Mikhail´s Journey: How to stop being a Natural and be a Noob instead

[Dr.Suave]

There is this Russian guy who is a childhood friend of my sister. Let´s call him Mikhail.

I met Mikhail when he was in High School. Mikhail had never had a girlfriend at the time, but not because a lack of options. I think he had some natural Red Pill Instincts that made him hold off on giving exclusivity.

At the time I decided to have a little chat with Mikhail, make him red-pill aware (more than he already was). I told him a bit about Plate Theory, about divorce-rape, about Rollo, etc. He was mind-blown.

Fast forward a few years. Mikhail is now 24-26 years old. After years of spinning plates, he decides to give exclusivity to a 20 year old girl (Mistake 1?). He gets out of his current living situation (I cant remember if he was with his parents, or siblings, or what) and he get his own place, which would usually be a good thing, but he only got his own place to have her move in with him (Second mistake?). Both of them invest in a business together as partners (Third mistake?).

After some time of living together, Mikhail goes off on vacation with his parents & siblings, leaving his gf back at his place. On the third night of vacation, Mikhail goes fishing at night, leaving his phone back in his room. He returns after 1am to find a photo of a bag of weed sent to him by his gf. Mikhail has a camera at home so he checks the feed. There´s his gf, a couple of her regular females friends, AND ABOUT EIGHT MORE UNKOWN PEOPLE (THREE OF THEM MALE), ALL OF THEM HIGH AS F0CK.

He texts her "When Im back, we are done. Pack your stuff, I want you out".

The now ex gf starts moving her stuff out of his house, a little every day. One day, he invites her over for lunch at his place saying "Let´s have lunch at my place and after lunch lets move the last of your stuff out" (Mistake 4?).

After lunch she convinces him to watch tv. During tv, she tried to begin escalating. He refused the sex. She tried storming off and he tried stoping her (Mistake 5?). While trying to stop her, both of them accidentally end up with scratches and bruises. She tried playing the "domestic violence" card and call 911 or something. He took her phone before the call went through.

He proposes to go to couples therapy (Mistake 6?). She agrees. He makes an appointment. The day of, she was supposed to meet him at his place and go from there. Her father shows up instead at his door to let him now they are filing a report on him with the police.

It was a bluff, they didnt file a report. Mikhail says something like "Maybe with some couples therapy, in the future, we could get back together".

I pointed out at least six mistakes but there are many, many more. Im not sure what happened here, its like he went from being a Natural to a Noob.

 

[Gamisch]

That's my story in a nutshell. Question is more if HE felt like his RP awareness was natural or actually holding him back from " living a normal life ".

I mean mostake 1 to three are all fatal mistakes as we learned by time. The moment you position yourself in such a way that you cannot walk at ANY GIVEN MOMENT, you're fecked. A simple house is already mucho, but a damn business with a woman?? Thats retarded.

Because you see, the business venture didn't glued them together, or gave them the incentive to keep going.

When she invited dudes over it was all dead. The fact he invented her AGAIN over for lunch basically resets the whole shyte show.


Unfortunately tor your friend after the redpill rage there's this blackpilled phase, a big nothing burger that tastes like anger,regret and unfulfilled desires.

He was an ALMOST natural. Almost...

 

[Dr.Suave]

The moment you position yourself in such a way that you cannot walk at ANY GIVEN MOMENT, you're fecked.

So true, brother

A simple house is already mucho, but a damn business with a woman?? Thats retarded

Not sure WTF he was thinking. Its like u said:

... the business venture didn't glued them together, or gave them the incentive to keep going.

Maybe he throught they could continúe as business partners if they ever broke up. Maybe he could do It but I dont think she can pull It off

When she invited dudes over it was all dead.

For sure. It was (or should have been) the Last nail on the coffin. Its like she wanted to create drama, AND/or self-sabotage or sabotage the relationahip

I think he could "get back on track" if he cuts her loose completely AND block her from everywhere But I dont think he sees it

 

[BPH]

1-3 weren't smart, yeah.

Maybe I'm in the minority here, or details are missing, but her having a bunch of friends over to smoke weed doesn't seem like a big deal - let alone breakup-worthy.

