Dare I enter after almost 10 years?

[In2theGame]

As many around here know, I have been single for just about 10 years and I have lived wildy for that time with many Women but a question has been on my mind recently that i wanted to share with the SS brothers and get insight from the mature section.

Quick back story, In 2014 I met this Russian girl while I was out with friends and I remember approaching her, got her number and made out with her but I left it right there because I was on my way to meeting some other girls at another bar. After some time I didn't bother texting her because I was so flooded with Women that I just couldn't fit her in so I chalked it up to whatever and deleted her number. A week later she found me somehow on Linkedin because we discussed briefly about both being involved in the finance industry and she sent me a message. After responding, I told her to shoot me a text sometime and we can meet up and 30 minutes later she texted me. I set up a date with her and that was that.

We met up to go have drinks and play pool downtown on the west side. Around that time I was seeing Women who were at minimum an 8 and many 9's, she however was a 7 but was still cute, sassy and feminine. the date went well but like I mentioned above, I was seeing a ton of Women and I put her in the casual sex category and with that said, I have been fvcking her casually since 2014 but throughout all this time, she has been trying to date me seriously but I always told her no because I still wanted to mess around with different Women, she could accept that or not and she did.

What has she done for me that has made me even consider this with her.... She has been extremely submissive towards me. I tell her to do something for me, she does it. I tell her to cook for me, she does it. she gives me massages whenever i want. If she knows i'm out on a saturday night, she will always offer to meet me or have me meet up with her and her friends. She has introduced me to all of her friends and they've all tried to tell me how much she likes me and wants to be with me but i turn a deaf ear to what they tell me. last year I was over her place and I ended up getting very sick, I had t go to the ER, She went with me in the ambulance and stayed with me the whole week even though i told her to leave and she doesn't have to stick around.

She has told me that she loves me but I never responded to that nor did I say anything back. She has been after me like this for almost 5 years and is still wanting to date me seriously. She has caught me out with other Women and has barged in to c0ck block me to make sure I leave with her, although I had to put her in her place a few time to never interrupt me with another Woman especially since her and I are only casual. Even then, she has been trying to be with me and has told me "Please try for us to date more seriously" Which i always responded that i do not trust Women and i have always expressed this to everyone. She just keeps telling me to try with her.

This past weekend, we went to check a movie at the theater and then she cooked for me. Next day we went to get a drink at an outdoor cafe since the weather has been beautiful lately in NYC. Overall, She's a 7 but still very cute, feminine and submissive towards me which is a big plus. She pays the food for me and whatever I need since she makes over $100K per year. The sex is on point and has not gotten stale.

I feel a bit anxious even thinking about trying to date seriously but I'm debating it.... What are your thought, advices?

 

[Kidd55]

Sounds like you're happy. I wouldn't change anything.

 

[Epic Days]

Your call. As long as you go into it with your eyes open I don't see a problem. Observe. Talk less and think less. Observe her and see how she changes, IF she does.

You will know when/if she does. If she avoids arguments instead of starting them, that is a really good sign. If she can continue this...you have a good catch.

 

[Spaz]

Just love her in your own way, there's nothing wrong with that, it doesn't unman you.

Either she excepts it or not, seems like she has.

But treat her well when u r with her which I'm guessing you are, keep it up.

I remember we somehow discussed this on another thread you created, not her but about you in general abt being more opened.

 

[zekko]

I agree with Epic Days, it's up to you and what you want, only you can answer that. Sounds like she's been on good behavior for five years, which is good. There's always the possibility she could change if you drop the competition, that's the main thing to watch out for. I wonder if you'd even be able to do that after all this time.

She sounds like good LTR material if that is what you're looking for. If so, you could try it. If it doesn't work, you can always go back to plates. You could even tell her that since she seems to put up with a lot. That you're willing to try it more seriously with her, but if it doesn't work out, you're out.

 

[In2theGame]

Your call. As long as you go into it with your eyes open I don't see a problem. Observe. Talk less and think less. Observe her and see how she changes, IF she does.

You will know when/if she does. If she avoids arguments instead of starting them, that is a really good sign. If she can continue this...you have a good catch.

Thanks, I truly don't remember the last time she started an argument with me. I have had to check her probably a 3 or 4 times in the last 5 years. Other than that, No arguments.

 

[In2theGame]

I also forgot to mention, She's 8 years younger than me.

 

[Epic Days]

Thanks, I truly don't remember the last time she started an argument with me. I have had to check her probably a 3 or 4 times in the last 5 years. Other than that, No arguments.

