The girl you just CAN'T figure out

Going to make this as short as I can, so please, if anyone has any advice...

Met this girl back in early december through a friend online and went out on a nice dinner date in mid december, to a very nice place she suggested. She lives a half hour away from me and i picked her up and didn't know any places around her, so she picked. When the bill came I paid which was fine but she didn't do so much as OFFER to pay a dime. Again, not that i would expect her to pay, i just found it odd that she didn't say a word and just let me whip out my credit card. Very high maintenance feeling. She did seem like she meant it when she said thank you though. Overall the dinner lasted TWO hours and we just talked and talked. Good times. She was great. Nice, beautiful, outgoing. Before I dropped her off I got a big time make out in the car which was amazing. I figured I was in. Boy was I kind of off.

From the very next day when I texted her seeing whats up, her responses were now delayed for hours, she didn't write back anything big, didn't ask me anything, didn't try and get to know me any better, and eventually I got the feeling that this was a party girl who just went out to get a free meal and her beauty validated by me. THere was even a case where I texted her asking how her xmas was where it took her an ENTIRE day to write back and when she did, she did NOT ask how mine was. At that point I figured I was done for. I should note that this girl recently lost weight and is now hot. Another red flag that maybe she's just trying to live life now and use me while doing so. So yeah, i thought it was over, especially when she wrote back to my last ditch effort of asking her to watch a football game at a bar with me and friends by saying "I dont know what i'm doing Sunday yet", with absolutely nothing else. Pathetic and disrespectful imo, and i was done. That WAS until that SUNDAY came and she texts me at like 3pm asking what i'm doing for the game that night. She says im welcome to come watch it with her and her friends as they were actually going out for it. Anyway, we all went out and had a pretty nice time. We talked a good amount. Her IL maybe even grew a bit (even though u would think it would be high enough after a full fledged makeout session) as she started texting me that Monday. Then that wednesday she messages me on facebook private message talking about a status i had up. All good signs.

I then ask her out for that Saturday night to which she rejects bc she already has plans with some friends. NO COUNTER. I felt awful. Either this girl had no common sense, or she simply does what she wants, when she wants. Who knows. She DID say that she would have invited me to hang with the friends but they are "new friends" and she isn't sure if that would be ok. I said yeah I understand. She then even IMed me on FB later in the night chit chatting, perhaps bc of feeling bad about turning me down, who knows. WHY COULDNT SHE COUNTER??

So I let that weekend go by as well as an entire week to see if i maybe heard from her which i didn't at ALL. Nothing. But, giving her the benefit of the doubt with nothing to lose at all, I text her straight up this past Monday asking if she wanted to do drinks "one night this week" . . left the whole week open to see what she'd say. She agrees for Thursday for a date! So a few days ago we meet half way at a restaurant and end up doing dinner as well as drinks. Date is amazing just like first time. She's outgoing yeah, and that can sometimes hide how the date REALLY went, but no, i think she def enjoyed herself. Like the first date she was all dolled up too, big time. Bill comes -SAME SITUATION AS LAST TIME. I let it sit on the table for a minute this time too before putting my card out where she AGAIN said thank you, but NO OFFER!!! she doesn't make a lot of money and has a lot of expenses in her life (she rents, while i still live at home) Note: i'm 27 and she's 28.... but STILL, i just think that is VERY telling of a girl. Is she that high maintenance where its just EXPECTED that i pay for every single meal???

But the real story is what happened back in my car which was yet ANOTHER full fledged make out as well as me feeling her up down there and up top. Truly an amazing moment. A solid 10 minutes of it. She was smiling during it, enjoying it, etc.

Its hard to figure out with her. She still is a bit into the party scene which turns me off a bit, and claims she has things she wants to do before she settles with a guy such as traveling and what not, but who knows. I mean is it possible this is a dinner wh0re? If it weren't for the makeout sessions I'd be done, but maybe there is more to it. Friday came and went and i didnt hear from her at all. I want her to come to ME now which in all honesty i feel like its not going to happen. Just weird. Not sure what the story is here, but i gotta admit, i do like her. She's fun to be around and she's just so beautiful. Bangable too.

I ain't have time to explain a lot but I'll say this, have you consider that you are not the only plate she is spinning at the moment?!? I'd suggest NC for you sir and next time you go out take her somewhere cheaper and if she still doesn't pay you might reconsider how much you like her!

one thing that stuck out to me was that she was heavier before but now she's hotter? Could very well be her confidence is at an all time high now that she's looking better and either wants to develop options, or already has options.