However, everything after that was f***ing stupid on his part. The domestic violence victim play would've been a hard stop.

 

[BaronOfHair]

I pointed out at least six mistakes but there are many, many more. Im not sure what happened here, its like he went from being a Natural to a Noob.

He met the fate that's inevitable for all fellas who start repeating estoeric buzzwords like "Spinning Plates" and "Red Pill Awareness" like autmatons, the way fresh converts to Scientology start mindlessly regurgitating all the psedudoprofund claptrap("Going clear", "Suppressive person", etc etc)they've learned from THEIR new religion

This stuff always craps out, when life proves itself more complex than our favorite theologian's theories would have us believe

 

[pipeman84]

Mikhail's only mistake is that even though he spent years spinning plates, he hasn't learned the difference between a woman who is plate material and one who is relationship material. If he knew that, then what OP termed mistakes 1-3 would've actually been steps 1-3 of a beautiful relationship.

 

[Dr.Suave]

The domestic violence victim play would've been a hard stop.

F0ck yeah. He is still very young, he should find a better, younger, hotter girl instead of "trying to fix" this one.

 

[Dr.Suave]

Mikhail's only mistake is that even though he spent years spinning plates, he hasn't learned the difference between a woman who is plate material and one who is relationship material. If he knew that, then what OP termed mistakes 1-3 would've actually been steps 1-3 of a beautiful relationship.

You make a good point. This is like the most common mistake, even among SoSuave members. I have made this same mistake in the past.

 

[BaronOfHair]

You make a good point. This is like the most common mistake, even among SoSuave members. I have made this same mistake in the past.

It's almost impossible to ever know for sure

 

[Gamisch]

1-3 weren't smart, yeah.

Maybe I'm in the minority here, or details are missing, but her having a bunch of friends over to smoke weed doesn't seem like a big deal - let alone breakup-worthy.

However, everything after that was f***ing stupid on his part. The domestic violence victim play would've been a hard stop.

Depends on several factors.

If you share a house with a woman and you invite over strange women she doesn't know or women she might not like, you're fecked. She'll ( rightfully so) claim she doesn't feel "save" or anything along those lines.

Amongst us men, nothing is more privacy invading than a strange man in your house without your permission.

If you know dudes , and she told you about it; mwah. Then there's at least something positive about it. But this was behind his back, and he only found out because she send a picture ( stupid as FECK, but women somehow can't keep up the lies. Sje didn't had to send it, but I geuss that feeling of guilt was eating her alive. ).

The most crucial thing I've learned is in similar situations like that: you MIGHT say" hey ,apparently I have to educate and literally raise her to be a woman instead of a teenage girl. So I'll let this mistake slip". But the question is whether she has the potential and appropriate character to even be able to accept and follow a " male teacher". If the discrepancy between her behavior when they are together and when he is on VACATION for away for a longer time is this big, then he made the right call! No need to deal with a two faced woman like this. (Imagine running a business with such a person!!)

Eventually Mikhail even tried to give it a second shot , resulting in a specific -baby don't-go- ish push pull situation ,when she threatened to call the police ( excuse me??) and it was only prevented because he took her phone away( the latter is a HUGE risk!!! Should've let her gtfo on her free will AGAIN) , basically confirming he should've just stood his ground the 1st time when he kicked her out.

 

[Gamisch]

For sure. It was (or should have been) the Last nail on the coffin. Its like she wanted to create drama, AND/or self-sabotage or sabotage the relationahip

I think he could "get back on track" if he cuts her loose completely AND block her from everywhere But I dont think he sees it

One of the deeper lessons of the manosphere should be that eventually a woman will find ways to self destruct. Many outside influences can be the root of this.

A man must pre calculate this. In better times it was supposed to be the man who kept the woman in check and kept her from (self) destructive behaviors. Nowadays it's worth a sturdy discussion with oneself whether a destructive woman is worth the effort and patience and energy and ect ect.

 

[BPH]

Depends on several factors.

I agree, but that's why it seems like a weird jump to a breakup; to discover she had company (most of which were women) and weren't partaking in anything illegal...

