New-data-shows-more-than-half-young-people-america-dont-have-romantic-partner

[SW15]

True, I actually think people have never in modern history had as little random sex as today. Too many people on social media and news outlets writing about their sex life is a sign that it is non-existent in reality.

Why Are Young People Having So Little Sex?

Despite the easing of taboos and the rise of hookup apps, Americans are in the midst of a sex recession.

www.theatlantic.com

Is the Sex Recession Turning into a Great Sex Depression?

In this post, I analyze data from the past four waves of the NSFG, spanning the years 2011 to 2019, exploring both year-long celibacy for men and women, and longer intervals of sexlessness for women.1 These data are compared to the more familiar estimates from the GSS. Year-long celibacy is...

ifstudies.org

 

[MatureDJ]

IT'S OVER!

 

[sangheilios]

I recall reading that article a while ago, I've been saying for a while that this has been going on for quite some time now but goes relatively unnoticed because it's not something people are that open about. I'd definitely say since COVID hit it's probably far worse now than it was prior to that, especially last year when you had many social venues (bars, restaurants, etc.) being closed down entirely for months. Many people were essentially just sitting around at home, some of whom weren't working at all, and next thing you know social isolation became a habit/routine that they developed, which ultimately proves to be difficult to break.

With that said, I haven't had a date in over 2 years and I can't even specifically remember the last time it's been since I've even asked a woman out, it was well before covid for sure. Between working a full time job, the gym, running errands and maintaining a home, my assets and investments I don't have the time to go chasing around some average woman that will most likely result in nothing for me, especially when I'm not even that into her lol. The dating market overall is very warped and is a far more difficult game now for men than it was in the past. Not all women are demanding men be these uber chads in order to date them, let alone **** them, but there are enough women like this where it has had a tremendous impact on the dating field, both directly and indirectly. If you have a host of men vying for fatties on tinder those women, who in reality are 2s and 3s, will feel entitled to men that are 5+ for instance. It causes this vicious cycle where men are dating down but because of this it leaves less and less for those further down the ladder, and there are hordes of men who fall into this category. If a white man in his early 30s who is 6'4" and one of the fittest guys at the gym is only getting matched with below average looking women this should tell you something.

 

[oc16]

I recall reading that article a while ago, I've been saying for a while that this has been going on for quite some time now but goes relatively unnoticed because it's not something people are that open about. I'd definitely say since COVID hit it's probably far worse now than it was prior to that, especially last year when you had many social venues (bars, restaurants, etc.) being closed down entirely for months. Many people were essentially just sitting around at home, some of whom weren't working at all, and next thing you know social isolation became a habit/routine that they developed, which ultimately proves to be difficult to break.

With that said, I haven't had a date in over 2 years and I can't even specifically remember the last time it's been since I've even asked a woman out, it was well before covid for sure. Between working a full time job, the gym, running errands and maintaining a home, my assets and investments I don't have the time to go chasing around some average woman that will most likely result in nothing for me, especially when I'm not even that into her lol. The dating market overall is very warped and is a far more difficult game now for men than it was in the past. Not all women are demanding men be these uber chads in order to date them, let alone **** them, but there are enough women like this where it has had a tremendous impact on the dating field, both directly and indirectly. If you have a host of men vying for fatties on tinder those women, who in reality are 2s and 3s, will feel entitled to men that are 5+ for instance. It causes this vicious cycle where men are dating down but because of this it leaves less and less for those further down the ladder, and there are hordes of men who fall into this category. If a white man in his early 30s who is 6'4" and one of the fittest guys at the gym is only getting matched with below average looking women this should tell you something.

But you are 6'4", you should have women throwing themselves at you since most women only want men over 6 feet!

I am just kidding of course!!

Most men of average height and below envy us taller men thinking we have it so easy. I am not as tall as you (6'0") but still taller than 80% of men. I haven't hooked up in 13 months either thanks to Covid and other stuff.

