regret.

 

[thealphabeta]

are you really 25? too much teen drama, you know what I do when I meet a ex? I ignore, there is no reason to talk and there is no reason to waste time on her, even more if you are with someone else (funny I always did)

drop the "cute" love song, burn the photo and move on, one thing you newbies need to understand, whn you think you finally get it what all you read, you really don't, you will only "get it" when you do it without thinking about it anymore, and when you finally don't waste time with crap like this

I feel you but it's different when you were friends for a year prior and it's the alleged most significant relationship of your lives. I'm not claiming to have understood the totality of it, more so had just applied certain aspects I'd learnt with success and obviously LTR are a different ball park to standard dating or one night stands.

Considering all the baggage, part of me looks at this situation as an opportunity to practice what ive learnt, even if it's wishful thinking, there'd be no harder challenge than going into and old scenario and trying to change the approach/mentality that wasnt working with all that past conditioning. worst thing that happens is we depart and im depressed for another 2/3 months. HA

 

[thealphabeta]

"I didn't offer to give you my time for you to entertain your new prospects whilst having me there as an option. you reached out to me. Us reconnecting is not a matter of negotiation. you either make time because you have a genuine desire or stop wasting mine." about to send this, whatcha think players?

at this stage it's either all or nothing. I wouldn't even get back into a relationship tbh, I dont want exclusivity. I just want to experience that connection unconditionally for mutual growth but thats probs a pipedream. HA

 

[AJ84]

"I didn't offer to give you my time for you to entertain your new prospects whilst having me there as an option. you reached out to me. Us reconnecting is not a matter of negotiation. you either make time because you have a genuine desire or stop wasting mine." about to send this, whatcha think players?

at this stage it's either all or nothing. I wouldn't even get back into a relationship tbh, I dont want exclusivity. I just want to experience that connection unconditionally for mutual growth but thats probs a pipedream. HA

Why are you expecting her to change just because you learned a few red pill theories?

You say you want all or nothing but who is giving the all? I’m not sure how realistic it is to want her unconditional connection if you want her back on your terms as a plate in an non exclusive arrangement (which is a demotion in her mind) after you too had what I assume was an exclusive relationship.

Ask yourself why it’s important that she (rather than a new girl) be with you on your terms?

I feel like this isn’t about her. It’s like when we have an argument with someone and they win, and afterwards we think of what we could of said or did to that was wittier, smarter etc, to win the argument and we kick ourselves, wishing we could go back to that time and redo it.

But we can’t, and it’s not likely that you can get this girl who knows who you truly are, to change her fundamental self because you discovered some alpha game that you wish you had applied when you were in a relationship with her.

It’s done. Just meet other girls and start fresh with your new found knowledge without this emotional baggage.

 

[thealphabeta]

Why are you expecting her to change just because you learned a few red pill theories?

You say you want all or nothing but who is giving the all? I’m not sure how realistic it is to want her unconditional connection if you want her back on your terms as a plate in an non exclusive arrangement (which is a demotion in her mind) after you too had what I assume was an exclusive relationship.

Ask yourself why it’s important that she (rather than a new girl) be with you on your terms?

I feel like this isn’t about her. It’s like when we have an argument with someone and they win, and afterwards we think of what we could of said or did to that was wittier, smarter etc, to win the argument and we kick ourselves, wishing we could go back to that time and redo it.

But we can’t, and it’s not likely that you can get this girl who knows who you truly are, to change her fundamental self because you discovered some alpha game that you wish you had applied when you were in a relationship with her.

It’s done. Just meet other girls and start fresh with your new found knowledge without this emotional baggage.

The idea of it being non-exclusive is an attempt to rid the relationship of all the monogamy related baggage and reconnect with the foundational friendship as the framework to explore the love that brought us back together, that we both felt when we looked into each others eyes and confessed.

I doubt she would want a committed monogamous relationship too so it wouldnt necessarily just be on my terms if she has the capacity to be convinced of its merit.

Why is she more important? I ****ed 7 girls in a period of 3 weeks after we broke up, 12 in the 8 weeks. Most felt empty, none felt close to what we had. Took me till I was 23 to find somebody I could connect with like we did. Call it selfish on my part too for ignoring the elephant in the room in fear of not finding something as strong. I know I just need to focus on myself. Just had a chat with a mate, thought about it all and realized the text that I thought about sending is overcompensation for my insecurity, as much as it is an attempt to be assertive and show that im willing to leave. just going to leave it. I'm ready to walk away after the bipolar rollercoaster of thoughts since we met last week. It's up to her now, even if the last impression she left with wasn't a strong one of me. thanks all

 

[Alvafe]

I feel you but it's different when you were friends for a year prior and it's the alleged most significant relationship of your lives. I'm not claiming to have understood the totality of it, more so had just applied certain aspects I'd learnt with success and obviously LTR are a different ball park to standard dating or one night stands.

