Are boundaries best communicated covertly or overtly?

[bigneil]

sazc is done providing zero working examples of what she is saying, only working examples about why she is whining.

I didn't think a woman in her 40's would like my rich 21 year old ex stripper, but at least I have a working example of a woman in love. Guess what? I've never communicated any boundaries. I simply push hers and she tells me where they are.

What kind of boundaries should a man communicate exactly?

THIS is how you will treat me?? No, I find a girl who naturally treats me right.

 

[wifehunter]

Npds / bpds have no boundaries, you are merely and extention of them. Aka a tool.

Boundaries are critical to maintaining sanity.

 

[Billtx49]

Npds / bpds have no boundaries, you are merely and extention of them. Aka a tool.

Boundaries are critical to maintaining sanity.

Amen man. They only consider you a usable accessory. It all has to be loud and clear to her and she respects the boundaries, or you abandon ship.

You can't be covert with that type of woman, or you Will get run over by a truck eventually if you stay.

 

[ubercat]

To go a little deeper scarcity also comes from attachment. @bigneil you define your own scarcity. You ve decided this girl is the love of your life ie a unicorn. How abundant are unicorns?

 

[bigneil]

Npds / bpds have no boundaries, you are merely and extention of them. Aka a tool.

Boundaries are critical to maintaining sanity.

• You don't think a man is a tool to a non-NPD/BPD woman??
• Every time I find myself wanting to say "you can't do this or that" I stop and realize I'm better off simply walking away until she reaches out.
• A man implies boundaries by virtue of her knowing he will walk in a second.
• Calling her on her bullsh!t is ok (once in a while, otherwise you should have walked by now).
• Saying "f*ck off then" is ok.
• Cancelling dates is fine.
• But telling her "You can't do this or that" is never a good idea (see Art of Seduction). We should reward good behavior, not punish bad behavior.
• You feed the cat when it comes to the door, you don't throw things at it when it's too far away. That will scare it off.
• Boundaries are like feelings. Men shouldn't talk about them, that's female territory.

I'm asking for one example of a man setting a boundary, and that improving things.

 

[bigneil]

To go a little deeper scarcity also comes from attachment. @bigneil you define your own scarcity. You ve decided this girl is the love of your life ie a unicorn. How abundant are unicorns?

• She ceases to be a unicorn if she does something I wanted to restrict.
  
• The problem self-corrects. If she strays, she was no good, so you didn't lose anything.
  
• Why build a fence to restrict a cat who comes to see you voluntarily?
• Just put out the best cat food in town.

Boundaries are ultimatums and we have agreed they never work.

 

[wifehunter]

• She ceases to be a unicorn if she does something I wanted to restrict.
  
• The problem self-corrects. If she strays, she was no good, so you didn't lose anything.
  
• Why build a fence to restrict a cat who comes to see you voluntarily?
• Just put out the best cat food in town.

Boundaries are ultimatums and we have agreed they never work.

They work...Boundaries are where I stop and you begin...it's respect for the other person. aka Love (which rarely gets a mention on this forum, doesn't suprise me.)

 

[bigneil]

They work...Boundaries are where I stop and you begin...it's respect for the other person. aka Love (which rarely gets a mention on this forum, doesn't suprise me.)

Why are you refusing to provide an actual example that worked??

 

[sazc]

Lol, "we" have agreed to nothing. There's a lot of foot stomping going on

Off course it certainly takes two to tango.. and I am sure on some occasions i may have said or done something that may have pizzed her off.. in what relationship does that not happen..

We are all prone to make the odd mistake..

Pretty much all relationships have the odd disagreement or even the odd fight.. I believe its all about how you over come these issues, with good communication skills..

I have also been guilty of not communicating correctly on occasion with her... but I recognised this, and made a real effort to work on myself.

But one thing I can clearly say.. I never disrespected her in public, in front of people.. and generally did my very best not to disrespect her at all..

I personally believe my biggest mistake was, not dealing with incidents of disrespect from her correctly..

Instead of pointing it out to her.. or calling her out.. I should have walked and let my actions do all the talking..

I let her off too easily.. not walking away sooner was my biggest mistake..

My realisation is.. that she believed she was better than me.. and she didn't need to treat with with value.. she had plenty of options, so why bother making an effort.

I dont think she thought she was better than you.... most of the time when this crap occurs it is because you are getting too emotionally close to the person, and that is scary for them, so they have to create a toxic situation in order to push you away. That situation is also a test - are you loyal? will you leave? because if you do leave then they get to go into their favorite victim mode and boo hoo about how mean you were anyways.

IMO the only way to deal with these types of people is to say, first time, "I'm sorry, you and I dont see eye to eye on how to resolve conflict and communicate, we are not compatible on this idea so I am going to allow you to find someone better suited to who you are" Better suited to who you are basically says "you have values I cant live up to so I am going to let you go". It's a BS line that allows you to GTFO without too much hassle.

I've given too many a$$holes the benefit of the doubt. I've given them time, patence and calm communication. None of them has ever changed. They are who they are. You cant change them. You will end up miserable. Stop wasting everyones time. GTFO the first time.

