An Introduction and a Request for Insight

[Mr.225]

Relax and be calm.

There's no need to be excited.

You're never done it so it's incomprehensible to you. I understand. Don't worry.

The advice was never meant for you.

Now hush.

I want to thank everyone for writing in. In the initial post, I tried to give the most important information. What didn't make the cut, is spanking.

I have spanked her before. First, it was a joke, and she clearly liked it. Second, it was a prelude to some of the hottest sex we ever had. She has explicitly told me that she does not want to disciplined with spanking, but does like it around sex. However, something I feel like I have noticed is that she does not like patterns as they relate to sex even if the pattern relates to spanking. She wants novelty more than she would admit. However, recently I have received more static from her about the spanking, like if I would pull her close and give her smack she would protest. In the last six months, I have been ignoring her and sex, and just reading as much red pill stuff, as I could find. It has been awhile since I put her over my lap, and slapped her bare ass.

I chalk this up to a good tip from Spaz. I have gotten lazy on the spanking. I have wanted her to "give me permission" to discipline her, and I do not think she could even if she wanted to. I don't think she wants to admit to herself that she likes it. However, she never viewed this as discipline. I think what she likes is what some people would call a maintenance spanking, she likes to feel a man's strength and aggression.

Spanking will be making a return to my house. However, I think she is noticing a "new frame" in my and things are going well, I am not sure exactly how to reincorporate it--discipline, maintenance, sex-play, etc. She is clearly more comfortable with the last two. However, I think when I truly have the right frame, she doesn't need much discipline.

Mr. 225

 

[highSpeed]

Weak bait?


That's why you needed to post this.....uber, when will you learn?



You can cry blood, roll on the floor and bawled like a baby, you can even howl at the moon with ur tail tuck between ur legs....you can't change my mind of what u truly are - an emotional passive man.

But u r welcome to fool others if that makes you feel good.

lol, the tool strikes again. you know what, let's change your name to crackerjack, cause that's all your advice is worth.

 

[Mr.225]

This is a typical, common situation. I recommend none of the above except the spankings but most likely you're too deep in the game to start that now. If you started off with it, then yes it works. Just an opinion from experience.
Not intending to burst your hope that something exists to re-ignite her desire for you. Go back and read Tomassi's section on genuine desire and then compare it to the experiences of other men. There are millions of men to choose from for this. The story is the same. Only the names have changed.

Here is the way this tool is used. Keep in mind that it is not done necessarily on purpose. Some women? Sure. As a rule, she genuinely doesn't feel desire. She can get horny of course and want sex occasionally. Approximately once to twice a month on average until later on when it quits entirely.
When the sex becomes scarce in a relationship it evokes a condition where you go into problem solving mode. A woman will handle her problems by getting a chemical fix from a man that has the masculine, sexual persona. She will jump from sexual chemical spike to spike in her body.
That lack of normal intimacy as well as sex becomes horrible and quite stressful for a man. It can be debilitating. Nearly all men step up their working and production in an attempt to obtain approval and ultimately a renewed sense of desire from her. These men (nearly all) become driven to succeed at whatever they are doing...for intimacy. This traps you even deeper into the program. All that work to regain that desire will trap you. You set up neural pathways in a reward/punishment circuit. You are in the feminine paradigm. She has secured her survival from you. It doesn't matter if she is an executive and even makes more than you. Her proclivity to secure a provider is biological.

Present day women are extremely jealous of the natural abilities of men. We produce naturally. Its our nature. We will create new ways of doing things. We are the procurers of survival and production. They are not necessarily jealous of MEN but they are envious to an obsessive degree of our natural inclination to roll up our sleeves and kick butt. It is easy for us because we are operating with our biology. We don't even think about it. This is an alien concept to the thought processes of women. They don't want to get a shovel and dig ditches, the want the job where they can tell the men where to dig those ditches. They want equality through the executive positions without all the work and creativity it takes to get to the executive position. When men show them up they get insecure and will disrupt the whole organization. They don't want to dig ditches first to show their worth. There's a good reason for this...they can't compete with men in the sphere of the natural inclination to produce. Notice how the media shames men and highly successful companies for the lack of women in executive positions?

