question...about "love"

So when do you know when to say "I love you" and how come it NEVER seems like the right time to say it. I've only been with the girl for about 5 months so I'm not even sure when it's appropriate.

Usually I only date a woman for about 3 months and break up with them.

Yes guys I'm sure you're going to say I have committment issues and it's def because of a couple exes. I'm usually "ok" at getting the girl, just not keeping her around.

This seems like a mess to me, I'm really not used to having to contemplate this scenario.

When....How....like I said it never seems like the right time to just come out and say it.

In general, it's better to wait for the woman to say that she loves you.

This is a good thread that helps explain the issue of the man's role in saying "I love you":

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=177940

Pay attention to:

Collossus said:

There are some times in life when you just have to say FVCK IT and say what you feel, consequences be damned.

I used to feel the same way about the "i love you" thing, but it's really indicative of a larger issue which is always operating from a defensive standpoint in a relationship---never putting yourself out there until she has first. In the early stages of dating I think this is advisable, but not in the long term. Relationships inherently have certain risks that you simply cannot mitigate if you want to experience them fully.

So I say if you are feeling it, and you're reasonably certain she is too, just grab your balls and say it. Think of it this way: if she hesitates or doesn't say "I love you too", you have your marching orders.

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And

jophil28 said:

Yes, Colossus is right ,and just to add -
Leadership always involves calculated, or well considered, risktaking behavior.
We cannot lead by standing at the rear of the room.

Secondly, if you do find the "right" moment to lob the Love grenade, pay close attention to the reaction of her body, her eyes and her face.

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You need to learn how to trust the gut. If it doesn't feel right don't do it. But ask yourself why it doesn't feel right and if you really love the girl. If you do really love her, then why doesn't it feel right?

You ultimately seemed preoccupied about the idea that your interest isn't going to e reciprocated and that you might lose her as a result. That doesn't sound very confident, and definitely not confident to take a "FVCK it consequences be d*mned" attitude.

There is nothing wrong with liking a girl. There is nothing wrong with loving a girl. But love is a serious word. Make sure you aren't using it wh*rishly. And if you feel more invested in the relationship than she is, you need to back off.

seems like the concept of 'love' is dead, buried, and rotting when both sexes think of it as a tactical move on life's chessboard.

Danger said:

Still, I wonder if anyone else has a similar comparison pre-game and post-game on how long it took a woman to confess her love?

Pre - average was probably about three months.
Post - average is 12 months with a sample of 3 (2 being dumped without ever saying it.....after 12 months and 20 months respectively)

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That's a pretty interesting statistic, considering part of "game" is supposed to make you so much more attractive to the opposite sex. If game is really effective for anything other than getting quick lays, you would think they would want to jump on your bandwagon sooner, not later.

I guess there could be an intimidation factor. Or maybe you're setting a frame where relationship type feelings are seen as a sign of weakness (which is very consistent with the "game" attitude).

If you are, new to all this, it's best you just don't stick with the i love you stuff. but once you figure out what you are doing it's no real hard rule.

telling a girl that is crazy about you that you love her will send her over the moon; telling a girl that you are obsessed about that you love her can send her urnning the other way.

i didn't tell my wife that i loved for about a year and a half; the first time i ever told her that was the day she had my son. and I ment it. she had asked me a few times do Ilove her and i honestly told her, I dno't know but that's not something i throw around lightly. so when i did tell her for the first time she had a **** eating grin on her face for weeks.

at the same time, when i was younger i would tell girls that i loved them and they would proceed to act like i had ebola and run away]


this is the best way I can put it; when i was young, i used love, or the "love card" as a way to try to get closer to the girl or try to get her to feel soemthing she may or may not been feeling if that makes any sense. i was tring to get a reaction out of them.

today, i use the love card as like a dog snack to my dog. when he acts like i want him to act and doesn't **** and piss in the house lol he gets a treat. when my wife does thigns like i expect her to do and act like i expect her to act I let her know hey babe, i love you. even now i don't say it all the time. we are both too pragmatic to get caught up in stuff like that

My last GF told me on New Year's after she'd had 8 drinks.

I haven't said that in almost 10 years. It would be amazing/horrifying to hear those words come out of my mouth.

Well...I got hit with a curve ball tonight. I got dumped haha. (before I told her)

It hurts a little bit, but it may have been like back breaker said "I was maybe using it to try and get closer to her".

And that would have been the first time I have said it in about 3 years. I've just been having sex with different women...one night stands mostly.

