A question about diet, i need to cut down to about 2000 cal diet.

[cyp6]

according to desils guide, (cutting down), i need to cut down about 2050 cal a day, thats no problem but the problem is the shere persentage of protine that needs to be included in the diet.. any one have good solution for this.. 6scoops of protine power only gives me about 120grams, i still need a quit a bit more, i could always use more scoops of protine powder but i dont think my stomech could hanndle more than 6 a day... any segestions will be awome. thanks.

 

[Warboss Alex]

according to desils guide, (cutting down), i need to cut down about 2050 cal a day, thats no problem but the problem is the shere persentage of protine that needs to be included in the diet.. any one have good solution for this.. 6scoops of protine power only gives me about 120grams, i still need a quit a bit more, i could always use more scoops of protine powder but i dont think my stomech could hanndle more than 6 a day... any segestions will be awome. thanks.

What is your weight and height first of all?

 

[cyp6]

5'9 160...16%BF.. i used be 5'9 165...11%BF.. not getting much exersize and working out for the past 5 months have taken its toll. =/

 

[Warboss Alex]

5'9 160...16%BF.. i used be 5'9 165...11%BF.. not getting much exersize and working out for the past 5 months have taken its toll. =/

okay mate.. there's no need to drop down to 2000 calories. clean up your diet and do cardio and the fat will melt away.

 

[cyp6]

^^

really? i should forget desil's diet? ok i have a few questions, if you dont mind..
is it possible to gain muscle while simolaniosly loosing fat?
according to desil to have athletic build long cardio is useless what ur oppinion on this?
What is the best way to work out, to gain mass while lossing fat?

i know these are all very long questions to answer.. i did a serch on them and lots of post came up :/.. know any good once, and thanks bro for the advice.

 

[cyp6]

hey bro actully i just did a serch on you.. youv writen some insanely good stuff about this.. ill read all of it.. and try to desing a program fro my self thanks! if i some questions mind if i contact you?

 

[Warboss Alex]

hey bro actully i just did a serch on you.. youv writen some insanely good stuff about this.. ill read all of it.. and try to desing a program fro my self thanks! if i some questions mind if i contact you?

no problem at all mate, feel free to PM.

 

[Warboss Alex]

really? i should forget desil's diet? ok i have a few questions, if you dont mind..
is it possible to gain muscle while simolaniosly loosing fat? YES INDEED IT IS
according to desil to have athletic build long cardio is useless what ur oppinion on this? I DISAGREE ENTIRELY
What is the best way to work out, to gain mass while lossing fat? I'VE WRITTEN ABOUT THIS MANY TIMES

i know these are all very long questions to answer.. i did a serch on them and lots of post came up :/.. know any good once, and thanks bro for the advice.

...

 

[EFFORT]

Whatever happened to taking those guides down

 

[cyp6]

Hey alex,

well iv read most of your treads, and this is what i have com up with as a program for my self..

Stats:
5'9 160 16% body fat as stated above...

My goal is to get to 170 and cut body fat down to 9% this should be good enough to let my six pack show, At 11% it was still showing so this 9 should be more than enough.. and i think 170 should be a reasonable goal for as body mass is conserned... i just want to look athletic again... i looked fairly good at 165 and even 5 pounds will create a nice look..

To get to my goal i have to loose about 12 pounds of fat, and gain about 22 pounds of muscles...

as far as diet is conserend im going to consenrate on eating lots of protine and cutting back on bad carb, and also using carb cut offs and drinking green tea. and using your method to improve metabolizm, the fat should start to melt off... Iv tried the tecnique of eating protine first and i was truly amazed at how much it improved my metabolizm..( I whent to a buffet with my parents today in las vegas, ill tell you guys the story if any one is interested)

and as for exersize and working out..

-20 - 30 min cardio sessions in the morning every other day(to improve metablizm)
-working out 6 days a week doing heavy weights in low reps. 4-8reps per set. 10 sets per body part would be ok right?
-using compound lifts and only working out one body section of the body a day
-sleeping 8 hours a day


any way this is the plan if there is some thing i need to fix please let me know.. and thanks to every one who has answerd some of my very rookie questions..

 

[Road Demon]

Why so much protein?

I'm confused, we really don't need more than 2 grams/kg/day for a positive nitrogen balance even during heavy training or 4-6 hour endurance training sessons. The rest will be deaminated as the AA backbone will be shunted into the TCA cycle to generate energy. The liver and kidney will be forced to deal with the nitrogenous waste, ie excrete UREA.