 

[allergictobs]

If you have a host of men vying for fatties on tinder those women, who in reality are 2s and 3s, will feel entitled to men that are 5+ for instance. It causes this vicious cycle where men are dating down but because of this it leaves less and less for those further down the ladder, and there are hordes of men who fall into this category. If a white man in his early 30s who is 6'4" and one of the fittest guys at the gym is only getting matched with below average looking women this should tell you something.

I strongly think that the dating market is split into two different realms, the online world and the real world.

In the online dating market, men vastly outnumber women and on top of that, the women out there are not seriously looking for anything. Even more importantly, they are there because they could not find a mate in the real world (no one was good enough).

In the real world, the women who are sane and at least moderately attractive tend to easily find a partner, and either stay with them long term or monkey branch from one relationship to another. They never appear online because they don't need to.

It's not a good idea to draw conclusions about the real world based on the online dating market.

 

[SW15]

If a white man in his early 30s who is 6'4" and one of the fittest guys at the gym is only getting matched with below average looking women this should tell you something.

But you are 6'4", you should have women throwing themselves at you since most women only want men over 6 feet!

I am just kidding of course!!

Most men of average height and below envy us taller men thinking we have it so easy. I am not as tall as you (6'0") but still taller than 80% of men. I haven't hooked up in 13 months either thanks to Covid and other stuff.

Men like me (5'10") who have felt the sting of rejection due to height think that men like the two of you are better positioned for success, which both of you are. @sangheilios is well positioned to hit on the 5'10"-6'2" volleyball player women, who are attractive.

I find @sangheilios to be an interesting case study because at 6'4" and muscular, that is the type of guy "on paper" that is supposed to melt panties just by being in the same room with them.

Between working a full time job, the gym, running errands and maintaining a home, my assets and investments I don't have the time to go chasing around some average woman that will most likely result in nothing for me, especially when I'm not even that into her lol. The dating market overall is very warped and is a far more difficult game now for men than it was in the past.

This is good commentary. Many of those things that you are doing are supposed to help a man attract and retain (if he wishes to have medium term relationships or longer women. Yet, you have not seen vaginal benefits from doing those responsible adult things.

I strongly think that the dating market is split into two different realms, the online world and the real world.

In the online dating market, men vastly outnumber women and on top of that, the women out there are not seriously looking for anything. Even more importantly, they are there because they could not find a mate in the real world (no one was good enough).

In the real world, the women who are sane and at least moderately attractive tend to easily find a partner, and either stay with them long term or monkey branch from one relationship to another. They never appear online because they don't need to.

It's not a good idea to draw conclusions about the real world based on the online dating market.

I really like that you made this comment because this exact idea has crossed my mind many times.

Men are best served by avoiding the swipe apps and websites.

 

[oc16]

Men like me (5'10") who have felt the sting of rejection due to height think that men like the two of you are better positioned for success, which both of you are. @sangheilios is well positioned to hit on the 5'10"-6'2" volleyball player women, who are attractive.

I don't know man, how come I don't have women throwing themselves at me then? I am also fit, full head of hair (a 7 out of 10).

If I had a dime for every time I saw some average height and below guy with a cute girl I would be rich!

I find @sangheilios to be an interesting case study because at 6'4" and muscular, that is the type of guy "on paper" that is supposed to melt panties just by being in the same room with them.



This is good commentary. Many of those things that you are doing are supposed to help a man attract and retain (if he wishes to have medium term relationships or longer women. Yet, you have not seen vaginal benefits from doing those responsible adult things.



I really like that you made this comment because this exact idea has crossed my mind many times.

 

[timmyroni]

I am seeing a ridiculous amount of 'randomness' in dating matchups. I'm seeing better looking taller guys dating fat or at best average looking girls. I'm seeing below average looking guys dating 7's and occasionally 8's. Of course, there is the huge part of the bell curve with average looking men dating average looking women.

What I am NOT seeing is some systematic pattern of good looking men and women dating each other.

The only clear pattern is that a very large percentage of young adults 20-late 30's are not dating at all.

 

[sangheilios]

I strongly think that the dating market is split into two different realms, the online world and the real world.

In the online dating market, men vastly outnumber women and on top of that, the women out there are not seriously looking for anything. Even more importantly, they are there because they could not find a mate in the real world (no one was good enough).