Could be she's keeping her distance somewhat because she doesn't want to get serious yet OR she doesn't want to lead you on and have you develop feelings

There's really a multitude of reasons for this behavior. I wouldn't over analyze too much, as you've already made out and felt her up several times already. obviously there is some level of interest there. I would personally play it cool and see what happens. You've shown her you're a quality guy. You've shown her a good time. Let the chips fall where they may.

I know what you mean about her not contacting you. Even when you have a good rapport with the girl. It can be ego bruising when you go NC expecting her to come around but she doesn't. But look at it this way, if that's the case, at least you know in advance what kind of girl she is. And you got to have a little bit of fun plus a learning experience.

I'd say this woman is using you for free meals, free entertainment and is keeping you sweet by making out with you, because if she loses you, she loses her free meals, her free entertainment when she has nothing else to do in the evening or on the weekend.

She might well be beautiful and she might well be fun, but she is using you, she has made is clear she's not interested, you have not taken heed of this and she has decided that you are a great source of social mobility to her and she is maximising your wallet to full effect.

I would walk away from this situation now, how many more meals or outings are you going to pay for? How many more make out sessions with this girl is needed in order for you to see what is glaringly obvious? You are being taken for a ride and it's quite shocking that you cannot see this, or even worse don't want to see it.

I agree with the advice in this thread. This girl is manipulating you. You have shown that she is allowed to manipulate you.

The best way to have chance at a serious, respect-based relationship here is to retract yourself. Be busy more often than she is. When she texted you on Sunday to invite you out, after being rude the first time, you should have said "No I'm busy."

Keep a busy, disinterested attitude toward her, and that's the most likely track for success. And if it doesn't work out, well, look at all the time you saved!

Just wish there was a way to find out already. I don't exactly have a million plates spinning right now and yeah, I do kinda like her. Not attached like some afc, but i think she's cool.

And of course as a guy, i dont have any place asking her what the story is in any way shape or form....

Or do I?

this thread shows how well game works on us

Aaron B said:

this thread shows how well game works on us

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I was thinking that too. I'm sure there's a female forum with a girl asking the same kind of question about a guy shes dating.

Well we can't have a man/woman tell their dating prospect "Hey I genuinely like you, I think you're awesome and want to keep seeing you". That would just be absurd.

We need no contact, vague responses, push-pull tactics. Haha people are ****ed up.

No I didn't say i would say that, but maybe just a quick comment at the end of the next potential date asking what she's lookin for here. That way I can get the hel out once i know whats goin on.

Smartone84 said:

No I didn't say i would say that, but maybe just a quick comment at the end of the next potential date asking what she's lookin for here. That way I can get the hel out once i know whats goin on.

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you are demonstrating a fundamental lack of understanding of the game

this is all a game, and she's badly outplaying you at it

women's game is designed to reach one of two outcomes:

1. she tests to see if you are a powerful man who is capable of leading her and her emotions, while controlling your own emotions and being willing to walk at any time if she doesn't jump thru your hoops. as you continue to pass these tests, she responds to you very powerfully, falls in love, can't bear to be apart from you etc.

outcome: she sees you as a real man

2. she succeeds in gaining the upper hand and all the power in your interactions. she leads and you follow. you have to come to her on her terms. initially she may enjoy the power she has over you, but in time she will grow to despise you because of the fact that you are so weak as a man that you allow a woman to run roughshod over you

outcome: she sees you as a chump and has no respect for you, and feels entitled to treat you like crap

No I get it, trust me I do. I admit that there is a good chance i'm being taken for a ride here. But you still NEVER know. A lot of guys on here are so quick to judge and hate on girls. I'm guilty of it too. But sometimes, u just never know. I might be in with her for all I know. I dont know. I just dont get how a girl can do hardcore makeout sessions just for fun just to keep a guy around. I always thought that was just a **** move that guys did.

Smartone84 said:

No I didn't say i would say that, but maybe just a quick comment at the end of the next potential date asking what she's lookin for here. That way I can get the hel out once i know whats goin on.

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So after the hypothetical 3rd date, you'd ask a woman where you stand/where is this going???

And you think this would have favorable results?

Listen, you need to spin more plates. This girl, and "what she's lookin for" should not be important to you. And my god, don't take girls out to dinner. Take them out for drinks.

It all comes back to this - If this girl values you, your time, and your ability to find other (or better) girls, then she WILL use her time with you to make a more committed move to keep you. If she does NOT value you, she will continue to play games while waiting for a better man to come along....which is what it seems like she's doing now.

Smartone84 said:

I just dont get how a girl can do hardcore makeout sessions just for fun just to keep a guy around. I always thought that was just a **** move that guys did.

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Haha. Really? You must not go to nightclubs or house parties often...