Nice. Remember, arguments out of thin air are actually her looking for a justification to do what she is going to do or a justification for what she has already done.
Disagreements are normal but rarely, if ever, escalate into a full blown argument.

 

[zekko]

The not being argumentative thing is huge in an LTR, and fairly rare in a woman. Shows they don't need that drama to sustain them, and prefer a peaceful life. It's one of the reasons why I appreciate my girlfriend.

OP, one of the most interesting parts of your post is that you tell girls that you "don't trust women" when they press for something more serious. I was wondering what kind of reaction you get from that? I could see them taking that as a positive or a negative. Either they sympathize (having been screwed over themsleves), or they think you're too cynical.

 

[Bokanovsky]

As many around here know, I have been single for just about 10 years and I have lived wildy for that time with many Women but a question has been on my mind recently that i wanted to share with the SS brothers and get insight from the mature section.

Quick back story, In 2014 I met this Russian girl while I was out with friends and I remember approaching her, got her number and made out with her but I left it right there because I was on my way to meeting some other girls at another bar. After some time I didn't bother texting her because I was so flooded with Women that I just couldn't fit her in so I chalked it up to whatever and deleted her number. A week later she found me somehow on Linkedin because we discussed briefly about both being involved in the finance industry and she sent me a message. After responding, I told her to shoot me a text sometime and we can meet up and 30 minutes later she texted me. I set up a date with her and that was that.

We met up to go have drinks and play pool downtown on the west side. Around that time I was seeing Women who were at minimum an 8 and many 9's, she however was a 7 but was still cute, sassy and feminine. the date went well but like I mentioned above, I was seeing a ton of Women and I put her in the casual sex category and with that said, I have been fvcking her casually since 2014 but throughout all this time, she has been trying to date me seriously but I always told her no because I still wanted to mess around with different Women, she could accept that or not and she did.

What has she done for me that has made me even consider this with her.... She has been extremely submissive towards me. I tell her to do something for me, she does it. I tell her to cook for me, she does it. she gives me massages whenever i want. If she knows i'm out on a saturday night, she will always offer to meet me or have me meet up with her and her friends. She has introduced me to all of her friends and they've all tried to tell me how much she likes me and wants to be with me but i turn a deaf ear to what they tell me. last year I was over her place and I ended up getting very sick, I had t go to the ER, She went with me in the ambulance and stayed with me the whole week even though i told her to leave and she doesn't have to stick around.

She has told me that she loves me but I never responded to that nor did I say anything back. She has been after me like this for almost 5 years and is still wanting to date me seriously. She has caught me out with other Women and has barged in to c0ck block me to make sure I leave with her, although I had to put her in her place a few time to never interrupt me with another Woman especially since her and I are only casual. Even then, she has been trying to be with me and has told me "Please try for us to date more seriously" Which i always responded that i do not trust Women and i have always expressed this to everyone. She just keeps telling me to try with her.

This past weekend, we went to check a movie at the theater and then she cooked for me. Next day we went to get a drink at an outdoor cafe since the weather has been beautiful lately in NYC. Overall, She's a 7 but still very cute, feminine and submissive towards me which is a big plus. She pays the food for me and whatever I need since she makes over $100K per year. The sex is on point and has not gotten stale.

I feel a bit anxious even thinking about trying to date seriously but I'm debating it.... What are your thought, advices?

A few things that stand out of from you post. One, you say (twice) that she is "a 7 but still very cute" and has other redeeming qualities. It sounds like you are trying to convince yourself that's she's good looking enough. Number two, it's odd that she's been playing the long game and trying to get in a relationship with you for five years despite you making it clear that you want nothing serious with her. Either she is desperate, has very low self esteem, or maybe she thinks that you are by far the best prospect she's ever going to have.

At the end of the day, you have to ask yourself if you're fine settling for this girl. Because it is clear form your post that you see this situation as settling.

 

[In2theGame]

The not being argumentative thing is huge in an LTR, and fairly rare in a woman. Shows they don't need that drama to sustain them, and prefer a peaceful life. It's one of the reasons why I appreciate my girlfriend.

OP, one of the most interesting parts of your post is that you tell girls that you "don't trust women" when they press for something more serious. I was wondering what kind of reaction you get from that? I could see them taking that as a positive or a negative. Either they sympathize (having been screwed over themsleves), or they think you're too cynical.

Yes, the low argument rate is very good. She actually said that she appreciates that i have a strong backbone so that probably contributes to her not trying to test me with anything. Also, she openly knows I have been with a lot of Women and I can sense Bullsh*t from light years away, Overall she shows a lot of respect and submissiveness towards me and one of the reasons I have been considering a more serious thing with her.

