Why women flake and why you should too

[Macaframalama]

You finger-point from a perspective of virtue. However, you are not virtuous unless you were in the same position and chose differently.

Don't be so quick to judge, unless you are in the shoes of the judged.

There is a difference between purposefully flaking (to be an assh0le) and flaking out of abundance. Same act, different motive. As to flaking out of abundance as it relates to women, I understand it and accept it.

Believe me, when I say that I hold myself to a higher standard and expect more of myself, than I would anyone else. I think you should reread the op and the context that it is being used and think about what's being said. There are young guys in here that are impressionable and do not know any better. I'm not trying to attack anyone personally, but you have to look at what's being advocated here.

 

[guru1000]

Believe me, when I say that I hold myself to a higher standard and expect more of myself, than I would anyone else. I think you should reread the op and the context that it is being used and think about what's being said. There are young guys in here that are impressionable and do not know any better. I'm not trying to attack anyone personally, but you have to look at what's being advocated here.

There is a bifurcation between how I treat people and how I treat hot OLD women in the dating phase.

I treat clients, investors, business associates, partners, friends, acquaintances and family direct, straight, with respect, with ethics, and serve their interests fully.

When dealing with hot OLD women in the dating phase, I don't deal with them the same, and neither do they deal with men "fairly." These rules of engagement between them and I are implicitly understood. Should a particular (OLD) girl graduate outside the dating phase and want exclusivity, and should I accede, then I will treat her fairly.

I am well aware that what I advocate will be impressionable upon young minds.

 

[Macaframalama]

There is a bifurcation between how I treat people and how I treat hot OLD women in the dating phase.

I treat clients, investors, business associates, partners, friends, acquaintances and family direct, straight, with respect, with ethics, and serve their interests fully.

When dealing with hot OLD women in the dating phase, I don't deal with them the same, and neither do they deal with men "fairly." These rules of engagement between them and I are implicitly understood. Should a particular (OLD) girl graduate outside the dating phase and want exclusivity, and should I accede, then I will treat her fairly.

I am well aware that what I advocate will be impressionable upon young minds.

I respect your perspective on a lot of things that you say on the forum and hell, even Urban's even though I disagree with allot he has to say. I hope neither of you have taken anything I say as a personal attack, as I know I can come off as brash at times, but I have to disagree with you. I think you are failing to put the horse before the carriage here. I myself walk with a certain precaution, when screening women, both online and off, but I try my best not to let the actions of others have any type of influence of who I am as a man and my principles. At the end of the day, I don't guess time is promised to any of us to begin with, but I strive to remain steadfast, barring unforeseen events that are out of my control. I just feel that using unreliability as a canned strategy is a bit dirty. No piece of @ss is worth compromising a man's balls over imo.

 

[Urbanyst]

Mac very well put. Shouldnt be something planned. If your naturally busy it will show on its own.

Where did I say to be FAKE busy?

Unreliability is a character flaw(for both genders) and has nothing to do with your business or non business. I am probably as busy or more busy than 99% of the posters here and it makes me physically ill to think about even saying you are going to do something and then not following through.

Just not happening ever. And just let me state that while you may think it's cool, it is definitely not.

If an emergency or something comes up that is one thing but just being a poor planner isn't an excuse.

That's all well and good. But women don't give a sh*t about your stance and they are going to do whatever they want.

I would rather play to my own advantage than play to the woman's advantage due to some horse sh*t code of conduct.

 

[Urbanyst]

Flaking is the natural effect of abundance. If some of you guys never flaked, you were never in abundance. Hence, why hot OLD women flake. It’s not so much an integrity flaw as it is the excess of options, and exercising those options who are best suited for you.

Men, don’t point at your scarcity and call it a virtue. You’re not virtuous, unless you have dozens of weekly options and have never flaked. And here I will call any of you out if you claimed this.

Don’t hate the “game.” Don’t hate women either. Just understand the “game” and get better.

Wow.

We agree on something lol.

 

[Urbanyst]

Bro I don't know about that. It seems like you are confusing the issues. Even if are jam packed, presented with new opportunities, and women have been trained to not prioritize men in their lives, what does all that have to do with flaking?

If you make a date, stick with it. Back up your word. Don't be flaking because you are upset at the laws of the country and that its not the 1950s anymore.

DUDE.. you just said women don't make men a property right?

But in the next breath you are telling me I should make WOMEN a priority lol.

Are you confused?

 

[marmel75]

Where did I say to be FAKE busy?


That's all well and good. But women don't give a sh*t about your stance and they are going to do whatever they want.

