Failing and need a boast

[kidkris2007]

Ok guys I've been on this site since oct 2004 and I have not managed to lay any girls. I'm want to explain what I think my problem is and then what I plan to do about it. My situation is more than I can type in one post so I'll just list my major problems and possible solutions. Please critique:

-I live at home - I just got a serving job so I'm saving up my money to move out with a friend of mine and hopefully I won't be as insecure about bringing girls I like back to my place.

- I've approached about 60 something girls and I still get nervous - I'm gonna join a lair and get some feedback from some guys who can help me out in the field. I need someone to get on my case when I get lazy and feel like giving up.

- I'm very used to and sometimes enjoy being alone - I'm kinda stumped on this one. Alot of times I like my privacy because it provides me comfort from having to reveal my inexperienced past. My best guess for this is to throw myself into the fire, reveal my lack of experience with women and just take the crap that comes from that. Then.....move on. This is the hardest one for me.

Any threads or advice would be welcome.

 

[On Point]

It seems like your problem is a lack of self-confidence and self-worth. You're describing your situation to us as if it makes you unworthy of women and they probably get that from you too when you talk.

I think you need to work on your inner game.

Go find Sapien's thread and read some of it, there's a lot of good stuff there.

Noooo! Don't reveal your lack of experience. There is no positive way to share that. They'll probably figure it out. Work on your posture (Stand up straight), get in shape if you're not, do what you need to do to gain self-confidence. A nice smile and self-confidence will do a lot for you.

Here's something I've been doing that has been a good exercise. Approach groups of women (at least 3, the more the better) at a bar or restaurant or whatever, and ask to join them. You are not going to get their number or talk about sex or any of that, so you should have nothing to be nervous about past the approach. Try and stay relaxed and confidence. Try to get to know as much as you can about them for about 20 minutes, and then leave. This helps boost your confidence and get past some of the nervousness, and just learn how to talk to them. But again, you may not be at that point and just need to work on inner game.

My best guess for this is to throw myself into the fire, reveal my lack of experience with women and just take the crap that comes from that. Then.....move on. This is the hardest one for me.

Any threads or advice would be welcome.

 

[Dark Chivalry]

Well done on approaching 60 girls, despite your nerves. You have balls.

A good way to work on your inner game is to accomplish some goals. Be succesful in your job and your studies. If you are home alone, do something useful; read some books, write a story, paint a picture, do some woodcutting or carpetry, pimp your ride, lift some weights, just anything you can be proud of and enjoy.

Can you tell us a bit more about your looks and the lines you tend to use when approaching women?

There are lots of DJ's in Cali, so meeting someone on the wingman forum to critique you in real life is certainly an option.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Here's something I've been doing that has been a good exercise. Approach groups of women (at least 3, the more the better) at a bar or restaurant or whatever, and ask to join them. You are not going to get their number or talk about sex or any of that, so you should have nothing to be nervous about past the approach. Try and stay relaxed and confidence. Try to get to know as much as you can about them for about 20 minutes, and then leave. This helps boost your confidence and get past some of the nervousness, and just learn how to talk to them. But again, you may not be at that point and just need to work on inner game.

Thanks for sharing this with us here On Point. I sort of thought about this too, but it didn't 'click' until now. When you are in group situations, the locus gets away from you, and you can always relax and let the group take it's own course of discussions. Even a mixed set isn't that bad.

I went on a buffet by myself yesterday, and I was seated by chance, next to a group of three attractive girls that appeared students talking with each other. Some sort of 'creative avoidance' set in and I was just too nervous to think of any opener thinking that whatever I said would not be good enough - it would be 'logical, factual' and probably would not get the type of connection I would want so I said why bother.

Then it dawned on me, if I had asked if I could join them from the get-go it probably would have been a healthy and theraputic experience. I felt bad and sad for myself that I didn't make that attempt and say, 'can I join you'. This is a good idea.

 

[kidkris2007]

Thanks for the responses.

Yes there is a definite lack of self esteem that comes from being so unsuccessful at this age of my life.

