A sales background

[Glassguy]

I would be willing to bet that most of the men on this forum who are good with woman have some type of a sales background. Although I am not talking about the super hyper used car salesman prototype, a background in sales of some sorts that you were successful at will transition to how you deal with women in your life.

My sales back ground is one of being a National Sales Manager/Consultant for a very large company for 7 years straight out of college. I learned very important skills through that line of work that benefit me now both in personal and business areas of my life. Now that I own my own business (for the past 12 years) I have fine tuned my sales skills tremendously, because it is my own money on the line.

There are great points to be made of sales skills that transition over to how you deal with women in your life:


1.) A good sales person will be able to recognize buying signs. A man good with women will pick up on things that show her interest. A GREAT sales person will not only recognize those buying signs, but takes it a step further and shows the potential buyer how life will never be the same without the product. A man who is great with women does the same. Recognize her interest level, act on it by turning it into a fun event (date, hang out, etc) to further conclude why she needs to be around him.

2.) Rejection- Most people with sales backgrounds can handle rejection to a certain degree. The old saying "They arent saying no to you, only saying no to your product" comes to mind. The GREAT sales people know how to eliminate their rejection before they go out to approach. Depending on your product, there are things to look for in your potential buyers. If you are trying to sell high end jewelry to low class people, you are asking for rejection. You dont see and Lexus/Cadillac dealerships in the ghetto. Its just common sense. Once you learn the value of your product (the product being you), you can effectively sell it to the right group of people (women). If you are a 6 and send 100 messages to HB9's, you should expect 99 non responders and one will message you out of boredom. None will end up in dates or lays. But that is what happens many times. Guys send messages or try to get with chicks who are way above their pay grade and they get rejected and turn to orbiters because the woman only communicates with them out of boredom (orbiters). Any smart sales person will concentrate their focus on people who are in a social class that would be interested in their product. Same with selling yourself to women. Know YOUR worth and go after women only on your level or slightly higher if you want to minimize rejection. If rejection doesnt really bother you like it doesnt me, swing for the fence. Be realistic but also expect to hit a few home runs every now and then.

3.) Accepting rejection- Rejection sucks but it happens to literally everyone. When it does, it is far more beneficial to keep smiling and bounce to the next potential customer or in our case, potential plate. What you do not want to happen is to let the last "no" set you up for failure on the next person that you encounter. Being p!ssed off at the last woman that rejected you wont help you get the next one. Shake it off as the next person might be your best sale yet.

Dont be the person who is pleading with the non interested buyer on why they should buy the product after they have clearly said "no". Its petty and desperate and will make the rejection even worse once you finally stop chasing a dead end. Same with women. Yes is yes and everything else is a no and move on.

4.) The art of the sale- Think of it this way......you are looking at a new car. The sales person tells you this: "I really need to sell this car. I am willing to do whatever it is to sell you this car today because we are having problems getting it off the lot. I can have it ready to go in no time as we dont have any other options for buyers right now"....that reeks of desperation and you would immediately ask yourself "something is wrong with that car since its so easy to get and nobody else wants it".

But what if you were looking at the car and the sales person walked up and said "That is a fine ride, but I think it has already been sold. We've had numerous people in here today wanting to buy it. Let me check and see if its still available". The minute he comes back and says "Its still for sale as of now, unless we start calling the people on the waiting list to let them know its still for sale if you arent ready to buy right now".....you will buy it. You will buy it because other people want it (at least you think) so it must have VALUE. Same with dealing with women. If you are desperate, willing to do anything, way too available......where is your value? Why would she want you out of all of the other cars on the lot that are more desired? This is why you never allow yourself to become too available, too needy and desperate. I have always noticed that when I have 3-4 chicks I could have another 3-4 EASILY. They can sense the competition and want what others want along with what they cant have.

5.) Social skills- I know lots of people who were not so good talking to people until they got into sales and started putting themselves out there in front of customers. The more sets they did, the better they got. The learned the hidden tricks, techniques and not only what to say but how to say it. They learn how certain body language makes them more appealing. No different than dealing with women. The more times you ask for the number, date, hook up, sex....the more comfortable you will be and you can fine tune your actions based on your results. You find something that works so you build on it and you scrap what doesnt work and try something different.

Just food for thought. Its a long read but should make sense.

 

[The Duke]

Well stated.