I would rather play to my own advantage than play to the woman's advantage due to some horse sh*t code of conduct.

They can do whatever they want. If someone jumped off a cliff your response is to do the same thing as then? Nah...I'm better than that.

 

[Urbanyst]

They can do whatever they want. If someone jumped off a cliff your response is to do the same thing as then? Nah...I'm better than that.

That's a dumb as rocks example.

You're arguing against playing the "game" to your own advantage? Pretty stupid lol.

I'm saying to stay busy and fill up your schedule. Have some abundance. If you have to flake on some women.. too bad.

 

[marmel75]

That's a dumb as rocks example.

You're arguing against playing the "game" to your own advantage? Pretty stupid lol.

I'm saying to stay busy and fill up your schedule. Have some abundance. If you have to flake on some women.. too bad.

How is being a flawed human being playing to an advantage? There is no need to do this as a man. If you need to do this you have major holes you are covering up for elsewhere which probably explains why you are doing this in the first place.

Ive had ZERO issues with getting as many or more dates as I could handle without compromising my integrity.

 

[Urbanyst]

How is being a flawed human being playing to an advantage? There is no need to do this as a man. If you need to do this you have major holes you are covering up for elsewhere which probably explains why you are doing this in the first place.

Ive had ZERO issues with getting as many or more dates as I could handle without compromising my integrity.

Flawed is a very subjective term. Ultimately women decide, not you.

And doing what? Having a full schedule? That's a bad thing now? LOL.

 

[Urbanyst]

When your doing this while saying this in your head. Its still a needy mindset.
Ever wonder why a natural cannot tell you how he does it?
He will say about women. Its easy "Just talk to them"
Its because hes "being it" instead of this thinking garbage.

Well none of us are "naturals" otherwise we wouldn't be on this site.

So get over it lol.

 

[guru1000]

I respect your perspective on a lot of things that you say on the forum and hell, even Urban's even though I disagree with allot he has to say. I hope neither of you have taken anything I say as a personal attack, as I know I can come off as brash at times, but I have to disagree with you. I think you are failing to put the horse before the carriage here. I myself walk with a certain precaution, when screening women, both online and off, but I try my best not to let the actions of others have any type of influence of who I am as a man and my principles. At the end of the day, I don't guess time is promised to any of us to begin with, but I strive to remain steadfast, barring unforeseen events that are out of my control. I just feel that using unreliability as a canned strategy is a bit dirty. No piece of @ss is worth compromising a man's balls over imo.

Mac, seems like you have a rigid perspective. I used too as well. Over the years, I have become greatly fluid in my thought process and approach, unencumbered by social and biblical construct entirely. Rigidity can serve you or crush you.

Do you believe in killing animals? Some may not, but, regardless, hunting is perfectably acceptable “game” to some. Where are the lines of propriety drawn: through your volition entirely—or-- through your indoctrination via social constructs?

You state, “cut your balls off" but to whom are your balls being cut? Which specific social or biblical construct did you surrender to that makes you “feel” that you are cutting off your balls?

“Sell yourself out.” To whom? To which specific construct?

Sometimes when you undergo a macro-analysis to your thinking and belief system, you can differentiate logic from indoctrination.

I serve my business clients, partners, investors, associates well because when I serve them well, they serve me well. Not because of social and biblical constructs of propriety.

I serve my friends and family well because when I serve them well, they serve me well. Not because of social and biblical constructs of propriety.

I serve hot OLD women in the same way they serve men. We’re in the same dance. Ironically, I, too, serve them well.

The universe has a way of making you reap what you sow. And within this landscape, I accept its lessons and operate fluidly, subject to change when prompted.

So your rigid landscape is unequivocal, correct? So would it be fair to assume that if ALL people are to be treated the same, then you would treat the raper of your daughter well too? This hyperbole is served with reason. Limitations are carved in every set of beliefs, regardless of their rigidity. No belief applies universally, to all, under every circumstance. Opposing this is what we call around here, binary thinking, that is, blinded to the myriad shades of grey. The discretion of how to treat WHOM deals with both the treator and the treatee, which ultimately deals with the landscape in which both are operating. If you are oblivious of the landscape and your go-to conduct is the specific social construct with which you have been indoctrinated, without considering the participants' motives and the context in which both participants are operating from, this demonstrates not virtuosity, but a lack of sagacity and comprehensiveness.

 

[zekko]

Flaking is the natural effect of abundance. If some of you guys never flaked, you were never in abundance. Hence, why hot OLD women flake.

