Boys Lagging Girls IN School

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By Peg Tyre
Newsweek


Jan. 30, 2006 issue - Spend a few minutes on the phone with Danny Frankhuizen and you come away thinking, "What a nice boy." He's thoughtful, articulate, bright. He has a good relationship with his mom, goes to church every Sunday, loves the rock band Phish and spends hours each day practicing his guitar. But once he's inside his large public Salt Lake City high school, everything seems to go wrong. He's 16, but he can't stay organized. He finishes his homework and then can't find it in his backpack. He loses focus in class, and his teachers, with 40 kids to wrangle, aren't much help. "If I miss a concept, they tell me, 'Figure it out yourself'," says Danny. Last year Danny's grades dropped from B's to D's and F's. The sophomore, who once dreamed of Stanford, is pulling his grades up but worries that "I won't even get accepted at community college."

His mother, Susie Malcom, a math teacher who is divorced, says it's been wrenching to watch Danny stumble. "I tell myself he's going to make something good out of himself," she says. "But it's hard to see doors close and opportunities fall away."

What's wrong with Danny? By almost every benchmark, boys across the nation and in every demographic group are falling behind. In elementary school, boys are two times more likely than girls to be diagnosed with learning disabilities and twice as likely to be placed in special-education classes. High-school boys are losing ground to girls on standardized writing tests. The number of boys who said they didn't like school rose 71 percent between 1980 and 2001, according to a University of Michigan study. Nowhere is the shift more evident than on college campuses. Thirty years ago men represented 58 percent of the undergraduate student body. Now they're a minority at 44 percent. This widening achievement gap, says Margaret Spellings, U.S. secretary of Education, "has profound implications for the economy, society, families and democracy."

With millions of parents wringing their hands, educators are searching for new tools to help tackle the problem of boys. Books including Michael Thompson's best seller "Raising Cain" (recently made into a PBS documentary) and Harvard psychologist William Pollack's definitive work "Real Boys" have become must-reads in the teachers' lounge. The Gurian Institute, founded in 1997 by family therapist Michael Gurian to help the people on the front lines help boys, has enrolled 15,000 teachers in its seminars. Even the Gates Foundation, which in the last five years has given away nearly a billion dollars to innovative high schools, is making boys a big priority. "Helping underperforming boys," says Jim Shelton, the foundation's education director, "has become part of our core mission."

The problem won't be solved overnight. In the last two decades, the education system has become obsessed with a quantifiable and narrowly defined kind of academic success, these experts say, and that myopic view is harming boys. Boys are biologically, developmentally and psychologically different from girls—and teachers need to learn how to bring out the best in every one. "Very well-meaning people," says Dr. Bruce Perry, a Houston neurologist who advocates for troubled kids, "have created a biologically disrespectful model of education."

Thirty years ago it was girls, not boys, who were lagging. The 1972 federal law Title IX forced schools to provide equal opportunities for girls in the classroom and on the playing field. Over the next two decades, billions of dollars were funneled into finding new ways to help girls achieve. In 1992, the American Association of University Women issued a report claiming that the work of Title IX was not done—girls still fell behind in math and science; by the mid-1990s, girls had reduced the gap in math and more girls than boys were taking high-school-level biology and chemistry.

Some scholars, notably Christina Hoff Sommers, a fellow at the American Enterprise Institute, charge that misguided feminism is what's been hurting boys. In the 1990s, she says, girls were making strong, steady progress toward parity in schools, but feminist educators portrayed them as disadvantaged and lavished them with support and attention. Boys, meanwhile, whose rates of achievement had begun to falter, were ignored and their problems allowed to fester (click here for related essay).



Boys have always been boys, but the expectations for how they're supposed to act and learn in school have changed. In the last 10 years, thanks in part to activist parents concerned about their children's success, school performance has been measured in two simple ways: how many students are enrolled in accelerated courses and whether test scores stay high. Standardized assessments have become commonplace for kids as young as 6. Curricula have become more rigid. Instead of allowing teachers to instruct kids in the manner and pace that suit each class, some states now tell teachers what, when and how to teach. At the same time, student-teacher ratios have risen, physical education and sports programs have been cut and recess is a distant memory. These new pressures are undermining the strengths and underscoring the limitations of what psychologists call the "boy brain"—the kinetic, disorganized, maddening and sometimes brilliant behaviors that scientists now believe are not learned but hard-wired.