Do other guys feel like they suck at relationships? I usually don't make time for a girl and I did make time for her which sucks. I guess being "unavialable" is the best place to stay.

Thanks for all the input guys.

shyguy32 said:

Well...I got hit with a curve ball tonight. I got dumped haha. (before I told her)

It hurts a little bit, but it may have been like back breaker said "I was maybe using it to try and get closer to her".

And that would have been the first time I have said it in about 3 years. I've just been having sex with different women...one night stands mostly.

Do other guys feel like they suck at relationships? I usually don't make time for a girl and I did make time for her which sucks. I guess being "unavialable" is the best place to stay.

Thanks for all the input guys.

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you have to look at relationships ike you look at a computer that is malfunctioning.

if every time i load a program and it starts to lag the more programs I have running I know without question, it's a memory(ram) problem. it cannot be anything else.

if every time you get in a relationship and your relationship hits the **** fan after 3 months, there is something you were doing very right to get IN the relationship that you stopped doing around 2 to 2 and a half months when you got in the relationship. only you can figure that out.

it's not beucase you haven't met the right one yet or they dont' deserve you fvck all that Bs. this is yo fault lol. the common demonator between all your problems and you is you.

and this is just my impression, but iw ould nto be suprsied if i was correct, but i thinkj your problem is that, you think that, one night stands and having relationships you have to treat women differently i know that beucase i used to think the asme thing too. you don't.

what most men do not realize, or even if they do they don';t pratice is, is most men, treat, FB's and girls they are laying it to differently from "good girls".

when i was 17 years old, i dated this girl named Alison. very very cute. she was really into me too. we dated for azbout 8 months. and i thought she was ust, the perfect girlfriend. so much so i went out of my way to treat her like a girl with respect.

after a few months, she made it clear.. backbreaker.. um... we need to fvck lol. you know i appreciate you thinking highly of me but i have needs and you aren't fulfilling them. she was a virgin at the time and i had this idea, this hallmark as **** in my head that the first time was going to be so special and i was going to do it the "right way" well on our 8 month anny she got gangbanged at a party lol.

that hit me harder than any breakup ever has in my life. i couldn't go to school for 2 days. but as i get older, I mean, i'm not going to sit here and say she ws perfect, she wasn't.. but honestly, she really wasn't a bad girl. **** even a cactus has to have a little water lol. I can get pissy at her all i want, but i know pretty much 99% sure that she did not cheat on me before then. i also know that she put us in some pretty good situations to get our freak on but it "wasn't right' for me and i didn't want to do her like that. lol i white knighted my ass out of some good *****.

even though i was 17, i took more from that relationship than any other besides the one i am in now;

and what i took out of that is, you can't decide yoruself who you are going to treat differently; you don't decide who is a LTR and who is a fvck buddy. tehy decide for you by their actions. once i thought of her as a LTR I refused to let myself have sex with her until the time is right. had i just laid it down to her who knows what would have happened.; the girl was for 6 months, crazy about me. like foreal.


I think the problem you have from that story is that you are meeting women and a woman might act nice, or act different and you don't treat them like you treat all the other women anymore. and while she appreciates the niceness and respectfulness, that is not how you keep a lady.

you have to run all women through the exact same process, the dating the sleeping over the plate spinning and the woman ho is seriously LTR for you will show you by her actions that she deserves, demands to be treated different.

in short, you are associating certain qualities to women who have not yet earned them, they know that, and because you are giving them too much too soon they either lose interest of feel that if they can get you head over heels, they can get someone better than you at least interested.


see this is what i like about this site. the nuts and bolts of the ****. see a real life problem, let's fix it, and get real life results.

2 things you need to know.

1. All women have exes.

2. Never be the first to say I love you. I love you is only for your relatives.

Also, love is just a 4 letter word. Have other options ready because you never know when a breakup will happen.

Case closed.

General rule of thumb: wait for the girl to tell you she loves you first. Sure there are cases when you can say it first, but it's best to wait for her to say it. Trust me, if she sticks with you long enough she will bring up the question. It's only a matter of when. Your "I love you" should be earned.....not given away.

On a side note, one hilarious way to really get a girl working hard to impress you is to say "I love you" to your Mom when you're done talking with her on the phone. Female jealousy can be a powerful motivator!

Lol...nice idea Lexington!

