Do you think that men face way higher appearance standards than women do?

[bigdave17]

a woman is considered close to a 10 as long as she is cute and has a very hot sexy body. Cute face is mostly genetic but almost any woman can have a perfect body with enough effort in gym

For a man to be a 10/10, he has to be 6'3, have a perfect hairline, perfect facial aesthetics and be jacked and ripped. 80% of that is all genetics so you have no shot if you're not 100% genetically blessed no matter how much you workout or you diet. Even a top 10 percentile male genetically can't be a 9 or a 10 because so few have everything required before you even start talking about the need to be very muscular and ripped. Its also much harder for men to have a perfect body than women - we have to be huge and ripped which requires years of working out and dieting. Women have a perfect body with 1 year of working out and just having a flat belly. They don't need to have shredded abdominals like we do (which are crazy hard)

IMO I see way more female 9s and 10s because it requires so much less to be a female 9 and we demand so much more from men. My family is perfect example. Me and my sister are both equally attractive but she is considered a 9 and I'm only a 7 to 8 because I don't have a perfect hairline and im only 5'10 to 5'11. We both have the same features in the face

 

[Mike32ct]

Yes. I believe that women are more particular about looks features than men are.

On the height topic, I’m also in the 5’10” to 5’11” range. The woman I’m dating right now is 5’3”. That’s totally fine with me, but notice how she went with a 7” delta lol.

 

[Who Dares Win]

A guy is required to be muscular (anabolic state from eating above necessity and training) but also ripped (you lose body fat by eating less than maintenance and training), this is just in terms of look.

Anyway this high requirements women have come only from the fact that there are too many men available so they can filter as much as they want, while women select men, men just grab the lesser crap they can.

Given wars and caresty more men would die and the few men could select women as much as women are selecting men...nowadays evolution and social selection works only to filter men.

 

[MoreThanSmooth]

The funny thing is that girls are the first to say they don't give a s**t about looks but it's utter nonsense. As others have said, I think girls judge on looks even harder than the more shallow men.

Just look at how many say stuff on OLD like "You must be THIS tall" (usually a ridiculous demand too, like she's 5'4" and she'll only date 6'6" and above...lol)

I've personally seen so many seemingly intelligent, "decent" girls who exclusively date guys who are thick, lazy, horrible garbage people just because they're handsome or have abs. Looking insanely good is basically the first step to even get a date in the first place tbh.

 

[Who Dares Win]

The funny thing is that girls are the first to say they don't give a s**t about looks but it's utter nonsense. As others have said, I think girls judge on looks even harder than the more shallow men.

Just look at how many say stuff on OLD like "You must be THIS tall" (usually a ridiculous demand too, like she's 5'4" and she'll only date 6'6" and above...lol)

I've personally seen so many seemingly intelligent, "decent" girls who exclusively date guys who are thick, lazy, horrible garbage people just because they're handsome or have abs. Looking insanely good is basically the first step to even get a date in the first place tbh.

Dont talk like that or someone will shame you for not a having a "tight enough game".

"I'm average height, I have a dad bod and a receiding hairline and girls dont give me a shot nowdays not even average single moms" says the average guy....

Then someone comes and say: "its all in your head dude, they can sense your insecurity....you should improve your game".

"But I successfully sell financial contracts to big corporation, Im not shy or lacking social skills"

"Dude trust me, your look doesnt matter with women its all about being confident and running your game like a pro".

 

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

Physical appearance is harder on women. That’s where all their worth comes from really. Especially nowadays since they can’t do **** outside of looking hot lol. Men are judged by more things so if we aren’t as hot physically, then we can still increase attraction through personality or finances or whatever. Height and hairline is genetic but so are the size of a woman’s tits and how slim her waist is relative to her hips and shoulders. The size of her ass is too really, it takes a lot of time for them to tone their butt or do whatever the **** to improve that.

I think what you’re confusing here is that women have harsher preferences than men do. Obviously some guys prefer say redheads over brunettes or something, but in general, if she’s hot then she’s hot. If women really decided to nitpick then they’d say how he does have to have a certain height and hair color with a specific facial feature that they really like for whatever annoying ****ing reason and blah blah blah. In the end though, if you say the right things the right way at the right time and act the right way at the right time, then you’ll get in her pants. All women at heir very core do fall for the same type of personality characteristics.