One night she was out with all of her friends because it was one of their Birthday parties and she really wanted me to go with her, So it was me and 10 girls, (3 of them I openly admitted I wanted to fvck lol but thats another story).... Many of them were coming up to me and asking me "What's the deal with you and her? its been 5 years I2TG, she REALLY likes you a lot" and I just nod and refused to answer any questions but more questions arose, "Why dont you want to try seriously dating her?" I responded to all of them.. "Because i do not trust Women". about half of them didnt really have a reaction and shrugged at my response while the other half asked me why? and 2 of them asked me, "have you been hurt before?"

I just smiled at all of them knowing for a fact that they knew they couldn't break me no matter how much they tried. Her friend who flew in from another state pulled me to the side and tells me "I2TG, She likes you more than you know, give it a chance and man up". I laughed in her face and said "Man up?, You have no idea what you're talking about but yes I know she likes me a lot and I have to think about this"

Long story short, They didn't test me much on it because I was like a rock that wouldn't budge.

The real debate honestly speaking is this, I do care for this girl and she has proven to be LTR material and has stuck by me for 5 years, even when she has caught me with other Women. I'm more than sure she has messed around with other dudes in the meantime because I told her that we're just casuals but even then, she still wants to date me seriously. It makes me anxious and my heart races thinking about it even though Im willing to give it a try. Call it PTSD or whatever but thats what it feels like because let's face it, dating someone more seriously entails giving at minimum a portion of yourself emotionally to someone else and it of course is a risk. I think about my past and how fvcked up it made me, I have trouble till this day (10 years later) with trust. I may look to give it a go because we all have to move on but it legit gives me anxiety.

 

[In2theGame]

A few things that stand out of from you post. One, you say (twice) that she is "a 7 but still very cute" and has other redeeming qualities. It sounds like you are trying to convince yourself that's she's good looking enough. Number two, it's odd that she's been playing the long game and trying to get in a relationship with you for five years despite you making it clear that you want nothing serious with her. Either she is desperate, has very low self esteem, or maybe she thinks that you are by far the best prospect she's ever going to have.

At the end of the day, you have to ask yourself if you're fine settling for this girl. Because it is clear form your post that you see this situation as settling.

IMHO, Yes she's a 7 but make no mistake, I'm not "settling" into anything or else I wouldn't even consider it. I have to be attracted to the girl for me to think about going through with it.

I've had other girls do similar except at most, it was 3 years but im sure she was seeing other guys while i was seeing other girls since it was casual. In terms of prospects, Maybe so lol, Or maybe the "SMV" she views me as is high because of the fact that, as mentioned above, been seen with other Women and other Women hitting me right in front of her. Even a small handful of her own friends tried flirting with me which i could of tried to fvck but didnt.

But anyway to the settling point... Like i pointed out in my post to Zekko, I feel a lot of anxiety thinking of dating more seriously and I have had a smoking hot blonde, blue eyes chick that wanted to be with me just the same but I refused to date her more seriously because she was just too demanding of my time. At one point she begged me to start a life with her and for us to move to California together.

The one now im talking about has never tried to change me and again as mentioned above, does not start arguments and drama with me, basically she followed my lead all the way.

 

[In2theGame]

I just want to say, I greatly appreciate all the responses here. I started this thread in the mature section because I was looking for solid advice from those with great input. When it comes to casual sex and hooking up, I'm good to go but i know that dating seriously is a whole different ball game and I've been out of THAT game for almost a decade.

 

[AttackFormation]

I feel a bit anxious even thinking about trying to date seriously but I'm debating it.... What are your thought, advices?

I think it's exactly the behavior and experience you now have which is what makes her so attracted to you. You're more emotionally aloof than she is, you know your way around women so they feel both enjoyment and respect with you, and you don't do weak behaviors. I think you'll have a satisfying relationship as long as those things stay the same and you keep in mind that she wants you to be this more or less this way even when the relationship happens, so not easing back into what you were with that plain-clothed demon from those years ago...

 

[zekko]

IMHO, Yes she's a 7 but make no mistake, I'm not "settling" into anything or else I wouldn't even consider it. I have to be attracted to the girl for me to think about going through with it.

I think 7s are plenty hot. I don't believe in 10s, and a girl has to be outright spectacular to get a 9 or even an 8 rating from me. I'm very hesitant to give those out. To me, most hot women fall in the 7 area somewhere.

I'm always amazed at how many guys think that when it comes to LTRs, you should just go with the best looking girl you can find. To me, once a girl passes the attraction standard, there are a LOT more important traits that qualify them for LTRs. Looks-wise, the novelty is going to wear off anyway. As someone said, you should pick a girl that you actually like, and that you actually enjoy being with.

