Need advice on a tough to read girl.

[Derek Flint]

Usually I don't ask for advice but there's this one girl that I'd like to date.

Here's the basics:
I'm 57 but look about 45

(Photo attachment below)


This girl is early to mid 30's, smoking hot and her personality is as good as her looks.

She's not the kind of girl that goes to clubs or other BS and has a good head on her shoulders and has her **** together.

Kind, sincere, unpretentious, genuine...the total package.
GF material.

I run into her here and there and we have short but good conversations.

She tells me what's going on in her life.
Things like about making a career change, taking classes to fulfill that goal and even her current living situation for example and has indirectly complimented me a few times.
Example; "You're getting very tan. It looks really nice."

She will be very open about herself and has revealed a lot but never mentioned a BF, but I don't know if she's interested or if it's just how she is with other people/guys.

Other times, she can be inattentive towards me.
Typical woman, right.

I'm going to ask for her number since our conversations are mutually enjoyable but my concern is that she's just a friendly, outgoing girl and might not be interested.

If she says something like "Oh, I like you but..."

Should I try to flip the script and respond with something like "Hey, that's not where I was going with this.
I don't know you well enough to have even considered that"
And/or: "Besides, you're way too young for me" (In a more diplomatic way and to make her prove to me she isn't.) or is there a better response to peak interest?

I'm at a bit of a loss here because at times it seems like she's interested but at other times not.

And yes, I do have a bit of "one-itis" for her because she's a definite keeper and I like her a lot as I really enjoy talking with her but would like to escalate but it's difficult when I only run into her randomly once or twice a week and we're both on our way to other places.

This one has got me stumped.

Should I try to build more repoire/rapport and risk losing her to some other guy who knows her better/has more "access" to her, or just ask her out?

Note that it took some time just to get her to engage in conversations with me so I sense she might have trust issues or just needed some time to figure out that I wasn't just another guy trying to hit on her as she, like all hot women get that all day every day.

I know the first thoughts will be to just ask her out and I'm pretty sure she will.
OTOH, I sense she needs more time to build comfort/connection but as mentioned, I have limited ability to do so as our paths do not cross very often.

I don't want to f*** this up as she's a keeper and I have to play it right.

I realize she's likely decided already if she would or wouldn't, but I don't want to be like every other guy that hits on her.

If she is interested but undecided, how can I "flip" her or move things forward if she says "I like you, but..."?

Apologies for not giving a better description of the situation, but I'm posting this from my cell phone and not a keyboard.

Right now, I'm in a good place mentally and physically and it won't be the end of the world if she says "no" but OTOH, she is a definite keeper.

I know I'm overanalyzing/overthinking this, but I don't want to f*** it up and if she capitulated, I want to try to salvage things in case I'm moving too fast for her.

I've probably had 6 brief but revealing conversations with her so this situation is hard too read.

 

[Square Hammer]

I'm 48, and and 3 months into a relationship with a girl who is 35. She is attractive and gets a LOT of male attention. We went from where you are, to me doing anything I want to her in one simple move...I just made a move.

Be bold my friend, you've nothing to lose. There are a lot of "The one" out there. Be the captain of the relationship. If you want her number, ask for it. If you want a date set it up.

To be fair...I do struggle with the "oneitis", but I've never had a problem getting the girl. Just do it! Be the man, and good luck!!

 

[Krueg]

You wont know til you ask. Just ask for the number, dont mention anything about a "date" until you call her.

 

[Derek Flint]

I'm 48, and and 3 months into a relationship with a girl who is 35. She is attractive and gets a LOT of male attention. We went from where you are, to me doing anything I want to her in one simple move...I just made a move.

Be bold my friend, you've nothing to lose. There are a lot of "The one" out there. Be the captain of the relationship. If you want her number, ask for it. If you want a date set it up.

To be fair...I do struggle with the "oneitis", but I've never had a problem getting the girl. Just do it! Be the man, and good luck!!