Could someone explain the logic that body builders require so much protein, well in excess of what is required for a postive nitrogen balance. I'm not being sarcastic with my question here, I'm really quite curious? It just does not make physiological sense to me.

Why limit carbs? They are the primary fuel of the muscle...I can surly agree on limiting refined garbage, but not whole grains etc.

Why not just limit your fat intake to no more than 10-20% of total calories?

Consume Omega-3 fats as WarBoss Alex suggested...they are potent modifiers of metabolism. 5-6rams fish oil per day ~ 2000 mg EPA/DHA combined.

Green tea capsules are a fine idea.

Do more Cardio. 20-30 minutes is nothing. I suggest 1 hour sessions or longer/ every other day. I KNOW endurance training. Add some interval intensity to burn more calories, but your intensity might be limited due to low CHO intake. Figure about 600 kcal/ hour with moderate cardio for your 170 lbs. My referenece level is four hours and 80 miles later on the bike.

 

[Warboss Alex]

Road Demon,

Your 2.2g/kg or whatever figure was most likely taken from a science textbook, which in turn was taken from a study done on athletes or whatever. But I can assure you they weren't heavy bodybuilders. Do you really think Ronnie Coleman has the same protein needs (not just for a positive nitrogen balance, but also for muscle growth, maintainance, repair etc) as your Auntie Mabel? No study has ever been conducted on heavy bodybuilders because they're too small a part of the population but us big guys (I'm talking guys who are a solid 240-300lbs) have to go on experience.. and experience shows that your 1g/lb recommendation is inadequate. I know of no advanced or professional bodybuilder who eats less than 1.5g/lb protein and most of them eat 2g/lb - and these are guys with elite genetics and drugs (some of them); how can us mere mortals expect to get by on less protein?

Pertaining to fat loss, I want people to still gain muscle while dieting so protein intake is the same as always, sky high. Muscle is built in the presence of a stimulus (through training) and adequate protein intake even in a caloric deficit. Pre-contest bodybuilders (natural or otherwise) can still gain strength and size (albeit less than when 'offseason') for three out of the typical four months of their dieting phase. The same applies here.

Also protein is very thermogenic. You burn roughly a quarter of the calories you get in through protein just by digesting the stuff. Say you take in 400g of protein a day which is 1600 calories of which 400 will be burned just through digestion. How much cardio you have to do to burn 400 calories!? High protein meals also give you a longer metabolic afterburn. Increased protein intake = increased metabolism = more calories burned (plus better nutrient partioning), which is vital to leaning out while still gaining.

As for the carbs, large amounts of carbs in your diet elicit an insulin response as I'm sure you know. Insulin is the most anabolic hormone known to man (hence the manipulation of insulin through carbs post-workout etc to enhance recovery and repair) but it's also anabolic to fat cells as well as muscle (which is why large amounts of fat and carbs together is unwise). Thus lipolysis (fat burning), a catabolic process, would be blunted by the presence of insulin. When the body needs to burn stored energy and insulin levels are high it will turn not to bodyfat but stored protein (muscle!). Therefore we minimise the insulin response as much as possible to maximise the amount of fat burned without muscle loss - a low-calorie high carb diet results in a smaller you without significant change in body composition, since you are losing muscle and fat in about equal measure.

For non-weight trainers I would not even recommend carbs in the morning, a pure ketogenic diet with controlled carb-ups is truly the best way to go as far as fat loss is concerned; however in order to maintain and gain strength carbs are required to cope with the training loads and they're taken in at strategic times (at breakfast where insulin sensitivity is very good after sleep and even better after morning cardio) and pre-and-post-workout which is self explanatory.

The body can use dietary fat as an energy source no problem (and will turn to bodyfat first if so and when in a caloric deficit at a given time of day e.g. during cardio), otherwise all the atkins/ketogenic diets wouldn't work as well as they do. Hence why a restricted-carb, moderate fat, high protein diet is the best way for a weight trainer to lean out on. I'm trying to help guys on here pack on muscle as well as get ripped hence the carbs, otherwise I'd cut them out altogether (just veggies and some fruit). You need carbs to fuel workouts - but human beings do just fine eating just protein and fats. We have essential aminos and essential fatty acids but no essential carbs remember.

Hope this clears some up.

