Dumped by main plate for NOT BEING AN AFC?

Cliffs:
- Dated for 8 months (both 26), always maintained strong frame, never backslid, had her eating out of the palm of my hand and chasing me all the way until...

- 3 days before she gives me the boot her older sister (28) and boyfriend come into town where he proposes to her at Soldier Field AFTER MOVING IN TOGETHER AND DATING FOR 9 MONTHS TOTAL. MET ON NEW YEARS EVE 2012-2013!

- Obviously my girl asks for my opinion and I tell her he's a nice guy (AFC) but he/they're f***** nuts its far too soon and that's that. (Not even worth explaining to her the million reasons why). She is rather displeased with my opinion. (Her sister has already been married and divorced prior at age 28)

- Next day, We go for a weekend away to the lakehouse with a bunch of friends and she is cold/distant/pissy. I back off and do my own thing.

- She blatanly disrespects me (first time ever) at the lakehouse and instead of going to her family picnic from lakehouse on Sunday in the suburbs and then driving us back to the city, I drop her a** off at her picnic and tell her to find a ride back to the city for her actions.

- Cliff Conversations via text after that are me: I found what you did to be disrespectful and unattractive. I expect better from you. Her: 3 paragraphs about how we don't want the same things and she cant waste her time with someone who doesn't want what she wants and that she honestly doesn't think I want it. Me (Didn't ask what that was) OK. No hard Feelings, I agree.


After that, NC for 3 weeks, went to a preplanned wedding together, was indifferent, aloof, ****y, funny (same frame I'm always in) and treated her as a "friend." No hint of tension or seriousness. She was rather flirty while her mom slapped me around all night telling me how much of an ******* I am.

Since then - 2 weeks NC by me and she's hit me up 6 times at 2:30 in the morning. I'm spinnin plates and made sure to subtly drop hints to her friends so she knows it.

Question: S*** test breakup, "logical breakup", perception skewed due to sister, or am I missing something here? She sees her sister getting lovey romanced and wifed up by this AFC where I am more far more dominating, aloof, I don't really care, and in NO hurry. I'm far from a WK beta and was close to giving in a bit towards "commitment stuff/mentality/conversations" after she proved her worth. Did I take Too long?

I'm 99% percent sure she don't want to get married now but did my lack of AFCness lower her interest? No my queen did not monkey branch or find another castle. Really just want to figure out where I messed up so I don't make these mistakes in the future with another plate I may see things progressing with.

From what I've read, you did everything correctly.

She tried to make you conform and you resisted.

Personally, I think if you go back then she has to apologize and whatever happens has to be on your terms. This is highly unlikely so don't hold your breath.

Or

You could get back with her and conform to her will.


I think it would be a lot less difficult to cut your losses and kick her to the curb but you probably already know this

She was looking for a chump and since she found out that you weren't (I'm so glad for you), she's mad she gotta find another man (woman with a penis/ girlfriend) to dump on.

Judge nismo commends you, and definitely drop her ass if you haven't.

Case closed.

Dgwizdal said:

Cliffs:
- Dated for 8 months (both 26), always maintained strong frame, never backslid, had her eating out of the palm of my hand and chasing me all the way until...

- 3 days before she gives me the boot her older sister (28) and boyfriend come into town where he proposes to her at Soldier Field AFTER MOVING IN TOGETHER AND DATING FOR 9 MONTHS TOTAL. MET ON NEW YEARS EVE 2012-2013!

- Obviously my girl asks for my opinion and I tell her he's a nice guy (AFC) but he/they're f***** nuts its far too soon and that's that. (Not even worth explaining to her the million reasons why). She is rather displeased with my opinion. (Her sister has already been married and divorced prior at age 28)

- Next day, We go for a weekend away to the lakehouse with a bunch of friends and she is cold/distant/pissy. I back off and do my own thing.

- She blatanly disrespects me (first time ever) at the lakehouse and instead of going to her family picnic from lakehouse on Sunday in the suburbs and then driving us back to the city, I drop her a** off at her picnic and tell her to find a ride back to the city for her actions.

- Cliff Conversations via text after that are me: I found what you did to be disrespectful and unattractive. I expect better from you. Her: 3 paragraphs about how we don't want the same things and she cant waste her time with someone who doesn't want what she wants and that she honestly doesn't think I want it. Me (Didn't ask what that was) OK. No hard Feelings, I agree.


After that, NC for 3 weeks, went to a preplanned wedding together, was indifferent, aloof, ****y, funny (same frame I'm always in) and treated her as a "friend." No hint of tension or seriousness. She was rather flirty while her mom slapped me around all night telling me how much of an ******* I am.