Yeah, I get that part.
Life is pretty damn good right now and women notice by how you carry yourself and find it attractive along with the confidence that goes with it and I control the frame so to speak.
I don't brag or seek validation from her (or anyone) and am different in a good way from probably 95% of guys that chat her up or hit on her.
Basic, DJ 101 stuff.
The type of person i am and not "fake it until you make it." BS

But I sense this girl might have trust issues even though she tells me a lot about herself.
It took a bit of time before she would give me little more than the time of day, probably because she gets hit on a lot so that's where the concern is if she is open to escalation at this point or if more "comfort building" is required.

If I had the time to build more rapport with her this wouldn't be an issue but a girl I have limited access to as our paths cross occasionally but randomly is, plus it took some time before she would engage in conversation.

For all I know, she might be thinking "what's he waiting for"? or OTOH, I may need to build more rapport/comfort.

Just a difficult set of circumstances and she can also be hard to read at times.

Not sure if she is being friendly/social or interested.

At times I think it will be no problem yet other times I think she's not that interested.

 

[Square Hammer]

So Derek, you need to make the most of these times. A Master DJ named Pook once said that we should just assume she feels the the same way about us that we feel about her...

I've used this advice, and it works. The people here are awsome, and really know the female mind. I never would have scored the girls I have wirhout them....trust their advice man.

 

[Derek Flint]

Thanks again.
I'll try to find some of Pook's old posts or "book of Poost" as I will probably run into this girl on Monday.

 

[The Duke]

Derek-

1. You really don't even know this girl yet and you have already placed her on a pedestal.
2. Pretty girls are good at making every body think how great and nice they are. And nobody is ever as critical of a pretty girl's personality as they are an ugly ones.
3. You are very outcome dependent. You worry too much about what others think or what might happen. So much that its dampens your confidence and ability to be bold. Women will pick up on this and find you inferior.

Walk right up to her, tell her you want to get to know her and take her out. If she says no, then who cares. Stop wasting time talking to her and find somebody else.

 

[Derek Flint]

Derek-

1. You really don't even know this girl yet and you have already placed her on a pedestal.
2. Pretty girls are good at making every body think how great and nice they are. And nobody is ever as critical of a pretty girl's personality as they are an ugly ones.
3. You are very outcome dependent. You worry too much about what others think or what might happen. So much that its dampens your confidence and ability to be bold. Women will pick up on this and find you inferior.

Walk right up to her, tell her you want to get to know her and take her out. If she says no, then who cares. Stop wasting time talking to her and find somebody else.

Thanks.
I've been out of practice as I was in a LTR and just getting back in to meeting women.

Ran into her this AM right when she was finished with a phone call.

Chatted her up for two minutes.
Then with her phone still in her hand I said "Give me your number. I'll text you sometime and we'll go do something fun."

Her: "I'd love to. What's your number? I'll call your phone right now so you'll have mine"

Yeah, I have a bit of oneitis for this one so Im glad I internalized a lot of this stuff and it went well.

Girls like this one are few and far between and competition for them is fierce so backsliding a bit to AFC behavior can happen but again, Im glad I've internalized this stuff, owned the frame, assumed attraction, was confident and didn't go all AFC on her.

All this time I was doing all the stuff you mentioned though while she was probably thinking "what the **** is he waiting for?"

Lesson learned.

 

[The Duke]

Good deal, you probably made her day as much as it made yours!

 

[Krueg]

I dont know... You asked for HER number. Instead she asked for yours. Women only use your number to CANCEL dates. Not hook up

 

[Derek Flint]

I dont know... You asked for HER number. Instead she asked for yours. Women only use your number to CANCEL dates. Not hook up

She called my number on the spot so hers would show up on my phone and I added her number to my Contacts and she did the same.

She asked for my number, called it and her number showed up on my phone while we were talking in person.

 

[lizardking82]

She called my number on the spot so hers would show up on my phone and I added her number to my Contacts and she did the same.

She asked for my number, called it and her number showed up on my phone while we were talking in person.