 

[Warboss Alex]

Iv tried the tecnique of eating protine first and i was truly amazed at how much it improved my metabolizm..( I whent to a buffet with my parents today in las vegas, ill tell you guys the story if any one is interested)

YOU HAD TO CHANGE SHIRTS DURING YOUR SECOND PLATE OF STEAK OR CHICKEN? HAPPENED TO ME TOO

and as for exersize and working out..

-20 - 30 min cardio sessions in the morning every other day(to improve metablizm)
AT 16% BODYFAT I WOULD RECOMMEND 6 CARDIO DAYS A WEEK, 30 MINS ON TRAINING DAYS AND 45 ON NON-TRAINING DAYS

-working out 6 days a week doing heavy weights in low reps. 4-8reps per set. 10 sets per body part would be ok right?
NO, REFER TO MY ROUTINE. YOU HAVE YOUR CARDIO AND WEIGHTS DAYS MIXED UP! LOL

-using compound lifts and only working out one body section of the body a day
AGAIN REFER TO MY ROUTINE

-sleeping 8 hours a day
EXCELLENT

Basically you need the half day carbs, half day fats diet without restricting calories too much. Eat less if you want faster fat loss, eat more if you want faster muscle gain (I would go for the latter )

 

[Road Demon]

WarBoss Alex...

I like to see different perspectives...

I DO appreciate your clarification.

It makes sense now to me know that these super heavy lifters are a special population, hence requiring more protien than normal trained individual due to high training load and unique genetics, perhaps an extreme adaptation to the training stimulus.

Part of the problem with reseach as it is hard to get elite/pro athletes to be tested, so that is why we know little about their extreme adaptations.
I have done my fair share of testing elite rowers/runners/cyclists. They are a hassle to deal with.

I have seen in endurance trained elite/Pro level athletes that they are different from the normal 'aerobic' trained population or even regional level competitive athletes.

I would be curious to see the mRNA or gene expression profile (via the gene chip technique) of thes hard core lifters. I'm sure their would a host of changes different even from the 'well trained lifters."

I agree with your rational on the protein for normal individuals undergoing the a weight training program.

I can also see the idea behind carb restriction, for those individuals who are exercising at a lower intensity, say less than 70% of max.

I did save your reply in my training folder!

 

[Warboss Alex]

I have seen in endurance trained elite/Pro level athletes that they are different from the normal 'aerobic' trained population or even regional level athletes.

And there you are! The body is an adaptive organism, and undergoing any sort of rigorous training whether this be weights, endurance, whatever, is going to make the body function a whole lot different to the average office worker.. whether this be huge protein requirements of elite bodybuilders or whatever else you may care to mention.

by the way did you forget half your post? lol.

 

[Throttle]

Why not just limit your fat intake to no more than 10-20% of total calories?

I don't think WBA addressed this. My understanding is that -- contrary to the low-fat conventional wisdom -- a balance of saturated, poly & monounsaturated fats together with omega-3s will produce an ideal balance of hormones for growth. Limit any one of them too hard & something gets out of whack (thus if low-fat diets work at all, it's by bringing down the level of saturated fats back into balance with omega-3s and zapping most / all transfats, which is easier to do now than ever).

To get your dietary fat below 20% you need lots of carbs & low-fat sources of protein. It's much too easy to rely on crappy sources of carbs to get the percentages to work out. Which is why I'd rather target a particular amount of protein per day, eliminate sugars & starches as much as possible (except post-lifting workout) and pick up your protein from a variety of sources, particularly lean meat, fish & eggs.

That is, I'd rather focus on what clean eating looks like, make sure you're getting enough protein, and let the numbers work themselves out..... to get enough carbs to get fat intake below 20% AND use only whole grains & fibrous veggies?...whoa. Ever see that SNL commercial parody for whole grain "Colon Blow"? mmm... pass the Triscuits!

 

[Skilla_Staz]

Whatever happened to taking those guides down

Whatever happened to kids learning how to read and write?

Forget the guides, lets help cyp6 get an education :trouble:

 

[cyp6]

Whatever happened to kids learning how to read and write?

Forget the guides, lets help cyp6 get an education :trouble:

HaHa, man this guy is funny. some one give him a mike.

 

[Skilla_Staz]

I would love a Mike. That hard lemonade stuff is grrrrrrreat.

I wouldn't mind a mic either. I've got mad skill on the microphone boyyyyyy

 

[cyp6]

haahahha ok that was funny. very cleaver. props to you bro