confused by all these conflicting advice!

[tennisfreak]

Firstly AD and the rest are always saying NOT to come on too strong when you first start dating a girl.
Then I read that you need to initiate KINO on the FIRST few dates to show that you are romantically interested.
Forgive me, but isnt that coming on too strong??? Also, how can you get yourself into a position to initiate KINO? In a public place? I mean say you are sitting across a table doing lunch, surely you cant just reach out and grab her??
What about at the cinema? Would it be risky/cheap to reach out and KINo then? OR when you two are taking a stroll in the mall.
Cheers

 

[Raoul]

It depends on what KIND of public place. If you want to initiate kino during a meal, it's always recommmended you sit next to her rather than across from. If yu do sit across, you could always try footsie, but I personally haven't done so.

Usually, the cinema date is when you're comfortable together, like the 5th date or so. Before this the girl would just be interested in watching the movie, and the only kino you can initiate is putting your arm around her. Sometimes, you can get the movie date as early as the 3rd outing, but 5 is the usual amount I use.

Strolling in the mall, teasing her is always good. Making her laugh, then give her a tap somewhere. Usually I ask "Hey, are you ticklish?" with a grin and jab her in the ribs gently. Most girls jump and giggle at this, so it's a sort of subtle kino while strolling.

Anyways, hope some of this helps.

- Raoul

 

[BigBadJon]

Tennis,

If you don't initiate some form of physical contact by the second or so date, you're taking leaps not steps into the friend zone.

I believe they are referring more to limiting phone calls and dates in the early stages. I say start kino ASAP. This doesn't mean grab her ass when you pick her up for the first date, but a little brush against her arm or leading her with your hand on the small of her back is good.

You aren't doing anything blatantly sexual or coming on strong, you are just priming the pump to step it up a notch on subsequent dates.

If you haven't touched, kissed, held hands, or anything by the third date, you're not showing enough agression and initiative, and unless this girl REALLY likes you, her romantic interest for you is going down the drain.

As far as across the table at lunch, touch her arm or hand to illustrate a point or brush her leg with your foot "accidentally". Kino isn't limited to hand holding, kissing, and the like. Any form of touch that is appropriate for the occasion is good.

 

[Armand]

Originally posted by tennisfreak:
Firstly AD and the rest are always saying NOT to come on too strong when you first start dating a girl.

And they are absolutely correct. Only she knows when she is comfortable enough for touching. She'll let you know when that is because she'll be touching you.

Then I read that you need to initiate KINO on the FIRST few dates to show that you are romantically interested.

She knows your somewhat interested already; you asked her out, didn't you? She just doesn't know how much you're interested. You don't want her knowing anything more about what you think/feel, until you can gauge her interest in you and respond accordingly. Otherwise, you're not providing a critical element: challenge.

Forgive me, but isnt that coming on too strong??? Also, how can you get yourself into a position to initiate KINO? In a public place? I mean say you are sitting across a table doing lunch, surely you cant just reach out and grab her??
What about at the cinema? Would it be risky/cheap to reach out and KINo then? OR when you two are taking a stroll in the mall.
Cheers

Keep it very light, make sure it's not obvious you're trying to -unless it's to be a gentleman and help her out of the car or across the street, etc- until she initiates the more affectionate-type touching.

See how far she will go with it by not responding at first when she touches you = challenge. You could raise her interest a lot more in no time by playing this self-control early on. When something is harder to attain (your response), we put more value on it.

You have to show her self-control. For one, every other guy she goes out with is trying to put his hands on her within the first hour of the first date.

She knows you're playing differently than all the other guys here, and she won't know what to expect; you're unpredictable. This intrigues her. This raises her interest.

------------------
Definition Of Insanity: Doing what you've always done and expecting things to change.

[This message has been edited by Armand (edited 11-03-2000).]

 

[Maverick]

Hey.....

Here... here... I agree guys...
It's more of a cat and mouse touchie feely sort of game when you start seeing a girl...
Be gentle, playful and fun-loving about Kino
you know your limits and you can judge by her reactions. Afterall, you've shown you're interest and this is a way for her to respond.

Carry on gents....

Peace

 

[Anti-Dump]

Originally posted by tennisfreak:


Forgive me, but isnt that coming on too strong???

I am the only guy here in the Forum that doesn't believe in Kino.

I'm not talking 'against it' now.

Before you ask for the number I feel it is a no-no. It shows too much interest.

On the first, second and third date you should be watching to see if she touches YOU. This is high interest if she does. If you are touching her, you have spoiled this little test.

A deep kiss and holding her in your arms at the end of the second and rest of the dates is enough to show a romantic
interest. And keep your Mystery in check.