How does this tie in to your situation? This is up to you. Just take another look at it with new eyes. The goal I want for you is that you get moved from the resources column in a woman's note book to the sex column. However I will not lie to you brother. Once in the resources column in a single particular woman's notebook, it is nearly impossible to be moved over to the sexually valuable column. Those are two different types of men. You are already labelled a resources man.
I hate giving bad news to someone who is probably a damn fine man. But most women will never acknowledge it in a sincere manner unless it benefits them personally. Women admire and respect a competent man but they sleep with piles of $hit. IF they are lucky, they will run into a very masculine man. In my opinion most don't deserve a high quality masculine producer. Become that man. Rule your dynasty again. The one that was your birthright.

A man who "makes love" to his women will loose them. The man who is capable of ravenously fukking her and fukking her into her place will win the day. This is why I have always felt, inside, that women are a subset of homo sapiens. She will never be your equal. We were meant to compliment each other. Both in their role. This is where she can truly be happy.

I understand why you write this. One reason I hope that your wrong is that we were married when I had no resources, and I was still clearly a notch above her in SMV. So...I am hoping (I realize it is hard) to re-establish "the frame". I have had frame in fits and starts, but never the way a man should, and I am not realizing this until now, after reading TRM.

Now, my money is right, and I have always kept my body right, but I have hit the gym like an animal and she is noticing.

Am not sure if I mentioned this in my original post, I was trying to get everything in. We are Christians. We were and we are. She wants to think of herself as submissive, but I think the programming from her parents and culture are clashing with feminine sexuality in her. She likes to think of herself as a submissive wife, but that submission has ended mostly in the bedroom for us. She says no to a lot of activities that you all would view as extra regular.

Nevertheless, I know now better than I ever did, that I need to worship my God and not her. I hope my introduction to this red pill life can help things. So far, I have had some small successes, and I hope to build on them with some help from the community here, and good red pill literature.

 

[Epic Days]

I’m not a Christian but I listened to “Sunrise Hoodie” on YouTube a couple of times. He has a Christian bent to his red pill message. He has more of a “monk” attitude but he references the Bible in his message. Maybe that could help.

He doesn’t talk about it too much but there’s a reason having more than one wife works. In time, if you study red pill long enough, you will see the brilliance in this as it applies to a woman’s biology. It worked for a reason. Naturally the feminine imperative got rid of that brilliance.

 

[Mr.225]

I’m not a Christian but I listened to “Sunrise Hoodie” on YouTube a couple of times. He has a Christian bent to his red pill message. He has more of a “monk” attitude but he references the Bible in his message. Maybe that could help.

He doesn’t talk about it too much but there’s a reason having more than one wife works. In time, if you study red pill long enough, you will see the brilliance in this as it applies to a woman’s biology. It worked for a reason. Naturally the feminine imperative got rid of that brilliance.

From a biological perspective, I think you are right. Sex at Dawn is a book that supports your view here. Maybe this is getting too far afield into the theory on this, but Sex at Dawn's hypothesis is that a change takes place in the sexes when agriculture is introduced. To me, this corresponds nicely, with story of "The Fall" in Christian theology--Adam and Eve mess up their divine imperative in a garden and are cursed with human struggle--the man, for failing to lead his wife correctly, is cursed with work, and Eve is cursed with the pain of child bearing. I think it is implied here that men will have to control their imperative for unlimited sexuality (they are now naked and ashamed) and women are called on to control hypergamy at his point. Obviously, both men and women fall short.

I understand you don't subscribe to this. I do think your view makes sense, if there is no God. However, I think there is one. The only reason I am still married is because of obedience to my God in this respect. If I thought I could divorce her and not commit a cosmic sin, I would have already.

 

[Spaz]

I want to thank everyone for writing in. In the initial post, I tried to give the most important information. What didn't make the cut, is spanking.

I have spanked her before. First, it was a joke, and she clearly liked it. Second, it was a prelude to some of the hottest sex we ever had. She has explicitly told me that she does not want to disciplined with spanking, but does like it around sex. However, something I feel like I have noticed is that she does not like patterns as they relate to sex even if the pattern relates to spanking. She wants novelty more than she would admit. However, recently I have received more static from her about the spanking, like if I would pull her close and give her smack she would protest. In the last six months, I have been ignoring her and sex, and just reading as much red pill stuff, as I could find. It has been awhile since I put her over my lap, and slapped her bare ass.

I chalk this up to a good tip from Spaz. I have gotten lazy on the spanking. I have wanted her to "give me permission" to discipline her, and I do not think she could even if she wanted to. I don't think she wants to admit to herself that she likes it. However, she never viewed this as discipline. I think what she likes is what some people would call a maintenance spanking, she likes to feel a man's strength and aggression.

