Male Friends

[AlphaDraconis]

Lol what is with you and Dolph Lundgren?

Well, just using him as a prime example of a genetically superior male. high T, 6ft5”, good bone structure, physique, etc.

I mean, there are probably better examples, but, let’s say someone of that genetic stock was introduced as a platonic guy friend, I doubt many of the 80% would be cool with that.

 

[B80]

I would be careful of reading too much into the fact that this lady has male friends. Nothing wrong with that at all, as long as they are just platonic friends. I have female platonic friends and they have boyfriends, the boyfriends know about me (I’ve met them) and everyone is cool.

If you have a girlfriend and she has male friends then the fact that it concerns you is a reflection of your insecurity, not her infidelity.

The idea that when you get a girlfriend, she has to drop all contact with her other male friends is just BS. Any girlfriend of mine has to accept that I have a good female friend and if that is an issue for her then she can leave. I have no time for the jealous girlfriends.

I’m just giving you a different perspective here. A confident man would not care one little bit about this.

Thanks for this.


Yeah I did consider that for sure... my issue and wary of causing doubts on her part over nothing.

anxiousness has certainly escalated after posting here and drinking more past few days, but feeling more at ease about it now.

 

[rjc149]

Well, just using him as a prime example of a genetically superior male. high T, 6ft5”, good bone structure, physique, etc.

I mean, there are probably better examples, but, let’s say someone of that genetic stock was introduced as a platonic guy friend, I doubt many of the 80% would be cool with that.

Lol dude you are too much.

 

[B80]

Again it's always a tricky fine line between communicating your boundaries, and in doing so, possibly coming off as insecure or threatened.

Given that this is at the very beginning of your relationship, you need to air grievances assertively, succinctly and immediately. If you don't, it will build up and fester, resulting in more and more insecure behavior from you, and more and more tests of your boundaries from her.

If movie night with a male friend bothers you, tell her. But tell her once, and don't keep bringing it up. Don't give her rules or tell her how she needs to behave.

If she values you and respects you, she will validate your concerns and will attempt to reach an understanding with you.

If she doesn't value or respect you, she'll dismiss it, deride it, and ignore or disregard the fact that it bothers you. And that's when you cut her loose.

So as I haven't demonstrated insecurity yet around this to her and I can accept it as my issue and that for now accept they are friends and nothing more, and not allow it to fester and show to her, I'm thinking better not to mention it, but continue to monitor.

Bearing in mind this was first time she mentioned seeing him since prior to xmas so not an overly regular thing.

Assuming above would you let things ride for now and not raise it?

 

[rart]

Lol dude you are too much.

where exactly is he wrong?

 

[AlphaDraconis]

Lol dude you are too much.

Women have the benefit of vastly enhancing their appearances. If you google celebs without makeup, a conventionally accepted 9 or 10 isn’t all that. In fact, many women look just as sh1tty as the average guy. Us guys have to face the world with what our genetics handed us, so it would be nice if women kept these things in mind when looking down on guys for not fitting their aesthetic ideal, when they know how they feel when looking at their own bare appearances each morning.

Without the power of makeup, they’d be the ones in simp mode.

 

[rjc149]

So as I haven't demonstrated insecurity yet around this to her and I can accept it as my issue and that for now accept they are friends and nothing more, and not allow it to fester and show to her, I'm thinking better not to mention it, but continue to monitor.

Bearing in mind this was first time she mentioned seeing him since prior to xmas so not an overly regular thing.

Assuming above would you let things ride for now and not raise it?

My advice here is going to be more relationship-focused, which is appropriate given that you have both agreed to be exclusive with each other. I think you get enough "be alpha and spin more plates" advice here.

You're now in a relationship with a woman who has a lot of close male friendships. If you expect this relationship to last, you will need to get comfortable with that.

But you will also need to voice your opinions and grievances in a succinct, non-emotional way.

If your grievances are fundamentally at odds with how she lives her life, then this is a basic incompatibility and your relationship doesn't have strong legs to stand on.