 

[wifehunter]

Why are you refusing to provide an actual example that worked??

Hmmm....even if I do provide an example...why do I think, you'll still not buy it??? Seems like a waste of time.

 

[sazc]

@wifehunter total waste of time, cognitively it will just never be understood in it's entirely

 

[Billtx49]

most of the time when this crap occurs it is because you are getting too emotionally close to the person, and that is scary for them, so they have to create a toxic situation in order to push you away.

Good description of a cluster B in operation.

 

[bigneil]

@wifehunter total waste of time, cognitively it will just never be understood in it's entirely

As you cognitively fail to understand I asked you to provide working examples.

Sure... don't listen to that man who is sazc's age dating a girl half sazc's age, says sazc.

Hmmm....even if I do provide an example...why do I think, you'll still not buy it??? Seems like a waste of time.

So you're not going to? That is f*cking really lame.

You guys are ridiculous. You have no evidence boundaries can be set (BY A MAN).

Now do your homework.

 

[wifehunter]

@wifehunter total waste of time, cognitively it will just never be understood in it's entirely

Thankyou!

 

[wifehunter]

As you provide zero working examples.

Sure... don't listen to that man who is sazc's age dating a girl half sazc's age, says sazc.

You guys are ridiculous.

Broken record spins...

Walking away, is setting a boundary that works, time and time again. There's your working example.

 

[sazc]

As you cognitively fail to understand I asked you to provide working examples.

Sure... don't listen to that man who is sazc's age dating a girl half sazc's age, says sazc.


So you're not going to? That is f*cking really lame.

You guys are ridiculous. You have no evidence boundaries can be set (BY A MAN).

Now do your homework.

Im still waiting to talk to a man about the topic.....

p.s.you dating a recent high school graduate has zero bearing on this conversation
(she did graduate high school, yes?)

Im with @wifehunter, boundary, im out

 

[bigneil]

saz

Broken record spins...

Walking away, is setting a boundary that works, time and time again. There's your working example.

Walking away is not setting a boundary, nor is that a working example.

Walking away for a specific reason (and telling her that's why) would be setting a boundary and an example.

I already said you could walk away. WHY DID YOU WALK AWAY is the boundary.

I asked you for a WORKING EXAMPLE. NOT CONJECTURE.

Broken record? Yes, I keep asking you over and over for something called EVIDENCE.

Yes, my having a gorgeous 21 year old girl (why is sazc talking about f*cking high school) is EVIDENCE that I know what I'm talking about. I'm using a working example and saying "In the 9 months I got the hottest girl I know to love me, I never once told her she couldn't do something - explicitly".

Examples of working examples

sazc's boyfriend said "If you don't leave the lid up from now on, you have to do the dishes" and she said "ok, I promise!"
Or
wifehunter told his girl "If you don't promise to be faithful, I will walk away" and she said "ok, I promise to be faithful".

So I ask again for a working example of a woman obeying a boundary that the man had to explicitly state.

 

[wifehunter]

saz

Walking away is not setting a boundary, nor is that a working example.

Walking away for a specific reason (and telling her that's why) would be setting a boundary and an example.

I already said you could walk away. WHY DID YOU WALK AWAY is the boundary.

I asked you for a WORKING EXAMPLE. NOT CONJECTURE.

Broken record? Yes, I keep asking you over and over for something called EVIDENCE.

Yes, my having a gorgeous 21 year old girl (why is sazc talking about f*cking high school) is EVIDENCE that I know what I'm talking about. I'm using a working example and saying "In the 9 months I got the hottest girl I know to love me, I never once told her she couldn't do something - explicitly".

Examples of working examples

sazc's boyfriend said "If you don't leave the lid up from now on, you have to do the dishes" and she said "ok, I promise!"
Or
wifehunter told his girl "If you don't promise to be faithful, I will walk away" and she said "ok, I promise to be faithful".

So I ask again for a working example of a woman obeying a boundary that the man had to explicitly state.

 

[Atom Smasher]

I haven't read this entire thread because I see it is yet another one that has descended into petty bickering, but I will say this: Women intrinsically and instinctively want a man who sets boundaries, and a good woman will actually work to try to discern them. It's part of the fun of trying to "figure him out".

That's why a man generally doesn't need to talk about them in ultimatum fashion. She is already tuned to sniff them out. What a man needs to do is to subtly imply that he doesn't stand for this or that. He can do that situationally as life unfolds. Women understand covert language very well.

She should know that the price to be paid for transgressing his boundaries is removal of attention or walking away completely.

 

[wifehunter]

I haven't read this entire thread because I see it is yet another one that has descended into petty bickering, but I will say this: Women intrinsically and instinctively want a man who sets boundaries, and a good woman will actually work to try to discern them. It's part of the fun of trying to "figure him out".

That's why a man generally doesn't need to talk about them in ultimatum fashion. She is already tuned to sniff them out. What a man needs to do is to subtly imply that he doesn't stand for this or that. He can do that situationally as life unfolds. Women understand covert language very well.

She should know that the price to be paid for transgressing his boundaries is removal of attention or walking away completely.