I usually LEAN IN CLOSE during the dates when I'm reaching for something or doing something on the date. Like reading a menu together. This is my version of 'kino'. I get real close then get back to a normal
position.

This shows her I am a Mystery
BUT not afraid to get close to her. It substitutes for touching.

Now about hand holding. I always wondered, do you hold her hand when crossing the street during the first few dates. Or at times when she might be get hurt?

No. You touch her shoulder or back just below her neck. You do that to protect her. No hand holding for as long as you can hold out.

If she grabs YOUR hand at any time, first date on, make sure you hold back.

Massive touching from the number thru the fourth date I feel I the act of a man who is needy.

Hold her, kiss her, sit VERY close, but no massages please.

Sorry if this goes against all the others.This is my personal opinion. Use your own judgement men.

I guess I am TOO strict. But I won't return to MR. Nice Guy.

AD

 

[XCMan]

Personally, you I have to read the person. your gut is rarely wrong... If you just KNOW it will work do it... otherwise, i'm with AD.

 

[BigBadJon]

Originally posted by Anti-Dump:
Before you ask for the number I feel it is a no-no. It shows too much interest.

I would have to agree with you on this, for the most part.

On the first, second and third date you should be watching to see if she touches YOU. This is high interest if she does. If you are touching her, you have spoiled this little test.

I don't know... most of the time if I have waited this long to initiate contact it becomes awkward to start. Also, unless she really likes you, you are starting to step into the friend zone.

A deep kiss and holding her in your arms at the end of the second and rest of the dates is enough to show a romantic
interest. And keep your Mystery in check.

Man, I hate awkward moments. If I have at least made her comfortable with an innocent touch from me, it will be that much less awkward when I go for the "not so innocent" stuff.

I usually LEAN IN CLOSE during the dates when I'm reaching for something or doing something on the date. Like reading a menu together. This is my version of 'kino'. I get real close then get back to a normal
position.

I like that. Studies have shown that someone who already has a favorable impression of you, sitting closer makes them like you more.

Massive touching from the number thru the fourth date I feel I the act of a man who is needy.

Massive touching is a no-no. Light, innocent stuff will increase her interest and make her want more. And thats the idea, make her want more, right?

I guess I am TOO strict. But I won't return to MR. Nice Guy.

I can see where kino may lead to too much interest being shown on your part. I think the trick is to use it wisely to project confidence and raise interest.

None of us wants to return to our nice guy roots. We all just have different ways of keeping ourselves from it.

 

[tomazu]

to AD: do you know any nice guys who use kino? sincerely I've never seen any mr. nice guy doing it..

(perhaps that's why they never win.. hahaha.. just joking!)

ciao t

 

[Anti-Dump]

Tomazu,

You are right. I shouldn't have said 'nice guy'.

I really meant I think it just shows too much interest.

Caressing a new girl, I just would never do that. They have to prove interested in ME.

A divorce would teach you that.

He,he,he,he,he!!!!!!!

AD

 

[BigBadJon]

Originally posted by Anti-Dump:
Tomazu,A divorce would teach you that.

He,he,he,he,he!!!!!!!

AD

I'm sure a divorce would teach us all many valuable lessons

 

[Pook]

There is a single purpose for Kino: to show that you are a Sexual Being. Light touching on the arms, shoulders, upper back, forces her to think sexually about you and gives her permission to touch you similairly or to up the ante. Girls LOVE kino.

If you do not initiate Kino and wait for her to do it, you are Mr. Nice Guy. This is what Nice Guys do and why they lose. They are too 'nice' and think that touching them will 'scare' her or show that you are too interested (by touching her it tells her that you are interested in her sexually).

Failure to do this will land you right into the "Let's Just Be Friends" Zone. The girl will see you as a nice personality but sexually as a mannequin. Why? Because mannequins don't intiate kino.

Even my 'nice guy' friends, when they started iniating Kino, had full relationships BLOSSOM practically overnight. Kino is that powerful.

You TEST the girl's interest by doing Kino and SEEING HOW SHE RESPONDS.

Kino is the ULTIMATE INTEREST TEST. You can tell if a girl is just 'playing', 'teasing', being a 'professional dater' or truly interested by how she responds to the Kino. If she opens up her posture, mirrors your touch, etc. then she is interested and attracted to you SEXUALLY. (This is why Kino is said to be the first true step of the courtship ritual.)

If you WAIT for her to kino first, you will A) Spend more money and time taking her on dates waiting for her to initiate Kino (She's waiting for THE MAN to initiate it, just as you initiated the courtship by asking for her number) and B) Eventually landing in "Friend" zone.

Failure to initiate Kino = Nice Guy

------------------
Pook
"As you think, you shall become."