 

[Dingo]

Yes... Because even a 5 female will get laid by desperate men.

A guy who is a 5 is screwed....

 

[Murk]

Girls don't need you to be jacked and shredded to be a 9-10, some girls yes but many prefer a fit/lean/healthy look instead.

You can get away with a bad hairline by being attractive and symmetrical in the face. If a women is not that beautiful in the face she is FVCKED. It means everything. I don't care about hot her body is, if she is not stunning, she can never be a 9-10.

 

[fanatic22]

This is bs. First off, most of you are totally ignoring the dynamic women face. A woman who is less than a 6 has much more relaxed standards. This represents probably 70% of women. The issue is that you do exactly what you complain about and write them off immediately based on looks.

Women who are at least a 6 but less than an 8 might be more picky because they get significantly more attention from men, but it's partly a delusion. See, most guys are willing to fvck these women, but not date them seriously. If they're too picky, they find that they're being used as cvm dumpsters by guys who are more attractive than they are. They have a very difficult situation because they have the option to be intimate with someone who is unclear about his intentions. What would YOU do in that circumstance? Date someone several points lower because his intentions were clearer?

Finally, yes, the highest bracket of women (8+) can get guys who are 10s, so if you are not in the top male bracket it's difficult to get these women. The thing is, it's not at all impossible - women do care about things like humor, intelligence, and ambition to a far higher degree than men. If you have an ugly face as a woman you're fvcked. So ultimately I think it's time to stop feeling sorry for ourselves and realize that we are really in the better position.

 

[playa99]

This is literally the opposite of what is true. You are trying to bend the truth to protect your ego.

Your problem is not your looks, according to you. Therefore it must be something that you are doing. Look for opportunities within your failures & chances to learn. Even the best fvck up from time to time.

 

[guru1000]

1) Women have it easiest between 18-25 yo. After 25 yo, it becomes progressively harder for women.

Men above 25 yo have it easier because men hold value outside of their looks, and just start to build their finances/career/status at this time.

2) Most (not all) women do not approach. Hence, they are saddled with options who are not entirely their physical type or what they are looking for.

Smart men do approach. Although men will have to face rejection, the options we do have are either our physical type or what we are looking for.

Men who approach have it easier.

You, Dave, are unwilling to do the work (by approaching), so you will find it extremely difficult and are limited like women who are the bystanders not "making it happen" and thus surrounded by many men not of their caliber.

 

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

Yes... Because even a 5 female will get laid by desperate men.

A guy who is a 5 is screwed.... View attachment 1402

All this means is to make yourself more attractive so you can get away with more things.

 

[claudolfgeorgini]

Women have crazy high standards for appearance. A 5 woman can easily get laid. BUT it's harder for her to get a relationship and she knows that.

That's why the "game" is to make her think that you're willing get in a relationship with her.

The lower your value, the more you have to sell her on the relationship dream. This will only work on women that is your level or below.

 

[zekko]

You, Dave, are unwilling to do the work (by approaching), so you will find it extremely difficult and are limited like women who are the bystanders not "making it happen" and thus surrounded by many men not of their caliber.

That's my impression. He has limited his options so much by rationalizing why nothing can work for him dating wise.
So the only way he is going to end up with a girlfriend is for him to literally "luck" into one. Unless he changes, he is just going to have to wait until he accidentally meets someone that appeals to him. But then he runs the risk of putting too much value on her because he has built a world of scarcity.

Women have crazy high standards for appearance. A 5 woman can easily get laid. BUT it's harder for her to get a relationship and she knows that.

That's why the "game" is to make her think that you're willing get in a relationship with her.

Two things:
1) I thought "game" was built specifically to be directed at 8's and above, not 5's. 5's shouldn't need to be gamed.
2) I thought "alpha males" were supposed to be a challenge and very reluctant to commit, because they had so many options. I thought that was the image you were supposed to project, and that seems to be the opposite of "willing to get in a relationship with her".

 

[oldmanofthesea]

It's as you describe in OLD, but not in real life. In real life you see plenty of overweight unattractive guys with really attractive women. People go by looks alone in OLD. In real life, there are tons of factors women use to determine a man's attractiveness and looks are only one part of it. I'd say 50% or less are looks.