And It's not going to change anything right now, but I'm getting ready to go visit a FB that I was effing before I hooked up with the new ex. haha

backbreaker said:

and what i took out of that is, you can't decide yoruself who you are going to treat differently; you don't decide who is a LTR and who is a fvck buddy. tehy decide for you by their actions.

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That s some deep stuff right there man! I always respect your advice, but this is some of the hardest truth you've ever dropped on here. In other words, let the girl qualify herself to you, instead of you qualifying her as a ONS/FB or LTR material...

If only this could be engraved somewhere at the top of the site, would solve so many questions right off the bat.

But I think the problem with most guys, even those who get laid on a regular basis, is that they re not REALLY scoring the girls they wish they were scoring. So when they do get that stripper or party slvt, all of a sudden all SS teachings go out the window and she becomes "the one", the girl you're gonna say "I love you" to within a month.

Or I see guys who've been out in the trenches for years, maybe not really evolving their games as much, but at least getting girls, then nxt thing you know they have a "girlfriend". How long they've known her? 2 weeks... But she is so special! They get all defensive when you try to tell them, hey listen, maybe she is special, maybe (most probably) she isn't, you just can't tell in 2 weeks. Then you don't hear from them for 3 months, when they come back with their tail between their legs, asking you "what did I do wrong?" lol That's cuz you picked her up treating her as a stripper, then you made her run away treating her like a wifey!

Well I hit up my old FB and probably screwed her up a little more with all her crazy emotions. I don't like leading people on and usually tell them up front that it's just sex (like I did with her).

I have to say it kinda helped out even though I didn't think it would.

Honestly even when I was getting dumped I knew it was the right thing, but feelings are hard to overcome.

She was 27 no kids, I'm 39 with a 16yo. She was still going through a divorce...I mean I really knew from the get go that there wasn't anything there. My own fault for putting myself in that situation and letting it go on for so long.

It still hurts, but I know its the right thing. You guys are all very wise, but i'm 39 and I don't like ONS really, but I do love them just to prove I can. I'd love to have something more than that, just DO NOT want to settle for less than I deserve.

Becareful also that a woman can say "I Love You" to manipulate your emotions and entrap you while taking from you what she needs. I have learned after 40 years of being alive and well, that some women who have by nature an 'innocent' looking face can end up being the worst enemy you will ever encounter with psychological manipulation.

Danger said:

Pre - average was probably about three months.
Post - average is 12 months with a sample of 3 (2 being dumped without ever saying it.....after 12 months and 20 months respectively)

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Sorry to bring this up again, but I really find this intriguing.

Danger:
Maybe you were spinning plates after but not before? And that they knew you were seeing other women and thus were more hesitant to try to get a commitment?

Danger said:

I am honestly not sure why it took longer for post-game girls to admit they loved me.

The one I'm with now did tell me that she kept waiting for me to say it, as there was only one guy who had not told her first. Finally she broke down and said it.

Perhaps they sensed that I liked to move slow on that sort of thing, although one of the three prior ones was my BPD nutjob so she probably doesn't count.

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Could it be your emotions were more in check for post-game girls, that they didn't feel the emotional tug as fast?

Unless Danger's experience is atypical, it almost makes it sound like "AFCs" are more likely to get an "I love you" than a DJ. This may not be surprising actually, since a lot of "game" is built around the idea of sending the message that you are not the type of guy who gets emotionally attached. That you're a guy who has a lot of women. That you're a guy who is safe to have a one night stand with because you're not going become a nuisance by hanging around.

If the idea is to make a girl feel emotions, I can see why some AFCs might have some success.

the way i see it, when i first met my wife i was spinning 3 plates already. after some time with her i slowy started to drop the plates and committed to being in a relationship with her. she is the woman i met that made me actually want to put the black book up.

what i am saying is, i don't have to tell her anytihng. she knows or knew. my actions demontrated how i felt about her. and she stuck around while i spun plates for a good 2 months before i started to drop them; she doesn't have to tell me how she feels about me either.

From the 16 Commandments of Poon:

I. Never say ‘I Love You’ first

Women want to feel like they have to overcome obstacles to win a man’s heart. They crave the challenge of capturing the interest of a man who has other women competing for his attention, and eventually prevailing over his grudging reluctance to award his committed exclusivity. The man who gives his emotional world away too easily robs women of the satisfaction of earning his love. Though you may be in love with her, don’t say it before she has said it. Show compassionate restraint for her need to struggle toward yin fulfillment. Inspire her to take the leap for you, and she’ll return the favor a thousandfold.