I'm going to repeat Attack Formation's warning: If you do decide to get with this girl, don't go all weak on her. You don't want to be a d!ck, but your basic personality should stay the same. Keep it together, and don't get complacent. Guys getting complacent is one of the things that give LTRs a bad name.

 

[Serenity]

Call it PTSD or whatever but thats what it feels like because let's face it, dating someone more seriously entails giving at minimum a portion of yourself emotionally to someone else and it of course is a risk. I think about my past and how fvcked up it made me, I have trouble till this day (10 years later) with trust. I may look to give it a go because we all have to move on but it legit gives me anxiety.

This is very understandable to me as I also have a past that could easily have taken me down the same path. I chose differently, where you chose to simply not commit I chose to move past the trauma. That's why you've been living like this for 10 years, you fear being hurt again so you don't let anyone get too close to you and you become a rock when faced with uncomfortable questions.

There certainly is a risk to trust and love, but IMO the benefits are greater if not betrayed. Ultimately you're only risking time and there's a lot you can do to mitigate this risk. Getting into a serious relationship by itself isn't that risky if you think about it, if it goes bad you are always free to get out of it. You probably know a lot more about what you like and don't like in a woman than you did 10 years ago, right? That experience will potentially save you a lot of time if things start going bad, you will know quickly if you're not liking it as opposed to the inexperienced who will doubt for a long time and waste that time.

You have already thought about what you may gain from this, you should face your fears and confront what negative scenarios you may face. Say you get serious and you notice she's changing, she becomes someone other than the woman you liked. If she won't be the woman you fell in love with, then break up, simple as that. Do it before the relationship gets to a really bad state, it will be better if you can look back on it with mostly good memories. Then you can go back to spinning plates.

Yes it may hurt, but feelings aren't dangerous. Most of my friends had been through several girlfriends by the time I had only had one. I took forever getting over the first, it hurt so bad for so long, I saw myself as a failure with all the mistakes I made. I simply couldn't forgive myself and it was ultimately irrational. About 6 years ago I finally realized how my friends successfully found a good girlfriend, they moved on quickly. It's not that they never got hurt, I've seen all of them cry over women, but it didn't last long. They crashed hard and got back up again. Each girlfriend lasting longer than the previous until they found a good match.

I think that both giving trust uncritically and not giving it at all is a bad way to go about it. One is naive and the other is cynical. You should aim for the middle ground here. What I do is give a little bit of trust and see what the other person does with it, will they betray it or be worthy of it? If they show themselves to be trustworthy I will give a little more and so the cycle repeats. You shouldn't give your entire heart right away or any significant portion of it, you should test the waters.

I have one last thought that may calm your anxiety, it can't be worse than it is now unless you allow it. You're fairly content with the life you've lived the past few years, correct? You can definitely use that to measure a relationship. Remember what your current life is like, if a relationship ever falls below today's situation in terms of satisfaction you can always return to what you have today. Your current life is your baseline, if a relationship isn't better than that then it's not worth it. You always have a choice, you're not really risking your current lifestyle because nobody can stop you from reverting to it.

For relationships by itself it's fairly low risk, most of what can make them really bad is not ejecting when it's worse than it was without, which is totally within your control. What's much riskier is marriage and children, you can't just get out of that without consequences that will affect your life afterwards. Meaning the level of trust should be very high, preferably so high that only the laws of nature are more certain.

I think you should give it a go with my advice in mind, what's the worst that can happen? You go back to what you do today, so relative to your current situation you would only have lost a bit of time. But would you really lose time? I would say no if you enjoyed it the entire time up until you didn't and swiftly ended it before it got worse. Or considering the alternative, continuing like today not knowing what it could become.

If you do go for her though then don't lose your character. You should know what you like and don't like, you should still put her in her place if necessary and you should generally be the same guy you've been the 5 years she has known you. The only exception is that you should slowly and gradually trust her with your more vulnerable sides, the parts of the story about you that you haven't told her. If she treats that with respect then you've got a winner.

Good luck, whatever you choose.

 

[Kidd55]

OP, there's a lot of great advice in this thread. Keep us updated.

 

[In2theGame]

This is very understandable to me as I also have a past that could easily have taken me down the same path. I chose differently, where you chose to simply not commit I chose to move past the trauma. That's why you've been living like this for 10 years, you fear being hurt again so you don't let anyone get too close to you and you become a rock when faced with uncomfortable questions.