The girls I have dated that were the most charming always had sales jobs! They were good at getting what they wanted from me and convincing me that I liked it.

They never failed to seduce me right out of my pants either. Hell some barely had to say anything. I could probably be seduced by a mute as long as she had nice t!ts and a flat stomach.

I'm betting there is a high percentage of guys on this forum with technical backgrounds.

 

[Bible_Belt]

I started with Kirby vacuum cleaners when I was 19. After that I sold outdoor signs, stocks, insurance and retirement plans, and finally mortgage loans.

 

[RichardTheFrog]

I started with Kirby vacuum cleaners when I was 19. After that I sold outdoor signs, stocks, insurance and retirement plans, and finally mortgage loans.

Isn't 90% of it just having a good product?

If your loan is at 4%, and the bank next door is 3.5%, nobodies going to buy from you. Unless the customer is just lazy.

 

[Red Legg]

I started with Kirby vacuum cleaners when I was 19. After that I sold outdoor signs, stocks, insurance and retirement plans, and finally mortgage loans.

I sold a now defunct vacuum called a "Fairfax" door to door price tag of this vacuum 2500 $ in 1995 !......I am convinced that ex- door to door vacuum cleaner salesmen are the best DJ's in the world for obvious reasons.I took salesman of the month for the entire region many times.

 

[guru1000]

!......I am convinced that ex- door to door vacuum cleaner salesmen .

When you can extract million dollar checks over the phone after 15-20 minutes of pitching a new client, then you become the greatest of salesmen. Stockbrokers are the best of the best.

 

[PokerStar]

been in sales my whole working career. mostly over the phone. it thickens your skin, especially recovering from rejections.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

Isn't 90% of it just having a good product?

If your loan is at 4%, and the bank next door is 3.5%, nobodies going to buy from you. Unless the customer is just lazy.

Salespeople have a word for people who think this way:

order takers

 

[RichardTheFrog]

Salespeople have a word for people who think this way:

order takers

Why is Bill Gates rich? What about the Saudi oil people? Good salesmen, or good product?

A salesman has never sold me a bad product.

Do you think the world is run by salespeople? Or is this post just as bad as all your others?

 

[Glassguy]

Why is Bill Gates rich? What about the Saudi oil people? Good salesmen, or good product?

A salesman has never sold me a bad product.

Do you think the world is run by salespeople? Or is this post just as bad as all your others?

The ask Richard the frog thread was the other day.

You're too late.

 

[RichardTheFrog]

The ask Richard the frog thread was the other day.

You're too late.

Oh Damn.

Hey tell us about the 3 weeks of lacrosse you played 20 years ago.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

A salesman has never sold me a bad product.

Why do salespeople need to sell you anything, if all you need is the product specs?

Why do salespeople exist, if the product should be able to sell itself?

Salespeople that wait for customers to come to them are called "order takers" by other salespeople.

Salespeople that aggressively sell products make more money than order takers.

Some salespeople aggressively sell good products.

Some salespeople aggressively sell inferior products.

Some people are easily convinced to buy inferior products by aggressive salespeople.

Some people only allow themselves to buy superior products by aggressive salespeople, because they are equally aggressive in their pursuit of the best products.

The subject of this post, if I understand it correctly, is the relationship of a good salesperson selling a good product to the effective techniques used by effective seducers of women.

How much they overlap, etc.

Perhaps if you refrain from telling everybody how wrong they are, you might learn a thing or two, which would help in your quest to be more successful with women.

But that, however, is just my opinion, offered freely.

Since you have also stated your intentions of flipping houses, you might consider that these overlapping techniques (of sales and seduction) may come in handy in your upcoming business venture.

Unless you were going to sit on the side of the road and wait for eager buyers to come across your properties (that you will be buying, refurbishing, and then selling in the future...)

 

[Bible_Belt]

If your loan is at 4%, and the bank next door is 3.5%, nobodies going to buy from you.

Sure, if you are the perfect customer - 720 credit, perfect credit history, similar payment history for housing expenses, money in the bank and other liquid assets.....but there's not a lot of customers like that, which is where a mortgage broker comes in. A good broker can clean up a credit report and make a loan app look a lot more presentable to an underwriter, as well as choose banks and loan programs that would be the most accommodating to that particular client. There are hundreds of lenders, and they all tend to vary slightly in their underwriting decisions.