Since then - 2 weeks NC by me and she's hit me up 6 times at 2:30 in the morning. I'm spinnin plates and made sure to subtly drop hints to her friends so she knows it.

Question: S*** test breakup, "logical breakup", perception skewed due to sister, or am I missing something here? She sees her sister getting lovey romanced and wifed up by this AFC where I am more far more dominating, aloof, I don't really care, and in NO hurry. I'm far from a WK beta and was close to giving in a bit towards "commitment stuff/mentality/conversations" after she proved her worth. Did I take Too long?

I'm 99% percent sure she don't want to get married now but did my lack of AFCness lower her interest? No my queen did not monkey branch or find another castle. Really just want to figure out where I messed up so I don't make these mistakes in the future with another plate I may see things progressing with.

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you handled it all very well, the one flaw is your 99% certainty she didnt want to get married....wrong, she hid it very very well from you, she wants the wedding, the cake, the dress, the kids...the whole deal!

Ive had an LTR with a divorcee with a child, she swore she was never getting married again, she proposed to me...a real WTF moment, we broke up for good 3 months later.

what made it worse for you was the sister, that was rubbing her nose in it

Dgwizdal said:

I'm 99% percent sure she don't want to get married now but did my lack of AFCness lower her interest?

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No.

You made a typical rookie mistake. You said something that should never be stated directly and should only be implied through your actions. You know how women say one thing but then do something entirely different (i.e. saying they want a nice guy but falling in love with a 'bad boy')? I'll let you in on a little secret. Women also respond best to men who act the same way. Guys who are most successful with women (the so-called 'players') promise women the world while treating them as disposable assets. But one's chances of getting laid would instantly evaporate if he were stupid enough to actually tell a woman that he was 'aloof', '****y and funny' and treated women like sh!t.

When you said that her sister's boyfriend was nuts to propose after nine months, it was like a slap in the face to her. Chicks are prone to 'marriage envy' in general, and in this case, it's her own sister we're talking about. Your girl has probably spent days if not weeks fantasizing about what her own marriage would be like...and there you are, sh!tting on her castle in the sky. In response to her question, you should have just said "awww that was co cute" or something similarly fluffy and proceeded to act the way you normally do.

Holy sh-t you handled this like a boss. Amazing.

Dgwizdal said:

Her: 3 paragraphs about how we don't want the same things and she cant waste her time with someone who doesn't want what she wants and that she honestly doesn't think I want it. Me (Didn't ask what that was) OK. No hard Feelings, I agree.

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I jumped out of my seat and applauded the same way I did after that grand slam in Game 6 of the ALCS last week!

Bokanovsky said:

No.

You made a typical rookie mistake. You said something that should never be stated directly and should only be implied through your actions. You know how women say one thing but then do something entirely different (i.e. saying they want a nice guy but falling in love with a 'bad boy')? I'll let you in on a little secret. Women also respond best to men who act the same way. Guys who are most successful with women (the so-called 'players') promise women the world while treating them as disposable assets. But one's chances of getting laid would instantly evaporate if he were stupid enough to actually tell a woman that he was 'aloof', '****y and funny' and treated women like sh!t.

When you said that her sister's boyfriend was nuts to propose after nine months, it was like a slap in the face to her. Chicks are prone to "marriage envy" in general, in this case, it's her own sister we're talking about. Your girl has probably spent days if not weeks fantasizing what her own marriage would be like...and there you are, sh!tting on her castle in the sky. In response to her question, you should have just said "awww that is co cute" and proceeded to act the way you normally do.

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Very very good point and noted.

Bokanovsky said:

No.

You made a typical rookie mistake. You said something that should never be stated directly and should only be implied through your actions. You know how women say one thing but then do something entirely different (i.e. saying they want a nice guy but falling in love with a 'bad boy')? I'll let you in on a little secret. Women also respond best to men who act the same way. Guys who are most successful with women (the so-called 'players') promise women the world while treating them as disposable assets. But one's chances of getting laid would instantly evaporate if he were stupid enough to actually tell a woman that he was 'aloof', '****y and funny' and treated women like sh!t.

When you said that her sister's boyfriend was nuts to propose after nine months, it was like a slap in the face to her. Chicks are prone to 'marriage envy' in general, and in this case, it's her own sister we're talking about. Your girl has probably spent days if not weeks fantasizing about what her own marriage would be like...and there you are, sh!tting on her castle in the sky. In response to her question, you should have just said "awww that was co cute" or something similarly fluffy and proceeded to act the way you normally do.