When Cris Messler of Mountainside, N.J., brought her 3-year-old son Sam to a pediatrician to get him checked for ADHD, she was acknowledging the desperation parents can feel. He's a high-energy kid, and Messler found herself hoping for a positive diagnosis. "If I could get a diagnosis from the doctor, I could get him on medicine," she says. The doctor said Sam is a normal boy. School has been tough, though. Sam's reading teacher said he was hopeless. His first-grade teacher complains he's antsy, and Sam, now 7, has been referring to himself as "stupid." Messler's glad her son doesn't need medication, but what, she wonders, can she do now to help her boy in school?

For many boys, the trouble starts as young as 5, when they bring to kindergarten a set of physical and mental abilities very different from girls'. As almost any parent knows, most 5-year-old girls are more fluent than boys and can sight-read more words. Boys tend to have better hand-eye coordination, but their fine motor skills are less developed, making it a struggle for some to control a pencil or a paintbrush. Boys are more impulsive than girls; even if they can sit still, many prefer not to—at least not for long.

Thirty years ago feminists argued that classic "boy" behaviors were a result of socialization, but these days scientists believe they are an expression of male brain chemistry. Sometime in the first trimester, a boy fetus begins producing male sex hormones that bathe his brain in testosterone for the rest of his gestation. "That exposure wires the male brain differently," says Arthur Arnold, professor of physiological science at UCLA. How? Scientists aren't exactly sure. New studies show that prenatal exposure to male sex hormones directly affects the way children play. Girls whose mothers have high levels of testosterone during pregnancy are more likely to prefer playing with trucks to playing with dolls. There are also clues that hormones influence the way we learn all through life. In a Dutch study published in 1994, doctors found that when males were given female hormones, their spatial skills dropped but their verbal skills improved.


In elementary-school classrooms—where teachers increasingly put an emphasis on language and a premium on sitting quietly and speaking in turn—the mismatch between boys and school can become painfully obvious. "Girl behavior becomes the gold standard," says "Raising Cain" coauthor Thompson. "Boys are treated like defective girls."

Two years ago Kelley King, principal of Douglass Elementary School in Boulder, Colo., looked at the gap between boys and girls and decided to take action. Boys were lagging 10 points behind girls in reading and 14 points in writing. Many more boys than girls were being labeled as learning disabled, too. So King asked her teachers to buy copies of Gurian's book "The Minds of Boys," on boy-friendly classrooms, and in the fall of 2004 she launched a bold experiment. Whenever possible, teachers replaced lecture time with fast-moving lessons that all kids could enjoy. Three weeks ago, instead of discussing the book "The View From Saturday," teacher Pam Unrau divided her third graders into small groups, and one student in each group pretended to be a character from the book. Classes are noisier, Unrau says, but the boys are closing the gap. Last spring, Douglass girls scored an average of 106 on state writing tests, while boys got a respectable 101.



Primatologists have long observed that juvenile male chimps battle each other not just for food and females, but to establish and maintain their place in the hierarchy of the tribe. Primates face off against each other rather than appear weak. That same evolutionary imperative, psychologists say, can make it hard for boys to thrive in middle school—and difficult for boys who are failing to accept the help they need. The transition to middle school is rarely easy, but like the juvenile primates they are, middle-school boys will do almost anything to avoid admitting that they're overwhelmed. "Boys measure everything they do or say by a single yardstick: does this make me look weak?" says Thompson. "And if it does, he isn't going to do it." That's part of the reason that videogames have such a powerful hold on boys: the action is constant, they can calibrate just how hard the challenges will be and, when they lose, the defeat is private.
 

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When Brian Johns hit seventh grade, he never admitted how vulnerable it made him feel. "I got behind and never caught up," says Brian, now 17 and a senior at Grand River Academy, an Ohio boarding school. When his parents tried to help, he rebuffed them. When his mother, Anita, tried to help him organize his assignment book, he grew evasive about when his homework was due. Anita didn't know where to turn. Brian's school had a program for gifted kids, and support for ones with special needs. But what, Anita asked his teachers, do they do about kids like her son who are in the middle and struggling? Those kids, one of Brian's teachers told Anita, "are the ones who fall through the cracks."

