A review of my dating life so far: Insights appreciated

[Konada]

I would say that I only really started putting myself out there in the past year even though I've been on this forum for quite awhile. And honestly, I'm not happy with the results I'm managing and at this point I feel that I've plateaued and don't know what I don't know.

So in the past year, I've:
- Been out with 15 girls, HB5-7.5
- Kiss closed 3 of them
- Laid one (could have laid one more but **** happens)
- Been on TWO second dates

As you can see, that's a pretty ****ty rate for girls willing to go out on a first date with me but I do not know what am I not doing/doing and frankly I'm angry at myself thinking that its not my game but rather my looks that are turning girls away (I'm 110lbs 5'8"). I live in Southeast Asia so keep that in mind.

What I do on a first date:

I invite them out for a drink at a local bar in the city area. So throughout the date I'm relaxed, show good eye contact and not afraid to express my interest in them. I always received IOIs like hair flipping, twirling and playing with shoe etc. Some light kino as the bar tables aren't really conducive for kino. We talk about anything, usual stuff then I tease her, get her laughing and some stuff about passions, dreams or experiences she had to get her reliving the feelings again. Lately, I've been trying a game of 10 questions where I will ask seemingly innocent questions then slightly provocative ones to test the waters out and after a drink or two we make our move to the nearby rooftop/go for a walk.

Now this is where I get fcking confused. If I were to sum up my experiences on what led to a kiss close mid date, its because they gave me the signals to amp up the kino (i.e bumping into me). The ones which didn't turn out well were the ones where even though I received IOIs in the beginning, they maintained physical distance which made kino extremely unnatural/forced and even if I tried to escalate, they'd freeze up, flinch, or move away and the mood dies from there.

I don't feel like I'm doing anything wrong and it sucks where I can get these girls out but they seem to do a 180 on me mid date. And it seems that I'm only having problems with local girls, as my lay was from a girl from the US and the other potential lay was a girl from NZ. I don't know what am I doing wrong and I have nobody to teach me this stuff. Please help.

 

[Desdinova]

What I do on a first date:

I invite them out for a drink at a local bar in the city area.

I have never taken a girl out for a drink on a first date. When it comes to a first date, my choice really depends on how much rapport I've built with them when I met them. If I already have good rapport, then I'll take them mini golfing. If I don't have good rapport, we'll go out for coffee first and THEN go mini golfing right after. A lot of times, I'll go somewhere else with her after mini golfing. I usually like taking her to an Asian grocery store to look at the unusual foods (that is unless she's Asian, then I'll take her to browse a thrift store). Switching locations helps her feel like things are progressing. It all seems spontaneous to her, but for me it's a time tested pattern that I almost always use for a first date.

Lately, I've been trying a game of 10 questions where I will ask seemingly innocent questions then slightly provocative ones to test the waters out and after a drink or two we make our move to the nearby rooftop/go for a walk.

I avoid stuff like this for the simple reason that it feels like a job interview. It's typical first date stuff, and I don't like being a typical guy. I want the experience to be unique for her. Mini golf puts her in action for a fun time and an opportunity for kino. I usually tell her she's gonna get a whack on the ass with the putter if she gets a hole in one.

If I were to sum up my experiences on what led to a kiss close mid date, its because they gave me the signals to amp up the kino (i.e bumping into me). The ones which didn't turn out well were the ones where even though I received IOIs in the beginning, they maintained physical distance which made kino extremely unnatural/forced and even if I tried to escalate, they'd freeze up, flinch, or move away and the mood dies from there.

Women who are interested in you will initiate kino. That is always a good sign. If they're not initiating kino, then they're not having a good time or they're undecided about you. If you end the date and she's still undecided, you're not going to get a second date. How she feels after the first date is going to be the deciding factor on whether she goes out with you again or not. The more fun she has, the better your chances are of having a second date.

 

[ubercat]

Firstly big props you r 1 of the guys here who is out there doing it IRL and you will progress. I'm kind of meant to be on a posting break but you've impressed me with your persistence so I wanted to drop by . Having being around the block a few times I know which cliches r true. It is always darkest before dawn. progress in anything in life is a staircase you reach a certain level of success and then have to push through to reach the next level.

It's not a hard and fast rule for me but my preference is Asian girls. now I'm in Australia so the cultural blend is different and my whole experience of SEO girls is 2 Vietnamese girlfriends, 1 Malaysian girl and one Filipino. hardly a big sample so let's learn together.

I agree with the other guys. what seems to be lacking is that your coming across as average. it's always worth remembering that whatever qualities you think you have the girl is judging you just by her experience at the time. From my very limited SEO travels it seems like the girls are very social and like a light fun vibe. but the Asian guys are very old school they don't pay their women a lot of attention.