I once did a refi for one of my old college professors. We moved him ahead three years in his payment schedule, and lowered his total monthly payments by paying off credit cards so much that he bought a new Honda Accord with the difference. So he skipped three years of payments, had a new car in his garage, and still ended up with slightly more money each month. That's why mortgage brokers exist, but you still have to sell people on the idea before they will trust you.

 

[RichardTheFrog]

Why do salespeople need to sell you anything, if all you need is the product specs?

Why do salespeople exist, if the product should be able to sell itself?

Salespeople that wait for customers to come to them are called "order takers" by other salespeople.

Salespeople that aggressively sell products make more money than order takers.

Some salespeople aggressively sell good products.

Some salespeople aggressively sell inferior products.

Some people are easily convinced to buy inferior products by aggressive salespeople.

Some people only allow themselves to buy superior products by aggressive salespeople, because they are equally aggressive in their pursuit of the best products.

The subject of this post, if I understand it correctly, is the relationship of a good salesperson selling a good product to the effective techniques used by effective seducers of women.

How much they overlap, etc.

Perhaps if you refrain from telling everybody how wrong they are, you might learn a thing or two, which would help in your quest to be more successful with women.

But that, however, is just my opinion, offered freely.

Since you have also stated your intentions of flipping houses, you might consider that these overlapping techniques (of sales and seduction) may come in handy in your upcoming business venture.

Unless you were going to sit on the side of the road and wait for eager buyers to come across your properties (that you will be buying, refurbishing, and then selling in the future...)

Yes, I understand analogies.

Obviously, I wasn't going to stand on the side of the road.

But most important is the product, and actually the market. The exact same house will sell for $150,000 in one location and $600,000 in a different city.

 

[guru1000]

Yes, I understand analogies.

Obviously, I wasn't going to stand on the side of the road.

But most important is the product, and actually the market. The exact same house will sell for $150,000 in one location and $600,000 in a different city.

Richard, unfortunately, there's no MLS for dates. You actually have to market yourself effectively--along--with a good product to consistently get the women you seek.

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

But most important is the product, and actually the market.

Yet one car salesman on the same lot in the same market will make six figures, while another will make considerably less.

And if you check any real estate agency, you'll find the same Pareto distribution.

Good salesman sell good products in good markets and make tons of money.

Bad salesman try and sell good products in good markets and struggle.

(I wonder if that same Pareto distribution exists in house flippers....)

 

[RichardTheFrog]

Yet one car salesman on the same lot in the same market will make six figures, while another will make considerably less.

And if you check any real estate agency, you'll find the same Pareto distribution.

Good salesman sell good products in good markets and make tons of money.

Bad salesman try and sell good products in good markets and struggle.

(I wonder if that same Pareto distribution exists in house flippers....)

If there's anything getting in the way of my house flipping, it's my energy levels. I've decided to do the work myself and I can't get myself to work more than 20 hours per week. Haha. But when I work, I get a lot done.

Plus, I sleep too much. Like up to 12 hours per day. And my schedule is messed up so I'm often awake at night, so I can't be in a residential neighborhood with power tools.

I don't think I would be able to find a contractor that wouldn't charge me too much, but I will have no choice if I ever want to expand to multiple houses at once.

 

[RichardTheFrog]

Richard, unfortunately, there's no MLS for dates. You actually have to market yourself effectively--along--with a good product to consistently get the women you seek.

True.

"Free" online dating isn't working for me. I'm left hoping that fat girls don't flake on me.

I'm having lots of success on pay sites. Seeking Arrangement and Miss Travel.

What are my other options? Hang out at Hooters?

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

What are my other options? Hang out at Hooters?

What would you do if you were selling a product that nobody was buying?

Look for easier markets?

Improve the product?

Improve the sales technique?

 

[Trump]

Great points OP.

My only concern is, if the salesman is "too good", I start to get suspicious. Couple of examples:

1) Coworker: Very good salesman. Top 10 nationally in our company. Makes very good and logical points in selling and is generally a happy guy. I've taken pointers from him, but I wouldn't trust him in a deal. Coincidentally, I've heard he has gone behind people's backs to make deals. Very good upfront, sneaky on the side.

2) Date: Just made a thread about this. Had a date with a good looking girl, she was very flirty and hands on. Used to be a good saleswoman in a dept store and still does sales but by herself. She came on very strong, I follow up and nothing. So essentially she wanted power rather than making a connection.

Being a good salesman kind of depends on who your audience is.