It's easy for middle-school boys to feel outgunned. Girls reach sexual maturity two years ahead of boys, but other, less visible differences put boys at a disadvantage, too. The prefrontal cortex is a knobby region of the brain directly behind the forehead that scientists believe helps humans organize complex thoughts, control their impulses and understand the consequences of their own behavior. In the last five years, Dr. Jay Giedd, an expert in brain development at the National Institutes of Health, has used brain scans to show that in girls, it reaches its maximum thickness by the age of 11 and, for the next decade or more, continues to mature. In boys, this process is delayed by 18 months.

Middle-school boys may use their brains less efficiently, too. Using a type of MRI that traces activity in the brain, Deborah Yurgelun-Todd, director of the cognitive neuroimaging laboratory at McLean Hospital in Belmont, Mass., tested the activity patterns in the prefrontal cortex of children between the ages of 11 and 18. When shown pictures of fearful faces, adolescent girls registered activity on the right side of the prefrontal cortex, similar to an adult. Adolescent boys used both sides—a less mature pattern of brain activity. Teenage girls can process information faster, too. In a study about to be published in the journal Intelligence, researchers at Vanderbilt University administered timed tests—picking similar objects and matching groups of numbers—to 8,000 boys and girls between the ages of 5 and 18. In kindergarten, boys and girls processed information at about the same speeds. In early adolescence, girls finished faster and got more right. By 18, boys and girls were processing with the same speed and accuracy.

Scientists caution that brain research doesn't tell the whole story: temperament, family background and environment play big roles, too. Some boys are every bit as organized and assertive as the highest-achieving girls. All kids can be scarred by violence, alcohol or drugs in the family. But if your brain hasn't reached maturity yet, says Yurgelun-Todd, "it's not going to be able to do its job optimally."

Across the nation, educators are reviving an old idea: separate the girls from the boys—and at Roncalli Middle School, in Pueblo, Colo., administrators say, it's helping kids of both genders. This past fall, with the blessing of parents, school guidance counselor Mike Horton assigned a random group of 50 sixth graders to single-sex classes in core subjects. These days, when sixth-grade science teacher Pat Farrell assigns an earth-science lab on measuring crystals, the girls collect their materials—a Bunsen burner, a beaker of phenyl salicylate and a spoon. Then they read the directions and follow the sequence from beginning to end. The first things boys do is ask, "Can we eat this?" They're less organized, Farrell notes, but sometimes, "they're willing to go beyond what the lab asks them to do." With this in mind, he hands out written instructions to both classes but now goes over them step by step for the boys. Although it's too soon to declare victory, there are some positive signs: the shyest boys are participating more. This fall, the all-girl class did best in math, English and science, followed by the all-boy class and then coed classes.


One of the most reliable predictors of whether a boy will succeed or fail in high school rests on a single question: does he have a man in his life to look up to? Too often, the answer is no. High rates of divorce and single motherhood have created a generation of fatherless boys. In every kind of neighborhood, rich or poor, an increasing number of boys—now a startling 40 percent—are being raised without their biological dads.

Psychologists say that grandfathers and uncles can help, but emphasize that an adolescent boy without a father figure is like an explorer without a map. And that is especially true for poor boys and boys who are struggling in school. Older males, says Gurian, model self-restraint and solid work habits for younger ones. And whether they're breathing down their necks about grades or admonishing them to show up for school on time, "an older man reminds a boy in a million different ways that school is crucial to their mission in life."

In the past, boys had many opportunities to learn from older men. They might have been paired with a tutor, apprenticed to a master or put to work in the family store. High schools offered boys a rich array of roles in which to exercise leadership skills—class officer, yearbook editor or a place on the debate team. These days, with the exception of sports, more girls than boys are involved in those activities.

In neighborhoods where fathers are most scarce, the high-school dropout rates are shocking: more than half of African-American boys who start high school don't finish. David Banks, principal of the Eagle Academy for Young Men, one of four all-boy public high schools in the New York City system, wants each of his 180 students not only to graduate from high school but to enroll in college. And he's leaving nothing to chance. Almost every Eagle Academy boy has a male mentor—a lawyer, a police officer or an entrepreneur from the school's South Bronx neighborhood. The impact of the mentoring program, says Banks, has been "beyond profound." Tenth grader Rafael Mendez is unequivocal: his mentor "is the best thing that ever happened to me." Before Rafael came to Eagle Academy, he dreamed about playing pro baseball, but his mentor, Bronx Assistant District Attorney Rafael Curbelo, has shown him another way to succeed: Mendez is thinking about attending college in order to study forensic science.