I m like Des I like to do mini golf or bowling some kind of action date. if you can play badminton might be a good one. every Asian girl I know even if she can't play seems to think she should be able to. of course you will be better than her at anything sporting so it's a good chance to tease and show your dominance. it also allows you to get in some sneaky Kino putting your hands on their hips eccetera to show them a shot.

So next steps.

Drop the questions game. the only time I might use that is with a girl I can't meet for a while that I was trying to keep on the hook. in other words it's a text or online play. and frankly my tolerance is pretty short these days so she would have to be smoking hot to bother.

I would tri amping up the venue change. if you are going to stick with drinks make it a three bar bounce. and try and find bars that have a gimmick. play pool or darts with her sing some karaoke dance around a bit. anything that gets her moving and takes the pressure off you to be her entertainment. if you think about it that's the pattern you want anywayin a girlfriend. you do stuff and she comes along for the ride you don't want to be a dancing monkey.

Asia seems to be full of scooters so I'm assuming you can hire them cheaply why not throw her on the back of a scooter when you move between venues. built-in Kino.

Old school pua tricks seem to work well with Asian girls. to be honest I think a lot of guys here don't understand the value of PUA moves. it's not about living your life to please women. it's just coming across as a little different. you don't have to memorize a whole lot of canned material just had a couple of tricks to your bag. have fun playing around with it. it's just training wheels once you have more experience and the right attitudes the material will just come naturally anyway. it's just like boxing nobody becomes a decent boxer without learning the 1 2 combination.

I would try some push pull and false disqualifiers, pet names etc. search here for specific tricks you'll find a ton of stuff. That would play nicely to the whole Manly guy ignoring your woman thing while still really giving her tingles. Asian girls in general seem to like that girlfriend boyfriend vibe from the start. so when you move them from venue to venue drop a hand on the lower back and gently guide them. if that goes well I d grab the hand or arm and walk that way. I'm guessing it's pretty crowded so I'm not sure if that will work so well where you are. have a look around if you see other couples walking that way I guess it will.



By the way I think being able to pull foreign girls is great social proof. so when you do make sure you get photos and post them on your Facebook Instagram whatever. talk about these countries on dates. saying my New Zealand friend told me all my American friend told me. if you keep things vague a woman will always assume friend means another chick / competition.

I also agree with the guys on the lifting. yes there are plenty of ripped Asian guys these days but percentage Wise it's still very low so it's an easy way of making yourself above average. I've also suggested previously on your threads that if you are interested and can afford it U train in some local martial art. 21st century or not chicks still like to know that you can protect them it's hard wired deep down. it's another differentiator that is also a hell of a lot of fun. now for God's sake I'm not suggesting you go out and pick fights or anything weird but it does seem true that when a guy can handle himself he subconsciously shows some subtle type of confidence. I live in a tough area. I walk around anywhere I like and nobody bothers me. I don't dress like a tough guy or give people the look. the way I move and look around the street guys just know obviously it's relative a tough area in Melbourne isn't so tough.

Last thought. people have shared a lot of material with you on this thread. don't try and do it all at once. you're getting the dates so no need to stress. concentrate on one thing at a time. maybe try a different date setup and get that down first. work out what places you will go what the logistics are. when you are happy with that try adding some push pull in the date. if you try and work on everything at once you will just get confused and lose motivation.

Like I said you r getting the dates so you were doing well. you are on the right path just keep walking. it might take 6 months but then you will have so much ***** you won't know what to do with it.

 

[ubercat]

BTW there are very experienced guys here like Des who have shown they are willing to help you out. you need to be quite diligent in your posting. if you disagree with some of the advice say so and why. if you think there are local cultural factors at play say what they are. if you try something we've suggested and it doesn't work try it a couple more times. it's unlikely you did it well the first time. if it still doesn't work postback your thoughts and recalibrate. this is a dojo mate. YOU deserve your best effort no half hearted attempts. and in case that all sounds a bit too serious. remember it's a game and still have fun with it. being amused at yourself and all the silly girls and their games is part of the fun.

 

[Young OG]

All good advice so far. Like someone else said, you need to get your weight up. Do you work out? I'm shorter then you and weigh 25 more pounds then you. Being skinny isn't going to help your appearance.

 

[dustmuffin]

Lot of good info on this thread so far. My 15 yo boy is 5'8" and weighs 130 pounds 8% body fat. He is as skinny as a rail.

All I got for you is eat and lift! The rest will come as you practice your game. Go out with as many women as you can. Sharpen your skills. That is what helped me the most. You game a 5 the same way you game a ten. Practice makes perfect.