Considering all the baggage, part of me looks at this situation as an opportunity to practice what ive learnt, even if it's wishful thinking, there'd be no harder challenge than going into and old scenario and trying to change the approach/mentality that wasnt working with all that past conditioning. worst thing that happens is we depart and im depressed for another 2/3 months. HA

that is the thing you are young the most significant relationship means little, you guys ended there is little significance if even it could end it, best thing for you to learn is to drop her, it was significant? for you maybe not so much for her, and reason for her to drop you was her hope you would still put your time on her even when she don't put the ***** out.

and you know the funny thing? she would more likely to go back to you when you show up with someone new then tryig to pursue her, she will start to care again when you don't care about her again, when she see you happy with someone else, on that moment she will try to reel you back and the sad part is if you let her reel you back she will lose interest, so wishifull thinking aside, its a now win battle, cut your loses and retreat

 

[mrgoodstuff]

that is the thing you are young the most significant relationship means little, you guys ended there is little significance if even it could end it, best thing for you to learn is to drop her, it was significant? for you maybe not so much for her, and reason for her to drop you was her hope you would still put your time on her even when she don't put the ***** out.

and you know the funny thing? she would more likely to go back to you when you show up with someone new then tryig to pursue her, she will start to care again when you don't care about her again, when she see you happy with someone else, on that moment she will try to reel you back and the sad part is if you let her reel you back she will lose interest, so wishifull thinking aside, its a now win battle, cut your loses and retreat

Can you play her and just be selfish and only care about sex?

 

[speed dawg]

The idea of it being non-exclusive is an attempt to rid the relationship of all the monogamy related baggage and reconnect with the foundational friendship as the framework to explore the love that brought us back together, that we both felt when we looked into each others eyes and confessed.

She doesn't care NEARLY as much as you do. I mean, look what you just typed. That's some Mickey Mouse stuff right there.

This attitude is likely why she left you, not the reason you might get her back.

 

[Alvafe]

Can you play her and just be selfish and only care about sex?

if he could pull that off he wouldn't be here

 

[mrgoodstuff]

if he could pull that off he wouldn't be here

Would that keep her strung along? Perhaps he has another gf and keeps his heart just out of reach. She gets enough of his time through the affections. But never all of him.

 

[Epic Days]

This is called automaticity. Your wiring is in automatic. Pretty simple concept.

When I first started driving, I would get in. Buckle up. Put the key in and the clutch and start the vehicle.
Put the shifter into reverse or first gear. Give it a little gas and the let the clutch out slowly until I was moving.
At first I had to consciously think about all the things I had to do. After a while, it became automatic. I didn’t even think about any of it. I just drove. When you get to this point, it’s called an automaticity. You put it on automatic.

Your interactions with your past girlfriend are still operating on that automaticity. She acts or says something and your actions and responses and feelings are automatically set up.

Let’s say you get nauseous when you look at an orange. At some point in the past you ate an orange and because you were sick at the time, you threw it up. Well it’s an automaticity to now get nauseous when you see an orange.

How you get rid of an automaticity is to be aware of it consciously. When you are around her next time you can see it now. Learn to shut automaticity's off.

Just say to that automaticity, not to your self, you are not your automaticity, “knock it off. It’s time for you to be turned off now”
It takes some practice, but it works nicely. Do NOT be afraid to confront this or try to avoid her. That would be cowardice. Only a coward is afraid of a woman. He acknowledges his weakness and thus reinforces It. Never run. Always confront.

 

[sosousage]

I'm 25 years of age and 8 weeks ago broke up with my 26 year old girlfriend (first relationship) of approx. 1 and a half years as an AFC beta that failed more than enough **** tests and lost my frame early on.

We met up again last week twice.

Within those 8 weeks I rigorously studied game theory, read The Rationale Male and applied what I'd learnt with great success. Maintaining frame and getting girls in my bed wasn't an issue although I didn't meet any that compelled me to such a degree that my ex had.

What I noticed is that within her presence a couple days ago it's almost as if all that I'd learnt went to ****. I returned back to an anxious, hesitant frame. I literally feel like I can't be myself around her. Potentially its the prior conditioning of me pedestalizing her as "the dream girl" and the subsequent fear of being perceived as inadequate or unworthy that cripples my true extroverted self.

We both confessed that we still love each other.

Do you guys think in some cases there are certain women that you'll always have a sense of anxiety induced expressive restriction around because of a mismatch in personalities or is it only and always an inherent reflection of a lack of confidence and insecurity within the man's character?

It could also stem from an intuitive feeling that she isn't as committed. Any comparative stories or advice and potential ways to break free some this plight? apart from the usual lift weight, focus on yourself and read. I don't have problems in the slightest with other women, although I don't care about them either. tyxoxo

hard next