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Exactly. OP read this post over and over again. You can't display stone cold overt alphaness to a woman and expect her to be ok with it. Sure she'll still wanna fvck you in the future but you've basically overtly spelled it out to her that you aren't relationship material. Show your lack of AFCness in actions not in words.

Bokanovsky said:

No.

You made a typical rookie mistake. You said something that should never be stated directly and should only be implied through your actions. You know how women say one thing but then do something entirely different (i.e. saying they want a nice guy but falling in love with a 'bad boy')? I'll let you in on a little secret. Women also respond best to men who act the same way. Guys who are most successful with women (the so-called 'players') promise women the world while treating them as disposable assets. But one's chances of getting laid would instantly evaporate if he were stupid enough to actually tell a woman that he was 'aloof', '****y and funny' and treated women like sh!t.

When you said that her sister's boyfriend was nuts to propose after nine months, it was like a slap in the face to her. Chicks are prone to 'marriage envy' in general, and in this case, it's her own sister we're talking about. Your girl has probably spent days if not weeks fantasizing about what her own marriage would be like...and there you are, sh!tting on her castle in the sky. In response to her question, you should have just said "awww that was co cute" or something similarly fluffy and proceeded to act the way you normally do.

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But what did he say that was so wrong? He didn't poo poo on the idea of marriage in general. He didn't say he'd never get married. He just said that getting engaged after 9 months is crazy. Which it is.

PairPlusRoyalFlush said:

Most of the time a bs breakup is because of another guy. Very few women will dump you without having a backup in place. Having said that, there is a small chance she was really upset about the wedding comment, I have run into both situations.(girl legit mad about that or uses as an excuse while cheating before or subsequent to comment). Women are like men, and when they overreact to things its usually because they can afford to do so because they have backup options.

Being hit up at 2:30am is not a good time to be hit up, it is "I just got done fvcking" time. Also, she managed to go NC for 3 weeks which is impossible for women to do unless they are dating new men. Because of that I would lean towards there being another guy.

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No she hit me up 4 separate times the 2nd week in to make sure I was still going to the wedding with her and then got angry at me because my answer of "ya" apparently wasn't good enough for her into which I responded "Ok does yes work." And that was enough ha. Just thought those were irrelevant details. She would have no reason to contact knowing she'd be seeing me at the wedding. Her calls and texts the last 2 weeks have been after failed attempts from her friends baiting me to come meet them wherever they're at ha. Maybe she's getting WK'ed now who knows but originally no branch swinging. Love your posts BTW.

TheCWord said:

But what did he say that was so wrong? He didn't poo poo on the idea of marriage in general. He didn't say he'd never get married. He just said that getting engaged after 9 months is crazy. Which it is.

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Bump. I agree with both of you. Logically She shouldn't have gotten her panties in a bunch over me stating the obvious but she is a woman, that is her sister, and this is their fairytale - should've kept my mouth shut.

TheCWord said:

But what did he say that was so wrong? He didn't poo poo on the idea of marriage in general. He didn't say he'd never get married. He just said that getting engaged after 9 months is crazy. Which it is.

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There you go, trying to logically analyze his statements like a man would. Stop with that nonsense and start thinking with your feelings, like women do. The OP said something negative about the holiest of the holy...his GF's sister's wedding plans. It doesn't matter what the actual meaning of his statement was. It's like taking a dump at the Lincoln Memorial and then trying to convince the guards that it was simply a call of nature and you meant no disrespect.

I think the following is going on:

The fact that you are reading this board and taking advice from these dudes, indicates that you believe there is some power in 'aloofness'/'dominance'/DJing. You think there is something awesome about suddenly pretending not to care about someone, or withdrawing into 'Mystery Man' mode, or disciplining someone like a child ("I found what you did to be disrespectful and unattractive.")

In the course of your relationship you became close to another human being. That person wanted to trust you with her future well-being and to share intimacy with you on the deepest level she could. When she realized how you feel about these things - e.g. that you have a "relationships-are-for-losers" frame which any random guy proposing can trigger, your "disrespect me and I'll vanish" frame, and various other indicators that you are not relationship material - when this came to light, she realized she had to do something to destroy the emotional bond you have. Hence her blatant disrespect. She realizes you can't be relied upon to build a secure committed future, as you view that as being possibly the mark of a loser.

She had no choice but to detonate your relationship. You have been dumped.

congrats bro! Another positive proof that the DJ principles work!!