 

[ubercat]

DM I m curious. Your numbers have been crazy good this year. What do u think we're the top 3 things you now do that really kicked it up for u?

 

[Konada]

Well I went out today with a chick today, did the same thing and she gave me 2 BJs like a champ. No s3x though she is a virgin and I'm not going to risk popping one for a NSA... That goes to show how inconsistent my modus operandi is and confuses the fck out of me. Crashing for the night... Update later

 

[Konada]

@LARaiders85

Looks: I will rate myself as a 5.5-6/10, refer to my pics
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/index.php?threads/sometimes-it-just-feels-so-fvcking-hopeless.234841/

Money: My family is well-off so I have no problems with my own finances, currently still in college

Status: I'm a lone wolf so if I were to rank my social status in college, it probably be a 1-2/10, however in my close knit social circles, I'm easily a 8/10

Game: Still prone to bouts of cognitive dissonance but all in all I can say I'm pretty natural when it comes to first dates, I feel in control most of the time until I try to escalate with lukewarm girls. 5/10

@ubercat

Anyway after last night, I got a better sense of what girls have exposed to on OLD and I'd have to say that I'm feel like I'm at the bottom of the barrel. They have literally countless options on Tinder that its basically frying their hamsters, like literally. Guys that are easily 8/10 matching with 5-6s are plenty and even then a girl has limited time to reply to matches. Its crazy, its hypergamy on fvcking 1000x steroids so I can sort of understand the situation I am in.

It sucks but truth is if I want to get hot girls with the numerous options they have easily, being 110lbs isn't going to cut it. Looking back, I think looks its my primary deficiency when it comes to outcompeting other guys on OLD. Even so if I get the date, I now sort of understand that a first date doesn't necessarily mean high interest anymore, it just means she's open to meeting and if you don't give her the gina tingles in person on first impression that's where all the IODs start coming in.

Other than that, I guess I just have to suck it up and workout even though I feel perfectly healthy with dance. Going to pick up MMA as you suggested and that would be a good motivator for me to work out as well. The reason why I've been putting off working out is because I know if I do, I am doing it solely for women and it just disgusts me.

 

[TheMonkeyKing]

Can't add a lot. My go to first date is 'Three Bar Bounce' - http://the3bromigos.com/2013/03/04/the-best-first-date-advice-you-will-read-this-year/

In fact it's usually my go to seconds and third dates as well, with the third ending at mine.

The point of three bars is to change venue, to make her feel she's been on three dates in one. Also, lose the 'romantic walk' at the end. It's a bit aimless and not helping you. Also, when you're in a bar, where possbile sit next to your date, not opposite.

The whole idea of Three Bar Bounce in summary (though please study the link):

Bar One
-Gauge connection and build rapport. You need to do this before you even consider a second drink. Is this woman and experience worth more of your time than one hour? Pay attention to how it's really going, rather than going through motions of kino, IOI's etc. You're too focused on the 'process', rather than the experience.

I always received IOIs like hair flipping, twirling and playing with shoe etc.

These are not always IOI's. Depending on the girl's whole demeanour and mood (i.e.how well you're doing), they might well be indications of boredom. Again, start paying more attention to her general mood opposed to what she's doing. Do they laugh and seem engaged? Or do they seem like they're waiting for the bus?

Bar Two
Escalate at least to kissing - again depending on the rapport you've build and gauged. Don't hold back.

Genuine IOIs that are pretty much more indicative:
-Lingering, mutual bodily contact, which continues while you talk - not forced, but natural.
-She will be getting near you with her whole body, especially her head, getting ready for you to kiss her. She should also be looking at you A LOT and smiling, A LOT. Like all of her attention is on you, not looking round the room, checking her phone or anything like this. Learn to recognise signs of low interest, as well as high.
-When her gaze is flicking between your eye and your mouth, kiss her.

Bar Three
-All being well, you should be all over each other now, in a classy, comfortable kind of way. Depending on how you are gauging the experience, ask her back to yours (if you think she'd definitely come). Do this in a subtle way, not a suggestive way; 'Come back to mine for some wine'.
Have a quick drink and then call it a night - important that you leave before she wants to.

Lastly, don't be too hard on yourself. Fifteen women in a year is little more than one a month. You really need to be engaging with different women every week to build confidence.

You don't have to always be organising formal dates to meet women. In fact, it's a bit too formal for a lot of people these days. Maybe just go out to bars by yourself or with friends and chat to women that way. It essentially achieves the same thing and same rules apply, weather you're on a date or just out anyway.