I think @Krueg misunderstood what you said, probably.

 

[lizardking82]

He fvcking well didn't lmao.

Haven't had a girl yet that took my number down that I've laid. At least whilst game aware and on SoSuave (there was one crazy exception that I think of that stalked me).

It's blatantly evident that she is on a ridiculous pedestal. This is based on prioritizing her over the actual approach itself.

Such poor game on many levels.

- Approach at least one other woman during the next week. Can't do that? Therein lies the problem.
-Focus on the approach over the woman. The game should always be more important than a woman. Consider each woman that has been in your life, and the effect she has now... that is how this one will ultimately be. Gain perspective.

Not kidding, but you remind me of how I was at 17. It's not good, mate.

What he meant is that she got his number, called him while in his presence so they both got each other's number. I did not go at all in the other aspects of it cause some things are pretty evident, but he states he just got out of a relationship where he probably was not gettin' anything on the side and that makes people rusty, like anything you don't practice for a while.

And do you mean I remind you yourself when you were 17 or the OP?

 

[Derek Flint]

He fvcking well didn't lmao.

Haven't had a girl yet that took my number down that I've laid. At least whilst game aware and on SoSuave (there was one crazy exception that I think of that stalked me).

It's blatantly evident that she is on a ridiculous pedestal. This is based on prioritizing her over the actual approach itself.

Such poor game on many levels.

- Approach at least one other woman during the next week. Can't do that? Therein lies the problem.
-Focus on the approach over the woman. The game should always be more important than a woman. Consider each woman that has been in your life, and the effect she has now... that is how this one will ultimately be. Gain perspective.

Not kidding, but you remind me of how I was at 17. It's not good, mate.

Beg to differ.

I've had girls call me often to hook up and she said "I'd love to" almost before I could finish telling her (not asking her) for her number.

Maybe girls don't call you for sex.
My experiences have been different.

And I exchanged numbers today with a girl that is a 10 across the board that is about 25 years younger than myself.

How did your day go?

 

[lizardking82]

I get it. I'm saying that this is a "start over from scratch" situation.

Not shaming it, or anything like that. But, it really needs to be said.

This girl is a beginning. Making your whole game around her is mental. That is what leads into crazyness (as I assure you, most people gaming would see it).

It's not a good situation to be sucked into.

Of course, it's a very different reality if you wait for women to approach you in certain sexual terms (in which case, I'd be getting laid probably about twice a year at present lol).

I've seemed to have stepped into crazy, quite frankly, and can't be arsed to rationalize too much.

You either get what I'm saying, or you don't.

Now that you mention it, I think you really seem strange lately. Not all the time, but quite a few times, actually

And I did not say his game is sharp or sth like that. He kinda accepts it himself that he has some kind of oneitis over this girl and that that's not gonna take him good places, so as I said above, I didn't wanna point out obvious things. And yes, I get what you're saying.

 

[Derek Flint]

Best of luck in your current set.

I don't rely on luck but thanks anyhow.

 

[Derek Flint]

You want to escalate the relationship from platonic to personal to sexual/romantic. If you haven't escalated, you haven't done anything. There is no romance. Get her out of your head until you've actually made a move.

But how do you make the move? Escalation is a tricky thing. Most guys get it wrong because they have an over active ego. You are supposed to escalate on a woman's high points, not yours.

What I mean is don't brag or doing something cool and then ask her out. It doesn't make any sense. And it violates being high value. As a high value guy, you only escalate when THEY DO SOMETHING interesting/worthy. So when a woman makes an effort to flirt with me, express her personality, offer me some type of value, I will say something like "Not only are you sexy, but I really like your vibe. We should get together sometime." In truth, it doesn't really matter how I say it. I have said many different variations that have led to dates and lays. The key is when I say it. I only escalate the interaction from platonic to sexual/romantic when she makes an effort to flirt with me/open herself up.

