Aging/Dying: What's the point? (Philosophical question)

[Vanderdonck]

First, I'm not suicidal or depressed. Second, I understand the evolutionary reasons behind our bodies' decline and eventual expiration.

I'm looking more for philosophical insights.

Death itself doesn't bother me so much as aging. (Ageing? How is it spelled?)

When I see seniors struggling after retirement in their so-called golden years, loaded up on meds and their bodies falling apart, I don't get it. What's there to look forward?

We accumulate all of this knowledge and experience and our bodies and minds betray us. Meanwhile sexually we peak when we're barely adult.

I speak as someone fortunate to have aged well. I'm very healthy. People think I'm 15 years younger than I am. But I still have to deal with my body changing, my metabolism mocking me and my memory slowing. I don't want to bang every hot thing I see anymore either (but maybe that's because I have banged plenty).

I suppose living past 60 is a recent phenomenon. Maybe we've expanded lifespan to absurd lengths.

And then there's women. They get hit far worse. Suffice to say I would not want to be a woman older than 45. But maybe for them it comes as a relief - no more bleeding or getting catcalled. But if I'm being honest, when I see how a beautiful young woman has changed over years and decades, a superficial part of me feels sad. But I guess if they were hot their whole lives, women would be unstoppable.

Anyway I'd like to hear your insights.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Does there have to be a meaning?

It's called the cycle of life. Be born, progress thru stages of life and then die.

Lots of other creatures go thru the same thing, pretty sure they aren't sitting around wondering what it means.

Humans always want to attribute meaning to everything when sometimes the answer is simply "Because that's the way life works".

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

Orson Scott Card wrote a short story on an immortal race of aliens visiting Earth to study our limited lifespan and their conclusion was that our limited timespan gave our lives the urgency and motivation to make something of our lives before we perished and to leave some legacy behind (offspring, art, philosophy, et cetera), while the immortal aliens often felt indolent and useless and unmotivated to create anything.
I'm not religious, but I do think that the whole fact that we think about aging and mortality, our self-awareness, means our lives are influenced by the fact that you can snuff it at any moment. For some that awareness leads to nihilism and self-destruction, for others it leads to enlightenment and creativity.

 

[DJ Novice]

The shortness of life should give life meaning.

You only have a limited time to find meaning in your own life.

The problem is that age catches up with you and most people think they have more time than what they actually have.

One minute you’re in your 30s, spinning plates at will with high testosterone levels thinking it’s going to last forever.

Next minute you’re in your 50s with a rapidly dwindling pool of attractive women and declining testosterone levels still trying to find the impossible holy grail of a relationship or s*x that never gets boring or is so much better than what you have already experienced.

You need to find some purpose other than women in your life.

 

[BillyPilgrim]

We were designed as slaves and our lifespans are short so we don't figure it out and do something about it.

 

[Vanderdonck]

Orson Scott Card wrote a short story on an immortal race of aliens visiting Earth to study our limited lifespan and their conclusion was that our limited timespan gave our lives the urgency and motivation to make something of our lives before we perished and to leave some legacy behind (offspring, art, philosophy, et cetera), while the immortal aliens often felt indolent and useless and unmotivated to create anything.
I'm not religious, but I do think that the whole fact that we think about aging and mortality, our self-awareness, means our lives are influenced by the fact that you can snuff it at any moment. For some that awareness leads to nihilism and self-destruction, for others it leads to enlightenment and creativity.

That's a cool take and I like the premise of the alien story.

My only question is how the supposedly complacent aliens achieved the technology to visit other planets, lol.

 

[Vanderdonck]

Does there have to be a meaning?

It's called the cycle of life. Be born, progress thru stages of life and then die.

Lots of other creatures go thru the same thing, pretty sure they aren't sitting around wondering what it means.

Humans always want to attribute meaning to everything when sometimes the answer is simply "Because that's the way life works".

There doesn't have to be a meaning. I'm not looking for a standard explanation. Just interested in opinions about it from a philosophical standpoint.

"Because that's the way life works" sounds to me like a tautology.

Also if other creatures aren't wondering about it, then they are not going through the same thing.

 

[Vanderdonck]

We were designed as slaves and our lifespans are short so we don't figure it out and do something about it.

Hmm. But we have, haven't we? Our lifespans are longer than ever.

But I get your greater point.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

There doesn't have to be a meaning. I'm not looking for a standard explanation. Just interested in opinions about it from a philosophical standpoint.

"Because that's the way life works" sounds to me like a tautology.

Also if other creatures aren't wondering about it, then they are not going through the same thing.

They are too busy trying to survive day to day to worry about any of that.

 

[Vanderdonck]

They are too busy trying to survive day to day to worry about any of that.

True. There are some humans in that situation too.

Once the basic needs are met is when the brain drifts elsewhere.

 

[Vanderdonck]

The shortness of life should give life meaning.

You only have a limited time to find meaning in your own life.

The problem is that age catches up with you and most people think they have more time than what they actually have.

One minute you’re in your 30s, spinning plates at will with high testosterone levels thinking it’s going to last forever.

Next minute you’re in your 50s with a rapidly dwindling pool of attractive women and declining testosterone levels still trying to find the impossible holy grail of a relationship or s*x that never gets boring or is so much better than what you have already experienced.

You need to find some purpose other than women in your life.

Well I don't mean this to be strictly about women but what you say is true.