NewJack said:

I think the following is going on:

The fact that you are reading this board and taking advice from these dudes, indicates that you believe there is some power in 'aloofness'/'dominance'/DJing. You think there is something awesome about suddenly pretending not to care about someone, or withdrawing into 'Mystery Man' mode, or disciplining someone like a child ("I found what you did to be disrespectful and unattractive.")

In the course of your relationship you became close to another human being. That person wanted to trust you with her future well-being and to share intimacy with you on the deepest level she could. When she realized how you feel about these things - e.g. that you have a "relationships-are-for-losers" frame which any random guy proposing can trigger, your "disrespect me and I'll vanish" frame, and various other indicators that you are not relationship material - when this came to light, she realized she had to do something to destroy the emotional bond you have. Hence her blatant disrespect. She realizes you can't be relied upon to build a secure committed future, as you view that as being possibly the mark of a loser.

She had no choice but to detonate your relationship. You have been dumped.

congrats bro! Another positive proof that the DJ principles work!!

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are you skinnyguy????

i like how you've handled the situation.
what i would have done on top of this, to make her feel guilty a little. this always work. women weapons against women. i occasionally do that. i do something she doesn't agree with, she gets pissed, i act like she was the one doing wrong, also change the subject, and usually she apologizes, and the "love" grows. there are women who can see through that. it is a stupid tactic, but women kinda expect you to be a little irrational and moody.

a small example to your situation: you tell her this marriage does not seem ok, she gets pissed off, why you don't see things her way. you then get pissed off and tell her it is stupid to force marriage on men, she says she never said to force, and you say you agree. forcing marriage is stupid. she will be mindfuked and will remember only that you both agreed on something. i know it seems moronic, but for whatever reason it works.

also, my 69th post
yeah, i'm immature.

OP, you've handled things properly. The reason why she is giving you a hard time is due to the lack of rapport. If you consider getting back together with her, do it in your terms, of course, but it would be wise to increase the rapport a little bit. Do this only if you honestly see her as the mother of your children, otherwise, just go fvck hotter chicks and enjoy your life.

NewJack said:

I think the following is going on:

The fact that you are reading this board and taking advice from these dudes, indicates that you believe there is some power in 'aloofness'/'dominance'/DJing. You think there is something awesome about suddenly pretending not to care about someone, or withdrawing into 'Mystery Man' mode, or disciplining someone like a child ("I found what you did to be disrespectful and unattractive.")

In the course of your relationship you became close to another human being. That person wanted to trust you with her future well-being and to share intimacy with you on the deepest level she could. When she realized how you feel about these things - e.g. that you have a "relationships-are-for-losers" frame which any random guy proposing can trigger, your "disrespect me and I'll vanish" frame, and various other indicators that you are not relationship material - when this came to light, she realized she had to do something to destroy the emotional bond you have. Hence her blatant disrespect. She realizes you can't be relied upon to build a secure committed future, as you view that as being possibly the mark of a loser.

She had no choice but to detonate your relationship. You have been dumped.

congrats bro! Another positive proof that the DJ principles work!!

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I have to agree with this, though not the dismissive view of DJing. This example is not DJing or DJ principles.

Dgwizdal, you were dating a girl for eight months, and you even went to a wedding with her. So you were boyfriend and girlfriend. But you refer to her as "your main plate"? Because "girlfriend" is something you're not supposed to have, or what?

You threw her out of your car and told her to walk home or find someone else to go with, after having promised that you would be her ride back home. Because you were angry with her. That is childish.You don't use punishment in a relationship. If you are angry, you say so, but you don't start taking things away, using power to have it your way. That is the sign of low-class, idiot relationships. And you had promised to give her a ride. You shouldn't break your word.

Then you didn't talk to her for five weeks. So you didn't give the relationship any chance to heal. You made sure that the argument would be the last thing you thought of when you thought of each other, for weeks. For what, had she shot your dog? No, she got angry with you. Big deal.


And you also gave her hints that you were hooking up with other girls....

So why shouldn't she break up with you? You gave her no reason to stay. Did you expect her to come crawling back and say "Please forgive me for getting angry over something"? Is this how you are going to act any time there is an argument in a relationship?

But of course, you can always get a pat on the back for this. Much like feminists will always applaud a woman who divorces her husband, no matter what the reason. It doesn't help you grow by overcoming difficulties in the relationship, but it sure fits the ideology.

D Wolfgang said:

I have to agree with this, though not the dismissive view of DJing. This example is not DJing or DJ principles.

Dgwizdal, you were dating a girl for eight months, and you even went to a wedding with her. So you were boyfriend and girlfriend. But you refer to her as "your main plate"? Because "girlfriend" is something you're not supposed to have, or what?