Spanking will be making a return to my house. However, I think she is noticing a "new frame" in my and things are going well, I am not sure exactly how to reincorporate it--discipline, maintenance, sex-play, etc. She is clearly more comfortable with the last two. However, I think when I truly have the right frame, she doesn't need much discipline.

Mr. 225

Don't ask for permission, that's the wrong frame.

She's the type that needs to be dominated, all women do but more so for her.

Just carry her off, despite her protestations, bend her over your lap, tear off her panties and give it a good spanking.

Make sure she pleads for mercy and then caress her..play around with her softness..seduce her into a submissive frame by being dominant.

She will be turned on by this.

I can explain in detail as to why she would be turned on but it's one fvcking long story.

Welcome to the forum.

 

[Spaz]

lol, the tool strikes again. you know what, let's change your name to crackerjack, cause that's all your advice is worth.

You must feel real manly to be constantly abused by the women in ur family, which is why you are so adamant to get OP in the same boat as you are in.

 

[Mr.225]

Don't ask for permission, that's the wrong frame.

She's the type that needs to be dominated, all women do but more so for her.

Just carry her off, despite her protestations, bend her over your lap, tear off her panties and give it a good spanking.

Make sure she pleads for mercy and then caress her..play around with her softness..seduce her into a submissive frame by being dominant.

She will be turned on by this.

I can explain in detail as to why she would be turned on but it's one fvcking long story.

Welcome to the forum.

I am entertaining this.

So, lets say she says, "Why are you doing this?" Why did you do that?" etc. etc.

This would be a drastic change in behavior from what has been going on...recently. Recently, I have been aloof. I have been spend my time working on the house (renovating a bathroom), lifting, playing pool (billiards), or reading red pill books. She is noticing a lack of attention from me.

What is the response to her? I realize that in asking this question my frame is not right. Someone who was living where this seems natural would have the right frame and that is what I am trying to fix.

I guess I would say something like, "I have been neglecting or your nice ass; it needed a spanking.", or "I am doing this because I want to watch your get smacked. You are welcome."

 

[highSpeed]

You must feel real manly to be constantly abused by the women in ur family, which is why you are so adamant to get OP in the same boat as you are in.

Lol, no, I live in reality land, you live in some fantasy land where your opinions are actually worth something @crackerjack. I'd say someone should kick you off the f*cking planet but it seems as if you've done that yourself already.

 

[Spaz]

I am entertaining this.

So, lets say she says, "Why are you doing this?" Why did you do that?" etc. etc.

This would be a drastic change in behavior from what has been going on...recently. Recently, I have been aloof. I have been spend my time working on the house (renovating a bathroom), lifting, playing pool (billiards), or reading red pill books. She is noticing a lack of attention from me.

What is the response to her? I realize that in asking this question my frame is not right. Someone who was living where this seems natural would have the right frame and that is what I am trying to fix.

I guess I would say something like, "I have been neglecting or your nice ass; it needed a spanking.", or "I am doing this because I want to watch your get smacked. You are welcome."

I've spanked women in Bahrain, Sweden and Singapore - tough places with tough laws.

And I never asked for permission nor even mentioned it. Nor was I ever in jail because of it, don't worry about those noobs that keeps on harping about jail, they're too passive for it to work anyways.

When my woman gets out of hand or have extremely displeased me, they will be punished. No exceptions given. No mercy shown. I will punish them.

Each and every time a woman gets punished by me they get extremely turned on, which often leads to some mind blowing makeup sex - and women craves make up sex. I know it sounds stupid but it is what it is.

Women's emotions needs to swing like a pendulum for them to feel alive....to feel love...to feel desired..etc. They must have that emotional highs and lows.

When you do this, you'll hit 2 birds with 1 stone. You get an amazing sex life and an adoring wife because you maintained/reinforce a dominant frame over her.

Does this make sense?

I'm at the bar drinking beer and typing this so how I'm framing this might be weird.

 

[Spaz]

Lol, no, I live in reality land, you live in some fantasy land where your opinions are actually worth something @crackerjack. I'd say someone should kick you off the f*cking planet but it seems as if you've done that yourself already.

You have done nothing in this thread so far but discourage OP.

And at the same time offered nothing. Not a single viable solution.