It's not so much the initial approaching that scares me as it is the subsequent bombing that occurs when I 'run out of steam' and am open to their judgements and intrustive questions about my life. I'm insecure about that. They say to learn from your mistakes but most of the time I really don't know what I'm doing wrong. Or if I do know what I did wrong it's really really hard to recreate an emotion I'm trying to convey in the interaction.


My life is actually much better than this post seems, I just suck with women

Can you tell us a bit more about your looks and the lines you tend to use when approaching women?

I'm actually a pretty good looking guy, I eat really healthy, stretch everyday, and workout 4-5 times a week. It's all part of my facade to create a visual image that "Ya, I'm a ladies man. Look at me!" despite my lack of experience and fear of putting myself out there.

I don't use lines, just situational stuff. I usually don't mess up on the approach, I can come across as warm and geniune when I approach. I just have a far time when they ask my questions about my life. I'm still learning how to reply with joke answers cus when they come out of my mouth they don't sound funny and it just makes them drill the question even more.

Noooo! Don't reveal your lack of experience. There is no positive way to share that. They'll probably figure it out. Work on your posture (Stand up straight), get in shape if you're not, do what you need to do to gain self-confidence. A nice smile and self-confidence will do a lot for you.

My theory (and it's just a theory) is since I'm so insecure about this aspect of my life I might as well throw it out there and deal with and get used to it. I can't change the fact that in the past I've have no girlfriends and very little sex. This way, if it doesn't affect me anymore I won't be so insecure and more confident. Thats what I'm begining to think anyway.

 

[bigjohnson]

Maybe if you concentrate on improving yourself confidence will happen. It's worked for plenty of others.

 

[kidkris2007]

Amante Silverstre, I've read alot of your advice on this forum and it's all dead on. Thanks for replying.

I'm mostly scared of what my friends and family will think since I've lied to them about having girlfriends in the past. This is the REAL hard part for me. It's become a huge burden in my life and I want to let it go. Much like a deep shameful secret.

I'm glad you see where I'm coming from. Most people say to cover it up and go bang 10 chicks to get it out of your system. I have no desire to hook up with 4's and 5's 'just to get it out of my system'. That won't help my confidence with women. If i can defeat my insecurities I will be free.....but it's REALLY ****in scary. And shameful.

 

[Ol'BlueEyes]

I'm mostly scared of what my friends and family will think since I've lied to them about having girlfriends in the past. This is the REAL hard part for me. It's become a huge burden in my life and I want to let it go. Much like a deep shameful secret.

What are you afraid of? That they'll think you're a loser because you've never had a gf?
You're assuming your closest allies in life will turn against you over something which, frankly doesn't matter that much.
If they've never seen you with a girl, they already know you've never had a girlfriend. And shockingly, they probably don't care.

 

[Boschy]

I was very, very shy as a youngster. I got over it by basically bluffing and pretending to be outgoing and social. After a while I gained confidence and could do it for real.

People don't know what's going on inside your head or emotions....so use that to your advantage. Pretend you are smooth and a babe magnet with the ladies despite lack of real success. No one knows except you and people who read this forum.

 

[On Point]

The problem is if you do this, you're basically saying "I'm not worth dating". In the best case, you're giving them the power in the conversation and it's going to be an uphill battle.

You need to focus on solving the source of the problem - your insecurity, but if you're going to have any chance in the meantime I strongly advise you NOT say that. You can find a better way to accomplish what you're after I think, which is basically taking a little pressure off. Maybe try something like "I'm a little shy, but cool girls can usually draw me out.". That makes it seem like a challenge and puts it on them a bit, instead of sounding like weakness.

Thanks for the responses.
My theory (and it's just a theory) is since I'm so insecure about this aspect of my life I might as well throw it out there and deal with and get used to it. I can't change the fact that in the past I've have no girlfriends and very little sex. This way, if it doesn't affect me anymore I won't be so insecure and more confident. Thats what I'm begining to think anyway.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Special Top Secret Files - Confidential.

Here's a thread of my experiences in November, 2006, documented, of my attempts to get a quick first date lay from adultfriendfinder and lavalife by claiming I was a virgin and needed someone to 'help me out'.