Pretending you don't care when you do care is not the way to go. Don't put on an act. Being in a relationship means you need to be yourself.

Simply tell her you feel it's a little disrespectful that she's having movie night alone with a guy right after asking you to be exclusive. Don't give her rules, ultimatums, requirements. Make sure you clarify to her "I want you to have friends, I want to you have a social life, and I want to you feel free to do what you want to do. Just understand how I feel when you're spending evenings alone with another guy. That's all."

And that's it. Never bring it up again. Gauge how she reacts. But don't let it slide "for now." That's weak. Squash beefs immediately.

If you have no interest in anything serious or long-term with her, then yeah, I agree, don't bring it up. Just go spin more plates.

 

[rjc149]

Without the power of makeup, they’d be the ones in simp mode.

Believe it or not, 75%+ of women are.

 

[rjc149]

where exactly is he wrong?

He's not wrong, technically. He's just -- over the top with this stuff. I'm beginning to find it humorous.

 

[AlphaDraconis]

A high value man can be friends with anyone he wants to because he doesn't give a fukk. You're assuming a male friend does man-servant things like this, but that's coming from a low-value perspective - maybe based on your experience or from some of of the binary posts around here.

@CoandaEffect is right IMO, it's about insecurity and inner game. Doesn't mean there is never sexual tension, or that they won't wind up fukking some day. But women can bring a lot of value to a man's life besides just sex - I know most of Sosuave doesn't believe that but that's been my experience.

As I mentioned in a previous post, you should consider yourself king of your own world, regardless of what anyone else thinks, or regardless of your genetics. By that, I mean respect and take care of yourself and your own happiness no matter what.

And let’s face it, women do have their categories they place men in. It’s either: the simp category aka friendzone where she places guys she considers genetically unworthy to fvck - (her butlers, chauffeurs, tampons, Mr Fix it’s, etc). Then there’s fvck boy category (good looking guys with no financial assets); then the guy they’d marry - the genetically superior man with money and status.

 

[rjc149]

you should consider yourself king of your own world, regardless of what anyone else thinks, or regardless of your genetics. By that, I mean respect and take care of yourself and your own happiness no matter what.

My man -- are you taking your own advice?

 

[AlphaDraconis]

My man -- are you taking your own advice?

Yes, I told you before that I am happy in my own world, and would only sacrifice that single life happiness for a woman who was really worth it. By that I mean a woman who doesn’t come along and try to destroy my happiness and peace of mind. If she doesn’t come along in this lifetime? Not the biggest deal, but it would have been nice to have started a family with the right woman. Again, no major loss. Whatever will be, will be.

 

[Lordeterra]

Time to do the sosuave special..................

and invite "Mei Ling" (the size 4 asian) into the equation.....

She will get rid of Back up boy, real quick.

Lol

 

[oldmanofthesea]

Late getting into this thread and have not read the 7 pages of replies but I will chime in based on your original post.

Back when I was blue-pilled and married, my wife left me for one of her male buddies who she then entered a multi-year LTR with. I never thought he was a threat because he was a 4 and she was an 8 or a 9. They barely ever hung out and she almost never talked about him. You just never know with women.

The girl I just dated for a year and recently broke up with had a lot of beta male orbiters. I didn't feel threatened by them because none of them were anywhere close to her in looks, but that may have been naïve on my part given what happened with my ex wife. I'll never know for sure if anything happened with her and any of those guys but I have reason to believe something did.

At the same time, you can't control women either. If a woman wants to cheat, she will cheat. However, I do think that drawing clear boundaries is important because it accomplishes several things. First and foremost is that it forces her to ACT and make a decision on what is more important, seeing her male friends 1:1 or being in a committed relationship with you. In my book, no person in a committed relationship should be spending time 1:1 with someone of the opposite sex. That is a boundary for me and it applies to me equally as it applies to a girl I'm in a relationship with. There are some women who won't accept that boundary, and will try to label me as insecure or controlling for it. That's ok. Those women can go date someone else instead of me. Second is that it reduces the chance that an emotional affair happens, which can then lead to a physical affair, and it reduces the chances of someone meddling in your relationship. If a woman WANTS to cheat, she will, but if your boundaries remove her from the types of situations that evolve into an affair or cheating, it does reduce the risk. And it's also very important that you are standing up for yourself - by setting these boundaries. Good women will respect your doing this.