There certainly is a risk to trust and love, but IMO the benefits are greater if not betrayed. Ultimately you're only risking time and there's a lot you can do to mitigate this risk. Getting into a serious relationship by itself isn't that risky if you think about it, if it goes bad you are always free to get out of it. You probably know a lot more about what you like and don't like in a woman than you did 10 years ago, right? That experience will potentially save you a lot of time if things start going bad, you will know quickly if you're not liking it as opposed to the inexperienced who will doubt for a long time and waste that time.

You have already thought about what you may gain from this, you should face your fears and confront what negative scenarios you may face. Say you get serious and you notice she's changing, she becomes someone other than the woman you liked. If she won't be the woman you fell in love with, then break up, simple as that. Do it before the relationship gets to a really bad state, it will be better if you can look back on it with mostly good memories. Then you can go back to spinning plates.

Yes it may hurt, but feelings aren't dangerous. Most of my friends had been through several girlfriends by the time I had only had one. I took forever getting over the first, it hurt so bad for so long, I saw myself as a failure with all the mistakes I made. I simply couldn't forgive myself and it was ultimately irrational. About 6 years ago I finally realized how my friends successfully found a good girlfriend, they moved on quickly. It's not that they never got hurt, I've seen all of them cry over women, but it didn't last long. They crashed hard and got back up again. Each girlfriend lasting longer than the previous until they found a good match.

I think that both giving trust uncritically and not giving it at all is a bad way to go about it. One is naive and the other is cynical. You should aim for the middle ground here. What I do is give a little bit of trust and see what the other person does with it, will they betray it or be worthy of it? If they show themselves to be trustworthy I will give a little more and so the cycle repeats. You shouldn't give your entire heart right away or any significant portion of it, you should test the waters.

I have one last thought that may calm your anxiety, it can't be worse than it is now unless you allow it. You're fairly content with the life you've lived the past few years, correct? You can definitely use that to measure a relationship. Remember what your current life is like, if a relationship ever falls below today's situation in terms of satisfaction you can always return to what you have today. Your current life is your baseline, if a relationship isn't better than that then it's not worth it. You always have a choice, you're not really risking your current lifestyle because nobody can stop you from reverting to it.

For relationships by itself it's fairly low risk, most of what can make them really bad is not ejecting when it's worse than it was without, which is totally within your control. What's much riskier is marriage and children, you can't just get out of that without consequences that will affect your life afterwards. Meaning the level of trust should be very high, preferably so high that only the laws of nature are more certain.

I think you should give it a go with my advice in mind, what's the worst that can happen? You go back to what you do today, so relative to your current situation you would only have lost a bit of time. But would you really lose time? I would say no if you enjoyed it the entire time up until you didn't and swiftly ended it before it got worse. Or considering the alternative, continuing like today not knowing what it could become.

If you do go for her though then don't lose your character. You should know what you like and don't like, you should still put her in her place if necessary and you should generally be the same guy you've been the 5 years she has known you. The only exception is that you should slowly and gradually trust her with your more vulnerable sides, the parts of the story about you that you haven't told her. If she treats that with respect then you've got a winner.

Good luck, whatever you choose.

Thank you Grewd. Great insight. Really appreciated.

 

[In2theGame]

I think 7s are plenty hot. I don't believe in 10s, and a girl has to be outright spectacular to get a 9 or even an 8 rating from me. I'm very hesitant to give those out. To me, most hot women fall in the 7 area somewhere.

I'm always amazed at how many guys think that when it comes to LTRs, you should just go with the best looking girl you can find. To me, once a girl passes the attraction standard, there are a LOT more important traits that qualify them for LTRs. Looks-wise, the novelty is going to wear off anyway. As someone said, you should pick a girl that you actually like, and that you actually enjoy being with.

I'm going to repeat Attack Formation's warning: If you do decide to get with this girl, don't go all weak on her. You don't want to be a d!ck, but your basic personality should stay the same. Keep it together, and don't get complacent. Guys getting complacent is one of the things that give LTRs a bad name.

Thanks Zekko, LTR wise, yes, the get along part is definitely important. We spoke last night about it and she was surprised and happy that I decided to move forward between her and I. Not going to lie, My heart started racing and beating 10X harder lol

 

[AttackFormation]

Thanks Zekko, LTR wise, yes, the get along part is definitely important. We spoke last night about it and she was surprised and happy that I decided to move forward between her and I. Not going to lie, My heart started racing and beating 10X harder lol

I know you know better but I'm rooting for you over here dude, so I still wanna make sure you don't do anything blue pill now like buy her a gift...

When me, my ex-plate and two or three of her friends were in a car and one of them said my plate would really like it if I bought her flowers with a hint of admonishment, I just laughed in her face...