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=110996

At the end of the day this was the results in a nutshell:

- First-wave (girl from lavalife - beginning to mid-November): Muslim woman was going to meet me, but cancelled at the last meeting stating she preferred romance over just losing her virginity with me after meeting. She was rather nice - interaction lasted two weeks. Adultfriendfinder was a flop although I was documenting things on my blog.

- Second-wave (four prospects - mid-November to end of November): Nothing further came from lavalife. On adultfriendfinder sparks were starting to fly. About four women wanted to meet me, and I would have had a potential of four hook-ups within that month if I really pursued them - but I chickened out.

I documented the 'Muslim' girl experience on my blog and people felt sorry for me that she didn't come through and cancelled out on that date, and finally a married girl stepped up and said her birthday is on the date of the expiry of my subscription and I could fvck her once I send her photos. Three other people also followed from routine solicitiation of various ads - all ending in the dialogue 'would you like to help me out?' -- header and profile constantly changed during the time.

------------

Standard lines -- me: 'would you like to help me out?

This is the standard f-close line in this strategy. The theme was 30 days to lose my v-card, starting from November 1st to November 30th -- or I had a month to lose it. You can read the story on the thread. I'm still a virgin by the way - I made a choice not to go ahead since it didn't feel right so I ended up teasing myself on this whole thing - but it was definately an ego-booster.

It was actually fun broadcasting this whole thing online and had some interesting play online.

 

[On Point]

There's a lot of advantages to groups. I'm not doing much individual approaches yet, but I'm beginning to think group approaches are better.

For once thing, it makes you seem like you have a lot of balls and differentiates you from most guys.

When you approach most of them are going to stare at you like a deer in headlights or start looking at each other. Just stay relaxed and wait for someone to speak. One of them will say "Sure" and you're in.

Once you sit down you don't have to dominate the conversation. Just take your spots and ask questions. You can ask the same question multiple times since you can ask different women and this puts less pressure on you to think of stuff. If you've hit a friendly set they will likely start to engage you.

You're getting to know a bunch of woman at the same time and you can figure out the dynamics between them. Don't talk to the one you want most first. Make eye contact with her once in a while but front like you're more interested in talking to the others. There is just no downside to this and it often works in your favor.

You really don't need a line for this. You can just say something like, "Excuse me, mind if I join you for a beer?". Another thing that works really well is if you create some sort of artificial time constraint from the beginning. Once I used "Excuse me, I've got 20 minutes to kill, mind if I sit with you?" That was a pretty hot group and I could see the gears in their mind turning. They said yes, but I don't think it would've worked if I hadn't created the time constraint. They will probably ask you what happens in 20 minutes. I say my friend is coming to meet me. This is pretty bulletproof. When he doesn't show say he's flaky and maybe he's late. At that point time is running out so you can #close or just bail.

Live and breath the 3 second rule, it totally makes this work. I try and make it seem like I'm used to sitting with people and this is just something I do, which is basically becoming true.

If you sit down and they are boring or rude I suggest moving on. While you're sitting you're building social proof with any other sets and there may be a much better one now wanting to talk to you.

Another thing I do is say I want to sit with them for a beer. If they're fun I drink slow, if they're not I drink fast. Just be careful not to get sloshed. I've also got chicks buying me another because they want me to stay. That is pretty awesome when it happens.

Thanks for sharing this with us here On Point. I sort of thought about this too, but it didn't 'click' until now. When you are in group situations, the locus gets away from you, and you can always relax and let the group take it's own course of discussions. Even a mixed set isn't that bad.

I went on a buffet by myself yesterday, and I was seated by chance, next to a group of three attractive girls that appeared students talking with each other. Some sort of 'creative avoidance' set in and I was just too nervous to think of any opener thinking that whatever I said would not be good enough - it would be 'logical, factual' and probably would not get the type of connection I would want so I said why bother.

Then it dawned on me, if I had asked if I could join them from the get-go it probably would have been a healthy and theraputic experience. I felt bad and sad for myself that I didn't make that attempt and say, 'can I join you'. This is a good idea.