Colleges would welcome more applications from young men like Rafael Mendez. At many state universities the gender balance is already tilting 60-40 toward women. Primary and secondary schools are going to have to make some major changes, says Ange Peterson, president-elect of the American Association of Collegiate Registrars and Admissions Officers, to restore the gender balance. "There's a whole group of men we're losing in education completely," says Peterson.

For Nikolas Arnold, 15, a sophomore at a public high school in Santa Monica, Calif., college is a distant dream. Nikolas is smart: he's got an encyclopedic knowledge of weaponry and war. When he was in first grade, his principal told his mother he was too immature and needed ADHD drugs. His mother balked. "Too immature?" says Diane Arnold, a widow. "He was six and a half!" He's always been an advanced reader, but his grades are erratic. Last semester, when his English teacher assigned two girls' favorites—"Memoirs of a Geisha" and "The Secret Life of Bees" Nikolas got a D. But lately, he has a math teacher he likes and is getting excited about numbers. He's reserved in class sometimes. But now that he's more engaged, his grades are improving slightly and his mother, who's pushing college, is hopeful he will begin to hit his stride. Girls get A's and B's on their report cards, she tells him, but that doesn't mean boys can't do it, too.

With Andrew Murr, Vanessa Juarez, Anne Underwood, Karen Springen and Pat Wingert

© 2006 Newsweek, Inc.

© 2006 MSNBC.com
 

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Couldn't be more succinct.

A few of my opinions...

>> Is it any wonder women would succeed? The emphasis in school isn't about intellect or intelligence or learning; if it was, they'd utilize MULTIPLE styles of LEARNING and TESTING so that all had a fair and level playground from which to learn. But it's not. Most tests (99%) require memorization of factual data (some of it incorrect). Proper behavior, guidance, listening, and such things fall in the category of women, feminine behavior, not masculine. Boys aren't rebels, but they are the explorers, pioneers, entrepreneurs, etc, that are restless enough to not want to sit still and listen. This isn't a "bad' boy thing, it's a gender issue, inherent in our genes. What happens when boys are put through the ringer with girls under situations girls succeed at? Girls succeed, and the majority of men end up like women, as is the case today.


>> The hooks are promises to boys in getting them to succeed in school is by dangling the carrott of "a good career and good college," which is pounded in by the parents, and if not parents, the school. To me, I've always thought grades to be very limiting in what they measure people. I have a cousin who does well in about 50% of his classes, and poorly in the other 50%. His best skills are in computers, graphics, and languages (spanish), but his worst appear to be English, Science, and History (which is mostly madeup in school and leaves out more critical details). Not that he CANNOT learn these topics, but in the confined period of 3-8 months, he cannot. Were he able to drive full force at his computers, graphics, and foreign languages with the passion he has to tinker in his off hours, he wouldn't NEED college at age 18 or 22, because he'd be more competent than most college students. In fact, I've found that MOST computer types are better BECAUSE they did it prior to college, and during their childhood, and then went for the degree as a sign of competency.


>> I say this: it isn't BAD to be CEO, President, VP, Finance OFFICER, Salesman, whatever...I fit those categories, IF YOU WANT it. The problem as mentioned by this article I found on Askmen.com is that when you're FORCED to do it, and fit into a certain role because you don't match up socially or economically. The problem is, education/learning is fundamental TO EXISTENCE, and doesn't NEED to be forced upon the public. WE ALL want to learn, don't we? From the basics of learning to surf, to learning poker, betting, football, or soccer...we all want to learn. And to learn, we pay dues. If you can surf for the rest of your life w/out requiring money, GO DO IT. You owe nothing to society. And if all of a sudden people found a way to do the same, we wouldn't croke! People WANT to learn, they want to outgrow their situations; it's inherent to life.


>> Also, remember the link posted on that teen who was suing his school for imbalanced education, I think in Souther MA? Well, it just so happens teen boys at MY old HS are doing the same. It was in the local paper. When I told people @ my office, they had to do a double take. Many of the women piped and said "Girls are worse than boys these days." Rather made me proud to see some people had an idea of what was going on.




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Æquitas

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This is something people definitely should be more aware of. To me it feels like in school girls are being awarded just for being themself while guys like us, either turn gay or has to waste enormous energy just to restrain ourself and stay focus to do good in school.
 