 

[highSpeed]

You have done nothing in this thread so far but discourage OP.

And at the same time offered nothing. Not a single viable solution.

No, I'm giving him real advice, not fantasy land advice. You've given him domestic abuse advice, which will result in him going to jail @crackerjack. So please, keep giving him your dipsh*t, deluded advice.

 

[Mr.225]

I've spanked women in Bahrain, Sweden and Singapore - tough places with tough laws.

And I never asked for permission nor even mentioned it. Nor was I ever in jail because of it, don't worry about those noobs that keeps on harping about jail, they're too passive for it to work anyways.

When my woman gets out of hand or have extremely displeased me, they will be punished. No exceptions given. No mercy shown. I will punish them.

Each and every time a woman gets punished by me they get extremely turned on, which often leads to some mind blowing makeup sex - and women craves make up sex. I know it sounds stupid but it is what it is.

Women's emotions needs to swing like a pendulum for them to feel alive....to feel love...to feel desired..etc. They must have that emotional highs and lows.

When you do this, you'll hit 2 birds with 1 stone. You get an amazing sex life and an adoring wife because you maintained/reinforce a dominant frame over her.

Does this make sense?

I'm at the bar drinking beer and typing this so how I'm framing this might be weird.

Yes that makes sense. Maybe I am not taking away from your advice something you want me to, but let me rephrase my question.

Rollo says in The Rational Male, that women communicate covertly or through their actions. A man should basically never listen to what his woman says. However, sometimes when they are sort of placed on the defensive / caught off guard they will revert to overt communication. I believe something like this is also in TRM. I loaned my copy to a buddy.

My wife has covertly said that she enjoys physical domination. However, I think she sort of fights against this desire, because of her religious upbringing (and I was trained from a young age to be a gentleman, etc.). I believe that while I am in the midst of spanking her, she will resort to overt communication in an effort to understand. My question to you is: do you have an idea on how to respond?

Also, the way I read your advice, is that spanking, while maybe o.k. for foreplay, is necessary as discipline. Do I understand your position on this?

 

[LOOKS]

Prediction: O.P. Ends up getting his a$$ spanked in court then spanked again in a submissive position of foreplay, dominance and punishment by his dominant hubby in lockup.

 

[AJ84]

Yes that makes sense. Maybe I am not taking away from your advice something you want me to, but let me rephrase my question.

Rollo says in The Rational Male, that women communicate covertly or through their actions. A man should basically never listen to what his woman says. However, sometimes when they are sort of placed on the defensive / caught off guard they will revert to overt communication. I believe something like this is also in TRM. I loaned my copy to a buddy.

My wife has covertly said that she enjoys physical domination. However, I think she sort of fights against this desire, because of her religious upbringing (and I was trained from a young age to be a gentleman, etc.). I believe that while I am in the midst of spanking her, she will resort to overt communication in an effort to understand. My question to you is: do you have an idea on how to respond?

Also, the way I read your advice, is that spanking, while maybe o.k. for foreplay, is necessary as discipline. Do I understand your position on this?

Why didn’t you tell us this before? If she responds sexually to spanking then do that lol.

You made it seem like she was an asexual starfish who didn’t like anything and turns out she is into some fun juicy stuff but feels some guilt about it? Need to find a way to unlock her inner sex kitten lol.

FTY There’s a difference between spanking as a fetish and spanking as punishment keep her in line. If you look into domestic discipline they seem to say not to mix the two as it sends mixed signals and the punishment is supposed to be unpleasant if it’s being used for discipline and keeping her in line.

If she responds to spanking in the context of sex but not as a form of physical punishment is there a reason why you need to do both? Is she a bad wife in other ways? Seems like you found something she likes do sexually that you also like to do. I thought the issue was getting her to open up more sexually and willingly do more things in bed no?

 

[ubercat]

Well that changes everything. No do not try to smack your wife for discipline this is not the 1950s. In the bedroom if she likes it sure search on dominant in this forum and you find a million threads.

 

[Mr.225]

Why didn’t you tell us this before? If she responds sexually to spanking then do that lol.

You made it seem like she was an asexual starfish who didn’t like anything and turns out she is into some fun juicy stuff but feels some guilt about it? Need to find a way to unlock her inner sex kitten lol.

FTY There’s a difference between spanking as a fetish and spanking as punishment keep her in line. If you look into domestic discipline they seem to say not to mix the two as it sends mixed signals and the punishment is supposed to be unpleasant if it’s being used for discipline and keeping her in line.