In the real world, the women who are sane and at least moderately attractive tend to easily find a partner, and either stay with them long term or monkey branch from one relationship to another. They never appear online because they don't need to.

It's not a good idea to draw conclusions about the real world based on the online dating market.

I agree, though the reality is that the OLD market is one of the primary means for people to meet one another, particularly as you get older. Once you get past college age the opportunity to meet women that you have access to and are actually single will slowly diminish as you get older, as these women over time become locked into serious relationships. Most normal women are locked down well before they hit 30, this is roughly when they feel their biological clock, and for one to still be single at this age there are reasons for it and none of them are good.

Example: Let's say you have a guy that is around 27, reasonably attractive and normal, holds a job as an electrician in a decent sized metro. He is single, maybe he hits the gym or hangs out with friends but he is more or less pretty busy with life. If he doesn't have a really good social circle where he can meet women his only options are nightlife, OLD and maybe some social events. Nightlife is not for everyone and social events are normally very awkward, both of these also require actual time and physical effort. OLD is really his only option and is easy, as all he needs to do is swipe and send a few messages.

 

[oc16]

I agree, though the reality is that the OLD market is one of the primary means for people to meet one another, particularly as you get older. Once you get past college age the opportunity to meet women that you have access to and are actually single will slowly diminish as you get older, as these women over time become locked into serious relationships. Most normal women are locked down well before they hit 30, this is roughly when they feel their biological clock, and for one to still be single at this age there are reasons for it and none of them are good.

Example: Let's say you have a guy that is around 27, reasonably attractive and normal, holds a job as an electrician in a decent sized metro. He is single, maybe he hits the gym or hangs out with friends but he is more or less pretty busy with life. If he doesn't have a really good social circle where he can meet women his only options are nightlife, OLD and maybe some social events. Nightlife is not for everyone and social events are normally very awkward, both of these also require actual time and physical effort. OLD is really his only option and is easy, as all he needs to do is swipe and send a few messages.

It's frustrating as hell that you see many guys locked down with these cute girls, but we aren't. Most of these guys don't have anything that we don't and less! Yeah, I am sounding like a hater right now, but it is frustrating.

 

[sangheilios]

Men like me (5'10") who have felt the sting of rejection due to height think that men like the two of you are better positioned for success, which both of you are. @sangheilios is well positioned to hit on the 5'10"-6'2" volleyball player women, who are attractive.

I find @sangheilios to be an interesting case study because at 6'4" and muscular, that is the type of guy "on paper" that is supposed to melt panties just by being in the same room with them.



This is good commentary. Many of those things that you are doing are supposed to help a man attract and retain (if he wishes to have medium term relationships or longer women. Yet, you have not seen vaginal benefits from doing those responsible adult things.

I honestly pursue all of those things not to attain women but because they make my life easier and there are certain lifestyle factors that I can enjoy or actively working towards that are out of reach for most people. I'm honestly just not all that enthusiastic about the women that I have access to and really don't see all that much of an incentive to pursue anything with them. I'd be totally open to dating or being a relationship with an attractive woman that is well adjusted and essentially "normal" but that's like finding a unicorn based upon my observations and experiences.

 

[allergictobs]

I agree, though the reality is that the OLD market is one of the primary means for people to meet one another, particularly as you get older.

Well, this is probably true for most introverts, but there are plenty of men who are outgoing and spend a considerable amount of time meeting and interacting with new people every day (I'm not one of them). Introverted men lose to extroverted men in the dating market, there's no way around it.

Once you get past college age the opportunity to meet women that you have access to and are actually single will slowly diminish as you get older, as these women over time become locked into serious relationships. Most normal women are locked down well before they hit 30, this is roughly when they feel their biological clock, and for one to still be single at this age there are reasons for it and none of them are good.

Very true, and hence a guy should mainly aim to date women between the ages of 20 an 25.