You threw her out of your car and told her to walk home or find someone else to go with, after having promised that you would be her ride back home. Because you were angry with her. That is childish.You don't use punishment in a relationship. If you are angry, you say so, but you don't start taking things away, using power to have it your way. That is the sign of low-class, idiot relationships. And you had promised to give her a ride. You shouldn't break your word.

Then you didn't talk to her for five weeks. So you didn't give the relationship any chance to heal. You made sure that the argument would be the last thing you thought of when you thought of each other, for weeks. For what, had she shot your dog? No, she got angry with you. Big deal.


And you also gave her hints that you were hooking up with other girls....

So why shouldn't she break up with you? You gave her no reason to stay. Did you expect her to come crawling back and say "Please forgive me for getting angry over something"? Is this how you are going to act any time there is an argument in a relationship?

But of course, you can always get a pat on the back for this. Much like feminists will always applaud a woman who divorces her husband, no matter what the reason. It doesn't help you grow by overcoming difficulties in the relationship, but it sure fits the ideology.

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are you this girls mother?

betheman said:

are you this girls mother?

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i actually agree with this guy (and now i have re-read your post more carefully, i was a little rushed the first time, my bad). i'm all bros before hoes, but the poster makes good points when he says a DJ should never act low-class, or like a vindictive jerk.

and girls will always think about the LAST encounter. it's how they work. they are creatures of the moment. if you show integrity and backbone, while not being a chump, but neither a jerk, she will see herself acting childish, and will come after you. of course, IF she is at least somewhat of a quality girl. if not, her loss.

the only girls who will come back begging after a treatment like this will be the low self esteem ones. i don't think you want someone like that. the fact that after 3 weeks she acted OK, is a good sign.

if you are not interested to leave her / make her a FB, this is what i say (dunno if it isn't too late already):

you both should talk about this. mature people can talk about problems and resolve them. you can both agree to disagree in this one, while still liking each other. she has the right to feel upset about what you said, and you have the right to distance yourself after she acted bytchy. i would even go that far to somehow admit to her i was a jerk for leaving her on the streets if she admits she overreacted on the marriage stuff.

depends on the situation. a man should me a man, and do what he wants, but being a man means also admitting when you made a mistake, and take responsibility for his actions.

you can of course leave her if this means so much for you. there are planty of fine broads for the taken anyway

and the "her MOM" thing... ouch. MAJOR red flag against LTR.

I tend to disagree with some DJ thoughts, I'm a noob here.


Anyway, I think to a certain extent there should be a part of every man that is an "inner" beta male. The beta is a good thing to have inside of you from an ethical and spiritual perspective. As far as I can tell.


I think there are times to pursue alpha methods, and there are times to let so called "beta" ideas gain a little more traction. I think there is a problem with the idea of alpha and it should be redefined for a "higher" level. My idea is that someone can be alpha while also respecting their own emotional needs and allowing themselves a certain amount of femininity... you need to be strong and have all alpha characteristics, but you should also be able to be honest, kind, and loving. For me, if those things are not part of a relationship in any way shape or form, I will have difficulty giving a **** about even getting a relationship in the first place.

So there are two types of seeing PUA... as a die hard philosophy of women vs. men, or the second better way: a way for all types of men to get what they want. It has taught me a great deal about dealing with women, I would be ****ed without it, to a certain extent. It has helped guide me. But in the end there are certain things that are left out.

You probably handled the situation fine for yourself, however the better goal is to find a girl you can really be honest with, but honest of course from an alpha frame and not disrespecting yourself. IDK what I'm getting at. All I'm saying is that from reading the OP that it seems like you're emphasizing dominance, control, and respect a little too much. It may be wise to realize that relationships CAN in fact be more than this, if you are willing to experiment. I advocate a certain "proud beta" philosophy. I'm not a masculine type like a lot of the people here who say "**** em dump em" (even though I am pretty much totally bros before hos)... I am a romantic. And I think this can in fact be compatible with the alpha mindset. This is my contribution to the field. Because not all men are the same, they don't all like cars, ****ing sluts, and being ripped, guns, cigars, etc. I like all of those things but there is another side to me I am simply unwilling to discount, it is central to my masculinity that I have a strong intellect and a healthy spirituality that allows me to enjoy the finer things.

Whether this works out in practice is a much bigger, more excruciatingly difficult question to answer. Trial and error. Obviously if it was simple I wouldn't be reading this stuff so much. But I will always hold out for the possibility.