 

[Poet]

Failure to initiate Kino = Nice Guy

[/B][/QUOTE]

100 % with you on your entire post...totally correct sir! I finally figured this out for myself & I always go for as much Kino as I can..you will know easily enough if it's being accepted or not...immediate feedback & easily adjustable to the mood & the mindset of the recepient....very powerfull stuff...Outa here, Poet


------------------
Action is all....words don't mean ****.

Trust your instincts & nothing else.

 

[jester1x]

Pook is dead on here! Kino is a necessity during the first couple of dates or even when your trying to get something going with a woman. Kino can be described as "making a pass"
which is not necessarily trying to kiss her. You have to let her know that you have "needs" that you would like her to fulfill. It's not acting abnormal, but acting like a MAN!
Kino can be the key to getting with that woman you've always wanted. I use it every opportunity I can. (Women sure do smile a lot when you do it!)

------------------
Fooled(Jester) one(1) time(x) too many!

 

[BigBadJon]

Originally posted by Pook:
There is a single purpose for Kino: to show that you are a Sexual Being. Light touching on the arms, shoulders, upper back, forces her to think sexually about you and gives her permission to touch you similairly or to up the ante. Girls LOVE kino.

Amen brother.

If you do not initiate Kino and wait for her to do it, you are Mr. Nice Guy. This is what Nice Guys do and why they lose. They are too 'nice' and think that touching them will 'scare' her or show that you are too interested (by touching her it tells her that you are interested in her sexually).

Yea, that's exactly how I got mailed off to LJBF land many times. You want to touch them but are afraid of coming on too strong or whatever.

Kino is that powerful.

Very. You can be unattractive to her, and if you can get her comfortable with your touch her interest level may increase dramatically. I'm tellin you, my buddy wasn't all that in the looks department, (the girls that were chasing him told me this) but he poured on the kino and he had 6 of them at any given time all over him.

You TEST the girl's interest by doing Kino and SEEING HOW SHE RESPONDS.

Absolutely.

If you WAIT for her to kino first, you will A) Spend more money and time taking her on dates waiting for her to initiate Kino (She's waiting for THE MAN to initiate it, just as you initiated the courtship by asking for her number) and B) Eventually landing in "Friend" zone.

Not only do women expect the man to initiate contact, they also expect him to be the one to turn up the heat once you're in the kitchen.

Failure to initiate Kino = Nice Guy

Could have saved myself a ton of grief with this knowledge years ago.

 

[Ko-B]

I gotta agree with you, tennisfreak. The DJ Forums has a lot of conflicting advice.

There is a difference between coming on too strong and intiating kino on the first few dates. Initiating kino is meant to make the girl feel comfortable with you (a lean when they are talking, putting your arm on her BACK when you are walking together in a crowded place, etc.), while coming on too strong are gestures such as grabbing the a$s, attempting to "seduce" her, you know, those gestures those horny guys always do with women.

(Take note, that expressing sexual interest, isn't all that bad. Actually, it has some benefits. See the GM Style in the Lay Guide.)

I know this ain't related to kino and sh*t, but you gotta realize that every successful DJ in this forum has an approach that works FOR THEM. It is best for you to take the basic foundation of these approaches and mold them into your own "game."

 

[SoSuave.com]

bump

 

[john]

but remember the golden rule? she only gets the reward of a date with you once you have banged her. im sure williesacks would agree with this. like that kid has ever been on a date.

 

[Dancer]

JEEZ!
will someone shut this John guy up?

On the subject of kino: different girls like different things. I say to adjust the level of kino to the individual girl.

regarding the topic of conflicting advice: there certainly is a lot of it, but you have to go with what you feel will work best for you. Try all of it if it sounds good.

*S

 

[BigBill]

Ok here is my logic on Kino,

If the girl is one of your 'high interest' types, a little touch on the hand, or sitting next to her at the restaraunt, or greeting her with a little half-hug at the start of the date is NOT going to make her lose that interest.

On the other hand if shes not that into you and is just there to waste your time you will know the instant you touch her and she flinches.

for you doc Love people that means you don't have to wait till the 6th or 7th date with a stroker to know you ought to get rid of her. In fact, you can excuse yourself to go to the restroom and leave her ass right then and still salvage the rest of your night.

So by my logic, Kino (we arent talking massages here just things like maybe taking her hand for a few seconds to get a better look at her ring) isn't going to make anyone uncomfortable except a stroker who isn't interested in you the way you want her to be.

also I agree with not 'pouring on the kino' until you are making out. I use kino in my biology class at school with almost every girl in there. But only in very small amounts. They all like the way I touch them, and they sort of compete for my kino. Three of the better looking ones even come up out of the blue and initiate Kino now and then.

Mystery (which one do I REALLY like)
Challenge (Hmmm... how can I get him to pay more attention to me than the other girls)

I think Kino does alright if you use it right.