Need Advice: How would you handle these date situations and make them more sexual?

[Sebastian0001]

I NEED advice guys! I'm currently having a MAJOR problem where I keep turning dates into platonic friend-vibe dates. I went on a date recently with a woman and I think I did it again. Below is some of our convo through the night - what could I have done better? Can you tell me how you would have handled these below situations (excerpts from the date) better?

The woman is cute but not hot. We went out to dinner, then a wine bar, then desert. I felt that I did a terrible job at sexual escalation and all I got was a simple short kiss at the end with no passion and no invite up to her place. I really need help because I have completely forgotten how to flirt and create sexual tension due to a 7-year relationship! The only good news is I think there will be a 2nd date and I can still improve. The more detail the better please! Thanks in advance!

In Car: She talks about how her leasing agent doesn’t know anything and she wanted a second key and he had no idea.
I just gave her advice.

In Car: She told me she signed up for this dance class and she was excited to go.
I told her it’s in a sketchy part of town so she cancelled it while we were driving.

At Dinner: She said my blazer looks good on me and asked where I bought it?
I answered literally where I bought it.

At Dinner: She was telling me a story about she is sensitive to certain words that make her feel like she is being called a broad or just some chick.
I boringly tried to give advice.

At Dinner: She said that some people at work really disappoint her but she is a very kind person so she tries to spin it in a positive way like “how can we do better?”
I told her that happens to me too.

At Dinner: We took a lot of pictures of each other doing funny poses and being silly and she took one of mine and edited it to make me look like some mysterious black and white no color figure, we took some together too but I was the one said let's take one together.

At Wine: I told her she gave me the impression of a "goody two shoe" type because the only bad thing she had told me about herself was that she got a speeding ticket and she asked what that phrase means and how she grew up in challenging circumstances, so she always tried to do the right thing.
I answered boringly that she is a good person and I respect that and then she said that is true I am.

At Desert: She said I should run for president and that I’m eloquent and explain things well.
I answered literally that I don’t have national brand and would first need to accomplish one to think of anything like that.

 

[BadBoy89]

How do you remember so many exact details from a single date? You remember what she said, where she said it, how you reacted.

Seems very odd.

 

[Sebastian0001]

How do you remember so many exact details from a single date? You remember what she said, where she said it, how you reacted.

Seems very odd.

because it was very recent! Not hard at all to remember details and i also have a photographic memory

 

[Stuffnu]

Op. Don’t take women to dinner on the first date.
The wine bar (or pub) would have been a perfect way to start.
Let her do most of the talking and sit close. Sexual escalation is subtle by touch and verbal cues.. Brush your hand over homogeneous zones likes her knee, upper leg and lower back. You certainly had that opportunity while taking those pictures or consider a venue where you can add a little physicality.

Charge up that banter…
Dance class “perhaps you can show me some of your moves later“.
Blazer “but it would look better on your bedroom floor”
President and if you feel brave. “yeah I can be Bill Clinton and you can be my Monica Lewinsky”
She must have felt like she was talking to her brother the entire time.

Secondly, you did way too much. Date should only go a hour or 2 max unless she’s riding your member. You only want to give her a taste and hungry for more- not an 8 course meal.

Watch her demeanor and if she doesn’t reciprocate the whole time, she’s either not interested or a dead fish. Don’t waste your time and cut it short.
It’s okay, you’re not going to win them all so line up the next one.

Good luck!

 

[Stuffnu]

Players are storytellers. You don't let her do the talking - that's not sexually attractive. That's passive, submissive emotional tampon behavior.

Women never have much interesting to say because women don't do much aside work their boring corporate HR jobs, have pillow fights with their girlfriends and get either/or simped over/pumped and dumped by chads and simps. They don't want to talk about themselves. They are sick of guys that are "interested" in them.

They are wanting you to take her on an emotional, sexual adventure. Nothing a woman hates more than a guy who sits there quizzing her and trying to get her talking. She's thinking "fvck dude. Can you please turn me on. I'm bored of this interview bullsh1t."

So you come in, tell her stories (this is how she gets to know you, your value, status etc) and then she gets sucked into your frame, responding to you. That's what they want. Once she's in your frame, you're leading her. If you're a good leader then she'll follow you back to your place and jump on your d1ck.

Works for me Pan but I hear you. The interaction shouldn’t be conducted like an interview. You certainly want to contribute to keep the convo flowing
If she‘s interested, she’ll be an open book and you can provide a chapter or two from 50 shades.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Op. Don’t take women to dinner on the first date.
The wine bar (or pub) would have been a perfect way to start.
Let her do most of the talking and sit close. Sexual escalation is subtle by touch and verbal cues.. Brush your hand over homogeneous zones likes her knee, upper leg and lower back. You certainly had that opportunity while taking those pictures or consider a venue where you can add a little physicality.