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the problem is the classes. i have to go to 7 hours of high school classes every day and all i do is sit there and stare at the wall. when i get home i dont want to do any work because really i just spent 7 hours doing borring, useless stuff. if instead i could just look at the textbooks for 7 hours at home instead of going to school, id learn more and learn more efficiently and have more free time. god i cant wait for college
 

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Originally posted by dirtyvibe
the problem is the classes. i have to go to 7 hours of high school classes every day and all i do is sit there and stare at the wall. when i get home i dont want to do any work because really i just spent 7 hours doing borring, useless stuff. if instead i could just look at the textbooks for 7 hours at home instead of going to school, id learn more and learn more efficiently and have more free time. god i cant wait for college
I totally agree, same **** for me. I really could learn so much more on my own, not to mention 90% of the things we learn in school we'll forget and never use. Here at my school some of the teachers are so sexist its ridiculous. Girls are treated alot better by quite a few teachers. Theres alot of **** wrong with out eductation system. I have to get up at 5:30 every morning, to go to a place i hate for 7 hours and they expect me to work happily and well. We're treated like **** at my school, we get drug searches like 4 times a week and the administration is so unresonable. They found a bandana with one of my friends and they threatened to expell him from all the schools in the district, assuming he was in a gang. He's a skinny little white kid.
 

diplomatic_lies

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The problem is, men respect authority and violence, but most schools today are full of wimpy teachers who try to make things "fair" and "nice".

Simple solution: Re-introduce corporal punishment. Anytime a student screws up, beat him senseless until he does it right. That was how the original Prussian school system worked in the 19th century.

After all, discipline is a manly trait.
 

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Back in my senior year of high school, I once had a teacher tell me this story.

The class was Business Management. It sounded interesting, so that's why I took it. The teacher was semi-retired. He was retired, but they begged him to come back part-time to teach one class (so he was only there one hour a day). This is significant because since he didn't need the money earned from teaching the class, he felt more free in what he could do in the class, and thus told this story:

He told the class that during his career with the school district, he's known of teachers with serious biases (no he didn't name names). I can't remember what all of them were, but two that really stuck out were that one teacher (probably a horny male) automatically gave an A to attractive girls, and another teacher never gave an A to any male student (that teacher was probably a man-hating feminist).

I don't think either teacher still works. But even if they don't, there's still many who do who have anti-male attitudes like this.


Ben
 

Page

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This problem is disturbing, to say the least.

I've always known that school wasn't designed for males--- all those hours of sitting still and listening/taking notes bores the hell out of me, and its not because I have ADD. Even back when I was taking the meds when I was a kid I still was bored in class because I spent so much time learning on my own outside of school. I learned more on my own time than I ever did at school.

I've always learned by doing. I remember taking things like machines apart when I was a kid so I could understand how they worked, this taught me more than a diagram or lecture on the subject ever could. Even in high school, when we were being instructed on how to use a piece of equipment or something like that I could barely restrain myself from trying to figure it out for myself.

In short, our educational system is a failure because conformity and the practice of following rules is encouraged over independence and free thought.
 

Abbott

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Originally posted by Page
This problem is disturbing, to say the least.

I've always known that school wasn't designed for males--- all those hours of sitting still and listening/taking notes bores the hell out of me, and its not because I have ADD. Even back when I was taking the meds when I was a kid I still was bored in class because I spent so much time learning on my own outside of school. I learned more on my own time than I ever did at school.

I've always learned by doing. I remember taking things like machines apart when I was a kid so I could understand how they worked, this taught me more than a diagram or lecture on the subject ever could. Even in high school, when we were being instructed on how to use a piece of equipment or something like that I could barely restrain myself from trying to figure it out for myself.

In short, our educational system is a failure because conformity and the practice of following rules is encouraged over independence and free thought.
I know what you mean. I don't hate learning.

But I always hated the public school system. I often thought it was a waste of time, and now that I'm out of high school, my opinions haven't changed. The only truely useful information is geometry and algebra, and I don't often need either. Geometry has to do with shapes and such, which is occasionally useful. Algebra is basically glorified plus, minus, times, and divide.

Algebra is useful for figuring financial stuff, and for figure cost per unit. A good example of cost per unit is that I drink a lot of orange juice, so I want to figure the cost of cents per ounce, so I buy the size that has the lowest cost per ounce. The assumption is that larger carton sizes are cheaper, but that's not always the case.

Other than that, I can't think of anything useful that I've learned. But I can think of a bunch of propaganda.