If you aren't exclusive with a girl, then I wouldn't bring up male friends. I just take note at the stage in the dating process as to if she has any male friends and if so, how many, and how close they are and compare and contrast the same for her female friends. The more male friends she has and the fewer female friends she has, the bigger the red flag. I have learned not to enter exclusive relationships with women like that. But if she asks to be exclusive, and you really want to be, then that would be the time to bring up the guy friends and how you couldn't be in an exclusive relationship with a girl who spends time 1:1 with other men - it's just not what you are looking for.

Because you said you were concerned with how bringing up her guy friend(s) would go, and that she would react negatively to it, I will say that I have learned it is VERY important to form and communicate your own boundaries without thought as to whether a girl is going to like them or not. You can't worry whether or not she will like your boundary. You simply state your boundary and if she doesn't like it, you walk away and never look back.

 

[indiff]

Because you said you were concerned with how bringing up her guy friend(s) would go, and that she would react negatively to it, I will say that I have learned it is VERY important to form and communicate your own boundaries without thought as to whether a girl is going to like them or not. You can't worry whether or not she will like your boundary. You simply state your boundary and if she doesn't like it, you walk away and never look back.

One of my mistakes and regrets that I’ve made recently was to go into an exclusive relationship with arms wide open and not bring up anything regarding boundaries.

The only reason why I felt I messed up was by reading stories similar to OP’s. I have the same exact problem where she goes for drinks with her male friends 1:1. She’s perfect in every other aspect(cooks, passionate in bed...) but this is not something I would accept. Comply or goodbye.

Right now, I’m lining up some candidates, creating distance between us and only replying sporadically to her texts. I disagree with some of the advice about communicating with her that you fill uncomfortable with her spending time with male friends. She absolutely knows what she’s doing. They are all adept at manipulation and way better than us men.

The main lesson from all this is always have a talk about boundaries and if she balks at any of your requirements, you will pretty much know what’s in store for you in future.

That being said, I’m interested in gathering thoughts regarding how to have the ‘boundaries’ conversation midway in an exclusive relationship without appearing insecure(if one of the boundaries is her seeing her male friends) and setting myself up to be gaslighted.

 

[B80]

One of my mistakes and regrets that I’ve made recently was to go into an exclusive relationship with arms wide open and not bring up anything regarding boundaries.

The only reason why I felt I messed up was by reading stories similar to OP’s. I have the same exact problem where she goes for drinks with her male friends 1:1. She’s perfect in every other aspect(cooks, passionate in bed...) but this is not something I would accept. Comply or goodbye.

Right now, I’m lining up some candidates, creating distance between us and only replying sporadically to her texts. I disagree with some of the advice about communicating with her that you fill uncomfortable with her spending time with male friends. She absolutely knows what she’s doing. They are all adept at manipulation and way better than us men.

The main lesson from all this is always have a talk about boundaries and if she balks at any of your requirements, you will pretty much know what’s in store for you in future.

That being said, I’m interested in gathering thoughts regarding how to have the ‘boundaries’ conversation midway in an exclusive relationship without appearing insecure(if one of the boundaries is her seeing her male friends) and setting myself up to be gaslighted.

Yeah I'm sure they know what they're doing, but isn't the point of this to bring it to the fore to let them know that you don't like it/find it acceptable/doesn't sit well in an exclusive relationship. If they get funny or try gaslighting, that's a red flag that they should be dumped or relegated to plate status? If they respect you/trueky have high interest they will validate rather than throw it back in your face as being paranoid, insecure, controlling etc?

 

[oldmanofthesea]

I disagree with some of the advice about communicating with her that you fill uncomfortable with her spending time with male friends. She absolutely knows what she’s doing. They are all adept at manipulation and way better than us men.