Charge up that banter…
Dance class “perhaps you can show me some of your moves later“.
Blazer “but it would look better on your bedroom floor”
President and if you feel brave. “yeah I can be Bill Clinton and you can be my Monica Lewinsky”
She must have felt like she was talking to her brother the entire time.

Secondly, you did way too much. Date should only go a hour or 2 max unless she’s riding your member. You only want to give her a taste and hungry for more- not an 8 course meal.

Watch her demeanor and if she doesn’t reciprocate the whole time, she’s either not interested or a dead fish. Don’t waste your time and cut it short.
It’s okay, you’re not going to win them all so line up the next one.

Good luck!

I LOVE THE BANTER SUGGESTIONS! Argh if only I could think of these things lol....thank you!!

As for watching her demeanor, its all mixed signals I'd say. And that is probably because I am boring and acting like "her brother" as you said. I'm surprised I am even getting mixed signals. When we are face to face at dinner, she is usually talking to me while playing with her hair and her hair to her side. I think that is supposed to be a good sign? When we walk, I put my arm around her but she does not reciprocate and put hers back around me. I got a kiss but short and nothing more. She also asked me how and why my previous relationship ended and that I could tell her when I feel comfortable which seems like interest? So its all kind of mixed. I think if my game could pick up, then I'd have a good shot but it has been tough.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Players are storytellers. You don't let her do the talking - that's not sexually attractive. That's passive, submissive emotional tampon behavior.

Women never have much interesting to say because women don't do much aside work their boring corporate HR jobs, have pillow fights with their girlfriends and get either/or simped over/pumped and dumped by chads and simps. They don't want to talk about themselves. They are sick of guys that are "interested" in them.

They are wanting you to take her on an emotional, sexual adventure. Nothing a woman hates more than a guy who sits there quizzing her and trying to get her talking. She's thinking "fvck dude. Can you please turn me on. I'm bored of this interview bullsh1t."

So you come in, tell her stories (this is how she gets to know you, your value, status etc) and then she gets sucked into your frame, responding to you. That's what they want. Once she's in your frame, you're leading her. If you're a good leader then she'll follow you back to your place and jump on your d1ck.

what is an example or two of good stories you have told on your dates?

 

[Sebastian0001]

LOL!

Seriously, granted I've had a couple of vodka tonics, but man you are good!

The bolded, I nearly spit my drink out, literally.

Not sure if every woman would respond this way, but it definitely would have gotten my attention.

I, and most woman I know, assuming they're attracted, respond well to clever sexual banter like that.

And disagree with @Pan87, let her talk, you listen.

Talking and sharing information is feminine behavior, remaining silent and stoic is masculine.

The Monica and Bill line was even better. This guy probably has women lining up at his door

 

[Dr.Suave]

Op stop overthinking. Enjoy the dates themselves, girls on them are just a bonus.

Get a bunch o matches from OLD. Plan dates u would actually enjoy regardless of company. Triple book girls, if none cancels go out with the hottest one and bail on the others, Rinse and repeat.

If, for some reason, u havent made a move by date 3, just say f0ck it and make a move. Like my current gf, back when we were dating, she was f0cking paranoid about the virus and she would wear her mask all the f0cking time. So one day I say f0ck this so I just plain told her "I wanna kiss u but u always wearing ur mask. Im gonna lower ur mask now". So I removed her mask and kissed her.

Was it my smoothest moment? Hell no. But it sure as hell was better than making no move at all. Her interest was high at this point so it didnt matter that is wasnt so smooth, all that matter is that I made a move. After that I just chilled. She kept wearing her mask around me all the time a few more dates, but IDGAF, I made my move. Once we became exclusive, she chilled too and stop wearing the mask around me.

 

[Barrister]

Players are storytellers.

I will disagree with the blanket assertion that "players are storytellers" and with the insinuation that a man should always be the one leading the conversation. Plenty of men, men of few words, can make women wet and get a lot of pvssy. I know this because I have used the tactic of letting the woman do most of the talking on plenty of dates and gotten a bang at the end of the night. In fact, being quiet with a smile (smirk) on your face but delivering what you say in a very confident manner (body language and inflection both) is a very powerful way to create attraction. Doing this while using kino at the right times works wonders in early stage dating. This is not to say you can't eventually talk without being prompted of course.

There is nothing submissive about that IMO.

 

[Sebastian0001]

@Barrister - if only men could lead women into the bedroom without saying much. That’s some serious telepathy.

Women are seduced by words, body language and touch. But they have to know you!