Luckily for me I don't have any regrets regarding females. I definitely had my share and then some, a lot of great experiences. I think that's why I no longer feel the drive the way I used to. When I see an attractive young woman, to me instead of simply a piece of a$$ she's a living breathing set of problems and complications that I don't feel like surmounting just to be intimate. I don't mean that in a disparaging way at all, it's just a been there/done that mentality. But I'm in a relationship, if I were single I'm sure my attitude would be more proactive. I still flirt and even dangle the fruit just to see them chase a little.

Nevertheless cemeteries are filled with people who had great purposes in their lives.

 

[Scaramouche]

Hi VanderDonck,
"I'm looking more for philosophical insights."
Thought I might point you to a really good read,on ageing,charming yet profoundly wise,it's by an American Philosophy Prof by the name of Daniel Klein,called "Travels With Epicurus"....I have re-read this lovely book several times,lent it out and purchased other copies for Friends and Family...You will find the thoughts of many of the greats sandwitched into his experiences relocating to an isolated Greek Island.

 

[Plinco]

First, I'm not suicidal or depressed. Second, I understand the evolutionary reasons behind our bodies' decline and eventual expiration.

I'm looking more for philosophical insights.

Death itself doesn't bother me so much as aging. (Ageing? How is it spelled?)

When I see seniors struggling after retirement in their so-called golden years, loaded up on meds and their bodies falling apart, I don't get it. What's there to look forward?

We accumulate all of this knowledge and experience and our bodies and minds betray us. Meanwhile sexually we peak when we're barely adult.

I speak as someone fortunate to have aged well. I'm very healthy. People think I'm 15 years younger than I am. But I still have to deal with my body changing, my metabolism mocking me and my memory slowing. I don't want to bang every hot thing I see anymore either (but maybe that's because I have banged plenty).

I suppose living past 60 is a recent phenomenon. Maybe we've expanded lifespan to absurd lengths.

And then there's women. They get hit far worse. Suffice to say I would not want to be a woman older than 45. But maybe for them it comes as a relief - no more bleeding or getting catcalled. But if I'm being honest, when I see how a beautiful young woman has changed over years and decades, a superficial part of me feels sad. But I guess if they were hot their whole lives, women would be unstoppable.

Anyway I'd like to hear your insights.

It's a biological process to prevent overpopulation. Other than that, there is no reason for aging.

 

[BaronOfHair]

When I see seniors struggling after retirement in their so-called golden years, loaded up on meds and their bodies falling apart, I don't get it. What's there to look forward?

Google the work of Rodney Dangerfield

 

[zekko]

When I see seniors struggling after retirement in their so-called golden years, loaded up on meds and their bodies falling apart, I don't get it. What's there to look forward?

As someone in their '60s, let me say this: As I've gotten older, and as my time on the planet shortens, I've come to appreciate every minute as a gift. You can do this when you're young as well, but it seems to intensify as you get older. You have to take pleasure in the simplest of things. Just being able to get up and walk around the block is a privilege, because I know some people can't do it anymore.

I've known many people who did not make it to my age, so I feel very fortunate and blessed that I'm still here, and still able to get around reasonably well. Obviously if/when your health deteriorates to a certain point where you are no longer able to function, you're reaching a point of diminishing returns. Now if you look at it from a spiritual standpoint, death is meant to be a punishment of sorts as a result of the Fall of Man, or as an eventual escape from the material world, which is inherently shallow.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

Here's one theory:

At our core we are infinite spiritual beings.

We decided to become human to experience the struggles and successes of being human.

Including the necessity of wrestling with our own mortality.

Then we die and become spiritual beings again and remember who we are.

There is no answer to the question.

Meaning comes only from contemplating the question.

 

[Vanderdonck]

Hi VanderDonck,
"I'm looking more for philosophical insights."
Thought I might point you to a really good read,on ageing,charming yet profoundly wise,it's by an American Philosophy Prof by the name of Daniel Klein,called "Travels With Epicurus"....I have re-read this lovely book several times,lent it out and purchased other copies for Friends and Family...You will find the thoughts of many of the greats sandwitched into his experiences relocating to an isolated Greek Island.

Thank you, I will have a look. Some great replies on this thread.

 

[sevbucmash]

I suppose living past 60 is a recent phenomenon. Maybe we've expanded lifespan to absurd lengths.

Cave in Dmanisi, Gerogia dates back to 1.8 millions years ago. Contains remains of homo georgicus, which is inbetween homo habilis and homo erectus. Back then they cared for their elderly. Process is called grandfathering. Elderly can care for children, while adults hunt and do chores. So we can deduct good and bad comes from the times before 1.8 million years ago. You do good, don't eat your children, you survive, your genes get passed on. The dudes that ate their children, died out. You do good, you survive.

So the idea of living old and really old, it is an evolutionary adoptation.

 

[Bible_Belt]

As far as statistical life expectancy, it usually doesn't control for infant mortality, which has been reduced drastically by modern medicine.
People didn't just drop dead at age 35. That's a statistical average that includes a lot of zeros and small numbers. Other than that, science really hasn't done all that much to extend lifespan, at least in a while. The US life expectancy is decreasing and has been for some time.

 

[Scaramouche]

As far as statistical life expectancy, it usually doesn't control for infant mortality, which has been reduced drastically by modern medicine.
People didn't just drop dead at age 35. That's a statistical average that includes a lot of zeros and small numbers. Other than that, science really hasn't done all that much to extend lifespan, at least in a while. The US life expectancy is decreasing and has been for some time.

Hi Bibles,
Yes you are absolutely right,Plumbers,Drainers and House Builders have done more for longevity than Doctors.