 

[zekko]

In real life, there are tons of factors women use to determine a man's attractiveness and looks are only one part of it. I'd say 50% or less are looks.

I've been watching some Jordan Peterson videos lately. He points out that women are the choosers, so they are like nature. They are the selectors of which genes get to survive (they're the guardians of their womb). Aside from looks, he says women are also looking for ability and ambition.

So women are pickier, but as you say, looks are only a part of what they are choosing for. So it's hard to compare how much they value looks compared to a man.

 

[oldmanofthesea]

So women are pickier, but as you say, looks are only a part of what they are choosing for. So it's hard to compare how much they value looks compared to a man.

Yes, and women are extremely varied in what they value. It's different from one to the next. Every woman has their own internal pie-chart describing what weighting they give to all a guy's characteristics:
1. Demonstrated social value (is he always out with a group of people? Does he act like the leader of them all? Are there attractive women in the group and do they flirt with him?)
2. Muscles/shape (stuff a guy CAN change)
3. Height, face, hair, and other physical things a guy can't change
4. Style
5. Charm/Humor
6. Sucess/Money/Ambition etc

Some women might give a low weighting on face, but she might go for a guy who looks like a supermodel because his looks are SO high.
In the same way, a woman giving a high rating on face might date an ugly stand-up comedian if he's REALLY funny to her and humor is another slice of the pie she values highly.

In my observations, if you are like a 4+ in the looks you can't change, but you are very high in all the other things mentioned above which you CAN change, you are going to be DROWNING in opportunities with women. Yes, it's true, a guy who is a 10 in looks is going to get away with having less in some of the other areas, but it's rare because being that good looking *usually* allows them to grow up with natural confidence, charm, social value etc.

It's WAY easier for guys to get protect their own feelings of inadequacy by blaming women for "only being attracted to X" where X is something they don't feel they have, rather than manning up and changing what they have control over (from the external to internal).

 

[claudolfgeorgini]

That's my impression. He has limited his options so much by rationalizing why nothing can work for him dating wise.
So the only way he is going to end up with a girlfriend is for him to literally "luck" into one. Unless he changes, he is just going to have to wait until he accidentally meets someone that appeals to him. But then he runs the risk of putting too much value on her because he has built a world of scarcity.


Two things:
1) I thought "game" was built specifically to be directed at 8's and above, not 5's. 5's shouldn't need to be gamed.
2) I thought "alpha males" were supposed to be a challenge and very reluctant to commit, because they had so many options. I thought that was the image you were supposed to project, and that seems to be the opposite of "willing to get in a relationship with her".

A low value guy will have just as hard of a time with a 5 as he would an 8 or above. ALL women think they're hot these days.
First thing to understand is that sexual attraction is the number one thing that most women want in men.
Nothing you say will make a girl sexually attracted to you. BUT you can make her lose sexual attraction for you by
1) being needy
Neediness makes it seem as if you can't get any other woman but her.
2) she knows you'll never commit.
When you hear stories of a woman sleeping with a guy once and never again, it's usually because he was terrible in bed or she knows he'll never commit to her.

The key is to seem open and willing to commit while never 100% committing. It's a balancing act.
It's possible to be married to a woman while not 100% committing. She just needs to think you can leave for another woman at any point.
Too much commitment and you're boring and easy. No commitment at all and she's too insecure.

The amount of value she perceives you to have determines the amount of investment she will require from you.
The higher your value, the less investment she requires. (because she knows that asking too much will lose you)
That's why some guys have to take a woman on 3 dates and others could sleep with the same woman on the first day.

And half of your value to women comes from your physical appearance (Mostly face then height and body).
The other half is whatever else she values in men (status, money, personality, street cred, penis size etc)

 

[oldmanofthesea]

A guy who is a 5 is screwed....

The dude on the left in your pic is probably not really a 5. He's much higher if he took control of his sh*t. Lose weight. Work out. Get on acne medication. Do something with all that hair. Learn to dress. Work on being charming/confident. Smile.

 

[The Duke]

I had a girl I was dancing with the other night tell me the 3 things she is attracted to were callouses on his hands, white teeth, and he shouldn't ever cross his legs.
Maybe I better start posting pics of my hands on my dating profile!

Everyone of them has different requirements and everyone of them will change their mind based on what their emotions tell them to do at any given point in time.

Their is no one size fits all manual to figuring this all out.