I'm a hands-on type, like you. I remember that I got my first computer when I was seven years old. It didn't even have Windows on it, plus it was a 486 w/ 2MB RAM, no sound, no CD-ROM drive, no NIC, no modem. My father had no idea what he was getting into when he bought it for me. Now I know a lot about computers, and few people know more than I do. Most of those who might know more are those who do it for a living. I'm still weak on the programming aspect (I'm strong on networking, assembling PCs, and configuration), but I'm in the process of learning that.


Ben
 

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So Many Ways

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In neighborhoods where fathers are most scarce, the high-school dropout rates are shocking: more than half of African-American boys who start high school don't finish. David Banks, principal of the Eagle Academy for Young Men, one of four all-boy public high schools in the New York City system, wants each of his 180 students not only to graduate from high school but to enroll in college. And he's leaving nothing to chance. Almost every Eagle Academy boy has a male mentor—a lawyer, a police officer or an entrepreneur from the school's South Bronx neighborhood. The impact of the mentoring program, says Banks, has been "beyond profound." Tenth grader Rafael Mendez is unequivocal: his mentor "is the best thing that ever happened to me." Before Rafael came to Eagle Academy, he dreamed about playing pro baseball, but his mentor, Bronx Assistant District Attorney Rafael Curbelo, has shown him another way to succeed: Mendez is thinking about attending college in order to study forensic science.
I think this is a big part of it here. So many young boys nowadays don't have positive male role models due to so much single parenting. I was bored out of my mind in school but if it wasn't for my father who was hard core about education and had no tolerance for bad grades, I probably would have drifted off just like anyone else. The whole female-centric approach to education that the article talked about doesn't surprise me though.

College was such a huge difference. No one on your case if you're a couple of minutes late or you miss class, you're treated like an adult, and no thugs waiting to kick your a55. It was like night and day.
 

Desdinova

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First of all, absolutely fantastic article! People are starting to notice the off-balance society we live in - girls in the majority. Prepare for a backlash against the whole feminazi revolution.

One of the most reliable predictors of whether a boy will succeed or fail in high school rests on a single question: does he have a man in his life to look up to? Too often, the answer is no. High rates of divorce and single motherhood have created a generation of fatherless boys. In every kind of neighborhood, rich or poor, an increasing number of boys—now a startling 40 percent—are being raised without their biological dads.
This is an excellent point, and it also traces back to feminazism. It's all chain reaction. Women take the power away from men. Women become men, men become women. A woman is attracted to a men, not women. IMO, this is a HUGE reason why many relationships fail today. Now, since the woman has more power than the man, she ends up with the kids while the man pays for them. The kids, being male or female, grow up learning feminine traits from their mothers. They have no clue on how to be masculine. I have a friend who grew up without a father, and he's absolutely clueless on masculinity.

I also agree that the education system is crap. One big thing that comes into account in the grading system is the teacher-student relationship, as well as teaching methods. I learned this first hand in my grade 11 english class.

We started out the year with a substitute while the regular teacher was recovering from surgery. My grades were decent, around a B average. When the regular teacher recovered and took over, I failed to get along with her, and my marks dropped from a B to an F. Luckily, she went back for more surgery and the substitute returned. My grades shot back up.

One more thing... a female friend of mine has a five year old son. She got him some new pants, the ones with the chain hanging at the side. He got sent home with a note to refrain from wearing them because the chain was classed as a weapon!
 

comic_relief

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I can learn either way but I just hate sitting here all day. I can do it and get decent grades but I hate it.

The only good thing to come out of this article to me is that I now know how to change my style to help the children the best when I become a teacher.

comic_relief
 

Abbott

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Originally posted by comic_relief
I can learn either way but I just hate sitting here all day. I can do it and get decent grades but I hate it.

The only good thing to come out of this article to me is that I now know how to change my style to help the children the best when I become a teacher.

comic_relief
I hope they let you. I once heard of one teacher who was forced to award partial credit after failing 25% of her class. That portion of her class engaged in plagiarizing. I don't remember the whole story, but if that's really true she did the right thing but was then forced to do otherwise.

Teach college classes. There's a greater likelihood that the students are people who actually want to learn, since college isn't legally required. This is more true of classes that aren't "general education" and are more degree-specific. I don't want to teach, but if I did that's what I'd do.


Ben
 

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I'd long felt education should be privatized, but hadn't worked out the 'planning' of doing it. I would teach, but there's no where near enough $$, nor do I like the restricted program.

Who says what I should learn?