You intentionally schedule multiple dates at the same time with the intent to flake on one (or more of them). That's not the natural effect of abundance, you're just doing it because you want to, or it makes sense to you. Now, I can't speak to OLD, because I don't have any interest in it. In fact, I might say if one had true abundance, they wouldn't need OLD, but whatever.

I have no interest in planning to do something if I don't actually intend on doing it, I've got better things to do.

I think the main reason women flake is emotional. When the time comes for the first date or whatever, they don't really feel like doing it, so they blow it off. They may be feeling apprehensive about it, and the emotions that led them to accept the date in the first place have evaporated.

 

[guru1000]

You intentionally schedule multiple dates at the same time with the intent to flake on one (or more of them). That's not the natural effect of abundance, you're just doing it because you want to, or it makes sense to you. Now, I can't speak to OLD, because I don't have any interest in it. In fact, I might say if one had true abundance, they wouldn't need OLD, but whatever.

It's a zero-sum "game." OLD women flake, and I could entertain the remaining dates. If none flake, I rain-check those I cannot meet. There is no set outcome, as the outcome varies. I adapt to that change accordingly.

I have no interest in planning to do something if I don't actually intend on doing it, I've got better things to do.

Neither do I.

I think the main reason women flake is emotional. When the time comes for the first date or whatever, they don't really feel like doing it, so they blow it off. They may be feeling apprehensive about it, and the emotions that led them to accept the date in the first place have evaporated.

Two reasons: (1) Not enough rapport for her to feel comfortable; (2) Other options. Usually No. 2.

 

[Macaframalama]

Mac, seems like you have a rigid perspective.

I wouldn't deny that on some things I do. I try my best perceive the whole spectrum though for the most part.

Do you believe in killing animals? Some may not, but, regardless, hunting is perfectably acceptable “game” to some. Where are the lines of propriety drawn: through your volition entirely—or-- through your indoctrination via social constructs?

I do. I hunted and fished as a child and grew up on a small farm, until my parents divorced, when I was 15. We slaughtered and butchered the majority of our livestock, other than our cattle. It can be shocking and even horrific to stomach as a young child in the beginning. I don't care for butchering game, even today, but it was very necessary then and even today. Everything, that was killed, was consumed at the dinner table, other than the sick or the lame. So long as the killing is done for purpose and is respected and killed as humanely as possible, it's not for anyone to draw lines, other than to ensure an animal isn't hunted out.

You state, “cut your balls off" but to whom are your balls being cut? Which specific social or biblical construct did you surrender to that makes you “feel” that you are cutting off your balls?

“Sell yourself out.” To whom? To which specific construct?

Me, myself, my "tribe". I take allot of pride in knowing that I can be trusted and depended on. Am I infallible? No, but I try my best, as I think we all should. I would like to think that the younger generation of my family can look to me in the same way I see my father.

I serve my business clients, partners, investors, associates well because when I serve them well, they serve me well. Not because of social and biblical constructs of propriety.

I serve my friends and family well because when I serve them well, they serve me well. Not because of social and biblical constructs of propriety.

As do I.

The universe has a way of making you reap what you sow. And within this landscape, I accept its lessons and operate fluidly, subject to change when prompted.

I agree with this.

So your rigid landscape is unequivocal, correct?

No.

No belief applies universally, to all, under every circumstance.

But, it's impossible to realize circumstances, until they have been presented. Events and actions create circumstances. They are either past or creating in the present. What op is advocating is preconceived.

If you are oblivious of the landscape and your go-to conduct is the specific social construct with which you have been indoctrinated, without considering the participants' motives and the context in which both participants are operating from, this demonstrates not virtuosity, but a lack of sagacity and comprehensiveness.

But until you know, you do not know. What is being suggested, is that the man/leader lead the interaction into instability to begin with. When, things actually do take a rough turn, how are you to be depended on, when you have already proven yourself to be unreliable?.?.

 

[guru1000]

What is being suggested, is that the man/leader lead the interaction into instability to begin with. When, things actually do take a rough turn, how are you to be depended on, when you have already proven yourself to be unreliable?.?.

Reliability <> Attraction, and hence the website of formerly "broken" reliable men.

Good men are taught to be reliable, and to stand steadfast before a code of ethics to all. And for the most part, for most of your dealings, and in most instances, these ethics will serve you and the people of the world whom you serve.

But what happens in specific interactions, where this "reliability" neither serves you nor the party in question. Who does this specific type of reliability serve other than the indoctrination to which you have subscribed?

LTRs needs stability and reliability.

Attraction needs space and uncertainty.