 

[timmyroni]

I honestly pursue all of those things not to attain women but because they make my life easier and there are certain lifestyle factors that I can enjoy or actively working towards that are out of reach for most people. I'm honestly just not all that enthusiastic about the women that I have access to and really don't see all that much of an incentive to pursue anything with them. I'd be totally open to dating or being a relationship with an attractive woman that is well adjusted and essentially "normal" but that's like finding a unicorn based upon my observations and experiences.

Yeah, I rejected a woman recently, not because of her politics, but because she was incredibly dull to be around. She was a very pretty girl, 25-ish, but rarely talked, except for an occasional non-committal phrase which told you nothing about her.

She just seemed super shady and very low confidence. I checked her social media feeds and she was going crazy with constant BLM, POC, and other left wing jibberish. It was like she had a split personality or something.

She wound up dating the one guy who showed the most consistent interest in her. I won't even comment on his appearance but he has a solid career and is extremely attracted and devoted to her; not surprising since he probably moved up 4 smv points.

 

[sangheilios]

It's frustrating as hell that you see many guys locked down with these cute girls, but we aren't. Most of these guys don't have anything that we don't and less! Yeah, I am sounding like a hater right now, but it is frustrating.

It's taken me a while to figure this out but here is some truth to this. People on here talk about needing game or this or that but it's all nonsense for the most part for most men. I'm going to totally disregard men that are very unattractive physically and/or have very bad social skills.

What I've learned is that it's mostly to do with simply luck and being at the right place at the right time with the right person. It could be having a certain group of friends and through them you by chance cross paths with a woman you are into, who is into you and who happens to be single. It could be holding the door for a woman going out of the store and she is receptive to you and it proceeds from there. It could be taking a class in college, you sit next to this girl and she is attracted to you, you both hit it off and now you are dating. I could go on and on about various scenarios but they all mostly play out like this. There are certain things you can do to increase your chances of something like this to happen, sitting at home all day during your free time is not one of them. However, it really is all about what I'm mentioning here and there are plenty of men who do all of these things and still don't meet anyone.

 

[oc16]

Well, this is probably true for most introverts, but there are plenty of men who are outgoing and spend a considerable amount of time meeting and interacting with new people every day (I'm not one of them). Introverted men lose to extroverted men in the dating market, there's no way around it.



Very true, and hence a guy should mainly aim to date women between the ages of 20 an 25.

You have to remember most guys (myself included) were shy in college and have low SMV. Yes, you will never again be surrounded by so many attractive females in one place.

However, women at that age are at peak SMV and they know it. They pick and choose at will and usually go for the good-looking jocks.

I think most dudes in college (2/3) fail miserably with women.

 

[oc16]

It's taken me a while to figure this out but here is some truth to this. People on here talk about needing game or this or that but it's all nonsense for the most part for most men. I'm going to totally disregard men that are very unattractive physically and/or have very bad social skills.

What I've learned is that it's mostly to do with simply luck and being at the right place at the right time with the right person. It could be having a certain group of friends and through them you by chance cross paths with a woman you are into, who is into you and who happens to be single. It could be holding the door for a woman going out of the store and she is receptive to you and it proceeds from there. It could be taking a class in college, you sit next to this girl and she is attracted to you, you both hit it off and now you are dating. I could go on and on about various scenarios but they all mostly play out like this. There are certain things you can do to increase your chances of something like this to happen, sitting at home all day during your free time is not one of them. However, it really is all about what I'm mentioning here and there are plenty of men who do all of these things and still don't meet anyone.

Couldn't be said any better and I agree with you 100%. It's all about luck and timing. Mr. 5'8" average looking who is 20 lbs. overweight just happened to be at the right place at the right time.

 

[SW15]

the reality is that the OLD market is one of the primary means for people to meet one another, particularly as you get older. Once you get past college age the opportunity to meet women that you have access to and are actually single will slowly diminish as you get older, as these women over time become locked into serious relationships. Most normal women are locked down well before they hit 30, this is roughly when they feel their biological clock, and for one to still be single at this age there are reasons for it and none of them are good.

I can identify with this. I've had periods of being single after age 30 and dealt with dating women over 30. It's not fun.

There can be some physically attractive 30 something women out there but there are often mental health and behavioral issues there.