Learning is fundamental to life, and what you learn determines where you go, how you act, think, feel, etc. The more limited we are in our thinking/awareness, the more like animals we truly are. Public education does just that with MOST of the population. So people are genetically gifted, or blessed with good families who teach them on the side, but education in America is seen as a cult or religion to the point where parents defer their duties and opinions of their children to the school system.

If a teacher says your kid won't succeed in life based on her random, short-sighted assessment, your kid won't.

If a teacher likes your kid just because she's polite, gets good grades, then you feel good, regardless of if she's a follower, user, abuser, or something else. LOTS of kids, even college students can memorize a book sufficiently to skate by tests, BUT few exercise common sense in life, understand financial concepts, or having any awareness of philosophy (which to me is MORE important than what you learn).

Education underutilizes a person's inherent or latent skils, and overemphasizes those skills REQUIRED by society. However, it's not what CURRENTLY resides in society that makes 1 successful personally, but what IS NOT there, that makes you an entrepreneur, capitalist, and successful. You needn't be 1 of those to be happy and successful, but I would submit that a large majority of America would be happy DOING what they are good at and love and getting paid at it, rather than offering their services to someone else via employment.

I waded through Market basket (a supermarket) just before v-day, and noticed the myriad of kids (teens) working there, bagging groceries, working the check out line, etc. Initially, a kid learns responsibility, earns money, etc, maybe even learns some public skills. However, it's a far cry from how things were, or should be. Students who get internships, or follow in their dad's footsteps, end up successful SOONER.

I'd rather see a kid work for free and earn something valuable in regards to skills, than get paid 5-10 per hour and learn nothing.



A-Unit
 

Desdinova

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If a teacher says your kid won't succeed in life based on her random, short-sighted assessment, your kid won't.
I had a teacher tell me this personally. That rotten bastard expected handed us the books and said "here, go learn". The teacher then proceeded to fvck off and do something else. I spent that class time learning things on my own (which was actually related to the class subject).

When the test came at the year (and 90 percent of the class had dropped out) I failed it miserably. The teacher then proceeded to tell me that I was going to be a failure all my life.

Boy was he fvcking wrong! :D
 

Centaurion

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The US school system sucks. Period.

You guys need to adopt the Norwegian one. Over here you have Elementary school from year 1-7. Year 8-10 is Junior HS, and based on your grade point average you apply to a Senior HS (3 years).

Now if you want to continue studying at University you apply to regular HS, the better gpa you have, the better senior HS you get to choose. In the better schools, the teachers are usually motivated to help you out and you get more freedom. At my HS (the best in the country) it was almot College style. You were responsible for your own learning.

On the other hand, if you want to pick up a Trade (plumber,electrician, mechanic etc), you go straight from Junior HS to a tradeschool.

This way you are presented with more options early on, and can make a choice for yourself what you want to do.
 

comic_relief

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Originally posted by Centaurion
The US school system sucks. Period.
The school system sucks not because of the system per se but because of the damn No Child Left Behind Act which makes schools teach to the test which is primarily a guessing game.

Then to make matters worse. The state gives money out to whoever does well on the test but ignores whoever is doing poorly on the tests. Shouldn't the schools that do badly get the money to improve?

I heard my girlfriend tell me all about how good NCLB act was good because it showed how good the school did. I called bull because this doesn't prove anything other than you are a good test taker because you can be having a bad day and fail. Well you are a failure in life but still have a 4.0 GPA. That is a crock.

Or you guess well on it and your a genius.

It takes no consideration into if you can do well on it or not. That is just one problem.

--------------------------------------------------

Yeah, the American school system sucks. oh yeah, the American school system also is terrible because of how they deal with fights and violence. You cannot defend yourself if someone is beating on you. You have to run away and tell a teacher and they still can't do anything except give a slap on the wrist. What a crock of BS.

comic_relief
 

Soupar

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Originally posted by comic_relief
Yeah, the American school system sucks. oh yeah, the American school system also is terrible because of how they deal with fights and violence. You cannot defend yourself if someone is beating on you. You have to run away and tell a teacher and they still can't do anything except give a slap on the wrist. What a crock of BS.

comic_relief
So true man... I've had multiple friends go to court for assualt charges because of getting into fights at school (they didnt always start them). The fights arent even serious, like a few punches, nothing more.
 

diplomatic_lies

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Originally posted by comic_relief
Shouldn't the schools that do badly get the money to improve?
No.

Why should we support the weak parts of society? If you have a tumour, do you encourage it?
 
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