How can she know who you are if you don’t talk? I’ll call it seductive banter. If you don’t know how to seduce a woman by telling her stories that make her horny, you’re missing a huge trick here. It rapidly escalates things. I’m usually gunning for sex on the first date. That’s my goal. I don’t have time to sit around looking strong and silent - the great thing about being a man is that we act. We can dictate the tempo (and women want you to do this too).

Also, if you can hook a woman into an engaging, naughty conversation then that’s a DHV to her because it’s a form of proofing.

Finally, a woman is agreeing with your dating advice. That’s a red flag for me. It’s like a fish saying “Yes! Cast your line right here please. I promise I’ll bite your bait.”

You are 100% correct. The story is VERY important because the woman will start feeling the values that are being communicated and the high value which will then turn her on. A story that shows a guy is powerful or a story that shows a guy is strong and bold are HUGE turn-ons. And she will literally remember the story randomly throughout the week too which is an added bonus.

How do you generally decide which type of value that you want to communicate in the story? Do you try to first assess the woman's type? For example, one might tell a story about being very loyal to family but what if she doesn't care and instead is turned on by power in which case a story showing power would be more impactful?

 

[Barrister]

@Barrister - if only men could lead women into the bedroom without saying much. That’s some serious telepathy.

Women are seduced by words, body language and touch. But they have to know you!

How can she know who you are if you don’t talk? I’ll call it seductive banter. If you don’t know how to seduce a woman by telling her stories that make her horny, you’re missing a huge trick here. It rapidly escalates things. I’m usually gunning for sex on the first date. That’s my goal. I don’t have time to sit around looking strong and silent - the great thing about being a man is that we act. We can dictate the tempo (and women want you to do this too).

Also, if you can hook a woman into an engaging, naughty conversation then that’s a DHV to her because it’s a form of proofing.

Finally, a woman is agreeing with your dating advice. That’s a red flag for me. It’s like a fish saying “Yes! Cast your line right here please. I promise I’ll bite your bait.”

I am not saying "don't talk." I was saying men don't need to be "story-tellers" or be the one to be leading the conversation. I have had many first-date lays while letting the woman do the talking. You don't need (or really want for that matter IMO) a woman to "know who you are" on the first date anyway. Doesn't mean you can't get them into bed.

I do agree they are seduced by words, body language, and touch. But in early stage dating, the second two on that list are of far more importance than the first. Words are selectively given to the topic at hand. But generally, more is less.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Understand women, and you’ll understand what turns them on. When you understand what turns women on then you’ll know how to craft your stories.

Personally I’ve found it’s way better if the stories are real. I just don’t think guys are good at lying, to the extent of women. Most guys will get smoked out with inconsistencies in their stories so it’s better to tell real stories and be authentic.

I can’t give you a script man. But think about it. Attractive storytelling involves you telling a believable story where you are doing attractive things in the story. The story has to be told so that the woman you are talking to is imagining herself in the story. Women love fantasy. That’s the framework.

true true - any particular book or resource (in addition to experience) that did a very good job of giving you a strong "understanding of women and what turns them on"? I just read 3% male and i'm looking at my next read

 

[Sebastian0001]

I am not saying "don't talk." I was saying men don't need to be "story-tellers" or be the one to be leading the conversation. I have had many first-date lays while letting the woman do the talking. You don't need (or really want for that matter IMO) a woman to "know who you are" on the first date anyway. Doesn't mean you can't get them into bed.

I do agree they are seduced by words, body language, and touch. But in early stage dating, the second two on that list are of far more importance than the first. Words are selectively given to the topic at hand. But generally, more is less.

yeah but if u barely say anything, then how is she going to be attracted? Let's say she does 85% of the talking and you do 15%, won't she go home thinking things like "i don't even know who he is or what he does in life or likes in life" or "he was kind of a dud and didn't even talk"??

 

[HaleyBaron]

I NEED advice guys! I'm currently having a MAJOR problem where I keep turning dates into platonic friend-vibe dates.

Stop trying to make girls your friends. That's your stance and as such everything you say or do comes across as such. To me, any girl I'm with is my accessory. I let her know that. She knows that. If she was my friend, I wouldn't want to **** her. Weird, right? But it's the truth. Sex is different from friendship.

Again: stop making girls into your friends.

Feminism brainwashed you to be a gentleman and hers. Get rid of that programming. I want you to spend a week saying as many flaws as you can about women. Not blackpill territory. Just run it through your mind, even look in the mirror. Literally, spend some time retelling yourself that women aren't that special. They certainly aren't friend material. Look at all the conversations over the years you had with them and realize how silly they were or how useless. See how shallow their thinking process is, and how they are unable to really think abstract like you and I can. Finally...finally...tell yourself that it's alright to belittle women. This is the most important step. Just accept that it's fine to think of women lower than yourself.