I still haven't made up my mind on this - I go back and forth between exactly what you said above, and wondering if some women truly don't know any better. But at the end of the day it doesn't matter - the point is that you don't tell her you are uncomfortable by it and simply leave it at that - you tell her you are uncomfortable by it and don't want to be an exclusive relationship with someone who spends time 1:1 with other men, and that you understand if she doesn't want to give that up, but that she can't have you too. It's me, or them.

That being said, I’m interested in gathering thoughts regarding how to have the ‘boundaries’ conversation midway in an exclusive relationship without appearing insecure(if one of the boundaries is her seeing her male friends) and setting myself up to be gaslighted.

Again, don't worry about appearing insecure and don't worry about being gas-lit. You are nearly guaranteed to have her respond to your boundary setting (especially a late initiative of a boundary setting) with gas-lighting and her labeling you as insecure and unreasonable. But first and foremost, if YOU don't like her seeing other guys 1:1, then it doesn't matter what anyone else on the planet feels about that boundary - it is your boundary and if it is important enough to you that you'd end a relationship over it (and all boundaries should result in breaking up if she refused them or breaks them) , there is no such thing as an invalid boundary. Are there some people who would feel that boundary is unacceptable? Sure. All that means is that you aren't compatible with those people. It doesn't mean your boundary is unacceptable. This is probably the single most important thing I have learned in the last four years. Because women LOVE testing boundaries and they love trying to tell you that your boundaries are unreasonable, controlling, unfair, insecure, whatever. So the single most important thing I have learned is to think carefully about your boundaries ahead of time, and then be 10000000% convinced and unwavering in them - truly be willing to walk away from the relationship to enforce them. It makes things so easy because there can be no argument, no debate. You simply say, listen, I'm not comfortable with you seeing other guys 1:1 while you are in an exclusive relationship with me. I myself will not see other women 1:1 while I am with you, so I am adhering to the same rules. I will listen to your response, and I will answer questions, but I will not defend my boundaries nor are they negotiable. If you don't like it, then you can find a guy who is more compatible with you and who allows you to go out 1:1 with other men, but that's just not me and it never will be.

The fact that you are midway through a relationship technically makes no difference other than she will likely try to add in the whole "Well you never mentioned this before - what's changed - that's not fair...." bit as one of many arguments she makes in trying to push back on your boundary setting. Yes it is certainly better to set the boundary early-on but sometimes things change, you make certain observations, etc. Sometimes you don't even know something is an issue until mid-relationship because you don't uncover it until then, or didn't realize the extent of it.

 

[derby1]

you : were not compatible.
her: What?
You: I wouldnt date a woman who doesnt share the same values as me about the opposite sex. it would be FWB only.
Her: FOFOF!!!& .............**6y6868...insert swear word

you: "See were not compatible"

 

[Jor-El]

This topic has raised some great posts and answers

 

[rjc149]

I disagree with some of the advice about communicating with her that you fill uncomfortable with her spending time with male friends. She absolutely knows what she’s doing. They are all adept at manipulation and way better than us men.

This is also a way to look at her behavior. If she knows what she's doing, then she's seeing if she can get away with it. She's seeing if OP will say something and put his foot down. You can see it as a test of his strength.

He can not respond and pretend it doesn't bother him. She'll keep doing it to test him and see how far she can take it. His resentment builds and builds. Relationship doomed. Spin more plates.

He can start hanging out with other ladies one-on-one, turn this into a tit-for-tat. She'll keep doing it. Relationship doomed. Spin more plates.

Or he can call it out.

She keeps doing it, or thinks he's weak and insecure, and starts the distancing and ejecting process --> relationship over. Next. Spin more plates.

She listens to him, validates his concerns, explains her concerns about losing her friends, tries to reach some understanding or common ground etc. He's expressed a grievance, she's willing to communicate about it like a partner --> relationship has a chance.

The way I see it, if he wants this relationship to have a chance and she's not just a "plate" then he needs to say something, and say it NOW. If this causes him to lose her, send the b!tch back to the streets where she belongs. Good riddance. Find a better partner.