If she responds to spanking in the context of sex but not as a form of physical punishment is there a reason why you need to do both? Is she a bad wife in other ways? Seems like you found something she likes do sexually that you also like to do. I thought the issue was getting her to open up more sexually and willingly do more things in bed no?

O.k., yes, but I think she does not like things to seem to predicable. I didn't say this before, because this is the exception and not the rule, and I was trying to keep the initial post not too long.

So, I am not sure always spanking her is the answer. I am of the opinion that anything that seems ritualistic or part of a pattern is something that she doesn't like. However, I am less concerned these days with what she likes (it still matters to me), but I worry that it puts me in the wrong mindset.

I agree with you that I think it is important to distinguish between punishment and play, which is why I asked Spaz for a little more clarification.

Getting her to open up sexually is the issue. For example, one night I spank her, and she is like a woman on fire. A few days later, things get started and I move my hand between her legs and she forces them closed. I can spank her, but I am not allowed to finger her. I can face**** her (I believe she likes this, but she would never admit it), but I can't **** her doggystyle...ever. Lingerie is simply out of the question...always.

The problem I am having (or one of the problems) is that she will refuse certain things (fingering, lingerie, etc.--things I want to do. I do not want to be limited in the activities I can do with my wife--I don't think I should be) and when she does, I am no longer leading the interaction, she is no longer submissive, etc. I lose the frame. Whatever. In my pre-red-pill days I pointed this out to her, and she listened, but did nothing. I chalk this up to female solipsism, and desire cannot be negotiated.

Most of the time, duty sex is what happens, if it happens, and I am sick of it.

 

[AJ84]

O.k., yes, but I think she does not like things to seem to predicable. I didn't say this before, because this is the exception and not the rule, and I was trying to keep the initial post not too long.

So, I am not sure always spanking her is the answer. I am of the opinion that anything that seems ritualistic or part of a pattern is something that she doesn't like. However, I am less concerned these days with what she likes (it still matters to me), but I worry that it puts me in the wrong mindset.

I agree with you that I think it is important to distinguish between punishment and play, which is why I asked Spaz for a little more clarification.

Getting her to open up sexually is the issue. For example, one night I spank her, and she is like a woman on fire. A few days later, things get started and I move my hand between her legs and she forces them closed. I can spank her, but I am not allowed to finger her. I can face**** her (I believe she likes this, but she would never admit it), but I can't **** her doggystyle...ever. Lingerie is simply out of the question...always.

The problem I am having (or one of the problems) is that she will refuse certain things (fingering, lingerie, etc.--things I want to do. I do not want to be limited in the activities I can do with my wife--I don't think I should be) and when she does, I am no longer leading the interaction, she is no longer submissive, etc. I lose the frame. Whatever. In my pre-red-pill days I pointed this out to her, and she listened, but did nothing. I chalk this up to female solipsism, and desire cannot be negotiated.

Most of the time, duty sex is what happens, if it happens, and I am sick of it.

That really sucks, because one time she likes it and another time she doesn’t so it’s confusing and frustrating I can imagine.

I’m not sure having the attitude that you should be able to do whatever with her is going to be helpful for her, though ideally you should be able to and vise versa. If there’s a way you can communicate that without making her defensive that would be ideal. I think that’s where a sex therapist (who specializes in sexual hang ups) could be helpful imo. She needs to know that you are each other’s only sexual outlet (aside from solo stuff) so it’s important that she can be comfortable trying things and meeting your needs.

But that should go both ways, so if she wants to stick fingers up your butt, well at least try it .

 

[Spaz]

Also, the way I read your advice, is that spanking, while maybe o.k. for foreplay, is necessary as discipline. Do I understand your position on this?

Yes. It is.

You have sufficiently explained ur wife behavior at your 1st post and it was apparent even then. That was how I knew she'd be opened to spanking.

What women actually wants is actually shown by their actions rather then what she says.

She has that need for discipline, all women does in one form or another but more so for your woman.

Don't fret over it, she subconsciously desires it even if she says no and so do you - I'm certain.

Lead her along that path.

 

[Spaz]

No, I'm giving him real advice, not fantasy land advice. You've given him domestic abuse advice, which will result in him going to jail @crackerjack. So please, keep giving him your dipsh*t, deluded advice.

And now you know why you keep failing at every turn with your own wife.

I am always correct.