I feel like there's gotta be some details missing or some prior history of misbehavior for that to be a logical leap in his mind. Maybe he doesn't like the friends/the guys, maybe she purposely hid this information from him, I don't know...it's just that if my woman did something I don't like that wasn't blatantly disrespectful I would tell her it bothers me rather than immediately tell her to pack up and leave.

 

[BaronOfHair]

One of the deeper lessons of the manosphere should be that eventually a woman will find ways to self destruct. Many outside influences can be the root of this.

A man must pre calculate this. In better times it was supposed to be the man who kept the woman in check and kept her from (self) destructive behaviors. Nowadays it's worth a sturdy discussion with oneself whether a destructive woman is worth the effort and patience and energy and ect ect.

It's never been our responsibility to prevent women(Or anyone else, for that matter)from f-cking up their own lives. We all grow and develop by falling on our a-ses every now and then, then getting back up again

 

[Gamisch]

I agree, but that's why it seems like a weird jump to a breakup; to discover she had company (most of which were women) and weren't partaking in anything illegal...

I feel like there's gotta be some details missing or some prior history of misbehavior for that to be a logical leap in his mind. Maybe he doesn't like the friends/the guys, maybe she purposely hid this information from him, I don't know...it's just that if my woman did something I don't like that wasn't blatantly disrespectful I would tell her it bothers me rather than immediately tell her to pack up and leave.

Obviously we don't know everything, but one thing is clear ;

he'd seen enough from her to decide he would NOT miss anything if she would pack her shyte and leave. Whether that's because of his congruent beliefs, or because he got doubts about her because of how she moved along him is not clear.

Actually I'm impressed that a young inexperienced man stands his ground like this. Eventually he did let go of his strictness, and we know how the story finished..

Imo she broke the trust . I mean, being on vacation with your family and finding out your living in gf threw a party including dudes you dont know...that's like a death sentence. Only straight up cheating can top this . Imo.

 

[BPH]

Actually I'm impressed that a young inexperienced man stands his ground like this.

What do you mean? Dude's yoyo-ing back and forth with this decision and is trying to "make it work". Just sounds like he's actively participating in a toxic drama relationship. I would know because my last one was like that and I didn't know what a "normal" amount of fighting was.

 

[Gamisch]

It's never been our responsibility to prevent women(Or anyone else, for that matter)from f-cking up their own lives. We all grow and develop by falling on our a-ses every now and then, then getting back up again

In an ideal ying yang situation both sexes have their own powers and weaknesses, and by forming a positive ,strong unity they can both protect one another.

Women are overly emotional, and male rationally can keep that in check ( if she submits!!) . Just my opinion.

 

[Gamisch]

What do you mean? Dude's yoyo-ing back and forth with this decision and is trying to "make it work". Just sounds like he's actively participating in a toxic drama relationship. I would know because my last one was like that and I didn't know what a "normal" amount of fighting was.

Up untill that point. As i said , once he started to ease down on her he basically burned himself.

I agree from that moment on he orchestrated his own demise.

 

[Dr.Suave]

If you share a house with a woman and you invite over strange women she doesn't know or women she might not like, you're fecked. She'll ( rightfully so) claim she doesn't feel "safe" or anything along those lines.

100%. If the roles would´ve been reversed, he would have never heard the end of it. Most women always play the victim card anyways.

Amongst us men, nothing is more privacy invading than a strange man in your house without your permission.

Imagine random unknown Chads coming and going in your house as they please when you are not around, getting high as f0ck at night with your woman. Un-fockin-believable.

But this was behind his back, and he only found out because she send a picture ( stupid as FECK, but women somehow can't keep up the lies. Sje didn't had to send it, but I geuss that feeling of guilt was eating her alive. ).

I think, in her head, by sending him the picture it somehow made everything ok and she was doing no wrong?

(Imagine running a business with such a person!!)

We will have to imagine such a situation, he´s living it.

 

[Dr.Suave]

Update: Mikhail and his ex went to couple´s therapy. Word on the street is they could get back together in a couple of months unless he meets someone else before that happens. He has downloaded Tinder and seems enthusiastic about at least one of the girls.