Ignore what anyone would say to the contrary here, my way has gotten me more p*ssy in one year than being friends has gotten me only one pity lay in fifteen prior. Facts don't lie.

 

[Barrister]

I can tell you’re probably good with women by the way you write. You’re telling me a story right now. You probably tell women stories without even realising it. I’m not sure if we are on the same page. By talking, I don’t mean gushing over her and over-talking at all. Just to make that clear. Calibration is key.

Strong and silent works extremely well if she already knows you - either first hand, or second hand (proofing). Most guys aren’t in this position. Most guys who are cold approaching approach a woman as a total unknown.

My advice to guys who don’t have your natural abilities would be;

Establish your value first, so she likes you, and THEN go silent if it’s really obvious that she likes you and she’s hooking. This is where “strong silent” works so well. Because she already likes you, she’s now wondering if you like her because you’ve gone quiet - women get anxious when this happens. They are anxious because they are attracted to you. Fear, anxiety and horniness all overlap for women.

Appreciate you the compliment. Interesting thing is I grew up raised very blue pill and was like that well into my late 20s. I have only recently (last five years) discovered a lot of success with women and it was like a curtain was lifted. Confidence is the single biggest thing with charm being a close second. That combination of a confident, charming, strong persona instantly attracts women. You can be a man of few words with that and I don't think it even requires that she already know you. I have seduced women on Date 1 with this.

I do think certain things will work better for certain men than others.

 

[Barrister]

yeah but if u barely say anything, then how is she going to be attracted? Let's say she does 85% of the talking and you do 15%, won't she go home thinking things like "i don't even know who he is or what he does in life or likes in life" or "he was kind of a dud and didn't even talk"??

No - she won't go home thinking that so long as you made the 15% count. You need to maintain a lot of eye contact, have a genuine smile/smirk on your face while she is talking, keep it light, and be initiating kino throughout. You aren't a mute - you are asking her questions, letting her talk, and responding to what she says. Give her a little bit of a hard time here or there (not too much) and use kino throughout the conversations.

Once you get this down you will be surprised how many first date lays you can get.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Stop trying to make girls your friends. That's your stance and as such everything you say or do comes across as such. To me, any girl I'm with is my accessory. I let her know that. She knows that. If she was my friend, I wouldn't want to **** her. Weird, right? But it's the truth. Sex is different from friendship.

Again: stop making girls into your friends.

Feminism brainwashed you to be a gentleman and hers. Get rid of that programming. I want you to spend a week saying as many flaws as you can about women. Not blackpill territory. Just run it through your mind, even look in the mirror. Literally, spend some time retelling yourself that women aren't that special. They certainly aren't friend material. Look at all the conversations over the years you had with them and realize how silly they were or how useless. See how shallow their thinking process is, and how they are unable to really think abstract like you and I can. Finally...finally...tell yourself that it's alright to belittle women. This is the most important step. Just accept that it's fine to think of women lower than yourself.

Ignore what anyone would say to the contrary here, my way has gotten me more p*ssy in one year than being friends has gotten me only one pity lay in fifteen prior. Facts don't lie.

Thanks! This is absolutely a problem for me with regards to making women my friend. So you are spot on. Can you tell, from my original post interaction with this woman, what would you have said and done differently to make her "an accessory" or a sex object? Specifics would be very helpful as I have struggled, thanks!

 

[Barrister]

Absolutely. It has to be congruent. Your image, personality, words all have to line up in a woman's mind. It has to feel authentic. If it doesn't line up then her "bullsh1t detector" starts whirring and her eyes glaze over.

It seems we went on a similar journey. For me it began in my early 20's, and then a floodgate opened/curtain lifted around about 23-24 and my life has been nuts ever since. The biggest first issue to deal with is the sudden very addictive abundance and knowledge of "I know how to bang women". Most of my life since has actually been a struggle with sex addiction and dangerous casual sex encounters.

I agree 100%. Once you experience it there is no "OFF" switch for it. I believe in a LTR with strong boundaries - but even then now that I have experienced abundance there is an intense yearning to be out in the field if you will that was never there in my blue pill days.

 

[Sebastian0001]

Appreciate you the compliment. Interesting thing is I grew up raised very blue pill and was like that well into my late 20s. I have only recently (last five years) discovered a lot of success with women and it was like a curtain was lifted. Confidence is the single biggest thing with charm being a close second. That combination of a confident, charming, strong persona instantly attracts women. You can be a man of few words with that and I don't think it even requires that she already know you. I have seduced women on Date 1 with this.

I do think certain things will work better for certain men than others.

I never exactly understand what is meant by charm? Is it being sweet? Funny? Is being ****y/funny/jerkish charm? What is an example of a great charming act?