Try calling a girl after a great first date, and telling her that you will never leave her, she is your "soul mate," and that you want to see her tomorrow.

Try calling a girl after a great first date, and let her know you'll get back to her soon.

Which of the two serves attraction best (for both you and her)?

Reliability has its place. More important is to understand the context where reliability will serve you (and her).

 

[Macaframalama]

Reliability <> Attraction, and hence the website of formerly "broken" reliable men.

Good men are taught to be reliable, and to stand steadfast before a code of ethics to all. And for the most part, for most of your dealings, and in most instances, these ethics will serve you and the people of the world whom you serve.

But what happens in specific interactions, where this "reliability" neither serves you nor the party in question. Who does this specific type of reliability serve other than the indoctrination to which you have subscribed?

LTRs needs stability and reliability.

Attraction needs space and uncertainty.

Try calling a girl after a great first date, and telling her that you will never leave her, she is your "soul mate," and that you want to see her tomorrow.

Try calling a girl after a great first date, and let her know you'll get back to her soon.

Which of the two serves attraction best (for both you and her)?

Reliability has its place. More important is to understand the context where reliability will serve you (and her).

This is a bit on the extreme side of the spectrum. I've never had a problem creating or keeping attraction, while remaining true to my principles simultaneously. In the early stages of dating, they are the eager ones. Not trying to be ****y, but the actual dating process and making a woman feel comfortable is my strong suit. The rigidity does play a part in keeping them longer than a few a years though and something I am consciously working on. Simply telling them NO, seems to get the panties wet plenty, rather than having to conform. Being reliable doesn't mean always saying yes, when she WANTS you to.

 

[Urbanyst]

Speak for yourself. Im sure others with good frame dont believe this.

Don't care what people "believe".

Only care about FACTS.

 

[guru1000]

This is a bit on the extreme side of the spectrum. I've never had a problem creating or keeping attraction, while remaining true to my principles simultaneously. In the early stages of dating, they are the eager ones. Not trying to be ****y, but the actual dating process and making a woman feel comfortable is my strong suit. The rigidity does play a part in keeping them longer than a few a years though and something I am consciously working on. Simply telling them NO, seems to get the panties wet plenty, rather than having to conform. Being reliable doesn't mean always saying yes, when she WANTS you to.

Most feel they are staying true to their principles. So do mob members when they whack someone. La Cosa Nostra, right? The code of "ethics." Does it make it "right"? Just different principles and different members.

The exchange is not so much about principle (as they vary in accordance with the construct you subscribe) as much as it is about being aware of the principle you serve and how that principle actually serves you (as this is a website for men).

When principles no longer serve men; then it's time to reevaluate those principles. In the context of hot women on OLD, setting up one date with one women serves an inefficient use of your time, when and if she flakes.

I'm more interested in those principles that serve men and level the playing the field among a certain type of women.

Of course, you can freely choose to date offline only. But for those men who use OLD, there are more effective "methods of engagement" than subscribing to antiquated constructs which don't serve men best.

 

[Macaframalama]

Most feel they are staying true to their principles. So do mob members when they whack someone. La Cosa Nostra, right? The code of "ethics." Does it make it "right"? Just different principles and different members.

I think they knew/know better. You could argue that the U.S. fedgov is the new mafia. Look how it's serving us right now, with the lack of ethics.

When principles no longer serve men; then it's time to reevaluate those principles. In the context of hot women on OLD, setting up one date with one women serves an inefficient use of your time, when and if she flakes.

But they still do. There will always be those out there that subscribe to said principles. They may be far and in-between, but that's what makes those relationships with people of both genders all the more. And if a woman happens to flake, so what. Every man should have a rotation if he's not in a committed relationship and friends/hobbies if he is. Get on the cell. We are the party.

I'm more interested in those principles that serve men and level the playing the field among a certain type of women.

Again, this is my world. They are the ones that have to level up to have anything meaningful with me. I know a woman ultimately wears the choosing shoes, but she's got to have that chance in the first place. If i do hit a dry spell, oh well. It won't be for long and I would rather be training or hanging with the boys alot of times anyways.

Of course, you can freely choose to date offline only. But for those men who use OLD, there are more effective "methods of engagement" than subscribing to antiquated constructs which don't serve men best.

Old is one of my tools too. If it is a man's only mode of meeting women, he should have a rotation just the same. The majority of women flaking is a lack of comfort built. A man should be able to sell himself, whether online or off. If she flakes, because she thinks she's found a better option, good for her. It cost me very little investment to find out exactly who she is.