Smartone84 said:

Just wish there was a way to find out already. I don't exactly have a million plates spinning right now and yeah, I do kinda like her. Not attached like some afc, but i think she's cool.

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Personally I believe that it is better to have no plates than to be holding onto one who's not respecting you. Also if you're not thinking about her you're more likely to spot other opportunities.

A big part of the game is having the ability to walk away.

Smartone84 said:

No I didn't say i would say that, but maybe just a quick comment at the end of the next potential date asking what she's lookin for here. That way I can get the hel out once i know whats goin on.

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I'm not saying thats what you personally were going to say. I'm talking about in general. Don't we all wish neither sex had to play games and you could be real with people about your feelings and know definitely where you stand without jumping through hoops. But people who wear their emotions on their sleeve and reveal their intentions 1.) scare people off 2.) get taken advantage of.

That's just life man. At least you know how to handle the situation and are keeping your guard up.

Smartone84 said:

No I get it, trust me I do. I admit that there is a good chance i'm being taken for a ride here. But you still NEVER know. A lot of guys on here are so quick to judge and hate on girls. I'm guilty of it too. But sometimes, u just never know. I might be in with her for all I know. I dont know. I just dont get how a girl can do hardcore makeout sessions just for fun just to keep a guy around. I always thought that was just a **** move that guys did.

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If you got it, we wouldn't have to be explaining it to you.

You are failing her tests. You are failing to lead. You are deferring to her.

Period.

Knowing the right thing to do but not doing it - what good is it?

She either comes along with your program or she doesn't.

A real man isn't so emotionally involved so early that how she responds to his leadership causes him to feel bad emotionally. That's just ridiculous man.

If she denies you and it makes you feel devastated, she wins.

perseverance said:

I'd say this woman is using you for free meals, free entertainment and is keeping you sweet by making out with you, because if she loses you, she loses her free meals, her free entertainment when she has nothing else to do in the evening or on the weekend.

She might well be beautiful and she might well be fun, but she is using you, she has made is clear she's not interested, you have not taken heed of this and she has decided that you are a great source of social mobility to her and she is maximising your wallet to full effect.

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There is a report about this on the news!
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/date-food-women-seek-fancy-dinners/story?id=15107409

It has become a sport for some.

Regardless of her intentions, why are you so into this low quality party chick? Sounds like you don't have any other options, which is why your idealizing her, we all have been guilty of this at some point.

You need to go NC for a bit, slap yourself back to reality and realize that your playing on her terms, which is never a good place to be with a girl. She doesn't respect you, she's using you and as Iceberg and Aaron said, she's keeping you chasing the carrot with make out sessions.

Put it this way, even if she keeps agreeing to go out with you, she's not going to offer to pay any time soon. You'll be stuck in neutral and once you finally realized you have been wasting your time on her, you will have nothing but a larger monthly credit card bill to show for it.

Lastly, making out is no big deal at all brahh, don't get it twisted.


Girls won't start initiating contact regularly until you two have had sex. Which at this rate, I see a hooker as a better option than her, since you don't have to play this mental tug of war with yourself.

You know she's using you, but your emotions don't want to believe it.

Its easy for us to say "ditch her" etc since were not wrapped up in the situation, but objectively take a step back and really think for a second. The answer will be clear.






PIMP

Ok agreed, no contact for right now. But until when? What if she never contacts me? Which could never happen..

She doesn't sound all that interested, and is just using you for various reasons. Giving you lines about not wanting to settle down and showing no reciprocation is never good. The only question is, why are you pining after someone who doesn't want you? Hmmm? Get your self-esteem in check, stop focusing on the chase, and find someone who wants you. Problem solved. You don't have to analyze all this. Just wasting time and emotions on someone who doesn't want you. That's why she's so hard to figure out. You are also allowing yourself to be used, and she's taking advantage of that. Not a high quality chick.

It's like the game heavy rain.

Regardless of what you do, what methods you try, what tactics you use, you, are going to end up right back at the same pace, because at your core, you are trying to make this woman something she doesn't want to be, without her proving to you that she is that thing.

i mean dude, 3 dates and you want to know where this is going or what she is looking for?

who the hell wants to go out with a dude or hell a girl for that matter and the whole damn thing is an interview process. i don't know about you but i go out to relax and have fun. if you happen to run into someone you wouldn't mind dating so be it, but stop trying to force the issue. it's not attractive, it's not sexy, it's not manly, it's not anything. she's not playing a game. she just doesn't like you. you are basically cannon fodder until something worth while comes along. you are the human interlude. she likes you enough to kill time with you to not sit around hte house but doesn't like you enough to want to date your or even fvck you. that's the cold truth.

the real question is how did you get there, not why she feels that way. that's the question you seriously need to be asking yourself.