Example: Let's say you have a guy that is around 27, reasonably attractive and normal, holds a job as an electrician in a decent sized metro. He is single, maybe he hits the gym or hangs out with friends but he is more or less pretty busy with life. If he doesn't have a really good social circle where he can meet women his only options are nightlife, OLD and maybe some social events. Nightlife is not for everyone and social events are normally very awkward, both of these also require actual time and physical effort. OLD is really his only option and is easy, as all he needs to do is swipe and send a few messages.

This is a good example and a personally relatable example. I moved to a new city at age 28 and I am still in that city 10 years later. This city is the principal city in a large U.S. metropolitan area. I'm not an electrician but am reasonably attractive. I had no social circle upon arrival. I made friends in the city. None of my friends ever hooked me up with a date during the past 10 years. I had some shiit outcomes and that lead to towards embracing day game and reading Roosh's "Day Bang" along with "Bang". I was most interested in "Day Bang" because I had been fighting it out at night since age 18 (college residence parties and bars in multiple cities) and felt the need to do something different.

I agree that nightlife isn't for everyone. Some of my characteristics are not well suited for traditional nightlife, so I sought other options. I had been aware of day game as far back as about age 22. I actually wish I knew more about day game in college because I would have done more random, on campus approaching. You're also correct that many social events can be awkward.

Day game, night game, and activities like co-ed sports leagues can be tough slogs for meeting women. Interacting with women while sitting at home in a t-shirt and underwear seems appealing but unfortunately the tech assisted dating world is a complete shiit show. You see the absolute worst of women in that environment.

I honestly pursue all of those things not to attain women but because they make my life easier and there are certain lifestyle factors that I can enjoy or actively working towards that are out of reach for most people. I'm honestly just not all that enthusiastic about the women that I have access to and really don't see all that much of an incentive to pursue anything with them. I'd be totally open to dating or being a relationship with an attractive woman that is well adjusted and essentially "normal" but that's like finding a unicorn based upon my observations and experiences.

It's good that you are doing the investing, gym, and professional development stuff for yourself. It's best if a woman realizes what you offer and wants to be a part of your life because she perceives value in how you do things.

Your home city is a bit of a shiit show.

 

[timmyroni]

It's not really much of a mystery as to how couples meet, at least not according to the chart below. The data is 4 years old, so just assume roughly half or more of all couples meet 'online.'

I'm a bit surprised that bars (clubs too?) make up such a large percentage of how couples meet considering the batting average of most guys at these venues!

The rest of couples meet through 'traditional' means such as social circles or family.

But yeah, online meets are going to be the most common way for couples to meet if it isn't already which is quite scary.

 

[AttackFormation]

I'm a bit surprised that bars (clubs too?) make up such a large percentage of how couples meet considering the batting average of most guys at these venues!

They may be meeting online, but to save face still claim to have met at a more socially approved venue.

Personally, based on my experience on OLD from 18-28 i feel forced to conclude that a woman using OLD is a red flag in itself. There is something wrong with her - a personality disorder, a nasty attitude, just looking to be given validation and entertainment, mentally ill, delusional, and so on - and that's why she's on OLD. If she didnt have some kind of chronic psychological problem, she either wouldnt be on OLD at all or at least she would not stay on it.

But this OLD stuff is old news...

 

[sangheilios]

Couldn't be said any better and I agree with you 100%. It's all about luck and timing. Mr. 5'8" average looking who is 20 lbs. overweight just happened to be at the right place at the right time.

Something else to consider is that many young people, millenials and genz, are relatively picky compared to the generation of their parents. I can think of tons of examples of baby boomers who all settled into these super weird and dysfunctional marriages/relationships in order not to be single and alone. I personally always felt that their standards were pretty low in regards to selecting not only a mate but in regards to tolerated behaviors, which is one of the reasons their divorce rate was so high. Millenials grew up in divorced households and I personally feel their response to this was to be very selective with who they date and get into a relationship with, let alone marry or have children with. I can think of a few male boomers that were married and had kids who I guarantee would be totally dateless incels for the remainder of their lives if they were millenials lol.