A lot of high value guys make the mistake of showing up and acting like "Hey look at me. Look at how cool I am. Look at how much money I got. Wanna date?" The woman would be like "What? But I didn't do anything. Why me?" Whenever a woman asks "Why me?" You will be forced to say "Not only are you sexy, but I really like your vibe. We should get together sometime."

Either way, you will have to qualify/validate her, otherwise, you look like a total loser with no standards. And the proper way to do it is only after she's done something to earn your validation.

If you internalize this principle of only validating/escalating with women after they have made an effort with you, you will never make another escalation mistake again.

Thanks.
No. I don't brag or seek validation.
I get girls to talk about what they are passionate about, "feel good" things and good memories.

As for the "oneities" for this particular girl, I'm pretty much over it now that I got her number and how happy she was to give it to me.

From my experiences, women let it be known verbally, non-verbally or both when they ate ready to escalate.

I've been out of the game for a while but this stuff is still internalized and locked in.

 

[Derek Flint]

You want to escalate the relationship from platonic to personal to sexual/romantic. If you haven't escalated, you haven't done anything. There is no romance. Get her out of your head until you've actually made a move.

But how do you make the move? Escalation is a tricky thing. Most guys get it wrong because they have an over active ego. You are supposed to escalate on a woman's high points, not yours.

What I mean is don't brag or doing something cool and then ask her out. It doesn't make any sense. And it violates being high value. As a high value guy, you only escalate when THEY DO SOMETHING interesting/worthy. So when a woman makes an effort to flirt with me, express her personality, offer me some type of value, I will say something like "Not only are you sexy, but I really like your vibe. We should get together sometime." In truth, it doesn't really matter how I say it. I have said many different variations that have led to dates and lays. The key is when I say it. I only escalate the interaction from platonic to sexual/romantic when she makes an effort to flirt with me/open herself up.

A lot of high value guys make the mistake of showing up and acting like "Hey look at me. Look at how cool I am. Look at how much money I got. Wanna date?" The woman would be like "What? But I didn't do anything. Why me?" Whenever a woman asks "Why me?" You will be forced to say "Not only are you sexy, but I really like your vibe. We should get together sometime."

Either way, you will have to qualify/validate her, otherwise, you look like a total loser with no standards. And the proper way to do it is only after she's done something to earn your validation.

If you internalize this principle of only validating/escalating with women after they have made an effort with you, you will never make another escalation mistake again.

Also, thanks for emphasizing to ask for a number, a date, to escalate, leave the interaction on a high note when she is in a good "state" and to put her in one as well.

I think I was experiencing insecurity more than oneitis as I'm just getting back into meeting women and after reviewing the "Book of Pook" I didn't experience either when I conversed with her and told her to give me her number so we can go do something fun.

Saying "give me your number. I'll text you and we'll go do something fun" as opposed to "can I have your number? Maybe we can go have coffee sometime" is very powerful nut easy to do.

I'm in the process of looking for a new Apt. This weekend and it should give me some good day game oppurtunities.

This forum is a great resource.

Thanks again to all.

 

[Derek Flint]

When i said you escalate on a womans high point, i dont mean her state.

Read it again. Her high points is not when she is in a good state. Her high points is whenevr she has made an effort to flirt/ open up to you ..aka effort. The frame is as a high value guy, you escalate on women who have made an effort with you.

You dont escalate based on a womans emotional state. What does her emotional state have anything to do with you? Did her "state" cook you breakfast or give you a backrub?

Yeah, I got that part but she will be in a good state while she is doing the things you mentioned.

For example,if she is feeling attraction, that's an emotional state and a prime opportunity to jump from point A to point B, B to C, etc...

 

[Krueg]

If you give a girl YOUR number you are waiting for her answer. You are only fooling yourself by saying you don't care if she calls. That's bull. That is a PASSIVE approach anyway. Women prefer the DIRECT approach. Even if a guy is confident the women will see you as PASSIVE and afraid to ask her for the number. Very few men say 'what's your number?' right out like that. That's what they like. That's a turn-on. Not 'call me' honey . A women will think she isn't very attractive that way.